I remember the talk about the two dynasties going head to head.
Super Tuesday 2016 |OT| The Final Incursion is a double Incursion (Mar 5-15 contests)
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I remember the talk about the two dynasties going head to head.
Please. Superdelegates can say they've pledged but they have no real sway (outside of reinforcing a narrative). The only quantity that matters is how many delegates a candidate picks up from voters in the primaries. That total is currently at 757 to 543 in Hillary's favor, and there's a lot of favorable ground for Bernie in the upcoming states. And if by some insane twist of events the superdelegates do change who the winner is, then that will guarantee a GOP win. That's like treason against the voters and the republicans will play the card of a dishonest democrat party the whole general election.
ShironRedshift
Member
But that's irrelevant since we're talking about the United States and it's the United States' political spectrum that people use to decide their votes here, not the spectrum of the rest of the world, so I'm not sure what point you're making here. It's completely irrelevant where she stands on the political spectrum of the world since she's running for office of President of the United Stats and leader of the United State's Democratic Party, so it really has no bearing here at all and it's just odd whenever this gets brought up if you understand the difference between the U.S.'s political spectrum and that of other nations.
Evil Monkey DTT
Banned
Well tonight made me happy, looking forward to the eating of crow coming up soon ^_^
Well I'm sorry, I apologize being as obnoxious as I was with that post... But you know there is a hivemind of pretentious hilary posts here. that's as just undeniable as the bernie reddit takeover.
I do know what projections are, they are projections. They're pretty irrelevant to bring up when votes are being counted at that very moment and you can just wait and go by the actual thing, not a projection of it.
yeah guess not.
yeah so accurate, should've called it by the projection huh, why count votes?
pls allow this pettiness gaf mods.
Reality has a well-known liberal bias...wait.
OpinionatedCyborg
Member
For those interested in Michigan delegate math, go here: http://www.thegreenpapers.com/P16/MI-D
147 total delegate votes - 85 district / 28 at large; 17 Pledged PLEOs; 17 Unpledged PLEOs
147 total delegate votes - 85 district / 28 at large; 17 Pledged PLEOs; 17 Unpledged PLEOs
Calamari41
41 > 38
People forget that Hillary is the original birther. Her campaign, at least. She kept her hands clean of course.
Dr_LucienSanchez
Banned
I would certainly love to hear about all these different layers of progressiveness then. Presumably it's like a liberal onion.
It started in 1968. I haven't read up on it in a while but if I remember correctly I believe that Mayor Richard M Daley of Chicago was a huge proponent of it.
The biggest problem I have with Sanders is he is promising the moon to a generation that equates likes on Facebook to true activism and change. I'm all for the party moving further left, but when I talk to his supporters they think that in this political climate they'll have a $15+ minimum wage by the end of 2017, free college that summer and we'll flip Washington on its head. It's naive to a fault.
But I can alreday tell that I'm gonna get raked over the coals for being a party pooper, so I'll make my exit.
Kind of like how even moderate European politicians are okay with a refugee agreement that Donald Trump would propose in America.
eBay Huckster
Member
Harper's a given, but I wouldn't be crowing about Cameron considering his record prior to 2010
You know you've used Berniebros in discussions multiple times, right? You might not be the best person to police other posters.
brainchild
Banned
Hilary isn't really left by European standards. Probably centrist right. Bernie on the other hand would be seen as an actual lefty.
Or much of the South viewed him as more liberal...which he is, unquestionably. Also your response about layers and complexities honestly sounds like fluff. Excuses to why you're probably not as leftist as you actually think.
maabus1999
Member
They won't switch because Bernie isn't doing anything to promote down ticket races. He keeps railing on the establishment an His ideological purity doesn't fit well either.
The Donald sent Jeb his regards - in a manner of speaking.
Elfforkusu
Member
Wait, Bernie won Michigan independents by 40 points?
Yowza
Yowza
eBay Huckster
Member
Hillary is absurdly left by European standards if we restrict the lens to immigration and refugees. Likely center overall as things currently stand.
The Clinton machine had set up shop in Iowa for months. You could hold that contest tonight and it would still turn out the same way, she had the Obama machine and Iowa's never seen anything like it.
Yup, and Bill Ayers, Rev. Wright were both desperation plays by her campaign as it became increasingly clear she would lose.
What I found shocking was that Sanders(jew) won the Muslim vote in Michigan 2:1...
boiled goose
good with gravy
This is unfair. The dude basically mentions campaign finance, economic inequality, criminal justice, healthcare in every single speech. He says the same shit over and over but I know more about what he wants to do and what he stands for.
Hillary? More of the same?
And to be fair to Bernie, money in politics does affect every single issue.
Huh, you will need to elaborate on immigration. Also, she is definitely on the right on the economy, healthcare, education compared to developed European countries. Bernie is Center.
On guns Bernie is right, Hillary is more progressive but probably still right compared to Europe haha
I will be very very very surprised if Hilary doesn't easily win Illinois. She has ties to the state and is very popular within the traditional blue state.
