Dabaus
Banned
What’s the likely good someone like square gets bought out?
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Sony Business Thread [Quarterlies, Annual Financials, Share price, Acquisitions etc.]
- Thread starter Bryank75
- Start date
Burythelight
Member
Why focusing on square Enix? They have little talent left and many dickheads like nomura and toriyama. Just buy yoko taro company or yoshida team.
Dabaus
Banned
Im focusing on SE because they are probably the most important 3rd party partner Plsaystation has and their twitter feed is an xbox love fest. As a fan of their games and a fan of playstation the last thing i want to see for them is to get sucked into xboxs orbit.
lh032
I cry about Xbox and hate PlayStation.
SE has FF and DQ, which is my favorite, especially DQ
yea SE has incredible IP, especially dragon quest : O
Right. And as i said that perception means nothing in the grand scheme. It only pleases fans for forum talk.
On top of PS still getting Japanese exclusives.
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Why do you people keep falling for this?
MS kept Minecraft everywhere because it's a very successful and profitable franchise that played by kids and adults. Minecraft on one platform would be bad for business and cause a commotion from people who people who can't play the game anymore. So it made common sense that they would keep it multiplatform.
Their studios purchases have been 3rd party developers. 3rd party developers who would have games already in development on other consoles. MS can't just cancel those games so they still have to be released. MS takes these opportunities to the play the PR game on gullible people and make it seem like they're being the "good company" by allowing these games to still come out on other platforms. When in reality they have no choice. They tried to do ths again with Deathloop and Ghostwire tokyo. Phil saying "we'll honer the deal" when he knows damn well MS has no say in those exclusive contracts made by Sony and Bethesda. They were made before MS had anything to do with Bethesda.
Double Fine's game Psychonauts 2 is bound by the same rules. But guess what? There is no PS5 version and i doubt it'll be getting any graphics patches after release. All these games are just completing their development on the platform they're on. It's not MS being nice.
Sony on the other hand has never bought a 3rd party multiplatform developer. All the developers they bought were already making games for PS. After a successful relationship Sony buys them and brings them into first party studios. The same thing is happening right in front of us with Jade Raymond's new studio. There is no illusion games to play about Sony letting the games stay on other platforms since there are no games from those developers on other platforms.
If Sony were to buy Square Enix or Sega, yes of course current games already on Switch and Xbox will still be there. They wouldn't remove those games like people foolishly assume they would.
KingT731
Member
means a lot to casuals when they just want to play 3 or 4 games.
yurinka
Member
Yes, isn't MS being nice. It's just them making business, which is perfectly fine.
MS released Minecraft Dungeons less than a year ago, but bought Minecraft 6 years ago. Psychonauts 2 will be released on PS4, which means it will be playable on PS5. It doesn't seem the type of game where they release a next gen native version. MS said that at least some future Zenimax (so Bethesda) games beyond those already signed will also release on other consoles even if at least some after a timed console exclusivity on Xbox ("first or best on Xbox"). Ori games are on Switch.
I meant that the difference between Sony and MS wasn't only for the previous or already signed games (only partly), I meant for the future ones. Obviously when Sony bought Insomniac didn't remove Sunset Overdrive from the stores, it wouldn't make sense. I meant that once Sony bought them (like Psygnosis/Liverpool Studio, games like Wipeout were multi before being bought by Sony), they started to make exclusive games only. Same goes with the other studios previously bought by Sony, like Media Molecule or Naughty Dog.
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AHA-Lambda
Member
Only just seen this but damn this is big stuff if it pans out. I’m sure the Bethesda buy out has scared Sony after all.
I’d rather see Persona etc on game pass but oh well this may at least give me a reason to get a ps5 now
I’d rather see Persona etc on game pass but oh well this may at least give me a reason to get a ps5 now
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SaucyJack
Member
I really don’t believe that the Bethesda buyout has “scared Sony” at all. Sony will have always had a strategy for expanding their Worldwide Studios, through organic growth and acquisition and the PS4 era has given them a shit ton of cash to execute that strategy. Whilst they have the cash to buy a Squeenix or a Sega that hasn’t traditionally been their style, they’re far more likely to pick up a Housemarque or Remedy.
