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[MMarston]

I swear this turned up in the old EU.

 

[W_Dreamer]

Vader was clearly not trying to slice him up. Come on dude.

Vader was just screwing with Luke the entire fight, probably testing his abilities to see how strong he was. He could have killed him at any time had he wanted to.

I agree, Vader wasn't going near full power, but he was testing him in stages and Luke was reaching or even exceeding them.


Vader: "All too easy. Perhaps you are not as strong as the Emperor thought."

[uh...wait.]

Vader: "Impressive. Most impressive."

Luke even knocked Vader back- off the platform, c'mon that counts as something in my book. I dont think Vader purposely let Luke do that. He dialled his offence back to a test standard, and in that moment Luke surpassed that benchmark and drove Vader back.

By the next encounter Vader started FIRST with a TK barrage/assault. It would seem Luke's saber skills were impressive enough to attack with TK to weaken him, rather than test his duelling again.

Ben showed him the physical training, Yoda showed him the mental.

Do you think that's enough for padawan Luke to beat apprentice Kylo Ren?

Doesn't change my position. Kylo Ren lost to some pretty weak circumstances. You can chalk it up to mental and physical damage but that just shows how weak he really is.

Let's be honest here, praised Jedi Knight heroes (AotC Obiwan) have fallen AND stayed DOWN to much less...

 

[Johndoey]

what about lightsaber claws

I prefer wrist mounted sabers personally.

 

[FlashbladeGAF]

I don't agree the damage he sustained would have prevented him from beating up a Storm Trooper who was sanitation but then went one mission and lost to another Storm Trooper and someone who just discovered the force. Dude just seems so powerful that a blaster shot to the gut, that doesn't remove his mobility, wouldn't necessarily make him lose.

First off he was playing with Fin. But he got cocky and ended up getting hit. After he got hit he ended it instantly.

Rey managed to survive on her own. She's basically a Shaolin Monk that started fighting at a young age. While Kyo was being "classically" trained, Rey was fighting for survival. Once she got over "the monster in her vision", Her already honed skills and the guidance of the Force gave her a greater advantage over, Kylo's gut blast, shoulder saber wound, trauma of killing his dad, Rey's rejection. Obi-Wan said the Fore can guide your actions when he was teaching Luke to deflect a blaster with a blind fold.

Kylo realized everything was going out of control with the collapse of the base and her slowly getting a grasp of the force. He knew she would be dangerous the longer she was free, and that moment when she pushed him back was when time was up and that fear or doubt in himself made him that much more less connected to the force. As Yoda has shown us, lightsaber combat is not as important as controlling your emotions. Her conquering her fear allowed her to have the advantage over him. His wounds and his doubt versus her survival skills and confidence.

The stronger minded/willed person won in the end.

 

[Tatsumaki Senpuukyaku!]

that looks extremely dangerous

 

[Digital-Hero]

ok how about this

The more I watch that, the more I like it. She is indeed running for her life and on the defense most of the fight. Very cool sequence.

[BTW, where was this part of the film shot? It has a nice atmosphere and very OT feeling.]

 

[UFO]

Han Solo dies at the end. He dies guys. DIES.

 

[injurai]

Han Solo dies at the end. He dies guys. DIES.

buried in a star to boot

 

[MMarston]

Han Solo dies at the end. He dies guys. DIES.

lightsaber fuel can't melt bones

 

[Starsailor]

First off he was playing with Fin. But he got cocky and ended up getting hit. After he got hit he ended it instantly.

Rey managed to survive on her own. She's basically a Shaolin Monk that started fighting at a young age. While Kyo was being "classically" trained, Rey was fighting for survival. Once she got over "the monster in her vision", Her already honed skills and the guidance of the Force gave her a greater advantage over, Kylo's gut blast, shoulder saber wound, trauma of killing his dad, Rey's rejection. Obi-Wan said the Fore can guide your actions when he was teaching Luke to deflect a blaster with a blind fold.

