Well I assume the message hidden in the Saber isn't recent. And the way Luke appears to be cloaked in the second trailer is a nice way to hide his full appearance, and a throwback to Leia in ANH when she records the message with R2. I was under the impression the whole 'Luke is in only one scene' to be over when the second trailer hit. Like I understand keeping his full appearance a secret up until the end, but a younger cloaked Luke will definitely appear in a flashback and might or might not appear as a message.
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Star Wars: In Production [Rumors/SPOILERS for All Films Past, Present, & Future]
- Thread starter inm8num2
- Start date
Well I assume the message hidden in the Saber isn't recent. And the way Luke appears to be cloaked in the second trailer is a nice way to hide his full appearance, and a throwback to Leia in ANH when she records the message with R2. I was under the impression the whole 'Luke is in only one scene' to be over when the second trailer hit. Like I understand keeping his full appearance a secret up until the end, but a younger cloaked Luke will definitely appear in a flashback and might or might not appear as a message.
When I say "we don't see Luke until the end," I'm talking Old Luke as played by Hammill. Clearly, there is some younger version of him that appears via flashback, as seen in the second trailer.
I just don't think there's anything to support the idea that he appears as a hologram, other than wishful thinking.
Razgriz-Specter
Member
So if Rey is a Solo or Skywalker(like I believe her to be myself) what are the running theories as to why she is alone and isn't with Han, Leia or Luke?
Bobby Roberts
Banned
Seems to be that she was left there at age 5 (people wonder if Lor-San Tekka is supposed to be watching over her the whole time). She was apparently at the temple (or whatever it is) when the Knights of Ren attack, and is spirited away from there.
I'm not sure she's Han & Leia's - doesn't really seem to fit that she'd be sent to Jakku for safe-keeping if that was the case. If she's Luke's (or someone really important to Luke that he considers a daughter) then it'd be a matter of employing the same plan that kept Luke safe, but better: She doesn't know who she is, she doesn't have her actual name, and she's stashed somewhere with no connection to anyone's personal history.
Kitschkraft
Member
I've personally ruled her out as being a Solo. The story just doesn't seem to fit that way. It would be awkward for her to meet her pops when and where she does (after stealing the falcon on the smuggler ship or whatever it is). We'd have to sit through her being reunited with both Han and Leia, sounds messy to me. The synopsis doesn't seem to draw a particularly strong connection between her and Han, it reads as though Han is passing his particular torch to Finn, if anyone.
Of course, if she's Luke's, than she has the family connection to Han anyways....
We'll know for certain in about 20 days....
In regards to Luke talking...hmm, I was thinking that the flashback scene with him and R2 might have a line or something (Just like their banter in the OT), but after reading your guys thoughts on it, I kinda like the idea of him not saying a single word.
Of course, if she's Luke's, than she has the family connection to Han anyways....
We'll know for certain in about 20 days....
In regards to Luke talking...hmm, I was thinking that the flashback scene with him and R2 might have a line or something (Just like their banter in the OT), but after reading your guys thoughts on it, I kinda like the idea of him not saying a single word.
So Rey got hurried away during a temple attack when she was 5. Is that a flashback?
Do all three leads not have any recollection of their parents?
Like Rey got the Luke treatment? Finn got hijacked by the First Order when he was young?
What about Kylo? I still don't understand how this will work with Leia and Han being his parents?
Were they all really keen on giving away their children at the first sign of a resurgence of the Empire and hide them on the usual desert/snow planets?
Was Kylo stolen like Finn and got the Voldemort/Snoke whisper treatment?
Can't seem to find a solution for my biggest worry which is that Leia and Han will look like asshole parents, their lovechild being a bigger potential villain than the ones they fight against in the OT.
Do all three leads not have any recollection of their parents?
Like Rey got the Luke treatment? Finn got hijacked by the First Order when he was young?
What about Kylo? I still don't understand how this will work with Leia and Han being his parents?
Were they all really keen on giving away their children at the first sign of a resurgence of the Empire and hide them on the usual desert/snow planets?
Was Kylo stolen like Finn and got the Voldemort/Snoke whisper treatment?
Can't seem to find a solution for my biggest worry which is that Leia and Han will look like asshole parents, their lovechild being a bigger potential villain than the ones they fight against in the OT.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
Yeah, it appears to be revealed in the flashback
And it seems Finn doesn't really know who he is outside of FN 2187. Rey apparently doesn't really know what her real name is, either (she might remember it via the vision/flashback), so she probably doesn't know who her parents actually are, either. She knows she's waiting for "her family" but it's possible she doesn't actually know what that means. Kylo appears to know EXACTLY who his parents and his Uncle are - he just doesn't like them at all. He turned of his own volition, apparently.
