A Togami brainswashed into being a Junko, kill 2 birds with one stone
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[SPOILERS] Dangan Ronpa 2 Spoiler Thread | Aloha, Despair!
- Thread starter Nachos
- Start date
A Togami brainswashed into being a Junko, kill 2 birds with one stone
SolarKnight
Member
Well, considering Makoto was involved I'm sure that in the worst case we can just default to some ultimate luck bullshit being involved
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If you don't get it it
For a while, I thought all of the surviving characters might have been the survivors from the first game in VR avatars with their memories erased.
Yes it was a crackpot theory, but some of parallels between the two groups set me off.
The Akane/Hina, Nagito/Makoto and Byakuya/Byakuya similarities were definitely weird, exacerbated when Nagito pointed out the similarities between the first murders of the Killing School Life with the first murders of the Killing School Trip and suggested Monokuma might have something to do with that (which I suppose was simply a coincidence, in the end).
Really wished they would have explained that better.
I honestly thought Chiaki and Hajime going on about making a new future was a dumb move on their part. I mean if they forget everything then they won't even remember the fact that they gained he resolve to do that. They should literally be reset to Ultimate Despairs and any revelation they had would be wiped. So why would it matter how much you want to change your future if you won't remember it when you wake up?
And then he somehow did. There were so many things from Chapter 6 I wanted more elaboration on.
Thanks everyone for that info! That really is exciting! I hope it comes out sooner rather than later, especially seeing as Zero Escape 3 may never come out...
What's everyone's ranking of the chapters? I feel like the closer Nagito got to something, the better the chapter, personally, which made the game have high and low points in weird places.
Personally, here's how I rank it:
Class Trial Ranking:
Ch5>Ch1>Ch2>Ch6>Ch3>>>>>>Ch4
Outside of Class trial Content:
Ch5>Ch4>Ch6>Ch1>Ch3>Ch2
Personally, here's how I rank it:
Class Trial Ranking:
Ch5>Ch1>Ch2>Ch6>Ch3>>>>>>Ch4
Outside of Class trial Content:
Ch5>Ch4>Ch6>Ch1>Ch3>Ch2
Re: Makoto and Nagito
I'm surprised at the amount of people who thought Makoto and Nagito were one in the same. Maybe it's because Megumi Ogata's Nagito sounded vastly different from Makoto, or maybe it's because I went through his free time event (where he reveals the nature of his Talent, which was much different than Makoto's) but at no point did I think they were the same person. The parallels were pretty obvious, but I figured it was just one of the many, many parallels to the first game.
Plus it's right in the profile. Makoto is 5'3, and Nagito is 5'11
@_@
I'm surprised at the amount of people who thought Makoto and Nagito were one in the same. Maybe it's because Megumi Ogata's Nagito sounded vastly different from Makoto, or maybe it's because I went through his free time event (where he reveals the nature of his Talent, which was much different than Makoto's) but at no point did I think they were the same person. The parallels were pretty obvious, but I figured it was just one of the many, many parallels to the first game.
Plus it's right in the profile. Makoto is 5'3, and Nagito is 5'11
@_@
The only point where I ever thought to myself they might've been the same person was the creepy Chapter 0 interlude where Nagito shows off his, uh, arm, and maybe Makoto was went... really, really crazy. But I was fairly confident that they wouldn't undermine the whole lynch-pin of Makoto's character arc in DR1 in the first place, so it wasn't much more than passing suspicion.
I figured Makoto went through a growth spurt and several years. Unfortunately, you can only go through Nagito's free time in the first chapter, so most people would miss it. That and the english version has Makoto and Nagito sounding very similar. Also, a lot of the things he says about hope and despair sounds exactly like the stuff Makoto was spouting in the last trial in DR1, but twisted.
Edit:
Also when he came down with the despair disease and said "My real name isn't Nagito Komaeda." I thought that was proof, figuring that his despair disease forced him to say the opposite of what he'd normally say, not necessarily lies.
It's unclear when DR2 takes place in relation to DR1 at the start. From his name, to his looks, to his voice actor (which sounds the same?), to his talent, to his obsession with hope, to his love for Hope's Peak, to Byakuya—another survivor's presence—I think it's pretty clear that he was meant to make players who knew about Makoto confused about what his real identity was.
RurouniZel
Asks questions so Ezalc doesn't have to
Yeah, when she died I actually smiled and said "FINALLY!" I don't usually do that in these sorts of stories/games.
I figured by the end of chapter 1 people would know that he isn't Makoto due to the huge personality difference.
Aw, well at least she was trying to change a bit. Going at a slower pace than Fuyuhiko, maybe, but it seemed like she was coming around to the group in her own way, except for Mikan.
