I'm just giving another example that is clearly worse, but on the same scale for me. I don't see a significant difference between attempting to trade the DRM free games and attempting to trade a Humble Bundle key for profit. I never suggested that drizzle bought a bunch of bundles for a dollar, just that for the person who he is trading with, it is impossible to know (unless he shows them the receipt, or something).
If we assume good-faith on the part of the trader, then there is no difference between trading the DRM-free copies and trading a Humble Bundle key.
You don't see any difference?? Well...your further comments about this topic will need to be taken with that huge grain of salt by anyone else here then. At the least, your desire of "
we could shame the people trying to flip Humble Bundle keys" is one where I think that you would be quite lonely voicing once people understood your actual position.
"I keep piling up new examples?" This is the first new example I've brought up. I've also never suggested there was anything illegal about it. Some of the wealthiest business people in the world made their fortunes doing things that are perfectly legal, but otherwise scuzzy.
ah, I was under the impression that you had brought up two new examples, free promotional keys and selling DRM-Free copies. Apparently drizzle initially talked about the facebook Metro promotional keys, which I missed. But I don't have a problem with that either, seeing as how it was legitimately acquired, and how the other party being traded with finds value in the trade.
I don't have a problem with giving away Humble Bundle keys (even if it probably costs the Humble people a few sales as a lot of people just wait for someone to pass along the key in the thread). What I do have a problem with is selling them for profit and pretending that "because I'm only making a little profit and not selling it for the full retail cost, I'm not nearly as bad as other flippers."
Except that buying a Humble Bundle for $.01 and trying to sell it for several dollars isn't even remotely comparable to having an extra key for Humble Bundle for Android 3, which had a minimum price of $1, and trading it for another Indie bundle or game that cost $2.50. If Humble Bundle Inc. or the individual developers actually had a problem with people buying multiple bundles for the minimum, or selling/trading keys, then they would have done something about it to restrict such actions. Instead, we get white knights, like yourself, who moralize about this issue and define ANY trading where a profit is made to be wrong, a "scuzzy move". And really, ALL trading is suspect because there is no verification process to determine how much was paid, so that no profit can be made.
Absolutely ridiculous.
I took issue with your insinuation that the charities involved with the Humble Bundle aren't "worthwhile" and that giving to them isn't an "informed" decision. If you just meant for yourself personally, and weren't speaking about the charities and those who give to them broadly, I apologize. I disagree, but that's your decision to make.
My charity comment dealt dealt specifically with my own determination about the worthiness of the Humble Bundle charities, which are restricted to only two, Child's Play and American Red Cross. The "informed" comment had to do with people choosing to donate specifically, instead of just from two charities alone while purchasing games. Personally, I don't find either charity to be as worthwhile as supporting the developers. To quote myself from the THQ Humble Bundle thread:
I have voiced my issues with this in at least one previous Humble Bundle thread, but I really wish they would offer more Charity options than just
American Red Cross and
Child's Play. I am not going to give the
American Red Cross another dime due to their many ongoing issues and problems, as well as their bad history, and
Child's Play is a very nice concept, but not really what I want my money to go to if I am going to give with Charity in mind. Personally I would prefer to give to charities focused on boots on the ground type of emergency projects, food, or medical care in third world countries, like
Doctors Without Borders USA.
drizzle did actually propose trading/selling a free key, not me:
But again, I understand if you don't take issue with this because all deals are permissible between consenting parties so long as it doesn't violate a law.
I don't take issue with what drizzle proposed because what he is proposing isn't unreasonable. I do have moral/ethical qualms about people buying Bundles for $.01 and flipping them, more so since Humble Bundle Inc. changed their Bundles to having a minimum $1 purchase price. I do not for legitimately acquired promotional keys. At some point the promotions will end and those still wanting the game at a reduced price will find value in a trade. Apparently that is unethical/immoral in your mind, which I find strange, maybe in the end your position all boils down to a very strong distaste on your part for the end consumer making
any kind of perceived profit off of a deal?
EDIT: Went to mail something and didn't realize I hadn't posted this yet, should have checked before posting after I got back. My bad. I can delete it if necessary.
