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The 100 S3 |OT| Adventures In Character Assassination - Thursdays 9/8c

N

Napoleonthechimp

Member
Joni said:
You claimed the Grounders opened the conflict when the show established otherwise back in the first season.
Click to expand...

I just pointed out that Jasper got a spear through his chest before any of them knew what was what. The hostilities were begun by the grounders and there were no attempt at negotiations or diplomacy. Just plain old murder, or attempted as the case may be.
 
G

GordonHalfman

Member
It's not obviously relevant how "nice" the grounders are, how terrible their culture is or who started the original conflict. They are still human beings, not orcs. Working towards peace is obviously better then murdering hundreds of them preemptively.
 
D

Dunlop

Member
JacketsNest101 said:
I don't know what it is with AV Club, but the reviewer they have seems to utterly hate this show this year. They can't do anything right in his eyes. Even an episode like this one that was really good, gets a terrible review. My faith in AV Club ratings is quickly disappearing.
Click to expand...

I stopped taking them seriously as they continually give the shitfest that is Arror good reviews while Gotham is always rated low
 
E

eyeball_kid

Member
Napoleonthechimp said:
I find it interesting that some fans in here are willing to extend the benefit of the doubt to some but not others, no matter how many or little they kill.
Also, remember how Jaha was willing to sacrifice himself up on that ark? This isn't some one-dimensional monster we're talking about.
Click to expand...

No one said he was one-dimensional, but the guy has turned into a cult fanatic that believes the only way for humanity to "live" is to turn everyone into a computer simulation. He was already okay with all that before he convinced ALIE that it was okay to turn everyone into AI puppets. And yeah, up on the Ark he also started hallucinating. He's not all there and hasn't been for a while. Or, plot twist! he already had a chip in him and the AI was making him see babies and his dead son to manipulate him.

Napoleonthechimp said:
The guy is a naive moron who got himself branded like a piece of cattle and was willing to hand over Pike (who was a democratically elected leader) to a group that would absolutely torture him to death (an alternative option would be to operate within the scope of their own laws and judge him accordingly).
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Kane's biggest mistake was not discussing joining the tribes with his people before he did so. But he was taking the action he thought would bring lasting peace because he believed in Lexa. Unfortunately the flamekeeper didn't, and everything went pear-shaped.

The difference between Pike and Kane is, Pike's path to "protection" was to create an authoritarian regime as soon as he was elected. A free election in order to establish a dictatorship is probably not what the people wanted. I wish we knew more about Skycrew's system of government; it seems like the Chancellor has historically had wide latitude, but there had to be laws in place to prevent turning the society into a police state. It's possible Arkadia hasn't even been following the laws of the Ark. Regardless, Pike had his security thugs and took control of Arkadia regardless of the legality of his actions. So Kane's other big mistake was wanting free elections without laws in place that would prevent someone from easily doing what Pike did. Kane did what he thought was best to rectify that mistake, because he saw what the end result of Pike's path would be – the extermination of Skycrew.
 
O

Oddduck

Member
Dunlop said:
I stopped taking them seriously as they continually give the shitfest that is Arror good reviews while Gotham is always rated low
Click to expand...

JacketsNest101 said:
I don't know what it is with AV Club, but the reviewer they have seems to utterly hate this show this year. They can't do anything right in his eyes. Even an episode like this one that was really good, gets a terrible review. My faith in AV Club ratings is quickly disappearing.
Click to expand...

Kyle Fowle, the guy who reviews The 100 and Gotham, is one of the tougher critics on AV Club.

He rarely gives A's to most of the shows he reviews.
 
F

Funky Papa

FUNK-Y-PPA-4
I'm kind of enjoying the final part of this season more than the first one, although I despise the show's attempt at redeeming Bellamy or making him more relatable.

No. Fuck that shit. He was a shitstain since day one and giving him a modicum of authority only resulted in what generally happens when you empower a bully.

JacketsNest101 said:
I don't know what it is with AV Club, but the reviewer they have seems to utterly hate this show this year. They can't do anything right in his eyes. Even an episode like this one that was really good, gets a terrible review. My faith in AV Club ratings is quickly disappearing.
Click to expand...

I don't generally follow the AV Club, but I know that some of their reviews are completely off. Case in point, Gotham. I hate to say this because I happen to be a writer and it's the laziest excuse ever thrown around by apologist and fanboys, but they just don't understand that show *at all*. Their reviews are so off the mark it's absurd.
 
J

Joni

Member
Bellamy is not a good leader, he is better as loyal follower. It is a role he prefers to live in. It is why he needs Kane, Pike, Clarke, even Octavia. He needs someone to tell him what to do.
 
F

Funky Papa

FUNK-Y-PPA-4
It should be noted that the folks playing Kane and Pike acted their butts out in the latest episode.