Kylo realized everything was going out of control with the collapse of the base and her slowly getting a grasp of the force. He knew she would be dangerous the longer she was free, and that moment when she pushed him back was when time was up and that fear or doubt in himself made him that much more less connected to the force. As Yoda has shown us, lightsaber combat is not as important as controlling your emotions. Her conquering her fear allowed her to have the advantage over him. His wounds and his doubt versus her survival skills and confidence.

The stronger minded/willed person won in the end.

i like that point of view but for me the moment he killed Han Solo he became much more powerful than before

 

[UnemployedVillain]

The more I watch that, the more I like it. She is indeed running for her life and on the defense most of the fight. Very cool sequence.

I said it earlier, but that fight would have gone much much better in my mind if the ground splitting earth quake had occurred soon after this and it had simply been interrupted with Rey holding her own and without a "winner" or "loser"

 

[Johndoey]

Han Solo dies at the end. He dies guys. DIES.

Wait till he gets cloned and becomes evil.

 

[Christine]

I like how the Finn x Kylo calls back to ESB Luke x Vader. The second Luke / Finn lands a real hit, Vader / Kylo disarms them in the next move.

 

[Ghazi]

Nah, Solo survived. Then they blew up Starkiller Base while he was trying to escape.

 

[ryutaro's mama]

Sure are a lot of pirated gifs up in here...

 

[WillyFive]

Han Solo dies at the end. He dies guys. DIES.

Better than being hit by a moon.

 

[Starsailor]

I said it earlier, but that fight would have gone much much better in my mind if the ground splitting earth quake had occurred soon after this and it had simply been interrupted with Rey holding her own and without a "winner" or "loser"

Don't worry, Kylo remember her face

 

[W_Dreamer]

i like that point of view but for me the moment he killed Han Solo he became much more powerful than before

Official sources state the opposite actually happened. Kylo became weaker after killing his dad.

 

[Alebrije]

Kylo Ren is the classic Disney's villian on a movie , hope they change this because the character promises and the saga need a big boss villian not a wannabe.

 

[Digital-Hero]

I said it earlier, but that fight would have gone much much better in my mind if the ground splitting earth quake had occurred soon after this and it had simply been interrupted with Rey holding her own and without a "winner" or "loser"

Boogie2988 said it best.

Spoiler

Can't believe I just referenced him.

It was like the force allowed this separation as it's not time to battle each other. Consider it the will of the force or what have you.

Rey would have eventually killed him and then darkside she goes.

 

[Subpar Spatula]

Let's be honest here, praised Jedi Knight heroes (AotC Obiwan) have fallen AND stayed DOWN to much less...

And it's dumb there as well. Your point is similar to mine, then: inconsistency and needing to take a dive when the story demands it. They're space wizards with laser swords who, seemingly, aren't that powerful. Eletricstick Boogaloo Stormtrooper outclasses them all. Probably Snoke I think.

 

[Johndoey]

Better than being hit by a moon.

That was the coolest death ever though.

 

[Starsailor]

Kylo Ren is the classic Disney's villian on a movie , hope they change this because the character promises and the saga need a big boss villian not a wannabe.

well he's more like Ganondorf to me than a disney villain

 

[The Librarian]

I said it earlier, but that fight would have gone much much better in my mind if the ground splitting earth quake had occurred soon after this and it had simply been interrupted with Rey holding her own and without a "winner" or "loser"

But then my girl Rey wouldn't have been able to teach they boy a lesson. He shouldn't have messed with her!

Plus that wouldn't have been a satisfying end to Rey's arc.

 

[Johndoey]

And it's dumb there as well. Your point is similar to mine, then: inconsistency and needing to take a dive when the story demands it. They're space wizards with laser swords who, seemingly, aren't that powerful. Eletricstick Boogaloo Stormtrooper outclasses them all. Probably Snoke I think.

