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SONIC THE HEDGEHOG 4 or AGAINST |OT| of Huelen in Green-Eyed Heaven

The_Technomancer said:
Skip the guy's prelude and go straight to the comparisons and that's exactly the problems I had with the games physics. No mid-air momentum: you have to continually hold a direction or Sonic drops straight down. Applies even to going off edges: if you spindash off an edge, Sonic doesn't continue forward and keep rolling, he hits the ground a few feet away and stops. No rolling down hills....ironically, I think that this is the game that they made more Mario like, by giving you such complete 1:1 control over his movement. Sonic was based on knowing the characters innate momentum in order to predict where he would move and land, not having complete mid-air control of him.

Yeah, his comparisons are really good. I suppose if you've never played the originals or simply don't remember how they played, this game would be fine. But as soon as I started playing I was like, "What? What happened?" It is pretty jarring. It's not like we're trying to be angry nostalgic whores, the bottom line is the games simply play different.
 
Spectral Glider said:
Yeah, his comparisons are really good. I suppose if you've never played the originals or simply don't remember how they played, this game would be fine. But as soon as I started playing I was like, "What? What happened?" It is pretty jarring. It's not like we're trying to be angry nostalgic whores, the bottom line is the games simply play different.
- played the originals
- remember how they play
- game is fine

But I suppose if you like beating up little girls using a tire iron, the game isn't fine.
 

JimboJones

Member
The momentum thing is pretty apparent on the casino boss level, using the little pinball jumpers to send sonic flying which he does initially but he then comes to a complete full stop like there is an invisible wall in place.
 

Roto13

Member
JimboJones said:
The momentum thing is pretty apparent on the casino boss level, using the little pinball jumpers to send sonic flying which he does initially but he then comes to a complete full stop like there is an invisible wall in place.
You're using the pinball flippers to fight that boss? You've never played Sonic 2 in the first place!
 

Combichristoffersen

Combovers don't work when there is no hair
Roto13 said:
You're using the pinball flippers to fight that boss? You've never played Sonic 2 in the first place!

You could use those flippers to fight the boss in Sonic 2, although it made the boss much harder than he really is :lol
 

JimboJones

Member
Roto13 said:
You're using the pinball flippers to fight that boss? You've never played Sonic 2 in the first place!
It was actually after the fight I noticed I usually like messing around in the empty boss arena on casino night zone for a minute playing on the flippers and jumpers and that's when I noticed.
 

steveovig

Member
matthsv said:
Exactly what my thoughts have been after watching videos. I'm glad to know that they are accurate after playing the game and I can bury any thoughts of buying this.

I wouldn't do that. That guys review was a complete exaggeration. The game isn't the best Sonic ever but it's hardly a terrible game. Haters gonna hate, I guess. Sega could've released anything as Sonic 4 and people would find something to hate about it.
 
steveovig said:
I wouldn't do that. That guys review was a complete exaggeration. The game isn't the best Sonic ever but it's hardly a terrible game. Haters gonna hate, I guess. Sega could've released anything as Sonic 4 and people would find something to hate about it.
Probably, but if SEGA had gotten the physics right, the things the...sigh, haters would have found to hate about would have been a lot more trivial.
 
D

Deleted member 21120

Unconfirmed Member
jman2050 said:
If you didn't spin dash and jump off the wall to hit that boss in Sonic 2 you were doing it wrong.
If you don't use a pinball flipper to get height and then guesstimate where he's gonna be based on his movement pattern and so you're able to fall down every time right on top of him, which bounces you back up and allows you to do it again (and so you never touch the ground again)... then you're doing it wrong.
 
steveovig said:
I wouldn't do that. That guys review was a complete exaggeration. The game isn't the best Sonic ever but it's hardly a terrible game. Haters gonna hate, I guess. Sega could've released anything as Sonic 4 and people would find something to hate about it.

He can try a demo. I'm not picky at all, I'm not die-hard Sonic super fan but the game simply feels awkward due to all the physics and momentum choices. I can't enjoy playing it. You simply have to play it and decide; watching videos and reading isn't good enough.

Bottom line is changes were made to the core of Sonic 2D games and some don't mind and some can't bear it. It's a big change; it's not a case of "Haters will find the silliest things! This just proves they'd find ANYTHING to hate!" It's the whole feel of the game; it's a big deal.
 
I liked the demo and plan to buy it.

I love the Sonic series on the Genesis but understand things change. Yes, the physics are different. But the game is fun when played with the understanding of how it works.

I refuse to focus on what it isn't. Sonic 4 is a decent 2D platformer that's also the best console Sonic game in years.
 