The flashbacks and the crucifixion scenes were 10/10
 
H

Hamlet

Member
strafer said:
nah, Bellamy is cool as fuck.

only person worth rooting for on the show
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Nah he's been tarnished forever with the whole killing over three hundred innocent people thing. If anything Raven is the one that deserves some happiness and support. She's had a hell of a rough time these past two seasons.
Also on the AV Club review thing, I dunno this criticism sounds valid.
Portraying pre-drop Pike as a man of principle and empathy isn’t necessarily a bad thing, but it is when it comes during the 13th episode of the season and after the man has committed countless atrocities and straight-up executed one of the show’s most moral and noble characters. The attempt to slightly redeem Pike, or at least give him another shade of personality beyond “murderous villain” ends up coming across as disingenuous, as a way to correct the shoddy storytelling from earlier this season. It just doesn’t work. “Join Or Die” aims to complicate the character of Pike, which in itself is a worthy goal; in fact, presenting complex characters that have justifications for doing good and bad things is The 100‘s bread and butter. But with Pike the potential complication doesn’t hit the mark. Instead, it feels unearned. Pike has been a caricature up until this point, a monster with very little justification for his actions, so the fact that The 100 spends most of “Join Or Die” painting him as sympathetic is off-putting to say the least.

things continue to boil over between Bellamy and Octavia. Again, The 100 seems to be trying to course-correct the decisions it made in earlier episodes. Here, Bellamy is lashing out at Octavia for not accepting his apology and refusing to let him back into her life emotionally. He even goes so far as to tell her that had she trusted him maybe Lincoln wouldn’t have died. He doesn’t outright say the “Lincoln wouldn’t have died” part, but that’s the implication. I get that both of these characters are experiencing intense emotions and are prone to saying things they’ll regret, but the way in which the show is positioning Bellamy as sympathetic, just like Pike, is disingenuous and removed from his character arc this season.
Click to expand...
 
F

Funky Papa

FUNK-Y-PPA-4
I feel like the first paragraph is pure nonsense. Pike won A LOT of depth in just a couple of episodes. His background doesn't make him more likeable nor its meant to excuse his actions.

The second one is however 100% spot-on. Bellamy doesn't benefit as a character from this. It's obvious that the show is trying to portray him as more sympathetic, even if that means we are to forgive nearly two seasons and a half of him being an owlturd and Octavia kind of blaming herself (like, eff that right off).
 
S

Sober

Member
strafer said:
Why do people read AV club again? Why put your brain through that?
Click to expand...
Because finding actual reviews is very hard, other than the scattered critics you'll find on other sites doing the same old prestige drama train. The only other option are recaps, which actually don't provide anything worthwhile - because you already watched the show.

Like it or not AVClub is a good source of reviews for something like episodic TV, because more often than not you click a review and there's more than just a simple beat-per-beat recap of the episode. There's actual analysis and thoughts up on offer than just simple quips from the writer.

Whether you agree with the reviewer on certain points or not is up to you. It's like game reviews all over again.

Also since The 100 fluctuates as a critical darling/punching bag it's not hard to find reviews of the episodes as they air but trust me it might be harder to find reviews for less watched/covered shows. And AVClub doesn't even cast a really wide net, just a wider one in comparison.

If you just want recaps, you can find them anywhere. If you just want reactions, there's twitter or other places. I think critical reviews are much harder to find, especially these days - and for certain shows - even when we live in a post-LOST/Mad Men world.

Funky Papa said:
I feel like the first paragraph is pure nonsense. Pike won A LOT of depth in just a couple of episodes. His background doesn't make him more likeable nor its meant to excuse his actions.

The second one is however 100% spot-on. Bellamy doesn't benefit as a character from this. It's obvious that the show is trying to portray him as more sympathetic, even if that means we are to forgive nearly two seasons and a half of him being an owlturd and Octavia kind of blaming herself (like, eff that right off).
Click to expand...
I think I sort of half agree with your assessment but the review is still correct too. I think mostly because Pike's chancellorship has been fraying at the edges for the last couple episodes it allows him to show some more depth. But I also think something like this or a Farm-Station/Tailies flashback episode would've been much better placed earlier in the season, if only because earlier in the season we only had Pike really only on one mode that could've helped contrast or show why he now acts like he does.

It depends on how you think of the character and the writing surrounding him; I think they're doing a better job but honestly the timing needed a little work to make it more effective is all.
 
E

eyeball_kid

Member
Funky Papa said:
I feel like the first paragraph is pure nonsense. Pike won A LOT of depth in just a couple of episodes. His background doesn't make him more likeable nor its meant to excuse his actions.

The second one is however 100% spot-on. Bellamy doesn't benefit as a character from this. It's obvious that the show is trying to portray him as more sympathetic, even if that means we are to forgive nearly two seasons and a half of him being an owlturd and Octavia kind of blaming herself (like, eff that right off).
Click to expand...

I agree with you on Pike; I don't think the Ark scenes were meant to paint him in a sympathetic light. His mentality (and what he was trying to teach them) there was the same there as it is on the ground – fight as a unit against the enemy or you'll die. I sympathize with the situation he was put in by Jaha, but none of those scenes could erase the atrocities he committed on the ground or his general philosophy that violence (and an authoritarian police state) is the only path to safety.