MS may have acquired a bunch of studios, but they’ve yet to translate that into any sort of productivity, hence why were always talking about backwards compatibility and Gamepass. This is interesting in itself as Phil Spencer seems to have been allowed to keep on buying despite not yet demonstrating that he can make their existing portfolio of studios productive at all. We joke sometimes about how unproductive and unprolific Polyphony is for Playstation, sometimes it feels like all of the Xbox studios are like that!
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Bo_Hazem
Banned
What's funnier is that the first 2 next gen Xbox 1st party games are PS5 exclusives.
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SaucyJack
Member
What's funnier is that the first 2 next gen Xbox 1st party games are PS5 exclusives.
True, it’s certainly ironic.
But to me the real issue is in 2018 they had 14 first party studios yet they will not have a first party exclusive next gen title until Halo Infinite circa 12 months after the new console generation started. That is criminally poor studio management.
YeulEmeralda
Linux User
But they lost Neogaf's mandate of Heaven.
YeulEmeralda
Linux User
Could be that MS is trying to get mindshare. Diluting PS as the home for Japanese games.
How do you fight such a powerful name in the gaming industry? Undermine them. Not a bad strategy if you can write the cheques. Xbox did it before after all.
Heisenberg007
Gold Journalism
That is true. I'm surprised that Xbox is facing a drought of first-party exclusives during a console launch year, and instead of working and releasing 1 finished game as soon as possible, their development studios are working on multiple projects (Obsidian working on 5-6 projects; PlayGround working on at least 2 games; Ninja Theory was/is working on at least 3 games).
Bryank75
Banned
Yes, back up to nearly 136 Billion market cap.
On the strength of a new business they opened... something to do with ecology management through high-tech. Sounds interesting.
Their share-buyback scheme also ended without them buying any stock, which boosted the value a lot.
It's still quite a bit away from the high it reached after last quarter when it reached around 145 billion or so.
Hopefully it can sustain that soon and break the ceiling.
fighterman101
Banned
It is kind of funny Sony is help funding / promoting these 2 timed exclusive games. If these games become big new franchises, it will only help Microsoft in the long run because the future titles in these franchises can be permanently exclusive to xbox and help grow it's brand. Kind of reminds me of what is going on with Hell Blade 2.What's funnier is that the first 2 next gen Xbox 1st party games are PS5 exclusives.
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but everything is pretty much a long run game when it comes to Microsoft. Wait till next E3 has been Microsoft's mantra all last gen. Thankfully they bought several studios so this actually might work in 2 more E3s. I really don't have much hope for this e3 because covid.
This pretty much solidifies my opinion that xbox is going to dominate the last half of this gen. Sony has the strong start but xbox wins the marathon.
What's funnier is that the first 2 next gen Xbox 1st party games are PS5 exclusives.
And a 3rd would have been exclusive in MLB 21 until MLB no doubt forced Sony to put in on XBOX
Ya...and meanwhile Sony released FF7 Remake(timed exclusive not 1st party), Last of Us 2, Ghosts of T, Demon Souls, Miles Morales with MLB Show(MultiPlat now), Returnal, Deathloop and Ratchet and Clank all literally within like a year period. And then I assume Kena, Ghostwire Tokyo, Horizon and possibly GOW in the next year window and maybe more titles ?
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TKOFromTokyo
Member
I completely agree. This might be the weakest 1st party launch lineup that I can remember.
Everyone in MS that is in Marketing and PR should get massive raises tbh.
Bo_Hazem
Banned
Let's wait for years until we say how all these titles turn out under MS.
Bryank75
Banned
It's not a dividend stock really. Coke or microsoft are div stocks. Sony is growth... and is rated a number 1 strong buy by nearly all analysts right now.
