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Star Wars: The Old Republic [Releasing Date: Dec 20 NA/EU - NDA Lifted]
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Ignis Fatuus
Banned
Dear God, I always suspected Imperial Agent would be my main, but this seals it. Everything I could want and more.
Ignis Fatuus
Banned
Holy shit I just did my first flashpoint. This is so awesome and I've barely scratched the surface.
The ambition behind this game design is breathtaking. I'm not precisely sure how long this beta period will last but I'm sure it will consume my life for the duration.
The ambition behind this game design is breathtaking. I'm not precisely sure how long this beta period will last but I'm sure it will consume my life for the duration.
The_Squirrel_Menace
Member
ferr said:The problem with SWG was that those areas were huge and they were REALLY empty. When you were there, you just thought, "OK, time to leave."
Although, it was cool to see a random krayt skeleton.
I hope they have krayt dragons in TOR. Susceptible to KD/stun, of course
release this game already, damnit
Fuck .. It has been a very long time since I droped on a SWG screen shot. I had a blast with this game
R.I.P SWG Why oh why did you do this to us S.O.E!!!I remember waiting untill server reset to go Krayt hunting. Then selling those over priced crystals to them glow sticks wielders.
Ignis Fatuus said:
Just be careful Ignis, the Bioware mod's check GAF for details as well ~ Don't break your ToS if your enjoying it! Mega difficult to not talk about the awesomeness in the game, because theres quite a lot in there for any MMO fan.
September release please...
Ignis Fatuus
Banned
There's a reason I'm very circumspectly avoiding mentioning any details.syoaran said:
I've seen other impressions on the net that have toed the line much more daringly.Of course there's only so much praise one can give a game without discussing details, so I'll just shut up now.
I've watched a handful of E3 videos and I have to say I'm getting pretty excited. Will probably put it on pre-order next week.
Powertech Bounty Hunter sounds like a class right up my alley. Am I right in assuming that it's heavily DoT based? What other classes use lots of Damage over Times?
Powertech Bounty Hunter sounds like a class right up my alley. Am I right in assuming that it's heavily DoT based? What other classes use lots of Damage over Times?
It's very much a DoT class with a lot of modifiers in the firebug and advanced prototype skill trees.Skirn said:
I'd probably wait with pre-orders until they announce details about it. Wouldn't surprise me if they put it on Origin with some tempting bonuses to promote the service.
Giantbomb and mmo talk is utterly uninformative.GLopez12 said:
Cannata, who loves WoW, on Weekend Confirmed was really negative about how WoW-like the game was after playing it at E3.
The only hope I have for this game is WAR 2.0 PVP, after 6 years off and on not interested in WoW PVE. Warhammer Online's PVP was spectacular.
Second half of the day zero podcast they talk about it for a good twenty or thirty minutes.GLopez12 said:
It's mostly the same "no one wants to play a reskinned WoW" bullshit. Personally I feel like if there was ever going to be an MMO to compete in the market, it'd be TOR. What others have had half as much content as it at launch?
Either way, BW has to knock it out of the park even for EA to break even.
I think that people do want a Reskinned WoW, I know I do. Just with things being different enough and maybe sci-fi. Oh.. yes, that is TOR.CzarTim said:
I haven't heard any news about what endgame content is expected/planned at all.
I also get why magazines are leery as Making a better WoW, when WoW at this point has had about 9 years of production? Quite a tall order.
I'm also worried that TOR is part of the same bravado at EA that gave us Medal of Honor, that urge to take the same game from Acti-Bliz and make it for EA.
I am crossing my fingers however, as TOR failing would put tons of talented people out of work at one of the best studios in the world.
Affeinvasion
Member
Is it still a Star Wars game? Sign me up.
Retrofluxed
Member
I, and the rest of my MMO playing friends want a reskinned WoW. I don't hate WoW's systems, I'm just tired of the setting. 6 years in the same game with the same lore gets old. Bring on the uber-nerd IP of Star Wars.
Yeah I think alot of the press are offbase. WoW is in decline not because it is WoW. Its because the game has been on a path to be dumbed down continually and the story behind the game as far as most care is over.
If WoW had stayed on path without trying to cater to the dumbest for mass appeal etc I think it wouldnt be in any sort of decline. When you insult the user base and ruin their fun of course they are going to leave.
If WoW had stayed on path without trying to cater to the dumbest for mass appeal etc I think it wouldnt be in any sort of decline. When you insult the user base and ruin their fun of course they are going to leave.
You guys are honestly chill with the playing the same game just with a different skin? I mean, if you plan on playing this for as long as some of you may have played WoW, assuming you didn't play any of the MMO's that WoW was styled after before you started playing WoW, that's like... 12 years of the same game.
