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[Veelk]

Whether we're looking at EU stuff or the actual canon material, the series has been rough to the Emperior outside of Jedi. In Jedi, he's a creepy old man with a Yoda like presence except unsettlingly evil.

Then the EU got to him. Then the Prequels got to him. And even now, going forward, he has to deal with being named Sheev Palpatine.

Dude cannot catch a break.

 

[televator]

but not leather

That made me laugh! Damn, good point.

 

[Nostremitus]

Other than that weird EU book, I don't even know why special gloves or even The Force would be necessary. Both his hands are Metal under his gloves.

To be fair, I didn't know that book existed either.

 

[Fencedude]

It appeals to me because that's what the film sets as what happened.

Obi Wan never blocked shots or lightsabers with his bare hands. Niether he nor Yoda taught Luke to do it either. In fact, the lightsaber is a defensive weapon for that purpose, because otherwise the Jedi wouldn't even need them.

It makes sense that it's the gloves, it always has. It's made sense that the gloves were doing the blocking since I watched the movie as a kid. I'm not pulling the idea from the book, the book just explained why it worked.

I...what?

Why wouldn't it be the force? Why is the fact that Obi-wan/Yoda/Luke never did it relevant? This is a bizarre line of argument, and bringing up "well thats what I thought when I was a kid" is not the most astounding rhetorical trick.

 

[Aselith]

Blaster beams don't melt Sithsteel Crushgaunts

 

[televator]

To be honest.. it depends on the metal. Sometimes blaster fire rips through a metal grating or wall... other times it bounces away harmlessly or just leaves a scorch mark.

Don't make me bring up the lack of funds at the Senator Palpatine surgical reconstruction hospital... Or whatever the fuck it's called.

 

[QuantumZebra]

Blaster beams don't melt Sithsteel Crushgaunts

But what about Tower 7

 

[SirMossyBloke]

A little OT, but when I was younger a friend of mine told me he read a book that followed the events after RotJ and it had an enemy in it that made Vader look like a pussycat. Anyone know who he was referring to? He never did say. He did also mention it featured Han Solos kids or something.

 

[Fencedude]

A little OT, but when I was younger a friend of mine told me he read a book that followed the events after RotJ and it had an enemy in it that made Vader look like a pussycat. Anyone know who he was referring to? He never did say. He did also mention it featured Han Solos kids or something.

You'd have to be waaaaaay more specific than that

 

[Ragnorok64]

How many explanations do/did they have for Vader Deflecting blaster bolts? Like I'm looking at the wiki and there's mention of that whole Mandalorian weave thing, and hit right hand being indestructible and stuff. BE he's also listed as a known user of Force Deflection and has been depicted as deflecting blaster bolts with his left hand.

I guess all that is non-canon now anyways so we're just left with the movie itself which means we're back to having no explanation.

 

[Ragnorok64]

A little OT, but when I was younger a friend of mine told me he read a book that followed the events after RotJ and it had an enemy in it that made Vader look like a pussycat. Anyone know who he was referring to? He never did say. He did also mention it featured Han Solos kids or something.

Look like a pussycat in what way? Vader is pretty much always highly regarded in the overall lore.

 

[SirMossyBloke]

You'd have to be waaaaaay more specific than that

That's all he told me

 

[sphagnum]

Yeah, I've been sitting here frozen, attempting to process that Palpatine had a 3-eyed son named Triclops for the last 10 minutes.

To be fair, he was the son of Sly Moore, that bald pale Umbaran lady who hung out with Mas Amedda in the Senate, and he may be more of an attempt by Palpatine to create life through her in the way that Plagueis attempted to create a supreme Force being that led to Anakin's birth, rather than Palpatine literally having sex with someone. Or she may have impregnated herself and claimed it was Palpatine's son. Who knows.

But it's still dumb.

 

[Aselith]

That's all he told me

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Darth_Caedus

Perhaps Darth Cadeus

 

[Nostremitus]

Other than that weird EU book, I don't even know why special gloves or even The Force would be necessary. Both his hands are Metal under his gloves.

To be fair, I didn't know that book existed either.

I was referencing the 3-D reconstruction log. It came out in 2011, though. I didn't realize it had been de-canonized as well. To my knowledge it didn't conflict with anything in the movies or shows.

I...what?

Why wouldn't it be the force? Why is the fact that Obi-wan/Yoda/Luke never did it relevant? This is a bizarre line of argument, and bringing up "well thats what I thought when I was a kid" is not the most astounding rhetorical trick.

It's relevant because those are the characters that described what the force is to the audience. They also taught defensive training. Jedi=mostly defensive Sith=offensive. A defensive power like that if it existed would be within the realm of what Yoda would have known.

As per the bolded, It wasn't a rhetorical trick. It was a direct response to the question asked.