But I just don't agree that the show is trying to portray Bellamy as a sympathetic character. Clarke is really the only one consoling him, and she doesn't exactly stand on the moral high ground. More generally, take out the Lincoln grudge and this boils down to more of the brother-sister in-fighting routine the writers have been doing since the beginning, and it has never really worked. The writing (and/or acting) feels clumsy and it's just not interesting TV. At this point the writers need to either give Bellamy more depth and motivation than "protect my fam" or write him off the show.

They would've been better off killing Bellamy and keeping Lincoln on. Lincoln was like the Daryl of the 100 and I'm still shocked they got rid of him.
 
W

WhereAreMahDragonz

Banned
eyeball_kid said:
But I just don't agree that the show is trying to portray Bellamy as a sympathetic character. Clarke is really the only one consoling him, and she doesn't exactly stand on the moral high ground. More generally, take out the Lincoln grudge and this boils down to more of the brother-sister in-fighting routine the writers have been doing since the beginning, and it has never really worked. The writing (and/or acting) feels clumsy and it's just not interesting TV. At this point the writers need to either give Bellamy more depth and motivation than "protect my fam" or write him off the show.
Click to expand...

This is because they do it really fucking poorly
 
B

BewareTheBatsie

Member
Yeah, the show doing such a bad job at making Bellamy sympathetic is why I just can't care for the guy. The guy more or less helped play a part in what ended up with Lincoln's death and he can't accept the fact that dear God, it's been less than a month and Octavia won't forgive him.
 
J

Joni

Member
BewareTheBatsie said:
Yeah, the show doing such a bad job at making Bellamy sympathetic is why I just can't care for the guy. The guy more or less helped play a part in what ended up with Lincoln's death and he can't accept the fact that dear God, it's been less than a month and Octavia won't forgive him.
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It has been less than a week in the show. It does make sense in the context of their background. He protected her for 17 years. He is and has always been her knight, he doesn't know how to act differently. He is thus very much out of his element when he can't protect her. The fact he got her thrown in jail and her mother killed by giving her a public life also works against that. He still thinks she needs to be protected at all times, because if he doesn't, it gets people killed.
 
B

BewareTheBatsie

Member
Joni said:
It has been less than a week in the show. It does make sense in the context of their background. He protected her for 17 years. He is and has always been her knight, he doesn't know how to act differently. He is thus very much out of his element when he can't protect her. The fact he got her thrown in jail and her mother killed by giving her a public life also works against that. He still thinks she needs to be protected at all times, because if he doesn't, it gets people killed.
Click to expand...
That doesn't necessarily explain why Bellamy is so pissy about the fact Octavia won't forgive him. I get that a big part of Bellamy's character is him doing what he feels is best to keep everyone safe, but as you said, it's been less than a week and he is frustrated she won't forgive him for what he did.
 
S

Somnia

Member
Won't watch tonight's episode till tomorrow so I'll be stepping out of this thread till then. Going to see Captain America tonight instead.
 
W

WhereAreMahDragonz

Banned
I'm seeing spoilers because the episode doesn't air for another fucking hour here in Arizona (aka hell) and I'm just so confused because......

MONTY AND HARPER????????
 
T

tearsintherain

Member
Good for you Luna, don't ever trust Clarke "Bringer of Death" Wanheda, do anything she asks and its a guarantee all your people will get wiped out.

I do wonder though where the writers are gonna go with the chip now, I assume by the end Clarke takes it but I don't see how they get to that point.
 
S

Sober

Member
On one hand Monty and Harper isn't too bad.

On the other hand Monty basically had to kill his mom twice. Happy Mothers Day y'all!
 
H

harSon

Banned
Why is Luna, peaceful being extraordinaire's first course of action to
murder the fuck out of everyone in the room and shank her lover in the heart? Straight up channeling Monty.
 
S

Sober

Member
Just a guess but this is how Clarke adds to her genocide count - she sends a missile up to blow up the last piece of Ark floating in orbit and it rains down molten steel on everyone... enjoy!
 
B

BewareTheBatsie

Member
Sober said:
Just a guess but this is how Clarke adds to her genocide count - she sends a missile up to blow up the last piece of Ark floating in orbit and it rains down molten steel on everyone... enjoy!
Click to expand...
Season 4 is gonna have Clarke time-travel and be the cause of the nuclear apocalypse in the first place with her somehow causing ALIE to be able to let out to send the nukes.
 
J

Joni

Member
Monty must be fine in bed, considering Raven's 'finally' when she enters the room.
Luna was very impressive, that is how you make someone make an impression. Not by killing a couple of kids.
And at this point, just put the chip in yourself Clarke and see that the AI will accept you anyway.
 
Grizzlyjin

Grizzlyjin

Supersonic, idiotic, disconnecting, not respecting, who would really ever wanna go and top that
Monty & Harper - Yeeeeeees! Glad we got these scenes. The group is pretty much always under attack, so we rarely get to see them enjoy themselves...and each other. 😏

I like Luna's group. They're so peaceful and nice. Of course it didn't take long for Clarke to try and corrupt that lol. I like that Octavia even mentioned how it was a good place until they arrived.

Hanging out with Jasper is obviously a death sentence. Still betting on Luna & Jasper being a thing down the line. They'll bond over their loss.
 
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