Orangepeel said:
frankthurk said:That wasn't cheese that was brilliant harass.
They get tons of love in classic, absolutely killer in PvZ, thing is they had splash damage but they took it out for sc2 :/LaneDS said:Do Archons have any uses? In all the matches I've played, and all the replays I've watched of actual good players, I've precisely zero of them in use. Did they get any love in SC1 either?
Orangepeel said:whaaatever, those things build too fast, the T should've definately built a depot or something in his corners though to prevent it from happening again and again...
oh noes, i cant safely fe on temple! cheeeeeese, CHEEEEESE!Orangepeel said:
frankthurk said:Please tell me you aren't sorimachi...
'gg fag'? Didn't realize starcraft was running on xbox live.
x2+5 the amount of times he comments on unit balance in a game he hasnt played.Ice Monkey said:how many times does the guy have to say how disappointed he is he isnt in the beta in this thread before you dont assume he's the guy running around saying gg fag?
Orangepeel said:They get tons of love in classic, absolutely killer in PvZ, thing is they had splash damage but they took it out for sc2 :/
Orangepeel said:whaaatever, those things build too fast, the T should've definately built a depot or something in his corners though to prevent it from happening again and again...
NovemberMike said:Before the last patch they were probably the most powerful unit in the game, but the patch just made static defenses a lot better, which nerfed the muta quite a bit in their ability to harass. Missile turrets just got their damage nearly doubled, photon cannons got knocked up to 300 HP and spore colonies got cheaper, not to mention the Thor moving to AOE damage. They aren't horrible or anything, but they've had their ability to effectively harass greatly reduced.
NovemberMike said:Banshees are actually significantly better against turrets than mutas. Missile Turrets have 7 range while banshees have 6 and mutas have 3, which means that mutas will often take damage from 3+ turrets while shees are taking damage from 1, Banshees have more health, and Banshees do about 2.5x the damage against turrets that mutas do.
EDIT: Found some numbers. Mutas should be doing about 6 dps if they don't have a valid target to jump to (ie. the jump target hits a supply depot or something). Banshees are doing about 20 dps. The turrets are doing about 28 dps and have 2x the health of a muta and more than 2x the range. If you start microing a muta back too late it will often be dead before it actually gets out of the range of the turret.
Ice Monkey said:your perception of mutas in interesting, but way off base. They are easily the most powerful zerg unit even if just because of their speed. Your contention that they are less amazing because of static defense buffs is way off base, too, as you forget how much someone has to invest in static defense for it to matter to a muta ball...and any player worth his salt at that point would just use just as many mutas to control the map and attack the turtle's base with something else entirely.
hypothetical situation: a terran player has umpteen billion turrets in his base, that you notice as soon as you send a ball of mutas in to harass. Any zerg player should have 3-4 hatcheries at a point that the turrets would be all around in his base, but the gist of that is that you can immediately produce 30-40 zerglings assuming you follow the #1 zerg rule of spawning larva like your life depended on it.
Anyways lets continue, lets say he has 3 or 4 turrets somehow shoved at his ramp, PLUS 4-5 siege tanks. Not only is this again a major investment into turtling that will probably doom him against a good zerg player but lets go through the steps to easily break his choke. Go in, focus fire the turrets and/or the siege tanks first with mutas, and basically as soon as the siege tanks are dead, send in your army of zerglings. I guarantee you anyone building that many turrets is both strapped for cash and probably only has his main base. If his expansions have 10 turrets at each, then you must have fallen asleep during the match because it would take much longer to accomplish that than to build a 20-ball of mutas to harass with. In order to have both zerglings and mutas, you only need to build TWO TOTAL TECH STRUCTURES not including lair. speedlings should obviously have been researched and maybe even a +1 attack for mutas so basically you'd be ready after spending 200 minerals on a pool, 150/100 gas on lair, 200/150 gas on the spire and then 300 minerals per hatchery you buy, plus the 100/100 for speedlings and 100/100 for +flyer attack. This is a total of 1050/450 for structures +300 per extra hatchery. Anyways I went too long into that but the point is that you can spend the rest on units while the other guy is spending 75 minerals on each turret or 150 on each cannon.