Electro Trooper was so pumped though like Electro trooper achieved a Zen state the moment he realized it was go time. No one else was as primed and focused as Electro trooper was in that moment.

 

[SargerusBR]

Yay new thread

 

[Ishida]

And it's dumb there as well. Your point is similar to mine, then: inconsistency and needing to take a dive when the story demands it. They're space wizards with laser swords who, seemingly, aren't that powerful. Eletricstick Boogaloo Stormtrooper outclasses them all. Probably Snoke I think.

That's kind of the point in the movies, though. Jedi are badasses, but they are not invincible or immune to pain.

Anakin claims that "you cannot kill a Jedi" in Episode I, and Qui-Gon responds that he hopes that were the case. And he gets killed in the end.

Jedi and Sith are powerful, they can make use of the Force, jump higher than a human being and use all sorts of tricks and moves. But in the end they can make mistakes, they can be defeated.

 

[Subpar Spatula]

Electro Trooper was so pumped though like Electro trooper achieved a Zen state the moment he realized it was go time. No one else was as primed and focused as Electro trooper was in that moment.

Dude knew it was time to fuck shit up and came prepared. I think he was the only competent melee person in the movie.

That's kind of the point in the movies, though. Jedi are badasses, but they are not invincible or immune to pain.

Anakin claims that "you cannot kill a Jedi" in Episode I, and Qui-Gon responds that he hopes that were the case. And he gets killed in the end.

Jedi and Sith are powerful, they can make use of the Force, jump higher than a human being and use all sorts of tricks and moves. But in the end they can make mistakes, they can be defeated.

Obviously. You would think they would be considerably more durable than an added 75% armor, though.

 

[UnemployedVillain]

But then my girl Rey wouldn't have been able to teach they boy a lesson. He shouldn't have messed with her!

Plus that wouldn't have been a satisfying end to Rey's arc.

I didn't expect an arc finish at the end of part 1 of a trilogy. The fact that she wasn't struck down like Finn, who despite being a janitor had to have had SOME sort of formal combat training, would have said enough.

 

[Ether_Snake]

Rey became to be aware of the force BECAUSE Kylo enter into his head

The point is DARTH VADER didn't manage to get into Leia's mind in ANH with a torture device AND the force. PLOT HOLE, Star Wars isn't perfect, forever

 

[Starsailor]

I didn't expect an arc finish at the end of part 1 of a trilogy. The fact that she wasn't struck down like Finn, who despite being a janitor had to have had SOME sort of formal combat training, would have said enough.

well Finn doesn't have the Force. She does. And she started to remember how use it since Kylo enter his head.
Kylo create the instrument of his own destruction: rey

 

[Grover Cleveland]

FN-B4D455 da real MVP

Snoke should drop Kylo's jabroni ass and train him instead.

 

[excelsiorlef]

That doesnt scan with what weve seen of jedi training. Rey was a scrapper. Not a trained duelist.

And her fighting style against Ren was a scrappy style

 

[FlashbladeGAF]

i like that point of view but for me the moment he killed Han Solo he became much more powerful than before

Not really. If you watch again, it didn't have the effect he was looking for, which is why Chewie was able to get a shot off on him.

 

[JB1981]

I said it earlier, but that fight would have gone much much better in my mind if the ground splitting earth quake had occurred soon after this and it had simply been interrupted with Rey holding her own and without a "winner" or "loser"

Def agree there

 

[The Librarian]

I didn't expect an arc finish at the end of part 1 of a trilogy. The fact that she wasn't struck down like Finn, who despite being a janitor had to have had SOME sort of formal combat training, would have said enough.

You can have individual arcs for a character within each movie in a trilogy.

As for the rest of your post, I disagree. She needed to do some ass-kicking, and by God was it AWESOME.

 

[Subpar Spatula]

Def agree there

I wanted Kylo to win and the chasm separates him from his kill or surviving by escape. Rey and Finn would have been saved by the Falcon but it would at least give us some reason to think Kylo isn't a total jobber, and gives Rey a reason to train.