Unrelated: This game's voice acting was generally way better than the first game. They did a great job, though I'm not too sure I was into Teruteru's accent.
I personally wasn't ever really sure Nagito was Makoto, but I was always wary of the possibility, especially after his personality change. Are you saying it's out of the realm of possibility for this series to have characters go through dramatic personality changes?
Nagito's "breakdown" seemed exactly like what would happen if Makoto went into the negative instead of the positive, after being badly, psychologically affected by the Killing School Life he went through.
Actually, the ranting about hope from despair sounded a lot like Makoto would if he went insane. The final trial in DR 1 has him saying very similar things.
Yeah, that's pretty much what I was thinking. Either that or it was some kind of anti-Makoto engineered by Ultimate Despair.
Also, Makoto is short! How tall is Hajime?
http://hinatahearsahope.tumblr.com/post/96574596353/this-is-all-i-know-about-the-6th-trial-of
accurate summary of the ending of danganronpa 2
Crash Station
Member
Screw the overarching plot, Nagito is the reason you need to play DR1 before 2. Going from a more black and white exchange about hope and despair in the first game only to have it turned on its head when Nagito starts rambling is such a great moment that really drives the point home you're in for a ride and not a retread.
I wish this was Makoto's personality.
Also, I totally forgot there was that bit where Hajime went all super saiyan. I guess they couldn't go the whole game without doing it again.
I'm well aware of the fact he was designed to throw off players going into DR2. It's just that after actually playing the game, I figured that more players would discount that as an possibility (especially after the 1st chapter)
- I don't recall Makoto ever having a love for Hope's Peak academy. In fact, I seem to remember him being apprehensive about going there.
- Makoto is not obsessed with Hope. He describes himself as a person "who is a little more optimistic than most" and that's reflected subtly in his characterization throughout the events of DR1. (Refer to chapter 4's beginning as the most prominent example) It's only when he corners Junko that he becomes "The Ultimate Hope" and it's never even remotely implied that he has an obsession with Hope during or after that point.
- They have the same voice actor in both versions. It's just that his ENG VA sounds relatively similar for both characters whereas his JPN VA has a completely different take for Nagito.
And like Moonlight mentioned, I just don't think they'd toss his character development under the bus for a cheap trick.
dakkumauji
Member
Also, I totally forgot there was that bit where Hajime went all super saiyan. I guess they couldn't go the whole game without doing it again.
It's probably a Danganronpa thing now, at least one character in every game has to go super saiyan.
I wouldn't mind Monokuma, I just hope they don't bring Junko back again. I mean, she said it herself: (Paraphrasing here) "Bringing out the Mastermind at the last minute is so lame, but I do it all the time anyway."
Edit:
He did research on all the Ultimates beforehand, had great respect for them, and seemed to feel inadequate among them. Nagito mentions that he actually wanted to turn down his invitation to Hope's Peak academy.
As for obsession with hope, his inner monologue during DR 1 has a lot of Hope vs Despair talk.
I will give that the "Even my mother has never given me compliment" line does show a difference.
From Best to Worst ---
Class Trial:
Ch. 5 > Ch. 4 > Ch. 3 > Ch. 1 > Ch. 2
Out of Trial:
Ch. 2 > Ch. 4 > Ch. 1 > Ch. 5 > Ch. 3
I don't really count 6 as a trial but it was probably my favorite part of the game due to all the crazy things you learn and they hit one after the other.
Nightengale
Member
What if Dangan 3 ends up being a prequel and the story of the original killing?
Wouldn't that just be Izuru slaughtering a whole class?
Crash Station
Member
Well we already know the outcome as well as some of what happened during it thanks to Danganronpa Zero. It wouldn't exactly be a whodunnit mystery game either.
I wouldn't really like that. Everything would be a foregone conclusion and I don't want to just retread old ground. That sounds more like an idea for one of the novels rather than the third main game.
i think this could be potentially very interesting.
definitely Chapter 5 > 6 > 3 > 2 > 1 > 4
I swear my game was just messed up. Two or three of the blinking combinations weren't even dots othello paper or whatever it was called. Either my blinks were messed up or I'm just stupid and didn't record the blinks down right.
Oh, I forgot about the prior research thing. That said, I don't think Makoto ever displayed great respect for the Hope's Peak applicants (once again, his reaction towards Hope's Peak and its students was general apprehension)
Still, and it certainly doesn't change the fact that Makoto is the Ultimate Lucky Student and Nagito is the ｢Ultimate Lucky Student｣
I don't think they would go that route. If they do, we'd already know there are only two survivors of the first killing game. I'd be more interested on a real sequel detailing what actually the Future Foundation is and the current state of the world.
dakkumauji
Member
That would take the whole does canon kill your favorite characters aspect that we all love about Danganronpa.
