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Star Wars: In Production [Rumors/SPOILERS for All Films Past, Present, & Future]
- Thread starter inm8num2
- Start date
She's at home doing the dishes.
LegendofLex
Member
She's has the only real political experience among them, so if there's any kind of New World Order I can't imagine she wouldn't be at least tangentially involved. But it's altogether likely that she'll have a more distant role compared to other characters, not an active hero role like she had in the OT.
I hope so! =D
well that's super shitty to hear :/
Bobby Roberts
Banned
That appears to be the case, but almost zero about her has gotten out.
Then again, nobody knows what the hell Domnhall Gleeson & Andy Serkis are doing, either. We only JUST found out what Max Von Sydow is up to.
I went ahead and did a special edition episode of Full of Sith solely about the rumor stuff
Bucket Mouse
Member
Exactly.
In Star Wars, Obi Wan is as reliable a source as the film needs him to be. As far as I'm concerned, everything written for him in that movie was to be taken at face value in 1977 and simply functioned as a catalyst for a good vs. evil fairytale. So, if he says the Jedi were guardians of peace and justice for over a thousand generations, the film is saying the Jedi were guardians of peace and justice for over a thousand generations. The notion that you would even have to question Obi Wan's reliability only really arose in the sequels, when he was awkwardly forced (!) to backtrack on certain pieces of information as a consequence of the Vader/Leia retcons.
brandonh83
Banned
There is nothing to interpret. The prequels are incredibly straightforward. Myself, the person you quoted, and others also arrived at the same "interpretation" because it's explicit: the Jedi were flawed and that's why they were wiped out. In the first episode you have a Jedi protagonist who is very close to how Yoda and Obi-Wan were represented in the latter three, and when he dies he is seen meditating and being spiritual with the Force. At the end of the prequels Yoda reveals to Obi-Wan that he has been in communication with Qui-Gon through the Force and that they're basically going to follow what Qui-Gon learns beyond death. This is why the Jedi are the way they are in the prequels, and why Obi-Wan and Yoda are the way they are in the originals.
There is nothing to interpret. It's all spelled out blatantly clear.
And that's true, and true of the prequels.
LegendofLex
Member
But you're talking about "a film" (singular) that was made as a self-contained entity at first, not a massive blockbuster franchise (that came later).
It's inevitable that as a story becomes more complicated, what we understand about the details we're told in previous stories will also become more complicated. It wouldn't be very interesting if every new piece of information given in sequels and prequels precisely mirrors the information we already had. When you make a sequel or prequel, you must necessarily defy at least parts of the vision that many people had based on the original. Otherwise you might as well have just left the events up to the audience's imagination.
The result is often (if not always) a multi-layered narrative where you must critically examine your assumptions about everything that happens in order to make sense of any of it. Is that going to piss people off for not being a 100% replication of what they thought when they first saw the first film? Hell yeah. But is that a necessary sacrifice to achieve a compelling story that doesn't just continually re-tread stale ground? Absolutely.
This is incredibly important to grasp especially as we go into completely uncharted territory with these new sequels, where we only have scant justification for any of our assumptions about what might or might not happen. We can reasonably expect based on the end of RotJ that Luke will still be a peace-loving good guy Obi-Wan-like hermit who sees the good in everyone... but we really have no idea. The context of these sequels could be very different from the end of the OT, where one would expect based on the finale that defeating the Empire means an end to evil. But of course we should know by now (not from the films, but from real life) that nothing is ever that easy.
VistraNorrez
Member
People always look at the prequels as screwing up continuity, but it stared with TESB and continued with every new film. I expect Ep. 7 to be no different. It will change how we thought about certain things. The ending of Jedi will never be looked at the same after 7. Well unless you choose to ignore it of course. The change doesn't have to be bad either.
Yeah. I actually don't know how you get from that quote, which basically says they were the police force of a galaxy spanning republic that was destroyed by a political movement, to "they were monks and there were a handful of them brought down by one man". People seem to make that leap all the time and I just don't get it.
LegendofLex
Member
Let's just clear the air on this subject, since it seems to be a popular source of discontent. This is the line:
100% accurate summary of the story as it is told in the prequels.
ROTS seemed like George desperately tried to a check off certain must have items while narrative time was running out.
