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Street Fighter V |OTVIII| New Delayed Generation - Controversial Inputs

L

lucebuce12

Member
joe2187 said:
When are we going to get back to the true beauty that is Third Strikes art style?

1181242185179.png


Look how beautiful third strike was.
Click to expand...
What's wrong with you lol, that's MvC2.

THIS is 3rd strike.

breakers-revenge-screenshot2.jpg
 
N

Numb

Member
joe2187 said:
When are we going to get back to the true beauty that is Third Strikes art style?

1181242185179.png


Look how beautiful third strike was.
Click to expand...

It's not easy to get on that lvl
KOF13 was on that lvl too

ronaldmcthanos1.png


Terry sure changed over the years
Used to have makeup and sell burgers
 
U

Ucchedavāda

Member
Reizo Ryuu said:
I think only cammy has a really fast heavy, but that one doesn't even CC.
Click to expand...

I'm not sure what you would consider a "really fast heavy", so here are some numbers (excluding v-trigger variations for simplicity):

  • Ken has the only 6-frame CC normal (his crHP).
  • There are 6 CC heavys with a startup of 7 frames.
  • There are 14 CC heavys with a startup of 8 frames.
  • And there are 12 CC heavys with a startup of 9 frames.

This is based on the FAT website.
 
M

MCD250

Member
Ucchedavāda;237927021 said:
I'm not sure what you would consider a "really fast heavy", so here are some numbers (excluding v-trigger variations for simplicity):

  • Ken has the only 6-frame CC normal (his crHP).
  • There are 6 CC heavys with a startup of 7 frames.
  • There are 14 CC heavys with a startup of 8 frames.
  • And there are 12 CC heavys with a startup of 9 frames.

This is based on the FAT website.
Click to expand...
I think Reizo may have been referring to Cammy's sHP, which is a 6f heavy which doesn't crush counter.
 
M

MCD250

Member
lucebuce12 said:
I don't think I can even remember the last time I saw a Cammy get a CC that wasn't due to a blocked reversal.
Click to expand...
There's folks out here with 3-4 crush counters that give them a variety of stagger states to exploit. Meanwhile, I'm whiffing sHK point blank because my opponent is crouching. Like shit, man. Guile doesn't need three crush counters, much less one that gives him a juggle.
 
L

lucebuce12

Member
MCD250 said:
There's folks out here with 3-4 crush counters that give them a variety of stagger states to exploit. Meanwhile, I'm whiffing sHK point blank because my opponent is crouching. Like shit, man. Guile doesn't need three crush counters, much less one that gives him a juggle.
Click to expand...
Yeah man, Cammy's such a shit character.

myco666 said:
You mean it would be a normal Ken player?
Click to expand...
I was just gonna post this lol.
 
C

CountBlack

Member
Reizo Ryuu said:
I don't think it's a design problem, but more a hitbox problem.
Being able to 'poke' with a heavy shouldn't result in such big reward if their boxes were generally worse than medium buttons. But a lot of medium buttons in this game have pretty lousy boxes so they can only really overlap with heavies, instead of the medium button's hitbox only overlapping with the heavies hurtbox.
It's a tough thing to balance because you could wind up with medium buttons that are just too good for every situation.
I don't enjoy getting a max range cc boot in the face, but I think the idea behind them is that you need to be mindful of cc buttons when trying to poke, since if your opponent expects you to press a button, they can get a big punish. Kinda tying in to how offense oriented this game is.
Click to expand...

The game having both a priority system and a CC system is where the design gets muddy imo. Maybe just one would've been fine to go with but having both is where things get really wacky.

I understand having to be mindful of the situation, but I don't think that it's smart that poking with medium buttons is like playing with fire. Or sticking your leg into a bear trap to see if it's still active.

Versus Karin. When she has VT, you, the karin player, the audience, the planet and all living beings inside of it know that they're going to start fishing with st.HK and you end up with this. Now when I see this, I feel like "I should probably press a quicker button here", go with a medium, and then the karin player presses HK and the active frames overlap and CC gg.

