Have mercy! Finally we have a movie with nice pacing that never drags or gets boring, what I get like once in the blue moon and you are unhappy about that?
Agreed on new cast, tho
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[SPOILERS] Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Thread #3) - That's Not How the Force Works
- Thread starter Bobby Roberts
- Start date
Agreed on new cast, tho
Some shameless self promotion while the memory of Indiana Jones on the last page still lingers: I started a thread about the unused scripts commissioned for Indiana Jones movies a little while ago and just added information about cut stuff in the early drafts of Raiders and Last Crusade.
Now to bring it back to Star Wars, did you know George Lucas came up with the idea for Indiana Jones while working on what would become A New Hope in 1973? And then pitched it to Steven Spielberg while vacationing in Hawaii immediately after the release of Star Wars?
Now to bring it back to Star Wars, did you know George Lucas came up with the idea for Indiana Jones while working on what would become A New Hope in 1973? And then pitched it to Steven Spielberg while vacationing in Hawaii immediately after the release of Star Wars?
30yearsofhurt
Member
WadiumArcadium
Member
Yep. Screw waiting a year for any new Star Wars.
DrForester
Kills Photobucket
Yeah, as I said way earlier in the thread, TCW was Star Wars' first real attempt at addressing the gender imbalance. There are still things that obviously pander to the male audience sometimes (TCW's female characters are noticeably much curvier than Rebels', and Ventress is kind of a traditional sexy femme fatale, although she's a great character even so), but there are so many women in TCW, including villains and women in positions of power and who have equal presence with the male characters, that it shouldn't really be dismissed. It can't have the sway that TFA has by virtue of being a show and not a movie, but it was the vanguard showing the way.
DryEyeRelief
Member
Yep, give me my books, give me my comics, give me my TV show. Ain't nobody got time to be waiting for the movies to come out.
WadiumArcadium
Member
Don't paint us all with the same brush.
They are actually the same age, yeah same with Ahsoka, after clone wars got dark assumed they were all going to die. With Rebels now being more kid friendly who knows.
Twilight Gap
Member
Ventress is dead m8
Ahsoka on her own is good too.
30yearsofhurt
Member
If only the crew on the deck of the imperial cruiser had just shot the escape pod. They had one job. One job.
Twilight Gap
Member
Ventress's physique is almost never used as a plot device so it works IMO.
Coincidences are a big part of the Star Wars movies. You can find the answer if you ask the force in you.
Ventress, Mother Talzin, Shaak Ti, Aurra Sing, Barriss, Jocasta.
There is good and bad stuff, I know that
I'm not talking about tFA particularly, movies that never get boring are really rare, for me that is. They or overexplain, or drive point in for too long, or decide to meditate on atmosphere for no reason or keep pretending that something is a mystery when it's isn't for a very long time, I can continue forever. I never even once said that TFA is the best movie that there is or it is perfect, I only said that it's one of those rare movies with nice pacing and it's one of main reasons I like it. That's why I specifically asked for mercy about that point.
Twilight Gap
Member
Dutches Satine, Luminara, Kalifa, Chuchi, list continues
I'm not so sure. In TCW it was clear that Sidious wanted to create a dark side spy agency, which comes to fruition in Rebels. I wouldn't be surprised if Maul has been broken down and repurposed somehow.
Yea this is kinda why you can't fault TFA for having some of these same coincidences and call it bad storytelling whilst holding the ANH in high regard
Twilight Gap
Member
the movies aren't even the best Star Wars content though so
Son of Dathomir spoilers:
Sidious was using Maul to get to Mother Talzin, who he considered his true rival. He purposefully lets him escape from captivity knowing that he will try to find a way to revive Talzin, and he does by kidnapping Dooku and letting Talzin's ethereal form sap the life force out of him and use it to reform her physical body. Then Sidious and Grievous show up and kill her, removing the threat to the Sith. Maul gets away but Sidious tells Dooku to not bother chasing him because he's worthless now and has no support base since the Shadow Collective falls apart. Presumably, Maul would have tried to return to Mandalore and gotten killed during the siege that is mentioned in Rebels.
excelsiorlef
Member
ok I'm just going to level with you, EU stuff is great for filling in information and stuff but when it comes to female and minority representation the only thing that really matters is the film series, it was clear that that was what I was talking about and you can say yeah but Clone Wars all you want it doesn't matter. That the only place you could find a decent number of women characters is in a TV show that had 121 episodes (the equivalent of 25-50 movies) doesn't make Star Wars look good in that department.
So great Clone Wars has some women, the movies still hadn't up until TFA and TFA is only a small step.
I'm curious, based on what?
