tiggerkiddo
Member
Seems silly to hate the game just because of it's flawed special stage system. Come on now, you're better than that!
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Sonic the Hedgehog Community Thread: Green Hills and Laughing Iizukas
- Thread starter Professor Beef
- Start date
- Status
I didn't like the game to begin with. Toooo much holding right and boring level design!
tiggerkiddo
Member
But the Genesis games had me holding right all the time! That was the only real direction you had to go...right right right right right right right right RIGHT! Sing it with me!
Shadow Hog
Member
I need to find hax for the Chao Garden again so I may receive glorious Knuckles Chao and other rare Chao.
unlike sonic I dont chuckle
Advance 1 gogogo
unlike sonic I dont chuckle
Advance 1 gogogo
tiggerkiddo
Member
This is why we all hate Marble Zone.
Knuckles Chao is the dopest of dopes to ever live a dopingest life.
I always liked Advance 1 so no problem. Hey maybe this can give me motivation to work more on that project (even though I haven't been neglecting it at all)
tiggerkiddo
Member
And I want play by play feedback when you play through Advance 2. If you hate, eyeballs will be poked.
The special stages are the worst in the entire series, no doubt. Sky Canyon is text book shit level design, no doubt.
Other than that, the game was fast and furious and had decent platforming. That's all I ask for in a Sonic game.
There was a bit of a fad in the Jazz Jackrabbit 2 community for a while in which people would design levels that, through a combination of springs, wind currents, and tubes, could be navigated without ever having to jump. They were praised for their elegance and widely played.
And then after a while everyone collectively realized that deemphasizing one of the core mechanics made for really boring and predictable gameplay and stopped doing it.
Sonic Advance 2 is that fad.
And then after a while everyone collectively realized that deemphasizing one of the core mechanics made for really boring and predictable gameplay and stopped doing it.
Sonic Advance 2 is that fad.
Shadow Hog
Member
I don't care for Advance 2.
The game had a good sense of speed, but did a very poor job of transitioning that speed into the segments where you were supposed to go slower, often times leading to you throttling head-first into a spike wall or a bottomless pit, purely because, unless you memorized every such cheap shot in every stage in the entire game (which is hard to do with such large levels), you wouldn't see them coming with enough time to react accordingly.
What's more, the stages were not well-designed for backward traversal; like, even the Genesis games had some paths that once you went down, you couldn't go back, but it was generally a lot less frequent and a lot more obvious when it happened, so if you wanted to try a second time at reaching the higher paths, you had the opportunity, whereas with Advance 2, if you missed the split-second opportunity you had to take the upper road, that was it, accept the lower path or restart the stage.
The bosses were rather annoying in design; although I admire that they tried something different and focused every boss around a single concept (that being chase bosses a la Mushroom Hill Zone Act 2), the execution left a bit to be desired as approaching the boss was sluggish, while getting knocked back was not particularly difficult to do (and the instant kill of Sky Canyon's boss is ugh). Worse, the final boss requires you to go through a marathon of all the game's bosses before you can reach it, and while they're gracious enough to halve the number of hits for each one, it's still very tedious.
And of course, there's the well-known asinine Special Stage entry requirement that required a FAQ due to point #2 making it too difficult to adequately explore the stages and figure out where each ring was. But frankly, after the effort of running through the stage in the EXACT the path they wanted you to take without fail just to reach the Special Stages in the first place, my thumbs hurt like HELL and were in no shape to take on the timed challenges that were in store - and failing meant doing the perfect seven ring run through a stage all over again. And you had to do this seven times for five characters to unlock everything. At this point it just becomes a chore, and it's no wonder it's the most notoriously bad part of the game.
On the plus side, the soundtrack was leaps and bounds better than the first game's, and the first game's was already very good. Also, as I noted earlier, the animations were even better than the first game's - after half-assing Sonic's run animation to something between his classic wheel o' feet run and his modern arms-behind-back run, they went purely for the latter, and were better off for it.
The game had a good sense of speed, but did a very poor job of transitioning that speed into the segments where you were supposed to go slower, often times leading to you throttling head-first into a spike wall or a bottomless pit, purely because, unless you memorized every such cheap shot in every stage in the entire game (which is hard to do with such large levels), you wouldn't see them coming with enough time to react accordingly.
What's more, the stages were not well-designed for backward traversal; like, even the Genesis games had some paths that once you went down, you couldn't go back, but it was generally a lot less frequent and a lot more obvious when it happened, so if you wanted to try a second time at reaching the higher paths, you had the opportunity, whereas with Advance 2, if you missed the split-second opportunity you had to take the upper road, that was it, accept the lower path or restart the stage.