So ok Sony buing Sega JAPAN makes kind of sense (Persona, Yakuza, Sonic etc)
But.. what would they do with their western studios? The pretty much make pc stuff like RTS and strategy games - these do not really make sense for Sony from a first party perspective
And Sega has more western developers making strategy games than they have japanese devs making jrpg and platformers...
This does not make sense
KingT731
Member
They absolutely should. They convinced their base that they didn't want new games. It's actually crazy how well it worked after being on the power train at the reveal.
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Bryank75
Banned
Football Manager would be massive if they developed a full featured console exclusive with loads of social features.
The Total War series would be fine on console, particularly Shogun but they could put it on their subscription service and launch it on PC close to dy nd date due to it being so traditionally PC based. It's a small issue and if it didn't work out, it could be spun off.
TKOFromTokyo
Member
I’d also argue that dividend yield is not nearly as interesting as dividend growth rate. I’d gladly take a dividend aristocrat with a strong dividend growth rate but low yield. That tells me the company has a lot of room to grow and that there is a lot of headroom for dividend growth as well.
YeulEmeralda
Linux User
Well I want to say something positive about Microsoft: they are in it for the long haul.
Unlike Google Stadia.
Its like a poker game. MS had two choices: fold or go all in. I think its clear Xbox isn't going away.
Perrott
Member
I don't know any specifics regarding what their plans would be for the western studios, so what I am going to say next is purely my own speculation, but I would assume that they would continue releasing the Total War and Football Manager series on PC (like Sony Online Entertainment used to do with their MMOs) and maybe throw in some console version for certain titles. In addition to that, I could see Relic Entertainment being put to work on a strategy game aimed at both PC and console (I'm thinking of an XCOM type of game, maybe even based on some Sony IP such as Killzone or Resistance). And regarding Creative Assembly, it is well known that the Alien Isolation team has been working for quite a while on a new FPS IP, so that's some console-focused stuff that should be near to completion.
Ass of Can Whooping
Gold Member
Lol dividends are probably the last thing I pay attention to in a stock
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yurinka
Member
Football Manager, strategy games, stuff like Alien Isolation... these things would give more diversity for PS Now, specially for its PC version. And if Sony starts to release more PC games (even if old ports of previous gen games) it would help them. Sega would be a good fit for both Sony, Nintendo and Microsoft. In all 3 cases I assume they would get rid of the arcade division (with maybe Sony as exception, if they want to support the FGC an arcade Virtua Fighter would be great specially for the Japanese scene).
All the future games you mention are announced for this year (there are more, like Guilty Gear Strive). GoW maybe gets delayed to early next year, like Gran Turismo 7. Without any kind of doubt Sony releases way more big (and small, too) exclusives per year.
No, PS4 have been selling consoles and games at game history records. PS5 is outselling it even if heavyly supply constrained. Once they have enough stock it will sell bananas. I think that in the first half of the generation PS5 is going to create an insane lead and market share domination so big that even if MS will reduce it a bit in the second half PS5 will continue clearly dominating.
Ninja Theory, Obsidian and specially Zenimax had good sales, but all of them combined represented a very small part of the total PS4 game sales (over 1500 million games sold and counting), and the impact of MS subscriptions vs Sony subscriptions doesn't seem to be as of now important (Sony continue having a huge lead in subscriptions thanks to PS+), and will be less once Sony starts to rework PS Now for this gen. A few gaffers may make a lot of noise, but the numbers say Sony is on fire, and they have been growing the headcount in their studios and mentioned to be interested on acquisitions. So in the future we may see more frequently games made by Santa Monica, Naughty Dog, Guerrilla, Bend, Insomniac or Media Molecule plus a few new 1st party studios they may buy in the next year or two.
For years MS has been slowly moving their gaming division from Xbox to Windows, there their main business is. This generation will be the first one where since day one all their 'exclusive' games will be on PC too since day one so people with a gaming PC will have less reasons to buy their console. They sacrificed console sales in favor of PC. They also sacrified game sales in favor of Gamepass. They made a big investment on first party studios but many of them continued or will continue releasing some of their games (some of them after a timed console exclusive) on other consoles.