Climactic fight between Obi and Anakin next to lava as mentioned in the old books - check
Vader helped hunt down the Jedi - gotta have a scene where he kills a few - check
If Episode 1 would have had Anakin as a Luke aged boy it would have been way easier to do it all justice.
Vader could have even gotten the mask and costume at the end of Episode 2 then.
Episode 3 then would have had the Empire in full swing already and show a real purge with Vader spearheading the effort.
Ah well...
Bobby Roberts
Banned
Indie Revolver says "pump your brakes" on the most recent rumor regarding Luke Skywalker.
LegendofLex
Member
Part of me had this reaction, too. We don't really get to see proper early development for Vader once he becomes a Sith, which makes it hard to believe he'd go from wanting to save his wife to slaughtering the people who rescued him from slavery and taught him everything he knows within (for us) an hour or so of screen time.
But I think part of that is due to needing the film to stand as its own story and not just as a direct portrayal of stuff that was talked about in the OT. The villain of the story isn't Anakin, after all--it's Palpatine. So RotS is more or less the story of how Palpatine "wins."
I feel the same way about the way the Clone Wars are depicted--none of the battles we see in the live-action films feel remotely as definitive as the destruction of the Death Stars or the siege on the base at Hoth. They're just action sequences added for flavor. And the moment that ends the Clone Wars is really just Anakin showing up to terminate the remaining separatists. It all felt very rushed and incomplete.
But, in the end, this actually serves the story: the Clone Wars are a rigged game where Palpatine wins no matter the outcome. The real crux of the story is not the wars--it is the political game being played against the Jedi, and how the Order gets torn apart.
Doublesith
Member
Hey Bobby - nice job on that solo Rumor Control podcast. Really enjoyed it. Agree with you 100% in that it's not the "what", but the "how" and "why" that matter.
I second the comment about Bobbys podcast. Anyone even halfway interested in Star Wars needs to listen to Full of Sith. I was a huge fan of the podcast before even realizing the Bobby there was the same one here.
I have to admit it's also weird to see Bobby over at TheForce.Net boards as well hah. Worlds are colliding.
I have to admit it's also weird to see Bobby over at TheForce.Net boards as well hah. Worlds are colliding.
George Oscar Bluth II
Banned
Yeah, the podcast was fun to listen to. I'll be keeping up with them from now on
Bobby Roberts
Banned
Holy shit!
Thanks guys. Glad you dug it. It's the first solo podcast I've done in a couple years. I never quite know if its working when I don't have someone to bounce off of
Thanks guys. Glad you dug it. It's the first solo podcast I've done in a couple years. I never quite know if its working when I don't have someone to bounce off of
shira
Member
Holy shit!
Thanks guys. Glad you dug it. It's the first solo podcast I've done in a couple years. I never quite know if its working when I don't have someone to bounce off of
I'll give it a whirl, I didn't even know you had a podcast.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
Heh, I have like 5. The only one I don't talk on is "Rachel & Miles X-Plain the X-Men"
Sapiens
Member
Considering her main responsibility in the original films was to be the sole piece of ass in the galaxy, I don't wonder why...
TheKaeptain
Banned
Guy.brush's rant about cyborgs in the Star Wars universe just gets destroyed in one chapter of the new Star Wars Rebel book. The Machine vs Man thing is still in the series though.
I went ahead and did a special edition episode of Full of Sith solely about the rumor stuff
As others have said, great job!
Bobby Roberts
Banned
Thanks for that.
I do think the only way "Luke as a cyborg villain" works is if it's a vision, as that original rumor is now being modified to allow for.
It just seems a lot more plausible to me that we're getting a Luke whose gone sour somehow (think closer to Haymitch Abernathy) than a Luke who's gonna go evil robot on us. Maybe he'll do something that solves a problem in the best/worst way that just makes everything tougher on everyone heading into Episode 8 (and maybe he doesn't CARE that he did so) but I can't see Episode VII ending on a 100% down note.
I do think the only way "Luke as a cyborg villain" works is if it's a vision, as that original rumor is now being modified to allow for.
It just seems a lot more plausible to me that we're getting a Luke whose gone sour somehow (think closer to Haymitch Abernathy) than a Luke who's gonna go evil robot on us. Maybe he'll do something that solves a problem in the best/worst way that just makes everything tougher on everyone heading into Episode 8 (and maybe he doesn't CARE that he did so) but I can't see Episode VII ending on a 100% down note.