The bosses were rather annoying in design; although I admire that they tried something different and focused every boss around a single concept (that being chase bosses a la Mushroom Hill Zone Act 2), the execution left a bit to be desired as approaching the boss was sluggish, while getting knocked back was not particularly difficult to do (and the instant kill of Sky Canyon's boss is ugh). Worse, the final boss requires you to go through a marathon of all the game's bosses before you can reach it, and while they're gracious enough to halve the number of hits for each one, it's still very tedious.
And of course, there's the well-known asinine Special Stage entry requirement that required a FAQ due to point #2 making it too difficult to adequately explore the stages and figure out where each ring was. But frankly, after the effort of running through the stage in the EXACT the path they wanted you to take without fail just to reach the Special Stages in the first place, my thumbs hurt like HELL and were in no shape to take on the timed challenges that were in store - and failing meant doing the perfect seven ring run through a stage all over again. And you had to do this seven times for five characters to unlock everything. At this point it just becomes a chore, and it's no wonder it's the most notoriously bad part of the game.
On the plus side, the soundtrack was leaps and bounds better than the first game's, and the first game's was already very good. Also, as I noted earlier, the animations were even better than the first game's - after half-assing Sonic's run animation to something between his classic wheel o' feet run and his modern arms-behind-back run, they went purely for the latter, and were better off for it.
Neo Green Hill Zone is not bad but why is there a random spike in the beach? Stop putting traps that does nothing but stop me from running, Dimps! It's the first stage for goodness' sake!
Oh look, a special stage spring!
It's kind of difficult to know where you're suppose to collect the rings. I missed a bunch thinking they're on the edge of the area.
...Was that a Chao?
Oh look, a special stage spring!
It's kind of difficult to know where you're suppose to collect the rings. I missed a bunch thinking they're on the edge of the area.
...Was that a Chao?
Meccanical
Member
I didn't know SEGA was having a sale on PSN, my hands moved own their own and bought SA2.
Chaos are an extra continue I believe.
Dark Schala
Eloquent Princess
There's a Sega sale on PSN?
I bought a PSN card for The Walking Dead, but... hmmmm... Sega sale...
I bought a PSN card for The Walking Dead, but... hmmmm... Sega sale...
Meccanical
Member
I think it was a sale anyway, SA2HD wasn't always 6.99 was it?
Dark Schala
Eloquent Princess
NiGHTS and SA2HD were $9.99.
Speaking of which, did NiGHTS get a control patch yet?
Meccanical
Member
That's what I heard.
Also damn that new PSN interface is butter smooth, I love it.
Seven Force
Banned
360 version did, haven't heard about the PS3 version yet.
tiggerkiddo
Member
I will buy Nights very soon then! Even though I've never played it before...
Secret Base is a cool level. I always like its theme song. I really do wish they added more outdoor sections.
CasinoNight Paradise! Wheeeeeeeeeeeeeee- OKAY WHO THE FUCK PUT A RISING SPIKE RIGHT NEXT TO A RAMP?
Oh look, a floating barrel that functions like Carnival Night Zone's barrel except you DO jump on it this time! Is this some stealth nod?
Casino
Oh look, a floating barrel that functions like Carnival Night Zone's barrel except you DO jump on it this time! Is this some stealth nod?
tiggerkiddo
Member
Less raging more playing! Only I'm allowed to rage while playing and only in puzzles and riddles and obscure statements that sound wrong!
I just hate when all of my rings goes to waste for no good reason
The game is enjoyable most of the times though. I hope it stays that way.
Shadow Hog
Member
It's kind of a shame that Stick Canyon's conveyor belts are still kinda broken, but honestly they were the worst part of the level anyway. I'm just glad they apparently fixed the digital flying; that'd have been inexcusable to stick with.
tiggerkiddo
Member
I just hate when all of my rings goes to waste for no good reason
The game is enjoyable most of the times though. I hope it stays that way.
Rings are like coins in New Super Bah Bah Bros 2...they don't mean jack. That's the game's way of telling you to free your mind, expand your horizons and let go of those guady and clunky things!
Yeah but you can't get them allll back. So disheartening when you lose all those hundred of beautiful rings... *sniff*
Anyways, time for Ice Mountain!
I don't think there's a Sonic game that lets you do that. I'm just saying it feels nice to get hit cause most of the time it doesn't matter, also it doesn't stun as you much! But yeah the Casino level is so good, I like it almost as much as the one in Sonic 2.
Yeah, I know they don't. I just find cheap spikes/enemy placements annoying, it's never the player's fault they lose their rings, it's just weak game design. Thankfully it hasn't ruined the fun of the game since they're not all over the place.