The idea that because their kid went evil makes them bad parents isn't necessarily the fairest of leaps, though. Maybe the film will address that head-on though, who knows. But it's also possible they did the best they could, and it didn't matter, because Snoke was just too compelling/convincing.
Kitschkraft
Member
It's a "flashback" for the audience, but for Rey, it's more like a vision/repressed memory.
Rey - Her story seems to be about her repressing her force powers, and having forgotten her true past. There's also the line with Kylo taunting Rey with "you're JUST a scavenger". As though he knows that she's LUKE FUCKING SKYWALKER'S DAUGHTER and questioning how she could end up being a "no one" on Jakku.
Finn - Mostly speculation at this point. For all we know, maybe he has a line in the film "I joined the First Order as a teen" and that's the end of it. It seems that his character is meant to be a window into the mentality of a disenchanted stormtrooper. His non-trooper backstory (If he even has one) isn't that important.
Kylo - The spoilers seem to suggest that he knows his heritage. He is said to have a "moment" in the falcon, even sitting in the captain's chair. He later kills Han, telling him "You're not my father" (But this seems to be more of a defensive/metaphorical statement). It appears as though his knowledge of his heritage is the reason for him turning evil...he has some sort of obsession with Vader (His grandfather) and wants to 'finish what he started'.
In regards to Han and Leia, this was discussed a few pages back iirc. I personally think it's going to work as a great tragic story element. Family-induced tragedy is a common theme throughout all of the 6 films.
kaiju
Member
Yeah screw reboots but I'd love to see some kind of post-ROTJ Luke saga. Would be tough to pull off with a new actor and all, but damn I need that story.
Also something hit me like a brick today. The Force Awakens...what if Luke is in carbonite or some kind of force-induced sleep to avoid detection?
Kaep I hope you have my new avatar ready lol
Bobby Roberts
Banned
I'm pretty sure we saw the results of Luke's first attempt at it scattered around Kylo Ren's feet in the trailer.
I kinda hope he doesn't bring 'em back, honestly.
They more or less sucked.
I kinda hope he doesn't bring 'em back, honestly.
They more or less sucked.
TheKaeptain
Banned
If they come back they need to be completely different than the old order.
Yeah, they did suck. That's why if they bring something similar back, I hope this
is the case. I can see the concept working if the characterization of the organization is pretty much the opposite of the old one.
Charles Foster Kane
Rosebud
Bobby Roberts
Banned
I dont' know how you invert the characterization of that organization and still have it function, though.
It's likely very possible. Just because I can't see it doesn't mean it can't be done (and easily, too) but I dunno. I like the idea of abandoning the old ways and finding new ways forward as an underlying theme of this trilogy. Resurrecting the Jedi Order, even if it's in name only, would kneecap that.
ViewtifulJC
Banned
Charles Foster Kane
Rosebud
For some reason I haven't been paying attention to the date. It's so close!!!
George Oscar Bluth II
Banned
Just 17 days left.
tiredheadcrab
Member
Yeah and I did study a Film art class in college. Even A New Hope's story wasnt original by any means. It was the heroes journey through and through. This story is important because it is supposed to set up the next 3 movies.
Edit: Did someone in this thread say that StarKiller base is coming from some unknown region of space? I believe at the end of the book Aftermath an Imperial Trooper said that Palpatine was drawing his power from outside the galaxy. Perhaps they found Snoke out there in hiding or something.
Sorry Im always speculating because excited.
Oh man, this could be incredibly interesting if true. We always forget that there's stuff outside The Galaxy. We don't necessarily need books and movies set outside The Galaxy, but it'd be interesting to see outside stuff come in once in a while and affect things.
Just please, no canon Yuuzhan Vong.
tiredheadcrab
Member
What was wrong with the Yuuzhan Vong? I was never much into the EU. Kind of glad Disney did retconned it and will probably use themes from the material.
I've just never liked the concept of the Yuuzhan Vong because they're too big of a threat. I'm not exactly en expert since I didn't read all the books, but basically they wiped out hundreds of trillions of beings, which makes what happened in the OT look like nothing. I think they're a cool concept and I wouldn't mind them being toned down and brought into the new canon, but I wouldn't want them in the new canon as they were in the old EU.