KAL2006

Banned
I just played Sonic 2 and Sonic 3 and Knuckles, and it seems like they are a sequel to Sonic 4, it's like Sonic 2 and Sonic 3+K improved so much things over Sonic 4.
 

Teknoman

Member
The Chosen One said:
Figures.

It feels as if the developers are young and the first Sonic game they played was Sonic Adventure.

But heck, even Sonic Adventure 2 had levels with breakneck speed.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nG3sFkLuQCU

Those who have bought the full version of Sonic 4, do the latter zones have acts where you go insanely fast?

Sorta, but not really.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BppFmL_se_Q

Decent speeds, but nothing insanely fast.

Also apparently I suck at Sonic 4 :lol Is it because I didnt try to fly through the stage, or because I ran into some obstacles here and there?

EDIT: You actually gain a little more speed at certain sections in Lost Labyrinth act 2, but nothing as crazy as older Sonic titles.
 

Zen

Banned
I've almost beaten the game, I'll have my impressions up this weekend (not taht anyone should care, realistically :p).

Good game once you get past the lack of inertia.
 

JimboJones

Member
The speed of the game is fine in my opinion matches up fairly well to the original games (maybe leaning towards more to sonic1 rather than 2 ad 3) in that regard, nice mix of platforming and some speedy areas.
 

J@hranimo

Banned
The game is fun, but the strange thing I'm getting is that you can't play it like you've played Sonic 1-3&K, because the physics just isn't the same. I've gotten used to the physics and now I can just zip through the zones with ease. It's funny cause with the physics plus the homing attack this game is stupid easy. Sega has got to do better.
 
I'm enjoying this through the first act, I'm not a huge Sonic fan, but it's fun to play another Sonic sidescroller in HD. Sure there may be some physics difference, but it's still fun to me. I don't exactly play the original Sonic games on a regular basis anymore so the differences don't jump out at me. Looks great IMO, but two little nitpicks: the music is meh so far, and I don't love the Sonic model. Also, it seems the leaderboards are already borked (some people with 0 times on the time attack leaderboard)
 
Teknoman said:
Sorta, but not really.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BppFmL_se_Q

Decent speeds, but nothing insanely fast.

Also apparently I suck at Sonic 4 :lol Is it because I didnt try to fly through the stage, or because I ran into some obstacles here and there?

EDIT: You actually gain a little more speed at certain sections in Lost Labyrinth act 2, but nothing as crazy as older Sonic titles.

I see.

I guess Sonic is getting old and lost a step or two. Can't run fast forever. :lol
 
The $15 price point prejudiced me against the game a bit, just in the theory of "it won't be worth it" so I hadn't tried the demo yet.

I only made it through act 1 of the first zone. (Not sure if it went any further as I promptly quit and deleted...)

It just didn't feel right -- it looked really nice, but the speed was off and the feel? Apparently I now agree with the people who were saying Sega fucked up the "physics". :(

Maybe if I ever see it on sale for $5, but as of right now, I'm sorely disappointed.
 

MMaRsu

Member
Having just played the demo. Wow..this sucks :(

Didn't give me a happy "woohoo I'm playing a new sonic game that's awesome " feeling at all. It's like, it just doesnt feel right at all. Garbage.
 
Teknoman said:
With the homing attack, its actually more about waiting than speed. Dont try to home in on an enemy too quickly and you should be fine. Also try and take the high route.

Mad Gear Zone Act 1

I am 5th place in this level on the Wii. Well I was yesterday. Awesome level and you have to not use the homing attack if you want the best times.
 

[Nintex]

Member
So I bought it today and played it untill the second casino stage and to my surprise my screen wasn't covered in shit and vomit. I like the visuals, colourz - blue skies and all that and it's not nearly as bad as some other Sonic games. The music to my surprise actually fits the game well even though Jun Senoue went totally overboard :lol . It feels like a mix between classic Sonic and Sonic Rush so it might not be a Mega Drive 16-bit Sonic 4 but it's still pretty fun and plays well.
 

[Nintex]

Member
On the physics thing, I'm not surprised they're like this, the game is quite easy because of the physics and that obviously fits with the current (more casual) gaming crowd they're going for.
 

Combichristoffersen

Combovers don't work when there is no hair
The more I play this, the angrier I get.

And the bonus levels, god fucking damn. So awful. I'm stuck at the third bonus level, always run out of time.

Fuck this shitty excuse of a game, imma play Sonic 2. Again.
 

Roto13

Member
Combichristoffersen said:
The more I play this, the angrier I get.

