Which is the norm for spoiler threads
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[SPOILERS] Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Thread #3) - That's Not How the Force Works
- Thread starter Bobby Roberts
- Start date
Which is the norm for spoiler threads
Looks like I made the right choice then. I suggest we all do the same. Let him/her groan to him/her self about the non issues in this movie. There is no telling them otherwise, despite facts.
Its a spoiler thread for a movie not like this is weird.
TheSadRanger
Banned
Scientist Supreme!
Banned
Huh.
Yeah this is my last comment on it too. It's very clear why Leia should find Luke and seek his help. He's the only light side force user in the galaxy while dark side users attempt to conquer. His knowledge and skillset are essential tools that should be used if he can be convinced. His importance doesn't need any explanation.
I ignored that because, again, the reasoning is obvious. Explain how Leia, the person who wants him back, is supposed to know any of that at the beginning of the movie. Also explain the leap where Kylo Ren being messed up (for reasons we are not yet privy to) means that Luke's ability to teach anyone else is suspect. You have no reason to suspect that Kylo Ren's defection is his fault or that he could have done anything to prevent it.
The reason why Leia wants Luke despite not having an explicit reason for needing him for other reasons is simply a matter of putting the question in the correct context where you don't assume Leia has seen the end of the movie before acting it out and not jumping to conclusions regarding an event we have minimal knowledge about.
That's not how double standards work. You don't need to love the OT and hate TFA to be measuring them by different standards for no adequate reason.
That's not what I said.
Again, figure of speech, dude. It didn't mean anything. It's no more of an insult than if I said Finn is a ballsy motherfucker for taking on Kylo with a lightsaber when he's not a force user. Understand that when I decide to insult you, I will do so directly to your face without any ambiguities.
heliosRAzi
Banned
From your post, we can reasonably infer that you were calling him a bastard
From your post, we can reasonably infer that you were calling him a bastard
Yeah, and I would technically have called Finn a motherfucker too, but I wouldn't be insulting him in that context either.
Edit: Also, since the word was written out, that wouldn't be an inference, if we're being technical about it.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
No it isn't. That's not an answer at all. There's no end-game in it. It's open-ended.
It's like you've been bullrushing any possible problems with the film with your head down so long you haven't actually looked up to see where you are and if you even did anything you were trying to do.
heliosRAzi
Banned
Ballsy motherfucker isn't normally seen as an insult. Stringent bastard, though... I mean, Brakke is taking it as an insult.
I was joking about it, guy. Let's hug it out.
I dunno dude you're either misreading why I think that dynamic is weird or I'm miscommunicating. Of Leia's interest in finding Luke makes sense, of course she'd like to see her brother. Leia's not being dumb here. It's weird thread in the movie because the movie clouds Luke's return for us. When he shows up at the end all I can think is "what does this mean" and I can't answer that. It will be *crazy* if he turns Rey away but it wouldn't be out of character for him to do so. We don't really know what's "in character" for Luke now. Pretty much all of the things we know about Luke have been parceled out to other characters. Even his endearing, plucky cluelessness-about-girls has gone on to Finn.
1) The mere concept of insulting a fictional character is silly. 2) Nobody's ever interpreted "ballsy motherfucker" as an insult. I'm not going to tattle on you, dude. You're bringing in inflammatory language. Own that. I've called people arrogant up-thread.
Yes that's right. I don't have an end game. I've had interesting conversations, and that's what I was trying to do. I don't really care about assembling a coherent Thesis Statement On This Film. If I did, I'd publish a blog, not be talking about it on a discussion board.
But it has the word motherfucker in it, which, stripped of it's context, typically entails an insult. But, well that's the magic power of context for you. Remember, I didn't call you a bastard, which is what you take issue with, but a stringent bastard.
"(Adjective) bastard" is a common way of referring that someone is demonstrating an extreme of that adjective. I'm calling Brakke an extremely stringent person. And I'm not even disputing his right to be a stringent bastard, I'm actually encouraging him to be so to every SW film (and film in general) if he's going to be a stringent bastard to TFA, as a way of legitimate criticism.
Honestly, if that was an insult, how does that even make sense. Bastard is used to mean that someone is a distasteful person. I don't think he's being distasteful, I think he's unaware that he's using poor argumentative form. If I were to insult him, a much more appropriate target would be his intelligence, so I'd have been better off calling him an idiot if I had meant to insult him over it.
But I didn't. Which is obvious.
This makes even less sense than before then. You're confused what Luke's return means for the events before TFA happened? Nothing, because they already happened. Luke's return will affect future machinations, either through Rey, or if he decides to directly intervene. If he refuses Rey, then we have implications for that as well, because it means Rey is going to spend the film trying to convince him, at which point we'll learn why he's refusing, which will lend us an eye into him. He's there in the movie to imply things about the future. The fact that you don't know for sure which it will be isn't a diminishment of those implications. It's a widening of them if anything. Unless you think Rey's just gonna go "Train me" and he's all "Nope" and then she's all "kay" and then leaves and we never go back to Luke again. Then yeah, he's meaningless, but nobody is going to have that happen. You're criticism is then what, that they didn't explain the next movie to you before ending it?
heliosRAzi
Banned
I want to see the word cloud for this page.
instead of arguing it, couldn't you just apologize. He clearly has a problem with it.
The Broken Ska Record
Member
Finally saw it and thought it was pretty good. A lot of really obvious, but neat visual allegories. I hope we get a Kylo Ren backstory movie.
Also, I'm hoping that Rey wields a lightsaber staff similar to Darth Maul but with Luke/Obi-Wan's lightsabers.
Also, I'm hoping that Rey wields a lightsaber staff similar to Darth Maul but with Luke/Obi-Wan's lightsabers.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
No fuckin shit, Brakke.