I feel like you're put into situations where the risk/reward of poking with lower level buttons just isn't worth it because the punishment can lose you a round damn near instantly.
 
E

Edzi

Member
CountBlack said:
The game having both a priority system and a CC system is where the design gets muddy imo. Maybe just one would've been fine to go with but having both is where things get really wacky.

I understand having to be mindful of the situation, but I don't think that it's smart that poking with medium buttons is like playing with fire. Or sticking your leg into a bear trap to see if it's still active.

Versus Karin. When she has VT, you, the karin player, the audience, the planet and all living beings inside of it know that they're going to start fishing with st.HK and you end up with this. Now when I see this, I feel like "I should probably press a quicker button here", go with a medium, and then the karin player presses HK and the active frames overlap and CC gg.

I feel like you're put into situations where the risk/reward of poking with lower level buttons just isn't worth it because the punishment can lose you a round damn near instantly.
Click to expand...

We've had this discussion about CC spam before, and I think most people are in agreement that it's a poorly implemented mechanic that tends to make neutral pretty braindead for characters with good CC normals.

At least you guys aren't Alex, whose medium pokes are as slow if not slower than most of the cast's heavy CC normals/pokes.
 
L

lucebuce12

Member
Think about the fact that I play FANG. Compare Alex's damage output to F.A.N.G.

Then think again, if you really want to compare characters.

Trust me Edzi, it can get worse.
 
R

Reizo Ryuu

Member
CountBlack said:
I feel like you're put into situations where the risk/reward of poking with lower level buttons just isn't worth it because the punishment can lose you a round damn near instantly.
Click to expand...

It really is a hard thing to balance, but I think making max range CCs like necalli's stHK only being able to follow up with a special or super, instead of walking/dashing up for a full combo would be a proper "nerf" for instant death situations in neutral.
Though then you'd still have ken and karin kinda breaking the rules because of their VT cancel forward moving options.
 
C

CountBlack

Member
Reizo Ryuu said:
It really is a hard thing to balance, but I think making max range CCs like necalli's stHK only being able to follow up with a special or super, instead of walking/dashing up for a full combo would be a proper "nerf" for instant death situations in neutral.
Though then you'd still have ken and karin kinda breaking the rules because of their VT cancel forward moving options.
Click to expand...

Or just make them blow back like Balrog's st.HP. Only get a CA or maybe one special from a VT cancel but that's about it.

They did nerf Ken's st.HK CC by making the opponent fly further on CC, but he still gets decent damage.
 
M

MCD250

Member
lucebuce12 said:
Fuzzy guard gets the job done.

What she really needs is an air thr........
Click to expand...
It's weird because Cammy always had an air throw in the old games, and now in SFV she doesn't have one and will never, ever get one and there are no plans to give her one either.
 
N

Numb

Member
change ryu's cr.hp animation and nothing else but don't give him his donkey kick back smh
Not even as a vreversal?jmon
 
L

lucebuce12

Member
Think of it this way.

They didn't make his donkey kick his V-reversal so that means it could possibly comeback as a move!

It won't, but there's a chance. Not that it will, but still!
 
M

mbpm1

Member
Edzi said:
We've had this discussion about CC spam before, and I think most people are in agreement that it's a poorly implemented mechanic that tends to make neutral pretty braindead for characters with good CC normals.

At least you guys aren't Alex, whose medium pokes are as slow if not slower than most of the cast's heavy CC normals/pokes.
Click to expand...

I think what they're doing with Kolin is a step in what they want to do with it, if we're continuing the idea that as DLC comes out it aligns more to current vision.

Not crazy CC buttons in footsies, but good enough with a good read.
 
N

Numb

Member
lucebuce12 said:
Think of it this way.

They didn't make his donkey kick his V-reversal so that means it could possibly comeback as a move!

It won't, but there's a chance. Not that it will, but still!
Click to expand...

Gief got new shit so it is not impossible others getting some too
I'll keep waiting for it in every update
Even Smash knew better
 
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