Also, dont forget if someone turtles like this to the point that mutas would get demolished in their base you can always just build some mutas for defense and tech to brood lords and take out turrets with no hits being taken just like in sc1 with guardians. (can anyone confirm this, that brood lords can out range defense?)
Orangepeel said:
Ice Monkey said:your perception of mutas in interesting, but way off base. They are easily the most powerful zerg unit even if just because of their speed. Your contention that they are less amazing because of static defense buffs is way off base, too, as you forget how much someone has to invest in static defense for it to matter to a muta ball...and any player worth his salt at that point would just use just as many mutas to control the map and attack the turtle's base with something else entirely.
hypothetical situation: a terran player has umpteen billion turrets in his base, that you notice as soon as you send a ball of mutas in to harass. Any zerg player should have 3-4 hatcheries at a point that the turrets would be all around in his base, but the gist of that is that you can immediately produce 30-40 zerglings assuming you follow the #1 zerg rule of spawning larva like your life depended on it.
Anyways lets continue, lets say he has 3 or 4 turrets somehow shoved at his ramp, PLUS 4-5 siege tanks. Not only is this again a major investment into turtling that will probably doom him against a good zerg player but lets go through the steps to easily break his choke. Go in, focus fire the turrets and/or the siege tanks first with mutas, and basically as soon as the siege tanks are dead, send in your army of zerglings. I guarantee you anyone building that many turrets is both strapped for cash and probably only has his main base. If his expansions have 10 turrets at each, then you must have fallen asleep during the match because it would take much longer to accomplish that than to build a 20-ball of mutas to harass with. In order to have both zerglings and mutas, you only need to build TWO TOTAL TECH STRUCTURES not including lair. speedlings should obviously have been researched and maybe even a +1 attack for mutas so basically you'd be ready after spending 200 minerals on a pool, 150/100 gas on lair, 200/150 gas on the spire and then 300 minerals per hatchery you buy, plus the 100/100 for speedlings and 100/100 for +flyer attack. This is a total of 1050/450 for structures +300 per extra hatchery. Anyways I went too long into that but the point is that you can spend the rest on units while the other guy is spending 75 minerals on each turret or 150 on each cannon.
Also, dont forget if someone turtles like this to the point that mutas would get demolished in their base you can always just build some mutas for defense and tech to brood lords and take out turrets with no hits being taken just like in sc1 with guardians. (can anyone confirm this, that brood lords can out range defense?)
frankthurk said:Awesome, the zerg must be destroying the terrans in the ladders then! Or if not all the foolish zerg must have missed the brilliant muta strategy!
TurtleSnatcher said:If you just go all muta you will die. Thats the thing that most players really screw up on.
TurtleSnatcher said:So I'm uploading my favorite moment so far in SC2 beta. Well one of my favorite moments.
Demi and Zzoram will appreciate it. So will Panda!
EDIT: Uploaded!
Fav moment so far in SC2 Beta
Me and Panda vs Zzoram and Demi on Twilight Fortress. ZZ vs TT
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cGNC3rkaLUU
:lol :lol
:lolTurtleSnatcher said:So I'm uploading my favorite moment so far in SC2 beta. Well one of my favorite moments.
Demi and Zzoram will appreciate it. So will Panda!
EDIT: Uploaded!
Fav moment so far in SC2 Beta
Me and Panda vs Zzoram and Demi on Twilight Fortress. ZZ vs TT
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cGNC3rkaLUU
:lol :lol
-COOLIO- said:how do you get into silver league from bronze? because ranking up to first would be a maaad grind if thats it
Zzoram said:I think it's based on win ratio, not actual ranking.
Official Blizzard quote: "Just a unit to have when your HT run out of energy"LaneDS said:Do Archons have any uses? In all the matches I've played, and all the replays I've watched of actual good players, I've precisely zero of them in use. Did they get any love in SC1 either?
Hazaro said:Official Blizzard quote: "Just a unit to have when your HT run out of energy"
Bullshit.