Coherency is definitely a secondary concern when it comes to your arguments both for and against this film. Again, at one point in this thread you were arguing that defection from a Nazi regime was a morally questionable thing, and borderline useless from a storytelling perspective. I can only assume you wound up in that interesting situation precisely because you're not interested in assembling anything resembling a coherent thesis on the film. That kind of argument can only exist in a mostly contextless vaccuum, which you keep finding yourself posting from, admittedly in an aimless, pointless manner. You're not trying to go anywhere with any of this, and you don't care to.
I apologize for mistakes I make, not other peoples. I have nothing to apologize for because this obviously wasn't an insult, and I've made that clear. If he interprets it as an insult regardless, I can't help that.
heliosRAzi
Banned
Scientist Supreme!
Banned
Now I get SW fans.
About what I expected.
About what I expected.
It's cool. I'm not mad at you or anything, so I hope I don't come across as that.
I just try to come across as clearly as possible, because it's easy to see how meaning can be distorted over text. So I try to explain as clearly as possible where I'm coming from.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
DarkJediKnight
Member
LOL. Nice try at a good writing piece that comes across as fanboy wishlist.
Many of the elements - especially the emotional and physical distancing motif between Han and Ren doesn't work otherwise.
Digital-Hero
Member
I was just thinking about this movie again and have a crazy theory: (Someone may have thought of this as well.)
- What if Snoke is actually the father of Anakin?
Shmi Skywalker obviously doesn't know who the father is and the virgin birth thing could be discarded.
http://www.techtimes.com/articles/1...ns-might-not-be-a-new-character-after-all.htm
- What if Snoke is actually the father of Anakin?
Shmi Skywalker obviously doesn't know who the father is and the virgin birth thing could be discarded.
http://www.techtimes.com/articles/1...ns-might-not-be-a-new-character-after-all.htm
Already?! That's quick, but I can't complain. Moar Star Wars, pls Disney.
The Broken Ska Record
Member
Was it ever explained exactly why everyone was looking for Luke? Or did I miss that fact?
Because Luke has the keys to the trunk on the Millennium Falcon and Chewie left his lunch in there.
HerbertFish
Member
Not really a new theory. If Snoke Darth Plagueis, the thought is that he created Anakin since he was powerful enough to do so. Also with that there's no discarding the virgin birth.
The Broken Ska Record
Member
"It's stale, Chewie."
Ether_Snake
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I thought the force create Anakin in reprisal to Plagueis/Palpatine trying to create a being with the force?
As for why Snoke looks like Vader: what if Snoke transfigures himself into those who give themselves to the dark side? A way to gain immortality, he would convert people to the dark side and "become them". Ben is his replacement vessel, and Anakin and Ben (and presumably any Skywalker) would make a better vessel than some less-force-sensitive folks.
He's supposed to be weak and have a secret plan for Ben. Sounds likely to me. Might even explain why he is CG if they have him transform into Ben somewhat.
edit: Serkis said he is CG because of how his bone structure moves and how it ties to what his secret plan is for Ben. My bet is his face morphes into whoever he is "feeding" on. So right now he still looks like Vader, and over the next movies he might start morphing into Ben somewhat.
I hope the new trilogy doesn't touch this shit with a 10 foot pole (that would be the PT shit, not your post). The PT may be cannon, but that doesn't mean they have to do anything but move on from it.
Leave space Jesus behind.
Astral Dog
Member
In name, it was.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
Being the last Jedi in the galaxy makes for an important ally, or a high level threat.
He's basically like a weapon of mass destruction that wandered off while no one was looking.
The Broken Ska Record
Member
I figured about the Republic. I just wasn't sure about The First Order's plans.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
Yeah, the First Order's plans are basically "kill his ass."
Okay, I need to watch all of this. What the heck are they reading from?
From the opening crawl, they want to kill him, since he's a threat.
I wonder if their plan was to blow up whatever planet they found him on.
I think they made this because someone on reddit posted a picture of "10 things you didn't know about Darth Vader's suit!" and it was fucking ridiculous, but entirely factual to the SWU.
So they literally just printed out the star wars wikia/wookiepedia entry for Darth Vader and started reading it out loud.
Jest Chillin
Member
There is so much silly crap that's technically canon even in the new EU. I caught a fraction of Star Wars Rebels today (spoiler in case it was a new episode or something)
That is all kinds of ridiculous. But it's technically canon because.
Where two Darkside Force Users were able to block blaster bolts from a damn SHIP with their light sabers and then hold the ship in place while it was trying to fly away.
That is all kinds of ridiculous. But it's technically canon because.
The Broken Ska Record
Member
Pfft. I don't read things.
Grover Cleveland
Member
On third viewing, I've gained even more appreciation for Kylo as a villain (not that I didn't love him already). He's not the emotionless, faceless monster that Vader was (for 2.75 films) and he's not the sinister manipulator that Wrinkles was, but there's something about him being a desperate maniac with unbridled power that just makes him so threatening.
The sequence when he stalks Rey in the forest, like something straight out a horror film, coupled with him interrogating her on the Starkiller is just so...creepy.
The sequence when he stalks Rey in the forest, like something straight out a horror film, coupled with him interrogating her on the Starkiller is just so...creepy.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
It did seem like firing on the Republic was a secondary concern to Snoke. It'd be nuts if he was that scared of Luke that he commissioned the construction of a giant superlaser in the guts of a planet solely to find where he was hiding and blow it up.
When the hell did that happen...I don't remember this.
HerbertFish
Member
Pretty sure they wanted to kill Luke for another reason, we just don't know why yet. Same reason he's hiding to begin with.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
What other reason is needed besides "we're dark side users and he's the last Jedi?"
They're not gonna turn him.
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