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Super Street Fighter 4 |OT2| BACK OF THE BUS, SAGAT!

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S

SleazyC

Member
I'm not a good Street Fighter player by any stretch but to me it looks like Daigo has had his confidence pretty badly shaken these past couple of weeks. He's playing so timidly and hoping for his opponent to make mistakes that he can punish. Sako and Mago both seem to be players that rarely make mistakes that can be capitalized on so they have pretty much had their way with Daigo.

It also seems like everyone has up'd their play some while Daigo hasn't progressed at all. I enjoy watching Daigo play when he is aggressive so I hope he can get back into a groove.
 
Z

zon

Member
In my uneducated opinion it looks like Daigo doesn't have the hunger anymore after winning evo, taking a break for a while might be a good decision for him.

Oh and someone really needs to sponsor Mago so he can go to the big international tournaments.
 
K

KajunW

Member
Mago at the top of his game + Daigo not at the top of his game = worst beating of Daigo in quite some time.

Congrats to Mago, a well-deserved win. He truly has run over his opponents in the GG2 finals.
 
K

KidA Seven

Member
SleazyC said:
I'm not a good Street Fighter player by any stretch but to me it looks like Daigo has had his confidence pretty badly shaken these past couple of weeks. He's playing so timidly and hoping for his opponent to make mistakes that he can punish. Sako and Mago both seem to be players that rarely make mistakes that can be capitalized on so they have pretty much had their way with Daigo.

It also seems like everyone has up'd their play some while Daigo hasn't progressed at all. I enjoy watching Daigo play when he is aggressive so I hope he can get back into a groove.
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I don't think this had anything to do with confidence. It just seems like he had no answers for Fei. I wonder if he'll continue to use Ryu.

I have never seen Mago make Daigo look free. He must be psyched over this.
 
B

bigmit3737

Member
zon said:
In my uneducated opinion it looks like Daigo doesn't have the hunger anymore after winning evo, taking a break for a while might be a good decision for him.

.
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He does look like he lost his hunger. Hopefully this will fuel it again.

Mago and Sako are the ones to take down now.
 
A

anotheriori

Member
tough match when ryu fireball game is shutdown; unable to apply pressure and can't build meter. Only things that seemed to work was luckily focusing single rekka or jabbing it, or sweeping a rare single rekka whiff. Fei vs Shoto feels like at close; wins with pokes and rekka, further ex chicken wing into combo, further jump combo.
 
U

USD

Member
Mago on the phone: "Umm, I won the championship!" END
Really they're have phone problems, but it would have been hilarious if that was all he really said
:lol
 
D

DryEyeRelief

Member
zon said:
In my uneducated opinion it looks like Daigo doesn't have the hunger anymore after winning evo, taking a break for a while might be a good decision for him.

Oh and someone really needs to sponsor Mago so he can go to the big international tournaments.
Click to expand...

he's going to that dreamhack tournament. maybe that'll help him start something.
 
S

SleazyC

Member
KS Seven X said:
I don't think this had anything to do with confidence. It just seems like he had no answers for Fei. I wonder if he'll continue to use Ryu.

I have never seen Mago make Daigo look free. He must be psyched over this.
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It might just be my memories of Daigo dominating people in vanilla days, but he never seemed this timid to me. To me that looks like he is a bit rattled. It could have been because he just couldn't crack Mago's Fei but we have all seen Daigo pull off some pretty crazy stuff over the years and I haven't seen that from him at all this year.
 
S

Satyamdas

Banned
SmokeMaxX said:
I never said he was bad. He's supposedly the best Dhalsim in Canada and I can believe it. I'm just saying, I'm judging him alongside the best in the world and that's where he pales in comparison.

As for the Eventhubs/Iplaywinner tier lists- That's all we got to go on for now and the Iplaywinner one is made by FilipinoChamp (second best USA Dhalsim) while Eventhubs one is supposedly from Japan I believe.