They made an all in long term bet sacrificing Xbox and all their gaming division in favor of Gamepass even giving away big AAA games day one for almost free. If it ends working, nice. If it doesn't work, it will be difficult to recover and go back to the traditonal model that is so successful in Sony's and Nintendo's side.
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Ass of Can Whooping
Gold Member
The capital gains are going to blow past dividends. Going all in on Sony
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TKOFromTokyo
Member
I mostly agree, except if you’re closer to retirement age or looking to balance out your retirement funds a bit. I’m mostly in growth stocks, but I have about 15% of my portfolio in dividend aristocrats. I’ve calculated it out that given historic returns, I could probably live on my pension and dividends in retirement without having to withdraw my main balances until required age.
I agree.
They are adapting to their current situation in the market. And I dont think they are done adapting.
Ass of Can Whooping
Gold Member
Yeah dividends are something i'd potentially look at once i've got like, half a mill or something already invested
At just shy of £100K right now though it's just wasted potential imo. Much rather go all in on growth. That said I've got a substantial amount invested in Apple & Microsoft so i should see that dividend growth down the line too
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Perrott
Member
Late April I guess.
Microsoft isn’t really one too at .88% coke is a better buy. Good dividends companies are like Vanguard, O, P&G
Bryank75
Banned
Last few years Sony reported Q4 on 13th of May...I'd expect that to remain the same this year.
Q1 impressions or some data could come before, during or after that point.
This is why Sony starts strong and Microsoft still wins the race. Sony is still on a high from the ps4 plus a new console is going to sell like crazy is going to sell like crazy anyways for the first few months.
The issue isn't really how many games they sold in the past but how many gamers the zenimax purchase will pull over to xbox. Doom, elder scrolls, and fall out are still beloved franchises so folks will be hyped to hear news about them. For the growing headcount in their studios. Outside of Insomniac most of the Sony studios just released at most 2 games last gen and Santa Monica ,Bend, plus Media Molecule just released only 1. So we get what maybe 2 games per studio for this gen plus Covid happened. I would love it if Sony's first party studios expanded to the point they looked more like mini AAA third part publishers. I can't say I would be filled with hype for the new studio purchases unless it is Japanese. Blue point although nice would be a what took you so long to acquire this studio.
I always see this come up.
Do you mean getting rid of their PS5? Ppl still on PS4 or XBO and choosing Xbox?
My thing is each platform offers something, including Nintendo. And to switch platforms somewhere in that person's mind they know they have to give up something. No matter which platform it is. Ppl that played any of Sony's exclusives will have to give up the eventual sequel. If the current gap stays the way it is and ppl just get both consoles....MS will still come in 2nd in market share, maybe 3rd if counting the Switch.
I can see ppl getting both PS5 and a Series console. I can see that alot more than ppl switching that already have a PS5. Ppl arent gonna switch in droves because of Zenimax. I can see Game Pass having more of a pull than Zenimax.
If you mean ppl still on last gen and ppl that dont have either platform, thats a different story. Even then the same applies, because Sony exclusives that many played were on PS4. But ppl still on last gen and who dont have either platform is the key.
As amazing as Nintendo exclusives are and sell, they don't hurt PS4 or PS5 sales.
v_iHuGi
Banned
Bro, being delusional won't help you in life.
Ps5 will completely crush SX even if SX was free, the brand doesn't exist in Europe & Asia.
I could come here saying PS5 will destroy Switch in Japan but again delusion won't get me nowhere.
Bo_Hazem
Banned
Could be their last breath anyway, when ARM smashes x86 then that sweet pool of money would shrink really badly for the parent company.
yurinka
Member
Let's see, last gen:
-Insomniac and Japan Studio released a lot of games last gen.
-Media Molecule last gen released Tearaway, Tearaway Unfolded, Dreams and did help with LBP Vita and LBP3 (plus Sackboy for PS5).