Anyway I haven't been on very much (ok actually I haven't gone on in days) due to having 2.5 major projects for school.
Split them? Uh no. :lolLaneDS said:Ugh, yeah that's pretty awful. Maybe if you could split them back into HT later on it'd be more acceptable, but that's a big stretch. I still expect them to get some love because as of right now they serve little to no purpose it seems.
I think one of the commentators referred to them as 'super zealots' that can attack air.LaneDS said:Ugh, yeah that's pretty awful. Maybe if you could split them back into HT later on it'd be more acceptable, but that's a big stretch. I still expect them to get some love because as of right now they serve little to no purpose it seems.
Ice Monkey said:your perception of mutas in interesting, but way off base. They are easily the most powerful zerg unit even if just because of their speed. Your contention that they are less amazing because of static defense buffs is way off base, too, as you forget how much someone has to invest in static defense for it to matter to a muta ball...and any player worth his salt at that point would just use just as many mutas to control the map and attack the turtle's base with something else entirely.
snip
Ice Monkey said:Also, dont forget if someone turtles like this to the point that mutas would get demolished in their base you can always just build some mutas for defense and tech to brood lords and take out turrets with no hits being taken just like in sc1 with guardians. (can anyone confirm this, that brood lords can out range defense?)
FromTheFuture said:Anyone want to get on and play right now? ID is Alumnus.mosaic
ZealousD said:Me and DeltronZero (aznpxdd) were doing some 2v2 placement matches earlier. First four matches were a snooze fest, but we had a pretty epic fifth one. Our opponents went double 10 pool, put us behind really early on. They then waited for a bit and hit me, wrecking my econ. But a quick counter push and some great micro ended up giving us the win. I'm really surprised we pulled it off.
http://www.mediafire.com/?milmghjynim
TurtleSnatcher said:Zealous make sure you close your wall early.. lol.. you had a supply depot open for 5 mins while you kept feeding marines to Deltron yet nothing was happening.
NovemberMike said:Why does everyone point out that they aren't talking about straight mutas and then use retarded straight unit strats for the other race in their counter example? The terran player isn't going to mass missile turrets or anything, he's going to get 2-3 of them around a vulnerable expansion if he things that a harass is likely.
NovemberMike said:Seriously, what terran spends all his resources on turrets and siege tanks? He's going to have mixtures of marines, medevac, siege tanks, ravens, thor etc depending on what point in the game it is.
Watch live streams too off teamliquid: http://www.teamliquid.net/video/userstream.phpF#A#Oo said:Anyone got any good youtube channels for SC2?
I've sub'ed;
BlizShouter
diggitySC
HDStarcraft
HuskyStarcraft
PsyStarcraft
SCForAll
StarCraftLegacy
Anymore I'm missing out on?
Watching SC vids is really addicitive... I watch more then I play...:lol
ahh, you gotta play like crazy to stay up there thoughchris-013 said:It's actual ranking because you need to be at the 1-8 places of your division to go up in the league.
TurtleSnatcher said:Zealous make sure you close your wall early.. lol.. you had a supply depot open for 5 mins while you kept feeding marines to Deltron yet nothing was happening. Think if they zerg decided to just go for you instead
Nice game Deltron - That zealot/sentry shit is so lame .. works well agst roaches but anything smaller it rapes..
Also those 2 were god awful.. wtf they both had quadruple digit minerals by the end of the game. Blue had 2700 minerals when you killed him :lol
EDIT: Lolz at Deltrons Terran build order comment early on. No wonder you keep dodging partnering up with me.
I hope the fact that I'm checking my battle.net account from a mac doesn't hurt my chances for getting into the beta for my PCCalavera520 said:Any news on the mac beta?
I really hope it's out soon.
For what it's worth, I thought trapping the roaches between 2 forcefields, a gas, and your zealots was pretty impressive, even if it rendered the bulk of your zealots useless.aznpxdd said:Yeah, that game would have been cake if they didn't both 10 pool my ass.
But yeah, the Sen/Z build sucks ass, damn they got raped by banelings.