And the bonus levels, god fucking damn. So awful. I'm stuck at the third bonus level, always run out of time.

Fuck this shitty excuse of a game, imma play Sonic 2. Again.
If you're about to run out of time, you can pause and restart it without having to do the whole act over again. In case you weren't aware.

I got all of the chaos emeralds today. The fifth one was the hardest. Sixth was easy and the seventh wasn't too bad.
 

Combichristoffersen

Combovers don't work when there is no hair
Roto13 said:
If you're about to run out of time, you can pause and restart it without having to do the whole act over again. In case you weren't aware.

In the special stages? I might have to try that. Thanks for the tip.

The special stages still suck though :p
 

Shads

Member
Thank goodness for demos. I guess I was suckered into the Sonic Cycle this time (I never caved in for any 3D Sonic games since Sonic Adventure 2) and I was pretty eager and optimistic about this game regardless on what I heard or seen prior to the game's release, but wow, I think its an insult that they called this Sonic the Hedgehog 4. It's not a terrible game, but it shouldn't be considered the spiritual successor to the Genesis Sonics.

I think the graphics are fine, I do like the clean look of the game, though I do think the videos out there of the 2.5D Sonic remakes look even better, but I don't have any problems with the look of the game. My only problem is Sonic's full speed run animation looks a bit awkward and I hate how he spreads his arms and legs whenever he comes off a ramp. Otherwise, the look and level design felt like a Sonic game.

I haven't heard much of the soundtrack except for the 2 songs in the demo, but I think its okay. It pays some homage to the old Genesis music, but I didn't think they were as catchy as the previous Sonic games, but of course, I haven't heard the rest. At least it's not the Sonic rock music.

And of course, what majority of people are complaining about are the controls. Just wrong. I'm in disbelief that they couldn't get that right after all these years. All they had to do was download any of the Sonic games on XBLA, Virtual Console, or PSN to find out what it should be like. Perhaps it was their intention to make it "fresh" for the new generation, but for a project that they seem so dear on going back to its "roots", it's hypocritical of them to change so much of the controls and physics of the originals. The controls aren't unplayable for sure, but it just doesn't feel right. Especially if you're someone that owns Sonic 1, 2, 3, & Knuckles, then jump into 4; it's hard to adjust to what you're comfortable with and what everyone feels how Sonic should move in 2D. I don't even think Sonic Rush has this physics, but I could be wrong, I haven't played that in a long time. At first, I didn't believe in what people were saying on these forums on how they could mess up the controls, but they certainly did; no exaggeration about it.

Also, I'm not so sure about how they're going "old school" for this one where they wanted it to be more similar to Sonic 1 over any other Sonic game. I thought the progression in sequels usually builds upon the previous one. Like how levels got bigger over 2 and 3&K, how there were storytelling elements added, the addition of new power-ups, Tails (2-player coop), etc. But this one, they went backwards where it just seemed that they were too afraid to add too much because they knew they'd mess that up even more, but the improvements is what I looked forward to from each iteration of the Genesis Sonics. Sure, they added homing attacks, but it felt the game was too easy with that, which again, could have been their intention. I would've preferred them going back to the different shield mechanics from 3&K as it kept it interesting on depending which shield you had allowed you to explore different areas and added to the gameplay. Perhaps in Episode 2 (if they even make it), they'd bring these things back, but it was disappointing to see that there wasn't anything new or any previous power-ups that were retained in this game besides the original shield.

Yes, its unfair to make judgment on a demo, but I think I got a good idea what the rest of the game will be like and from reading plenty of GAF's rants, my assumption is probably not far off. I think on its own merits, the game seems okay. I'm just more disappointed with it that they called it "4". This really should've been a new spinoff if they really wanted the Genesis Sonic fans to get off their backs on this, but they took the risk and opened the can of worms and this is the result of it. I would consider buying it for $5, maybe $10, but not $15 as this is not the Sonic game I waited 16 years for.
 

Anth0ny

Member
Maaaaaaaaaaaaan, fuck the final boss.

first part is standard Sonic 2 procedure, second part is same shit but with flying limbs and lasers, and then the floor just fucking collapses. WHAT DO I DO WHEN THE FLOOR BENEATH ME COLLAPSES
 
Anth0ny said:
Maaaaaaaaaaaaan, fuck the final boss.

first part is standard Sonic 2 procedure, second part is same shit but with flying limbs and lasers, and then the floor just fucking collapses. WHAT DO I DO WHEN THE FLOOR BENEATH ME COLLAPSES
Hit him before the floor breaks.
 

clav

Member
Combichristoffersen said:
The more I play this, the angrier I get.