Also Casino Paradise is indeed great, although Casino Night wins because it has slot machines! Who doesn't find slot machines fun?!
Except for those times you luck out and lose all of your rings
EDIT: Uh, wow. Ice Mountain Act 2 is really short.
EDIT2: Boss fight? Not so much. lol
Chaotix technically did, if you had a big ring powerup at the time.
tiggerkiddo
Member
Mashing the directional buttons helps.
Hi Angel Island, long time no see.
Oh fuck you off-screen Buzzbombers.
Is there any reason why I can't spindash into the chameleons? Oh, looks like it was because of that gap... but still that shouldn't make it so I can't roll into the enemy.
By the way I just accidentally ran into a special spring and got the 6th and only chaos emerald. Funny.
oh hi metal knuckles
Egg Rocket is honestly an awful stage. What do you guys see in this level? Cosmic Angel is also awful. I can't tell if it's worse or not, I mean at least it doesn't have traps that forces you to backtrack but it sure has a lot of cheap shots.
Well... that was easy. Time to collect all of the emeralds!
Oh fuck you off-screen Buzzbombers.
Is there any reason why I can't spindash into the chameleons? Oh, looks like it was because of that gap... but still that shouldn't make it so I can't roll into the enemy.
By the way I just accidentally ran into a special spring and got the 6th and only chaos emerald. Funny.
oh hi metal knuckles
Egg Rocket is honestly an awful stage. What do you guys see in this level? Cosmic Angel is also awful. I can't tell if it's worse or not, I mean at least it doesn't have traps that forces you to backtrack but it sure has a lot of cheap shots.
Well... that was easy. Time to collect all of the emeralds!
It really does. It's a shame such an interesting concept gets wasted with bad level design.
7/10 game. Would of have been 8/10 if it weren't for the bad level design near the end and the cheap enemy placement.
tiggerkiddo
Member
I fear what you would rate Sonic Rush...especially after you play Altitude Limit...=D
It's official guys, Bah Bah Bros Wii has water levels worse than Sonic.
Bah Bah! do dodo do do do doo Bah Bah!
It's official guys, Bah Bah Bros Wii has water levels worse than Sonic.
Bah Bah! do dodo do do do doo Bah Bah!
I've grown to appreciate boost gameplay over the years, I might end up not hating Rush as much this time... or not because Dimps.
Impossible. No one can make a level worse than Blue Marine Zone.
tiggerkiddo
Member
One word.
Homing Squido.
Okay that's two but they hone in anyways so in actuality the first word doesn't even matter.
Bah Bah! Dimps is magical Bah Bah!
Seven Force
Banned
I never really had much of a problem with Egg Rocket (Cosmic Angel on the other hand...), although to be fair, it's been years since I've played Advance 1.
Maybe I should replay it to refresh my memory.
Maybe I should replay it to refresh my memory.
No, I shouldn't.
Dark Schala
Eloquent Princess
Does Bah Bah U have bad water levels? I can't remember Bah Bah Wii's. All I remember is that the physics in Mario games have changed a bit.
Man, water levels in Mario games used to be relatively decent. Even though I preferred Sonic over Mario by far back then, going back to something like Labyrinth Zone made me realize that Sonic was terrible about its water levels until Sonic 2/maybe 3's Hydrocity.
But then again, bringing in a time limit which made you manage your time carefully underwater was interesting--and then extending that to "the crappy route is the underwater one, so play flawlessly to stay out of the water on the top/middle path" was a neat idea.
TMNT for NES if anyone's unfamiliar.
You win.
tiggerkiddo
Member
Does Bah Bah U have bad water levels? I can't remember Bah Bah Wii's. All I remember is that the physics in Mario games have changed a bit.
Man, water levels in Mario games used to be relatively decent. Even though I preferred Sonic over Mario by far back then, going back to something like Labyrinth Zone made me realized that Sonic was terrible about its water levels until Sonic 2/maybe 3's Hydrocity.
But then again, bringing in a time limit which made you manage your time carefully underwater was interesting--and then extending that to "the crappy route is the underwater one, so play flawlessly to stay out of the water on the top/middle path" was a neat idea.
A bad water level is a water level. NO EXCEPTIONS. Just have Cosmic Mario swimming after me to complete the swirling, draining vortex of high powered sucking!
Seven Force
Banned
tiggerkiddo
Member
And that is?
Dark Schala
Eloquent Princess
Possibly the best water level in a Sonic game, period.
Seven Force
Banned
Aquarium Park from Colors. Sorry, should have put that in the post.
tiggerkiddo
Member
Hydrocity lives!
Don't believe Schala's lies!
Don't believe Schala's lies!
- Status