Also, the whole "Palpatine built the Death Stars to defend the galaxy from the Vong and he was actually a good guy all along!" theory. Ugh.
tiredheadcrab
Member
Yeah that kind of makes the Imperials look easy to fight lol.
As for the whole Palpatine drawing his power from unknown regions of space here is what i got from IGN.
http://www.ign.com/articles/2015/09/04/9-important-new-details-from-star-wars-aftermath
So I have a few theories
1: They found some source of power that the Dark Side was forming from and Snoke was there with The Knights of Ren. Perhaps they were in hiding from The Sith.
2: Maybe 1 of the people that was sent out there found this Power and he was a force sensitive character. The Dark Side corrupted him and he is drawing from this power as well since he was directly exposed to it.
Although I am leaning more towards number 1 as JJ said that Snoke is an Alien we havent met before. It could still be number 2 but the empire didnt allow aliens in its ranks i think.
Razgriz-Specter
Member
1 more spoiler question,
Why exactly is there no New Republic?
And why is the Rebel Alliance now the Resistance?
First Order I kinda understand, though it does seem weird after so long they can keep so many people in their ranks.
Unless they are paying out a fortune to everyone seems weird they could keep people when they are properly shown as black and white bad guys(especially after the DeathStar).
Why exactly is there no New Republic?
And why is the Rebel Alliance now the Resistance?
First Order I kinda understand, though it does seem weird after so long they can keep so many people in their ranks.
Unless they are paying out a fortune to everyone seems weird they could keep people when they are properly shown as black and white bad guys(especially after the DeathStar).
Charles Foster Kane
Rosebud
Well, I would assume empires don't fall in a day and that the galaxy is pretty divided. Resistance instead of rebels now makes sense to me too.
Also, they were shown as black and white to us. People follow crazy shit all the time. Depends where and how you were raised.
Razgriz-Specter
Member
Yeah but why not once Palpatine was taken out establish the Republic in whatever regions you currently have locked down.
If the status quo continued 30 years after ROTJ it kinda makes the efforts of the OT inconsequential
First Order I have no problem with, the Empire retreats and regroups where they think they are best suited and slowly rebuild from there.
Pretty sure there is a New Republic but Resistance is what operates within First Order territory (which is reformed remnants of the Empire).
There is a New Republic (they talk about its founding in Aftermath), they just haven't really mentioned it in TFA marketing for some reason.
Razgriz-Specter
Member
The New Republic did indeed form after the Battle of Endor, almost immediately. It even has a cannon Wookieepedia article.
But, it has probably been missing from the merchandizing because a) It doesn't really show up until the end of TFA (if it shows up at all) and b) they don't want to confuse anybody by showing both a Resistance and the New Republic.
Supposedly, Leia forms the Resistance because the New Republic refuses to remilitarize itself against the growing threat of the First Order.
Razgriz-Specter
Member
Didn't know that and makes sense. Thanks.
The few times it has been mentioned in current canon do they go into any detail on it(planets/systems aligned, capital, etc)?
Megalosaro
Banned
So... all signs point to this being a rehash of episode 4. Anything suggestin otherwise?
The only specifics I know for sure is that the capital is Chandrila and Naboo is a part of it.
Anything suggesting that it's a rehash?
Razgriz-Specter
Member
My personal prediction regarding Finn, Rey and Kylo...
Finn - No real backstory. Probably recruited from some Outer Rim planet where he felt he had no future. To be distantly related to say, Lando, would just shrink the universe too much. Finn's story will mirror Han's, in terms of coming into the world as an outsider.
Rey - Skywalker. The way the flashback scene was described, I seem to recall that in the vision Maz gives Rey, Kylo looks at her, and yet ignores her. Due to that, part of me thinks she isn't remembering it, but viewing it as an outsider. That said, I think she'll ultimately be there. We can kind of assume, that up until that attack, there was no real threat to the Jedi. Thus, he probably kept his daughter by his side. Why wouldn't he? After the attack, I wonder if Luke places her on Jakku to keep her safe. It's rumoured that Luke is guarding an old Sith tomb...either he's waiting for Rey to come of age, or he's waiting for a resolution to the disturbance in the Force he's probably felt. What possible reason can he justify leaving his daughter somewhere remote, AND turn his back on his friends and allies? I'm sure VIII will explore this more, but I am looking forward to THAT flashback more than anything I think. Incidentally, I think they could show Luke in that scene, but never reveal his face. From behind/afar, they could quite easily depict a cloaked figure with a green lightsaber, or, most likely, I think that scene will show Luke discovering the aftermath of the attack.