And for Guile-Sim, all I can go on is what I've read. From what I've seen, Guile does NOT have an easy time with this matchup since Dhalsim can either avoid sonic booms (jump into drill/yoga tower), match booms (yoga fire), or trade in his favor with limbs. Can Guile advance? Maybe. I don't know how fast Yoga Tower recovers, but I see it used a lot at high levels so I assume it's pretty much safe if you use it to avoid a boom. For running away- I assume if Dhalsim gets cornered, he can yoga fire and then teleport while Guile is in blockstun so he doesn't get punished. This is just a guess though.

Anyway, I would say you know the Guile-Dhalsim matchup better than me for sure. However, I wouldn't be too quick to discount the tier lists either. I think they know the matchup far better than both you and me.
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Yoga Tower is a nice tool, but it doesn't make any difference in this matchup. It's good from mid to full screen to avoid booms but doesn't factor into the outcome of the match at all. Escaping is not as simple as teleporting during fireball blockstun. A good Guile will not sit and wait for a fireball to block it when he knows you want to escape the corner, and if you don't time it perfectly you will eat an EX flash kick (sometimes even if you do time it perfect). Guile doesn't have it easy vs. Sim and vice versa. It is a war of attrition matchup and neither character has anything that puts it into the realm of a 7-3. Have you seen any of the Dieminion/Art matches from a few months ago? Or the Art/Henry Cen vs. Lamerboi matches from Evo? Some of the best in the world with both characters and you will be hard pressed to find a round that does not go down to the wire, or a set where they don't go to 3 rounds. From my own fights with Lamer and other great Guile players this is how the match always plays out. A grindfest where each chips away at the other and often comes down to the final hit. Hardly the kind of close fights one would expect from a 7-3 matchup (Mochi vs. Sako, now that is a genuine 3-7 matchup and the results and dominance by Cammy show it).

I disagree with playing theory fighter or saying a tier list is "all we got to go on" over one's own experiences and the experiences of other players of the same character. For one thing those lists change while you keep gaining experience with your character, and for another there are wildly differing opinions on matchups from list to list. So why discount your own experience for something that is always up for debate and anything but definitive?
 
K

KidA Seven

Member
SleazyC said:
It might just be my memories of Daigo dominating people in vanilla days, but he never seemed this timid to me. To me that looks like he is a bit rattled. It could have been because he just couldn't crack Mago's Fei but we have all seen Daigo pull off some pretty crazy stuff over the years and I haven't seen that from him at all this year.
Click to expand...

Daigo will rush you down if he feels it's effective and in most cases and games, Daigo does this. In this case, he thought turtling was the only solution. He couldn't throw fireballs because the matchup wouldn't permit him to do so.

This was the first time, I thought to myself, there is no way Daigo can win this. It would be hard enough if it was just another great Fei, but it's compounded because Mago has these god like reactions.

Good shit to Mago. I can safely say that he is the best player right now. I thought it was Daigo, Momochi, and Mago as the best players in Vanilla. I thought Daigo, Sako, and Mago were the best players in Super. But after this tourney, Mago is the best.

It's him and then everybody else.
 
S

sixteen-bit

Member
Kadey said:
Show em why you're the best baby!

♥
2j60izb.gif
♥
Click to expand...
this looks shopped
 
B

bigmit3737

Member
Satyamdas said:
Yoga Tower is a nice tool, but it doesn't make any difference in this matchup. It's good from mid to full screen to avoid booms but doesn't factor into the outcome of the match at all. Escaping is not as simple as teleporting during fireball blockstun. A good Guile will not sit and wait for a fireball to block it when he knows you want to escape the corner, and if you don't time it perfectly you will eat an EX flash kick (sometimes even if you do time it perfect). Guile doesn't have it easy vs. Sim and vice versa. It is a war of attrition matchup and neither character has anything that puts it into the realm of a 7-3. Have you seen any of the Dieminion/Art matches from a few months ago? Or the Art/Henry Cen vs. Lamerboi matches from Evo? Some of the best in the world with both characters and you will be hard pressed to find a round that does not go down to the wire, or a set where they don't go to 3 rounds. From my own fights with Lamer and other great Guile players this is how the match always plays out. A grindfest where each chips away at the other and often comes down to the final hit. Hardly the kind of close fights one would expect from a 7-3 matchup (Mochi vs. Sako, now that is a genuine 3-7 matchup and the results and dominance by Cammy show it).