Yeah, less of an "evil Luke" and more of an "old, drunk, apathetic Luke" would probably work a tinybit better.Thanks for that.
I do think the only way "Luke as a cyborg villain" works is if it's a vision, as that original rumor is now being modified to allow for.
It just seems a lot more plausible to me that we're getting a Luke whose gone sour somehow (think closer to Haymitch Abernathy) than a Luke who's gonna go evil robot on us. Maybe he'll do something that solves a problem in the best/worst way that just makes everything tougher on everyone heading into Episode 8 (and maybe he doesn't CARE that he did so) but I can't see Episode VII ending on a 100% down note.
Also, I just wanted to jump in with all the others and say, your podcast was excellent. You just gained a new listener.
CreepingFear
Member
Thanks for that.
I do think the only way "Luke as a cyborg villain" works is if it's a vision, as that original rumor is now being modified to allow for.
It just seems a lot more plausible to me that we're getting a Luke whose gone sour somehow (think closer to Haymitch Abernathy) than a Luke who's gonna go evil robot on us. Maybe he'll do something that solves a problem in the best/worst way that just makes everything tougher on everyone heading into Episode 8 (and maybe he doesn't CARE that he did so) but I can't see Episode VII ending on a 100% down note.
If Han is to possibly die in this one like Kasdan and Ford wanted him too so many years ago, we can't also have an evil Luke. Way too much darkness, even for a grown man like me that likes dark things sometimes.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
What if Luke causes Han's death?
that's not the same as Luke KILLS Han, mind. But what if the only way to "win the day" for the good guys involves Luke making a call that loses us Han?
that's not the same as Luke KILLS Han, mind. But what if the only way to "win the day" for the good guys involves Luke making a call that loses us Han?
CreepingFear
Member
Kind of like how Yoda and Ghost Obi Wan were telling Luke not to go to Bespin to save Han and Leia? I'd be okay with that if it is used as a device to make one of the new comers become disenchanted with Luke and his way's for that reason.
Ether_Snake
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I don't believe Luke will do anything that would put him in a position of regret such as killing a friend, nor do I think Luke will be killed, or at least not in a way that would make him the loser in a fight. He is Star Wars' hero, a hero can't lose. He can only leave in a way that brings closure but at the same time makes him eternal. He could go away like Obi Wan and Yoda did, but he can't "lose". Luke as a character cannot be diminished. That doesn't mean he can't have weaknesses, but once he "leaves" he only leaves in a way that makes him forever a hero.
Killing Luke or having him make regrettable mistakes would remove the cornerstone of the Star Wars universe in your average movie-goers' minds. He is the one everyone knows, and the one Star Wars' audience can't afford to lose. Once he leaves, he leaves to cement his legacy and Star Wars itself, otherwise his departure would effectively shut Star Wars in your average viewer's mind; they would lose their reference point. They need Luke as a reference point, even if he is no longer present afterwards, they must always be able to think of him when thinking of Star Wars, without a hint of diminished quality to his character.
It might sound cliche for Luke to be a savior-like character, but that's the path he was set on since the beginning and this was cemented by the end of ROTJ, and that's how people see him. He's the classic hero, you can't change that without shattering the character and throw Star Wars into a chaotic spin.
Killing Luke or having him make regrettable mistakes would remove the cornerstone of the Star Wars universe in your average movie-goers' minds. He is the one everyone knows, and the one Star Wars' audience can't afford to lose. Once he leaves, he leaves to cement his legacy and Star Wars itself, otherwise his departure would effectively shut Star Wars in your average viewer's mind; they would lose their reference point. They need Luke as a reference point, even if he is no longer present afterwards, they must always be able to think of him when thinking of Star Wars, without a hint of diminished quality to his character.
It might sound cliche for Luke to be a savior-like character, but that's the path he was set on since the beginning and this was cemented by the end of ROTJ, and that's how people see him. He's the classic hero, you can't change that without shattering the character and throw Star Wars into a chaotic spin.
TheKaeptain
Banned
If you remember I said Han would die saving Luke. I can see that happening. Luke is defeated by the bad guy and at the last second Han jumps in to save him or something like that.
Thanks for that.
I do think the only way "Luke as a cyborg villain" works is if it's a vision, as that original rumor is now being modified to allow for.