Kylo - It's all but certain he's a Solo. He's obviously force sensitive too, so Leia would have felt that in him upon his birth. She either helped guide him, or sent him to Uncle Luke for training. Ambitious, with an incredibly strong bloodline, I can see young Kylo being hungry to learn, to be strong, to be better than those around him. I think his ability of the force makes him vunerable, and from the trailers/leaks, it seems Snoke is in his head at the time of TFA. I think Snoke got into his head at a far younger age, tempting him with the power of the dark side and the legacy of his Grandfather. He abandons Luke/Leia and the path of the Light Side, and succumbs to the dark ways, and follows Snoke's guidance in joining/forming the Knights of Ren. The attack on the Jedi is an attempt at wiping them out, including Luke. After Luke goes into hiding, Kylo makes it his goal to kill the last remaining Jedi.
Finn - No real backstory. Probably recruited from some Outer Rim planet where he felt he had no future. To be distantly related to say, Lando, would just shrink the universe too much. Finn's story will mirror Han's, in terms of coming into the world as an outsider.
Rey - Skywalker. The way the flashback scene was described, I seem to recall that in the vision Maz gives Rey, Kylo looks at her, and yet ignores her. Due to that, part of me thinks she isn't remembering it, but viewing it as an outsider. That said, I think she'll ultimately be there. We can kind of assume, that up until that attack, there was no real threat to the Jedi. Thus, he probably kept his daughter by his side. Why wouldn't he? After the attack, I wonder if Luke places her on Jakku to keep her safe. It's rumoured that Luke is guarding an old Sith tomb...either he's waiting for Rey to come of age, or he's waiting for a resolution to the disturbance in the Force he's probably felt. What possible reason can he justify leaving his daughter somewhere remote, AND turn his back on his friends and allies? I'm sure VIII will explore this more, but I am looking forward to THAT flashback more than anything I think. Incidentally, I think they could show Luke in that scene, but never reveal his face. From behind/afar, they could quite easily depict a cloaked figure with a green lightsaber, or, most likely, I think that scene will show Luke discovering the aftermath of the attack.
Kylo - It's all but certain he's a Solo. He's obviously force sensitive too, so Leia would have felt that in him upon his birth. She either helped guide him, or sent him to Uncle Luke for training. Ambitious, with an incredibly strong bloodline, I can see young Kylo being hungry to learn, to be strong, to be better than those around him. I think his ability of the force makes him vunerable, and from the trailers/leaks, it seems Snoke is in his head at the time of TFA. I think Snoke got into his head at a far younger age, tempting him with the power of the dark side and the legacy of his Grandfather. He abandons Luke/Leia and the path of the Light Side, and succumbs to the dark ways, and follows Snoke's guidance in joining/forming the Knights of Ren. The attack on the Jedi is an attempt at wiping them out, including Luke. After Luke goes into hiding, Kylo makes it his goal to kill the last remaining Jedi.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
Most of this thread.
Basic structure, themes, etc.
No, some just see a repeat of A New Hope, but it's becoming obvious that they structured it more as a homage to the entire OT and Episodes VIII and IX will be more original stories (hopefully).
First Act of TFA: A New Hope (introduction to heroes, desert planet, a McGuffin)
Second Act of TFA: The Empire Strikes Back (snow planet, surprise Imperial attack)
Third Act: Return of the Jedi (A last minute victory for the heroes, Luke shows up and the Jedi come back into play)
There's even more stuff from the entire OT thrown in between. Themes from ROTJ come up in the second act, stuff from a TESB in the third etc., but it seems very likely this is what they went for.
Let's hope it works.
CreepingFear
Member
lol. Was just watching "This Week in Tech" and Leo Laporte pretty much spoiled that Han was going to die. They were talking about the new Star Wars film and to paraphrase, he said "there are rumors they are going to kill Harrison Ford".
Charles Foster Kane
Rosebud
I know it's a spoiler, but who doesn't really see it coming?
Killing Solo is one thing, but Ford? Bad joke aside, I think most are expecting Han to kick the bucket.
CreepingFear
Member
I agree with you. Let's see what happens if you post that info in a non-spoiler thread though. I posted in one of the early Creed threads with a spoiler tag asking Bobby if Han dying or Creed would make him cry more, and dummies read the spoiler even after the warning that the spoiler was for Episode 7. I edited my post quickly before I could get banned.
So it's structured like the good Star Wars movies in that order? Sweet!
CreepingFear
Member
Why'd I have to read about this right before I went to bed?