I disagree with playing theory fighter or saying a tier list is "all we got to go on" over one's own experiences and the experiences of other players of the same character. For one thing those lists change while you keep gaining experience with your character, and for another there are wildly differing opinions on matchups from list to list. So why discount your own experience for something that is always up for debate and anything but definitive?
Click to expand...

This is not a good matchup for Guile.
It's a grindfest but Sim does soo much dmg VERY easily as Guile only has the option to chip.

Sim can easily trade a sniper for a boom, and the dmg difference is very crucial.

Guile players do not like this matchup at all.

6-4.
 
U

USD

Member
bigmit3737 said:
This is not a good matchup for Guile.
It's a grindfest but Sim does soo much dmg VERY easily as Guile only has the option to chip.

Sim can easily trade a sniper for a boom, and the dmg difference is very crucial.

Guile players do not like this matchup at all.

6-4.
Click to expand...
Pretty much my thoughts on it. It's easier for Sim to get that life lead and sit on it, and that's the key to the match. Especially with me being lower level, the differences are exaggerated. Trying to get in on Sim in a situation when you're forced to do so is not fun at all. The only thing going for Guile is that he can keep Sim's meter drained. Probably my second least-favorite match-up as Guile (I don't like Fuerte either, and worse, don't have much experience with it).
 
N

ntropy

Member
KS Seven X said:
Daigo will rush you down if he feels it's effective and in most cases and games, Daigo does this. In this case, he thought turtling was the only solution. He couldn't throw fireballs because the matchup wouldn't permit him to do so.

This was the first time, I thought to myself, there is no way Daigo can win this. It would be hard enough if it was just another great Fei, but it's compounded because Mago has these god like reactions.

Good shit to Mago. I can safely say that he is the best player right now. I thought it was Daigo, Momochi, and Mago as the best players in Vanilla. I thought Daigo, Sako, and Mago were the best players in Super. But after this tourney, Mago is the best.

It's him and then everybody else.
Click to expand...
mago dickryyyyyyyyyyyyyyduuuhr
 
G

"God's Beard!"

Member
That far U1 through the fireball blew my mind as a Fei Long player since vanilla.

I've never seen Daigo play so desperately afraid as that last game. Even if he was sandbagging because he couldn't win the tournament, I don't think he wanted to lose like that.
 
T

Threi

notag
USD said:
Balrog VS El Fuerte 5v5 Exhibition from GC11

I totally missed this when it happened. I guess there were so many Fuertes that night --and naturally plenty of Rogs (being East Coast, and GC on top of that)-- that they decided to throw down.

I won't quote it, but Yipes's line at 15:09 is hilarious. :lol
Click to expand...
That was actually the most entertaining thing that night, and also very hype.

They should do 5v5 single character matches more often
 
U

USD

Member
God's Beard said:
That far U1 through the fireball blew my mind as a Fei Long player since vanilla.

I've never seen Daigo play so desperately afraid as that last game. Even if he was sandbagging because he couldn't win the tournament, I don't think he wanted to lose like that.
Click to expand...
I've always hated the spacing for that Ultra since you either have to be practically point-blank so both the first and second hits connect, or just far enough so the first hit quickly whiffs and the critical second hit connects, initiating the Ultra sequence. I think I've only pulled off the latter once.
Threi said:
That was actually the most entertaining thing that night, and also very hype.