-Santa Monica released GoW 3 Remastered, GoW 2018, had to cancel a game that was into production, incubated several indie studios/games and this year is supposed to release GoWR.
-Bend released Uncharted Golden Abyss, Uncharted Fight for Fortune, Days Gone, is working on its PC port and pretty likely next year will release DG2.
-Guerrilla released Killzone Shadow Fall, Horizon, did help with Killzone Mercenary or Death Stranding, and this year releases HZD PC port and Horizon 2.
-Naughty Dog released TLOUR, Uncharted Collection, U4, Lost Legacy, TLOU2, did help on the Vita Uncharted games and hosts the ICE team and is supposed to work on TLOU2 MP which sounds may end being a separate game.
-Sucker Punch released Infamous Second Son, First Light and GoT.
-San Diego released 7 MLB games and did help Guns Up!, Kill Strain, Drawn to Death and StarBlood Arena.
-London released 4 titles and did help in other ones.
-They also have Polyphony (GTS) and Pixel Opus (new team, 2 PS4 games).
-Evolution released DC before shutting down.
In addition to this they released a ton of 2nd party games (Quantic Dream, From Software, Bluepoint, RAD, Supermassive, Housemarque and many other ones).
So what are you talking about? Sony has an insane output of 1st and 2n party output. And most of their studios reported to be growing and/or to have grown a lot in the recent years and Sony said they will acquire more studios. If MS has been buying a lot of studios recently is because Sony has and had a way bigger output of first (and second) party games so they want to catch up and to be more or less in the same level in the future. These recently purchased studios won't start releasing big next gen exclusive games until at least late 2022.
The think is, we know some of the studios purchased by MS will continue releasing games on PS after signed the deals, some of them with timed console exclusivity. So the impact of these exclusivities will be smaller than the already small impact we could expect considering their sales were a tiny portion of the over 1.5 Billion games (and counting) sold on PS4.
Sony has a super top notch 1st (and 2nd) party output in terms of amount of games, GOTY candidates and awards and sales. And since they are growing, they will have more in the future. Microsoft has a long road to make not to pass, but to match Sony's output.
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Heisenberg007
Gold Journalism
1. I'm genuinely curious what race is that? When did it happen? How are you measuring MS's win?
2. Actually, no. It will take a long, long time for MS to recoup that investment cost. "The issue" is when will MS start earning incremental profit from Bethesda properties in excess of $7.5B.
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For the list of games released nearly half of the games you mentioned were either ports to the ps4 or pc. Japan Studios is nearly dead. The other portion was them assisting other studios to make games. Am I suppose to be impressed by this. A big gripe folks had at the start of the last generation was all of the ps3 ports to ps4 at the start. Like did you look at what they released after your list. Ports to ps4, ports to pc, assisting other studios, and nearly dead to dead studios. I think the only one to throw me off was London Studio and that is only because I'm not into singstar or vr. Sure Sony has great 1st party studios and many of the 2nd party studios ventured off into going more multiplat last gen.
They are playing the long game with video games. Of course the investment is going to take some time to recoup. I wouldn't be surprised if it took the whole gen for them to do so. It took them nearly a whole gen to get their studios and xbox brand at a decent state and half that is because of bc and gamepass. We all know that first party has been Microsoft's weakness when it come to xbox and now they have supposedly fixed it.
Yeah, that is xbox biggest weakness is those markets but right now what they need to focus on is Europe and making sure all of the Japanese games comes to xbox.
I would just like to say I don't think that the PS5 is going to be utterly crushed this gen. I'm not saying PS5 is doomed. I'm saying that Sony's actions seem to be very relaxed after their win last gen. I doubt they would have purchased Insomniac if Microsoft hadn't scared them in to doing so. Them expanding their studios is fairly normal thing to do. Studios get bigger over time and it takes more developers to make these big detailed open worlds. My opinion is that these studios should have doubled or tripled in size since it was taking so long to make games anyways.
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