This question:

Why would you choose to roll with the outside information as presented in an officially licensed book over what the film itself is presenting? What's the positives? How does interpreting it that way improve the scene over the default, which is that he simply used the Force?

I was explaining that I wasn't choosing to role with outside information. I was going with what I saw happen in the film long before that book ever came out.

 

[Jest Chillin]

Don't make me bring up the lack of funds at the Senator Palpatine surgical reconstruction hospital... Or whatever the fuck it's called.

I mean we can get into the details of the Galactic Trade Tariff fund misappropriations or the failed attempts at Med Droid Improvement Act. Let's get these Star Wars debates really poppin.

 

[PrivateWHudson]

Stop trying to ruin my childhood. Vader deflecting those shots with the force was an awesome power up. Using a Saber was what the kids did. It would be like saying "Ren didn't use the force to freeze the bolt, he redirected the tractor beam from his ship to hold it in place".

 

[Fencedude]

It's relevant because those are the characters that described what the force is to the audience. They also taught defensive training. Jedi=mostly defensive Sith=offensive. A defensive power like that if it existed would be within the realm of what Yoda would have known.

I could rattle off a half dozen reasons as to why even if they knew how to do it, they wouldn't have in any of the plausible situations where they could have used it.

But the point is that this isn't something that NEEDS an explanation other than "he used the force". People are way, way way way way way too prescriptive about what the force can do.

Its missing the entire point of what the Force is supposed to be

 

[Aselith]

Stop trying to ruin my childhood. Vader deflecting those shots with the force was an awesome power up. Using a Saber was what the kids did. It would be like saying "Ren didn't use the force to freeze the bolt, he redirected the tractor beam from his ship to hold it in place".

 

[televator]

I mean we can get into the details of the Galactic Trade Tariff fund misappropriations or the failed attempts at Med Droid Improvement Act. Let's get these Star Wars debates really poppin.

Sometimes I really fucking hate Star Wars. There's a side to it that's as bad as Naruto. I swear.

 

[Hawkian]

Huh? Does "Darth Vader has magic gloves" come up in one of the books or something?

perhaps I can interest you in this hilarious video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FVzc20Bm8Xo

 

[Fencedude]

This article is probably somewhat relevant to discussions:

https://www.facebook.com/notes/matt...awakens-the-rise-of-idiot-/10153163095086277/

 

[Ishida]

Sometimes I really fucking hate Star Wars. There's a side to it that's as bad as Naruto. I swear.

Ah yes. The fanbase.

 

[Fencedude]

Sometimes I really fucking hate Star Wars. There's a side to it that's as bad as Naruto. I swear.

Oh man trust me Star Wars is way, way worse than any anime or manga fanbase.

 

[Nostremitus]

I could rattle off a half dozen reasons as to why even if they knew how to do it, they wouldn't have in any of the plausible situations where they could have used it.

But the point is that this isn't something that NEEDS an explanation other than "he used the force". People are way, way way way way way too prescriptive about what the force can do.

Its missing the entire point of what the Force is supposed to be

He physically blocked it with his hand in the movie. Anything beyond that is adding explanation that wasn't in the film. If he were deflecting them with his mind he could have just stood there and watched the blaster bolts bounce away. It's not like he's using his physical hand to direct the force, it's robotic.

 

[Jest Chillin]

Sometimes I really fucking hate Star Wars. There's a side to it that's as bad as Naruto. I swear.

The authors put it out there, can't help that people hold onto it.

 

[OraleeWey]

Something I noticed after a second viewing.

Not sure if it has been mentioned yet, I am sure it has, but I believe Kylo Ren's mask is key to explaining how some scenes unfolded the way they did, negating some often heard criticism.

Kylo's mask is a powerful Sith Artifact, no doubt. It allows Kylo Ren to focus his hatred, and greatly increase his force power. The other Knights of Ren are using similar masks to increase their potential with the dark side.
But Kylo's training in the dark side of the force is not complete. His main issue is his self confidence / self image. He fears being weak. The mask serves the added purpose of hiding his former self, and making him appear strong (well it does also make him strong literally).

When Kylo takes off his mask for the first time during his interrogation of Rey, he wants to prove to himself he is strong and confident, even without the mask. Previous scenes with Snork and the First Order Commander left him frustrated and vulnerable. As a result, he wants to prove he does not need help (=the mask) to be strong, so takes off the mask.
But when he tries to intimidate/manipulate Rey without the mask, this quickly backfires. Rey exposes Kylo's fears, which causes him to panic and quickly retreat to seek the advice from Snork.
Some criticism has been that Rey's Force powers develop too quickly. I actually think Kylo's injury in addition to his lack of mask made him very weak. Weak enough for Rey to beat him. Not Rey miraculously becoming all powerful without training.