It just seems a lot more plausible to me that we're getting a Luke whose gone sour somehow (think closer to Haymitch Abernathy) than a Luke who's gonna go evil robot on us. Maybe he'll do something that solves a problem in the best/worst way that just makes everything tougher on everyone heading into Episode 8 (and maybe he doesn't CARE that he did so) but I can't see Episode VII ending on a 100% down note.
I can see it being a Luke vs Vader on Dagobah type of vision.
Good. I hope most of the OC have zip to do, outside of Mark training fools.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
TheKaeptain
Banned
The original cast is going to be very important in the first film. Each film after that they will have less of a role and by the end the John and Ridley will be the leads.
Could be fun.
Badlucktroll
Member
NOT FUCKING SPOILERS JUST RUMORS
"Even more shocking is that it appears that Episode VII ends with Kira (Daisy Ridley’s character) kneeling before Cyborg Luke to become his new apprentice. This is apparently what was filmed at Skellig Michael in Ireland. John Boyega’s character is then the hero of the new trilogy, and we’re left waiting for Episode VIII to see how the heroes deal with Luke becoming the new Sith Lord with Kira has his apprentice.
"
So Luke might become the evil sith lord at the end, and episode 8 will be dark as fuck?
"The evil she sought to vanquish with the power of Luke Skywalker, is Luke Skywalker."
http://www.starwarsunderworld.com/2014/10/rumor-episode-vii-villain-identity.html
"Even more shocking is that it appears that Episode VII ends with Kira (Daisy Ridley’s character) kneeling before Cyborg Luke to become his new apprentice. This is apparently what was filmed at Skellig Michael in Ireland. John Boyega’s character is then the hero of the new trilogy, and we’re left waiting for Episode VIII to see how the heroes deal with Luke becoming the new Sith Lord with Kira has his apprentice.
"
So Luke might become the evil sith lord at the end, and episode 8 will be dark as fuck?
"The evil she sought to vanquish with the power of Luke Skywalker, is Luke Skywalker."
http://www.starwarsunderworld.com/2014/10/rumor-episode-vii-villain-identity.html
Bobby Roberts
Banned
That's what the thread's been discussing for the last 3 or 4 pages
WadiumArcadium
Member
I'm pretty confident (and hopeful) that rumour will turn out to be load of baloney. The vision theory sounds a lot more realistic.
Future Foundation
Member
That appears to be the case, but almost zero about her has gotten out.
Then again, nobody knows what the hell Domnhall Gleeson & Andy Serkis are doing, either. We only JUST found out what Max Von Sydow is up to.
I went ahead and did a special edition episode of Full of Sith solely about the rumor stuff
Do you usually use the 20th Century Fox fanfare from Alien 3? Because that's really awesome if you do.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
So far that's the only episode in that particular series (it's a solo spinoff I'm doing from the main Full of Sith show) but yeah, I plan on keeping both the fanfare and the quote from Andrews at the top of the show when I do the next one
TheKaeptain
Banned
I was talking with one of my professors (he's a producer at ABC and he produces movies too) about the rumors and he said he finds it hard to believe John Boyega is the main hero. When I asked why he started quoting toy sale numbers and how no white or Hispanic parent is going to buy their child a shirt with a black kid on it.
Pretty fucking real shit to hear from a black dude in the industry.
Pretty fucking real shit to hear from a black dude in the industry.
IAmRandom31
Banned
Didn't Yoda use those laser firing robots and holographic galaxies to teach the younglings?
CreepingFear
Member
In regards to Leia/Carrie Fischer, I just assume she's going to be with Han and Chewie for the ride. Is that wrong?
TheKaeptain
Banned
They kill a lot of them but Vader and his lackeys hunt down the ones that got away during the 19 years after RotS.
We've been discussing this over the last several pages, and just saying, but rumour or not they would still be spoilers, a rumour is just something not confirmed that doesn't mean it isn't a spoiler.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
I don't know if anyone knows, honestly. If she was hanging out with Han & Chewie when they show up, I think she'd have been mentioned. But so far, it seems that her role in the movie is relegated to holding down Rebel HQ as a political leader of some sort.
I'm starting to think she's going to be Chancellor Valorum, essentially.
Moff
Member
Daisy Ridley as a young sith apprentice ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
TheKaeptain
Banned
That's more than likely what her role is.