And the bonus levels, god fucking damn. So awful. I'm stuck at the third bonus level, always run out of time.

Fuck this shitty excuse of a game, imma play Sonic 2. Again.
Wait until you get to the 7th emerald stage. You have to collect every single ring.

Most of them.
 

JimboJones

Member
Anth0ny said:
Maaaaaaaaaaaaan, fuck the final boss.

first part is standard Sonic 2 procedure, second part is same shit but with flying limbs and lasers, and then the floor just fucking collapses. WHAT DO I DO WHEN THE FLOOR BENEATH ME COLLAPSES


You only need to hit him one more time, he lands where the targeting reticule stops,bash him on the head but it is pretty cheap killing you if you miss or have no idea what to do
 
Picked up the Sonic Ultimate Genesis Collection today for some comparisons since I haven't played the originals in awhile and man, I already miss homing. I didn't think I would like it watching the preview videos but Sonic without it just doesn't feel like Sonic anymore. There's a lot I don't like about Sonic 4 but there's enough good to keep me replaying it and picking up the sequels.

JimboJones said:
You only need to hit him one more time, he lands where the targeting reticule stops,bash him on the head but it is pretty cheap killing you if you miss or have no idea what to do

Yeah, I died for a few days on that part of the boss because I couldn't figure it out. I assumed I couldn't hit him because of the electricity around him.
 

btkadams

Member
Roto13 said:
If you're about to run out of time, you can pause and restart it without having to do the whole act over again. In case you weren't aware.

I got all of the chaos emeralds today. The fifth one was the hardest. Sixth was easy and the seventh wasn't too bad.
im struggling with the seventh so badly. is there a walkthrough for it or some tips? i like last 3 seconds before whipping into the red. i'm not even sure im going the right way either...because i never even get close to seeing any emerald haha.
 

clav

Member
btkadams said:
im struggling with the seventh so badly. is there a walkthrough for it or some tips? i like last 3 seconds before whipping into the red. i'm not even sure im going the right way either...because i never even get close to seeing any emerald haha.
Remember if you don't hit the exit goal, you can always restart the level by pausing and hitting retry.

The emerald is right there from a start. You need 99 rings to open it.
 

Roto13

Member
btkadams said:
im struggling with the seventh so badly. is there a walkthrough for it or some tips? i like last 3 seconds before whipping into the red. i'm not even sure im going the right way either...because i never even get close to seeing any emerald haha.

There's not really any right or wrong way. The right way is everywhere there's rings. :p The emerald is right behind the gate(s). You actually have plenty of time to do it if you collect every time boost you see. I finished with like 20 or 30 seconds left.

The seventh special stage is interesting because it's non-linear. Just don't stress out, explore, try not to backtrack if you can help it, and you'll be fine.

I actually got the seventh emerald on my second or third try.
 

Teknoman

Member
I retract my statement about not liking Sonic CD's US tracks. Awesome stuff as well (currently messing around in Collision Chaos zone).
 

Roto13

Member
Apparently I'm an old pro at the final boss now. He's not so tough once you know not to touch him, and how to dodge his attacks. He only has three. :p
 

Iknos

Junior Member
IrishNinja said:

The whole point about semantics is not about enjoyment. Calling a spade a spade isn't about "enjoyment".

Got a text from my cousin...says that Sonic 4 is a piece of shit and boycotting Sega from now on. I wasn't planning on touching it but he ripped it apart to the point where I couldn't resist.

We put maybe hundreds of hours into the series on his Genesis...it is a slap in the face for Sega to release shit like this.

Agree that the physics suck but its the graphics and music sucking too that has me jaded. No effort went into this game.

Feels like it was made by people who didn't even play the originals. Like it was programmed in a sweat shop with child labor in India or somewhere. Showed their child artists some YouTube footage of Sonic 2 levels and they were told to recreate it.

Against.
 

Anth0ny

Member
JimboJones said:
You only need to hit him one more time, he lands where the targeting reticule stops,bash him on the head but it is pretty cheap killing you if you miss or have no idea what to do

Seriously, how the hell was I supposed to know that :lol

Picked up the Sonic Ultimate Genesis Collection today for some comparisons since I haven't played the originals in awhile and man, I already miss homing. I didn't think I would like it watching the preview videos but Sonic without it just doesn't feel like Sonic anymore. There's a lot I don't like about Sonic 4 but there's enough good to keep me replaying it and picking up the sequels.

You want to play Sonic Megamix. Find it, play it, love it, thank me later.
 
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