 

[Starsailor]

And her fighting style against Ren was a scrappy style

This is still the best fight of the saga for me.

 

[Toxi]

I didn't expect an arc finish at the end of part 1 of a trilogy.

A New Hope was about Luke's arc from farmboy to hero.

Luke got further development in the next two movies, which Rey will certainly get too.

 

[Starsailor]

Not really. If you watch again, it didn't have the effect he was looking for, which is why Chewie was able to get a shot off on him.

i think chewie was able to shot him because he was still "shocked" at what he just did

 

[Ganzlinger]

Nah, Solo survived. Then they blew up Starkiller Base while he was trying to escape.

I already called it. Phasma saved him and escaped Starkiller base.

 

[excelsiorlef]

It was a pretty meh moment. The build up was gone since you have to be blind, deaf, and dumb not to realize she's a jedi 20% into the movie. It was supposed to be a big reveal but nope. Tried doing the whole surprise at the end and failed. Will never top I am your father.

A big reveal? She uses the Jedu mind trick like 20 minutes earlier. She was terrifes to touch that thing and un this moment it was ger emracing her destiny. It's not a reveal it's a ln important character moment

 

[Johndoey]

I wanted Kylo to win and the chasm separates him from his kill or surviving by escape. Rey and Finn would have been saved by the Falcon but it would at least give us some reason to think Kylo isn't a total jobber, and gives Rey a reason to train.

This kinda my issue. Like right now Ren is in my jobber box, I would have preferred if Rey fought him to a draw instead of full on the ground decisive victory.

Not really. If you watch again, it didn't have the effect he was looking for, which is why Chewie was able to get a shot off on him.

I wish Chewie had a better Wookie rampage in the movie.

 

[UnemployedVillain]

I wanted Kylo to win and the chasm separates him from his kill or surviving by escape. Rey and Finn would have been saved by the Falcon but it would at least give us some reason to think Kylo isn't a total jobber, and gives Rey a reason to train.

That's my main issue as well. Yeah it makes Rey look good, but ending a movie where the main villain looks like a loser probably isn't a good thing. Even taking into consideration his injuries and having killed his dad and everything, it's like...the protagonist is suppose to be catching up to the antagonist, not the other way around!

 

[KingSnake]

I said it earlier, but that fight would have gone much much better in my mind if the ground splitting earth quake had occurred soon after this and it had simply been interrupted with Rey holding her own and without a "winner" or "loser"

Nah, that wouldn't have justified the full insanity that Kylo would bring over the galaxy in Episode VIII. Killing his father is just one step in his progression, he needed also the revenge/anger to fully build up as the pathological killer of Star Wars.

 

[Ragnorok64]

The heck is that?

 

[Digital-Hero]

I didn't expect an arc finish at the end of part 1 of a trilogy. The fact that she wasn't struck down like Finn, who despite being a janitor had to have had SOME sort of formal combat training, would have said enough.

Looks stupid now, but if in fact she remembers her training and was one of Luke's padawan's, it would work. So this could all be moot by Episode 9.

Empire Strikes Back had a random Obi-Wan ghost show up and tell Luke to go to a planet where another Jedi is at. That was quite silly as well. Now people just accept it and there were obviously no prequels man to flesh that out a bit.

 

[Dubbedinenglish]

The heck is that?

Darth Arachnis

 

[Starsailor]

Looks stupid now, but if in fact she remembers her training and was one of Luke's padawan's, it would work. So this could all be moot by Episode 9.

Empire Strikes Back had a random Obi-Wan ghost show up and tell Luke to go to a planet where another Jedi is at. That was quite silly as well. Now people just accept it and there were obviously no prequels man to flesh that out a bit.

well actually she remember when kylo enter her head, that's why this episode is called "the force awaken"

Darth Arachnis: looks like some fandom shit

 

[KingSnake]

It's not so much that Rey needed to win, but Kylo needed to lose to grow up.