During the Han Solo / Kylo Ren face-off. through taking off his mask a second time, Kylo wishes to face his doubts and perceived weakness. When Kylo says he is unsure if he can do it, I think he actually means killing his father and fully embracing the dark side. He might have some conflicted feelings, but if he is to redeem himself, he has to kill his father. The last rays of sunlight disappearing in the background symbolizes Kylo's definite turn to the dark side.

Nice. It's things like these that should be discussed more. Not Rey being a Mary Sue. Amazing discovery there, I want to go for a second watch now.

 

[Nostremitus]

You're killing me, Smalls.

touche, lol

This basically comes down to what we interpreted when we first watched the films.

My interpretation was reinforced by additional content.

But, until Disney releases something that states one way or the other in the new canon, these are just our opinions.

All I can do is explain why I interpreted it as being blocked by the gloves instead of the force.

 

[User1608]

I'm not much with substantial posts (lol) but I'm so lost reading this thread. Vader and his gloves and...!?

 

[televator]

The authors put it out there, can't help that people hold onto it.

No yeah, I'm totally talking about the authorship. I get that we joke around about the bad parts of this universe, but I eventually feel like:

The fan base is another thing, but that's not what I had in mind at the time of my comment.

 

[Jest Chillin]

No yeah, I'm totally talking about the authorship. I get that we joke around about the bad parts of this universe, but I eventually feel like:

The fa base is another thing, but that's not what I had in mind at the time of my comment.

Yeah it got rough but that's what happens when you just farm out an IP to so many different writers, each trying their damndest to make their mark and stand out.

I stopped reading that stuff in the early 2000's, so I missed a lot of the really, really outlandish shit but at the time I was just a kid who was stoked to be able to experience more adventures with my favorite characters.

 

[Surfinn]

Wait, what? It never even occurred to me that the ESB scene was anything but Vader using the force to block laser shots. What a weird idea.

Edit: Hang on, are you the guy who argued earlier that Ren's helmet was magic?

Same, just assumed he's using the force to block. One of the most memorable moments in the saga.

 

[televator]

Yeah it got rough but that's what happens when you just farm out an IP to so many different writers, each trying their damndest to make their mark and stand out.

I stopped reading that stuff in the early 2000's, so I missed a lot of the really, really outlandish shit but at the time I was just a kid who was stoked to be able to experience more adventures with my favorite characters.

Well now this gets me thinking... Was all the stuff about the Palpatine hospital and Vader's gloves solely contained in the EU? If so then... That's not canon anymore, right?

 

[MMarston]

Sometimes I really fucking hate Star Wars. There's a side to it that's as bad as Naruto. I swear.

Spoiler

I agree

 

[Jest Chillin]

Well now this gets me thinking... Was all the stuff about the Palpatine hospital and Vader's gloves solely contained in the EU? If so then... That's not canon anymore, right?

The only old stuff that's still Canon is the movies and The Clone Wars cartoon series. Everything else is new stuff. But it's still hard to say what's canon because some of the new stuff incorporates elements of the old EU stuff that was removed.. so knowing what is and isn't canon is a crapshoot unless you buy ALL the new stuff to know what they brought back, what they kept out, and what they tweaked.

 

[televator]

Spoiler

I agree

lol This image would fit perfectly if each trooper that passes had titles over their heads like Jar Jar, Midichlorians, The high ground, etc...

 

[watershed]

What a strange conversation in the last 2 pages. Kylo Ren's helmet is not magic and Vader's glove is just leather. I feel like these two things have always been plainly obvious in the films themselves.

It was interesting that Luke's lightsaber called out to Rey and sparked a force vision. I think that's a new idea that items can be strong in the force or infused with it like how the cave in Dagobah is strong in the force.

 

[televator]

The only old stuff that's still Canon is the movies and The Clone Wars cartoon series. Everything else is new stuff. But it's still hard to say what's canon because some of the new stuff incorporates elements of the old EU stuff that was removed.. so knowing what is and isn't canon is a crapshoot unless you buy ALL the new stuff to know what they brought back, what they kept out, and what they tweaked.

I kinda figured, but I wanted to see if anyone had a better read on the franchise that they could say with more certainty what truly is canon. They can toss out the EU literature that contains stuff like Vader's gloves, but who knows if that's not something that persists in the minds of writers for the next canonical literature.

 

[TheSadRanger]

Was listening to Kevin Smith talking about the film and got a chuckle when he mentioned C-3PO first shows up and he's all "hey look I got a red arm"

I have to admit it was a rather random moment in the movie lol.

I agree with Smith though saying they shouldn't use another mega weapon (death star) type device for the rest of the series. It was already a rather tired concept after RotJ.

 

[FlashbladeGAF]

The last rays of sunlight disappearing in the background symbolizes Kylo's definite turn to the dark side.