They should do 5v5 single character matches more often
Click to expand...
I don't know, I though the winner's and grand finals were very intense.

Now that I think about it, I had to have at least caught the last two matches of the exhibition, because I remember Kuma freaking out about Javits landing Dirty Ass. :lol
 
G

gutabo

Member
USD said:
I've always hated the spacing for that Ultra since you either have to be practically point-blank so both the first and second hits connect, or just far enough so the first hit quickly whiffs and the critical second hit connects, initiating the Ultra sequence. I think I've only pulled off the latter once.
Click to expand...
Actually IIRC it's the second OR fourth hit. I remember playing against a scrub fei on a broken stick, he did the ultra from almost full screen, I tried to do a teleport(sim) but got something else instead, and I got hit(the third and fourth hit), I started laughing cause I thought it was going to be only 3 hits but stopped as soon as I saw the launch animation :(
 
N

ntropy

Member
KS Seven X said:
WTF is this? Name me one player better than him right now?

If not, shut up and go back to where you crawled from.

Besides, I'm more of a Daigo fan.
Click to expand...
i was jokin obviously, calm down.
 
M

MIMIC

Banned
USD said:
Balrog VS El Fuerte 5v5 Exhibition from GC11

I totally missed this when it happened. I guess there were so many Fuertes that night --and naturally plenty of Rogs (being East Coast, and GC on top of that)-- that they decided to throw down.

I won't quote it, but Yipes's line at 15:09 is hilarious. :lol
Click to expand...

I played Spab rog a few weeks ago. Some crazy Fuerte mirrors we had. His Fuerte is so much more intimidating in real life. I kept forgetting to change my color and I kept forgetting which Fuerte I was :lol

I was one wake-up Ultra away from winning a few of our matches. =p I beat his Akuma, though. Small victory for me :D
 
K

kitzkozan

Member
If Mago is going to Dreamhack,he's also going to be at Beat by context next year.

He's gonna be in Europe for a tournament in february 2011.Possibly facing off against wild Marn,Wong and Ortiz.

If he start going out of Japan more and more,it's just natural that he's gonna invited to EVO 2011.Hope I can see him there next year,along with Sako and Daigo. :lol
 
U

USD

Member
gutabo said:
Actually IIRC it's the second OR fourth hit. I remember playing against a scrub fei on a broken stick, he did the ultra from almost full screen, I tried to do a teleport(sim) but got something else instead, and I got hit(the third and fourth hit), I started laughing cause I thought it was going to be only 3 hits but stopped as soon as I saw the launch animation :(
Click to expand...
Yeah, fourth hit also works, but as you'd expect, it's generally not relevant. :lol
 
F

FindMyFarms

Member
Daigo's performance in Gods Garden isn't anything crazy to be honest. He didn't win any of the first 3 GG tournaments and lost to only top players that he's lost to before (Uryo, Mochi.) Sako is just..... Sako. And regardless of public perception or casuals, Mago was more dominating in Japan than Daigo was with regards to tourney results in vanilla. He's just finally adjusted to his character of choice in Super and it's now showing.

What WAS surprising was him getting 25th at SB, especially to who he lost to. But yeah, I don't think he's in a slump or anything. He just had a bad showing at an overseas tourney (it's happened before) and had losses (that no one would consider upsets by any means) to absolute top tier players in Japan.

Daigo's an elite player, but sometimes you lose!
 
S

Spiderjericho

Member
FindMyFarms said:
That's not a problem!
Click to expand...

Says the guy who was scratching his balls on video. Zing!!

Good job to Mago. I agree with Finds, he was definitely the most dominating players in Vanilla IV. I'm sure with his victory, he'll get more invitations to come out to international tournaments. It's not like he hasn't come to Evo or overseas before.

Daigo does seem like he's in a slump but you can't always win. The important thing is the steps he takes to improve his game. I joked in the SB5 that his game was a little stale. He's a smart guy, so he'll figure out a way to beast on fools.
 
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