Vestal
Junior Member
I just hope everyone here is looking at this objectively and not thinking something like the above will happen. This is not 2008. This primary is not close. Unless a miracle happens and Bernie somehow wins Ohio and Florida next week, this will not be close period.
Epsilon-delta
Banned
Yup. People seem to forget 2008, but I assume most of GAF were still in high school though.
Not Australia. I'd love for him to come here and shake shit up.
eyeball_kid
Member
I didn't mean to suggest NPR is biased one way or the other, but your suggestion that lefty media is pro-Bernie is first I've heard of it. Many of the online rags have been publishing editorial anti-Sanders lately. And even a couple months ago, when Bernie went from not-a-chance to Feel the Bern, he still got very little media attention. Very different from what we saw with Obama in '08. The media doesn't give a shit about Bernie and only talks about him when there's a juicy story.
Independent voters neither like nor trust Hillary.
TheUntamedLegend
Member
Assuming Clinton does eventually win, she will still have these problems in the general.
Does it not make sense to put Sanders on the ticket as VP? I'm sure this is controversial but it seems like Sanders is a better choice than someone like Castro, which everyone thinks is an inevitability, to address the weaknesses of a Clinton campaign.
Are we talking about the same media that spent months covering Benghazi and the emails? Let's be clear here, without even considering super delegates, Bernie needs 40% more delegates than he has right now to beat Hillary. Saying he has little chance of winning is not a stretch.
And before you call me a salty Hillary supporter, I'm not a Hillary supporter.
Bernie is way to the right of Australia on gun control.
I'd love to see him rail against negative gearing though.
last couple of hours:
Holy shit. My new favorite jif.
There's a big difference between Nate Silver and MI pollsters as well. If there's anything to learn from tonight its that he/we should have trusted 538 more when some of their own models predicted this outcome.
ShironRedshift
Member
Very interesting stuff; thank you for this. ^_^
Elfforkusu
Member
That's the obvious interpretation. But that kind of result in a rust belt state really chips away at the electability argument for Hillary as democratic nominee...
Basically just banking on people hating Trump more than her at this point. Otherwise it's president Donald.
Tranqueris
Banned
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-m...ump/hillary-clinton-obama-birther-fact-check/
If you're gonna imply that she's responsible for that even though there's absolutely no evidence then we might as well start implying that Bernie wanted his supporters to call John Lewis a slave, even though there's no proof of that either.
The Dems need the white house more than the GOP does. If Bernie Sanders seems to be the only one capable of stopping the Trump train, the party will do what's right.
Hilary wins the night.
What the fuck does this mean? This type of shit posting is ridiculous.
That's not how it works, especially when bernie is the one not allowing it. Bernie is helping Republicans by not allowing funding to the down tickets.
Delegate totals - according to NYTimes.
Clinton - 753
Sanders - 541
So yes it's a very difficult uphill battle, where he needs to run up the numbers in a similar fashion to those caucus Northern States where he was able to beat her by a bigger margin. The good news for Sanders is this is a yuge fundraising boost, yuge organizational boost, a change in narrative and a show of momentum. People called me out a long time ago about my posts but this election is different. From here on Bernie has an organizational advantage in most contests. He already has offices in places like Washington with more paid staffers in the State. He has volunteers across the US that self organize, with a big portion actually writing free apps for his campaign. His advantage has always been this - and it has always been hand-waved. Back in the summer when I pointed out the Internet has changed electoral politics - now that advantage is actually finally playing into his hands.
Clinton - 753
Sanders - 541
So yes it's a very difficult uphill battle, where he needs to run up the numbers in a similar fashion to those caucus Northern States where he was able to beat her by a bigger margin. The good news for Sanders is this is a yuge fundraising boost, yuge organizational boost, a change in narrative and a show of momentum. People called me out a long time ago about my posts but this election is different. From here on Bernie has an organizational advantage in most contests. He already has offices in places like Washington with more paid staffers in the State. He has volunteers across the US that self organize, with a big portion actually writing free apps for his campaign. His advantage has always been this - and it has always been hand-waved. Back in the summer when I pointed out the Internet has changed electoral politics - now that advantage is actually finally playing into his hands.
Already Torn
Banned
Well they better start liking her, because she's the only chance we have for the GE. Sanders will never be able to get independents with his crazy super liberal policies.
It's not particularly complicated. It's been discussed multiple times on this board. Sanders offers a societal analysis which reduces all social issues to economic issues. This is just flat wrong in America, where racial issues dominate economic issues. To the degree that America is backwards in implementing and maintaining social programs, it has deliberately failed to do so to make sure people of color did not benefit. To the degree that America has succeeded in implementing social programs, it has done so in ways that ensured that people of color did not benefit.
Sanders's analysis and presentation does not demonstrate an understanding of this issue. That's why his supporters are predominantly white and frequently male -- because his flavor of progressiveness is non-intersectional and centered on the class-based issues that trouble white America.
No, they didn't? Did you like just fail to read? Go back and check out the exit polls on this issue.
I'm very far left. I'm just also a person of color.
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