I think it was more his final decision to choose the dark, after having conflicting emotions about it.

When Han strokes his face almost forgiving him, the dark red light that symbolized the dark side is no longer as strong as it was before.

It was a small light on his face, but a light nonetheless.

 

[Ishida]

lol This image would fit perfectly if each trooper that passes had titles over their heads like Jar Jar, Midichlorians, The high ground, etc...

Agreed. It would fit perfectly with Palpatine representing the old, bitter fans.

 

[Zero-ELEC]

That's the canon explanation.

No it wasn't, that was Force absorption. The thing with the hand was only ever used in the hilariously awful Jedi Prince/The Glove of Darth Vader books. It was never, as far as I know, used to explain his deflecting the blaster shot.

 

[GamerSoul]

Just saw it tonight with my brother and we really enjoyed it. The overall presentation felt very familiar, which was a nice touch! From the previews, I really thought Finn would somehow become a Jedi, but I was pleasantly surprised when it was Rey. Seeing her starting to understand the ways of the force when going up against Kylo Ren was fucking awesome. I love her already. She and Kylo will only get stronger and stronger. I was like "not like this" when the whole Han Solo/Kylo scene was happening. And there were so many nostalgic moments throughout the movie I couldn't help but grin. The characters have grown on me and I can't wait to see where this saga goes next.

 

[GhaleonEB]

NSIAP

'Awards Chatter' Podcast — J.J. Abrams ('Star Wars: The Force Awakens') (THR)

Some other good quotes from Abrams there. Didn't listen to the podcast, though.

Some tidbits while I took down while listening:

-No script or story ready when JJ came on board. "It was a blank page."

-Kasdan was there to be a story consultant originally. JJ and Kasdan stepped into writing because the original writer needed more time than they had. Developed the basic character arcs while taking lots of long walks together.

-Kennedy thought of Adam Driver for Kylo Ren; no one else was ever considered for the role. JJ sounded like he was still surprised how brilliant a casting call that was.

-No logistical way for JJ to do episode VIII given the timelines, at least not if he wanted his kids to still speak to him again (alluding to being absent for so long). Made it sound like it was offered and he declined.

-They put a lot of work into trying to keep the story beats a secret. JJ was happy they were able to preserve the surprises for most viewers.

-Says TFA "much more than the films that will follow" had to "go backwards to go forwards". Seems to indicate the next films will not follow the OT in the ways TFA did ANH's "bones".

-On the pressure pre-release: "I think I'm going to have a heart attack." He handled it by knowing his wife loved the movie. Knowing she liked it, gave him a "suit of armor". She's a brutal critic even of his work, gave him a lot of confidence.

-The scale of TFA was so overwhelming - thousands of people working on it - anything he does next will feel like a small project by comparison. Looking forward to doing something strange for a while: being home for dinner, taking the kids to school, and just explore life for a bit. JJ still feels like he's coming down from working on it.

Good interview.

 

[Surfinn]

Thanks for the updates, lots of good info there. Biggest take away is that the next two movies will most likely be much more fresh and creative in more ways. Good news.

 

[Rentahamster]

When the BluRay comes out, I have a feeling I'm going to be weirded out when I rewatch the series in order and in episodes 6 and 7 they blow up a giant planet killing superweapon twice in a row.

 

[GhaleonEB]

When the BluRay comes out, I have a feeling I'm going to be weirded out when I rewatch the series in order and in episodes 6 and 7 they blow up a giant planet killing superweapon twice in a row.

That's going to happen in three out of four consecutive movies. :\

 

[Trigonometrize.]

Was listening to Kevin Smith talking about the film and got a chuckle when he mentioned C-3PO first shows up and he's all "hey look I got a red arm"

I have to admit it was a rather random moment in the movie lol.

The red arm bit is perfectly done IMO. It could be something as simple as his old parts were malfunctioning or whatever, but it doesn't really matter. It was a hilarious joke and was a good re-entrance for the bumbling yet likable C-3PO.

That's going to happen in three out of four consecutive movies. :\

If Starkiller had rolled over to VIII because the Resistance failed to bring it down it would've been a lot better and less redundant IMO. Not only would that be a fresh development, but when Luke blew up the Death Star in ANH it was a triumph, but the Empire was massive to it's not like it was a tide-turning blow. In TFA with Starkiller, The First Order feels much smaller and blowing it up makes it seem like they just took a massive hit, although I don't doubt VIII will treat it like a minor setback.

Then again, that also means VIII also has a death star, so who even knows at this point.

 

[MMarston]

Call me crazy, but I bet Episode X is gonna get announced soon as part of this new era - not years after IX.

 

[FyreWulff]

Also as a note

I like how they actually kept the chess board pieces on the Falcon as stop motion