1. Makoto definitely has an affinity towards Hope's Peak. He was proud that he was able to go there, and he researches and discusses all of the newly admitted to the high school (which, coincidentally, Nagito does as well).
2. They have different obsessions with "hope", but Makoto is the "Ultimate Hope" for a reason. The last segment of the final case in DR1 pretty much shows his thoughts about hope vs. despair, and Makoto straight up says that he understands Nagito in DR2 because they both have the same goals, but with wildly different means.
There are subtle statements such as the mother statement that point away from Nagito being Makoto, but then there are also subtle statements such as Nagito being worried that they are being kept on an island in order to kill each other at the beginning of the game, before the Killing School Trip starts. Again, he's deliberately designed to be a red herring, which becomes more evident as the game progresses.
I want to see thoughts on makotos ultimate status. What do you guys think. Is he actually an ultimate lucky student? Is there just several ultimate lucky students and nagito happens to be far more lucky? So much so that you can actually consider it ultimate? It almost feels like they knew makoto was ultimate hope and just let him in under the guise of the lucky program so he wouldn't know about his true ultimate status. Did the academy even search for ultimate hopes and despairs? They didn't know junko was both fashionista and despair. Hope and despair seem like werid ultimate titles to look for. The whole hope vs despair stuff wasn't really a thing until after the tragedy thing.
Well I don't think Luck is a real talent or anything so I say he's just a normal dude, no different from Hajime, who happened to get picked to come that year.
It was stated in Danganronpa Zero that
every year, Hope Peak's Academy will admit one lucky student into the school, and that student is designated the "Ultimate Lucky Student". The school board wanted to abolish it, but Jin Kirigiri, Kyouko's father, pushed for the thing to remain, arguing that the ultimate talent of "luck" was real. (Think they made a reference to Nagito here? If Luck wasn't a talent, how could you explain those things going all smoothly for THAT person involved in the Despair incident?) They then drew a female student for the "lucky" student of that year, which was a female (would be cool if D_3 touch on her)
In any case, Makoto Naegi's "luck" is actually alluded to bad luck as well, getting admitted to the school just as the killing game started, being framed for the first murder by his crush so on and so forth
In any case, Makoto Naegi's "luck" is actually alluded to bad luck as well, getting admitted to the school just as the killing game started, being framed for the first murder by his crush so on and so forth
As for this series, it's amazing how I went from going "wtf is this" when I watched the first Danganronpa: Another trailer from last year's Sony pre-TGS conference, to jumping in on the hype train when Trigger Happy Havoc was released in Feb. I do like the first game, but the second game, despite being a sequel, still managed to hold its own ground. Now I also can't really wait for Another Episode (though it's probably not going to be as good as the mainstream ones)
Hajime is a Reserve Course student. He wasn't picked. He paid his way in.
SolarKnight
Member
Yeah, Zero pretty much explicitly shows it as not being mystery game material really.
-That wasn't Zero, it was the booklet thing included in the first DVD/BR
-He WAS picked to get into Hope's Peak...to become a test subject for Ultimate Hope.
dakkumauji
Member
You are in luck, cause with the first volume of the anime, there was a short story written by the writer of this series, showing how The Ultimate Lucky Student is found and Makoto's lucky experiences becoming it, lol
And here's a summary of it of course found from tumblr
Crash Station
Member
Interesting that Kodaka has so much faith in Another Episode to the point he doesn't know if he'll be able to make a game as good ever again. Wouldn't expect an action-oriented spin-off (from a non-action developer no less) to have a mind-blowing story, but I guess we'll see.
I know. I meant I think Makoto is just a regular non-talented guy just like Hajime was. Same with Nagito. Luck in the sense of sort of magical aura that makes good things happen to you isn't real.
They said that? DR:AE didn't look too hot from the little I've seen of it (mainly from the SCEJ conferences).
SolarKnight
Member
In the real world? Sure. In the DanganRonpa world tho? I'm preeeeeeeeetty Nagito strongly says otherwise. It's just that his case seems to be way more extreme than most.
Crash Station
Member
Yeah, I read Zero. The killing game is
straight-up Battle Royale.
That being said, I would love to get more info on it, like the players beyond Izuru and Murasame. We probably wouldn't get to see much beyond that, though. The descriptions in Zero were pretty graphic.
SolarKnight
Member
Good lord that part of Zero fucked me up
Nagito says that but that doesn't make it true. He just heavily believes in his luck. I think some of the things that happen to him amount to either coincidence (stranger things have happened in the real world) or the fact that it's a simulation.