Its not the same game though. Yes it has some design cues from WoW but not even WoW came up with those. They are just staples of the Genre.Izayoi said:
The common complaint from people quitting WoW is not that they are tired of how MMOs play. They are tired of how Blizzard is handling their game.
Izayoi said:
Im ok with playing another MMORPG. To a lot of people who 'discovered' the genre with WoW, many of the common MMORPG characteristics and general genre DNA is == WoW like. They dont know any damned better.... So hotbars, questing and killing X for exp to get levels and approach an 'endgame' at max, or near max level is "WoW in a different skin". When in fact, its really nothing of the sort, and is just really the primary building blocks of most MMORPGS as a genre. So theres a lot of mixed messages really, and its hard to really know what someone is saying when they throw out Wow-like or reskinned WoW.
antonz said:
Christ, thank you. Posted seconds before I did, but you are so right.
The real point of their discussion was that The Old Republic has to perform exceptionally well to make up its incredibly high budget, which doesn't even take into account the tens or hundreds of millions EA will spend in advertising. The game can't just do okay--it needs to be a major success, and that's a tall order for any game going up against something that dominates mindshare and has millions of subscribers. Even Star Wars. I'm totally pumped for it, but I think their observations were completely valid.CzarTim said:
Only the ones that tried to do so with mainstream expectations.antonz said:
EVE certainly has grown its audience and yet is one of he most out of the box mmos. While games like Galaxies (and even to a degree DCUO) tried to do so with a mainstream license and crazy exceptions.
If SWG hadn't had Lucas and Star Wars its initial base would have been lesser, but it sure as hell would have had a more focused development post launch.
On the other hand, cookie cutter mmo's like huge licenses like Star Trek have also failed with grand sales exceptions and little innovation.'
Its funny because IMO 2003 Galaxies would still look just as innovative in 2011 compared to TOR.
What I want out of the next MMO is emphasis on the first letter of "MMO" massively. I want the game's world to actually be used and alive in some way. Whether that's RVR or some world PVE is all up to the developer.
I think a lot of people will agree with me there. It's why a lot of people went to Rift, which seemed to start doing this at launch, but it has since fallen by the wayside for more emphasis on dungeons and raids.
It just seems silly to try to compete with WOW if you're just going to take the same approach of raids and dungeons. And no, spicing things up with some artificial choices and voice acting is not a big enough difference, especially in a genre in which players typically skip storytelling. The game that beats WOW is going to be a game that makes some sort of breakthrough, and it doesn't sounds like The Old Republic is doing that.
This is all especially worrying if you consider Bioware and EA have apparently estimated costs for The Old Republic to be as high as $500 million. That's absolutely insane. I'm now starting to get worried that Bioware is going to be in some trouble if this thing doesn't top WOW, which is a pretty unrealistic goal.
I think a lot of people will agree with me there. It's why a lot of people went to Rift, which seemed to start doing this at launch, but it has since fallen by the wayside for more emphasis on dungeons and raids.
It just seems silly to try to compete with WOW if you're just going to take the same approach of raids and dungeons. And no, spicing things up with some artificial choices and voice acting is not a big enough difference, especially in a genre in which players typically skip storytelling. The game that beats WOW is going to be a game that makes some sort of breakthrough, and it doesn't sounds like The Old Republic is doing that.
This is all especially worrying if you consider Bioware and EA have apparently estimated costs for The Old Republic to be as high as $500 million. That's absolutely insane. I'm now starting to get worried that Bioware is going to be in some trouble if this thing doesn't top WOW, which is a pretty unrealistic goal.
GLopez12 said:
I could discuss this for hours, literally because I do agree with you, Id like the same. But Im not terribly sure laying infrastructure for such a type of MMO can be done within reason. Mythic has great ideas for PvP. Dating back to DAoC's design, it was a really remarkable 'idea'.... but when I think back on how that actually played out once the game aged. Man, its alot easier to want a dynamic world w/RvR that matters than it is to do it.
Then games should take a different, innovative approach or just not try to compete at all.Cipherr said:
I know that sounds pessimistic for the genre, because it means we're stuck in a stagnant state with WOW, but I just don't see why these companies are throwing so much money when they can't even do something new.
But I kind of disagree this is impossible. Guild Wars 2 is doing world PVP in a unique way with its server vs. server vs. server model. APB kind of does world PVP without lag in the form of a shooter.
Server infrastructure has also vastly improved since WAR, and I think a company with proper phasing and different server instances could definitely do it right.
I agree with this. I almost feel like the game is destined to fail, and it makes me worried for Bioware.Azar said:
GLopez12 said:
I still don't know where the 500 million is coming from. The last report that I have heard is it is costing closer to 80 Mil. Not a drop in the bucket, but if it can actually survive with a decent amount of population past the first year (like 500k) and keep that, it will easily make a profit in its life time.