Star Wars are the movies, everything else is extra content.
thread title alone already says you "that's not how the Force works"
but you are posing in a movie thread right now, doesn't compute
Trying to read through the last 5-6 pages sure wasn't fun today. I hope there will be a special edition blu-ray with explanatory comic book bubbles as an overlay for the visual cues in the movie. Even for some dialogues, like:
"- We need a pilot!
- We have one."
"This means that Rey (yes, the girl) has flown a ship before. Yes, a real ship with engines and stuff. Yes, she's not lying, you can trust her, you will see later on why"
Or "There has been a awakening in the force, have you felt it?" means "Somebody except us has done an unauthorized use of the force. Coincidentally (like it always happens in Star Wars) this dialogue happens exactly after that girl pulled a piloting trick and she has no idea how. Probably it's not something related. Must be a plot hole or something"
"- We need a pilot!
- We have one."
"This means that Rey (yes, the girl) has flown a ship before. Yes, a real ship with engines and stuff. Yes, she's not lying, you can trust her, you will see later on why"
Or "There has been a awakening in the force, have you felt it?" means "Somebody except us has done an unauthorized use of the force. Coincidentally (like it always happens in Star Wars) this dialogue happens exactly after that girl pulled a piloting trick and she has no idea how. Probably it's not something related. Must be a plot hole or something"
WadiumArcadium
Member
You know what to do between now and Rogue One.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
Which is a fairly recent turn of events
Which is prompted by it's fairly bad track record previous
Which speaks to the larger point being made, which is that there was (and is) room for progress, and a lot of it.
That previously not-great track record doesn't just disappear from history because The Clone Wars has existed for about 6 years and was watched by roughly 1/3rd the audience any single one of the movies has probably enjoyed.
It's good that Filoni & Co. took the opportunity to make The Clone Wars a show in which the two most interesting, compelling characters were women (on opposite sides of the good/bad spectrum, at that). That doesn't negate the fact it took until around 2009/2010 before that really started to kick in, and even then it was in a much lesser-seen medium.
She worked three dudes on Jakku too
Astral Dog
Member
She is Darth Vaders apprentice, i think.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
Well, it was two dudes, but she whooped one so bad a second one popped out of him like Noob Saibot, and then she whooped him, too.
excelsiorlef
Member
Well bully for you.
Next time don't try to counter my point about the movies (aka the part of the universe that allowed your precious EU to exist) with a tv cartoon.
EU is optional, the movies are not.
I don't think anyone disagrees that TFA is just the beginning step for the movies, or that the movies have up until now had a dearth of female characters (although I think some people have argued dumbly that Leia being prominent is more or less good enough), but that even though TCW isn't as big as the movies it should still be taken into account because for half a decade it was Star Wars. It was a very popular show that introduced the franchise to a lot of kids and particularly got a lot of girls interested in the franchise because of Ahsoka. It was the beginning of the change.
And it's kind of weird to scoff at 121 episodes being "the only place" to find a decent number of women characters. If anything that's a positive because it shows how much time has been spent since the late 2000s being committed to tackling the gender issue.
The only reason I bring this up is because it can't be said that "the only thing that really matters is the film series" when Ahsoka, in particular, became such a huge element of the franchise. But yes, TCW is ultimately not as important as the movies.
The Clone Wars. The movies are the most important thing but that doesn't make them the best thing.
EVERYONE JUST WATCH THE CLONE WARS ALREADY
I would advice against it, I need force to be with me to watch it, and I do it only because I promised to finish watching it.
5th season now, I'm getting really close to the end finally
I suppose you aren't joking, I wish you were
The Clone Wars is very far from being any best thing in anything
oh well, opinions and all that
Not according to a significant number of fans!
I was more talking about books and comics through the years than just the cartoon, but sure I don't disagree more representation is good hopefully it didn't seem as if I was.
Edit: This is pointless.
She worked Finn, too!
I think TCW is all over the place in terms of quality, but when it is great then it is really great. ESB still reigns supreme as the best thing in the franchise though.
Astral Dog
Member
I think its really cool female representation has improved alot in TFA and recent cartoons, but, that was far from the worst flaw on the PT, for example. i see it more as an improvment and less correcting one glaring flaw, if that makes sense, what matters is not how many women there are but also how important and well written they are, the execution.
excelsiorlef
Member
Good for them then? The fact of the matter is you can't say the movies aren't important, you damn well can say the EU isn't important.
Look none of this fucking matters because I was talking about the movies and it was clear I was talking about the movies.
Yes, all the Star Wars movies have quite similar flaws that can be nitpicked. Or you can just enjoy the ones that are good movies despite those. And TFA is one of them.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
Shit, you're right! That was their meet-cute.
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