Secondly there are plenty of 'innovations' within the tried and true staples of the MMO genre. The biggest is the companions. The fact that they are tuning the game experience where you must have at least 1 of your companions on you at all times should make for an interesting soloing experience and even some small grouping experience (2 players + 2 Companions).
Also the 'voices' part is a huge understatement. They are making full cut scenes to go along with those voices in an attempt to give better immersion. When I played WoW (Hell a ton of MMOs that focused on questing), I felt detached from the world, almost like I was on shallow rails, moving from one area to the next to get exp and loot and nothing more. It was a job, not an adventure, I felt no meaning in doing the quests I was doing, and the end product certainly didn't feel like something worth being proud of (Oh hey... gear that will be replaced in a couple hours! oh joy). Cut Scenes and Voice work and actual changes that effect my storyline during all quests should at least make me feel its worth taking the quest, that it's worth trying to finish them all because i'm getting more from it then simple 'loot' and EXP, but an actual experience that opens and closes paths to me. People skip the story telling in MMO's because MMORPG story telling is usually horrendously boring or entirely text driven which inevitably leads to boredom anyways when quests come at you a dime a dozen. Those stories are also usually detached from the player. You do them and nothing really changes for you or the world around you. You save the world!... here is a couple coins or medals that no one but a couple of NPC's will care for!
The fact that your choices will affect your gameplay (Dark vs Light vs Grey affinity) as well as the companions you will get and how well they will help you gives more meaning to the quests after each one you do.
Its not a revolution of the genre, but there is enough evolutions to create a different experience that hasn't been handed to people before. And since its in such an expansive universe, I also have no fear that there will be plenty of content and stories to come in the future, so if the core gameplay clicks with people, I can see a lot of people sticking around to find more as more and more content patches get released.
I don't know if I should stop reading things about this game.
On one hand I read, "its awesome", then the other I hear "trainwreck".
I so want a good MMO other than WoW. So sick of WoW's gameplay, and universe. After 5 years I've had enough, but nothing has come along that's any better.
On one hand I read, "its awesome", then the other I hear "trainwreck".
I so want a good MMO other than WoW. So sick of WoW's gameplay, and universe. After 5 years I've had enough, but nothing has come along that's any better.
The $500 million number is coming from people inside the industry talking to reporters. You can hear about it in a few podcasts. It's a very, very troubling money, because it basically means the game will completely bomb if it does not top World of Warcraft's numbers.
Isn't the companion system just a pet system? It also sounds a bit like the hero system in Guild Wars. That's not really innovative, and it's not the kind of innovation that keeps people actively picking the game over World of Warcraft.
Also, a lot of media people and people who have played the game are saying the choices are fairly superficial. Weekend Confirmed in particular mocked how Bioware's key example of letting a character die or not had basically no impact outside of unlocking a line where the character thanks the player if he's allowed to live.
I just don't see the kind of notable innovation in this game.
I mean, when you see a few of the credible media people on Weekend Confirmed unanimously agreeing that The Old Republic just plays like another MMORPG, despite being advertised as a "great single-player experience," I think it's time to get worried.
Isn't the companion system just a pet system? It also sounds a bit like the hero system in Guild Wars. That's not really innovative, and it's not the kind of innovation that keeps people actively picking the game over World of Warcraft.
Also, a lot of media people and people who have played the game are saying the choices are fairly superficial. Weekend Confirmed in particular mocked how Bioware's key example of letting a character die or not had basically no impact outside of unlocking a line where the character thanks the player if he's allowed to live.
I just don't see the kind of notable innovation in this game.
I mean, when you see a few of the credible media people on Weekend Confirmed unanimously agreeing that The Old Republic just plays like another MMORPG, despite being advertised as a "great single-player experience," I think it's time to get worried.
Izayoi said:
I want an actual quote that says the 500 million number because I can't find it anywhere other then speculation by a rabid fan base or came from someone that has had a 'spotty' record of facts for EA games to the say least (in which that person said 300 mil, and he said it in such fashion that it read like a negatively influenced fanboy would write, and not someone with any inside knowledge.)
This however was announced fairly recently.
http://www.vg247.com/2011/05/05/analyst-swtor-could-cost-ea-as-much-as-80-million-to-develop/
The only other source that lingers on the 100 Mil + is a quote that doesn't even have anything to do with this game, and that is it cost Blizzard 100 mil to develop and publish WoW back in 2004 (including marketing costs) and that an EA representative said it was 'easily' our most expensive production yet... when there average game cost is somewhere around 30mil +.
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