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[RevenantKioku]

The thing with the JLPT grammar complaints, is a lot of these people I find are studying for 3kyuu, and while I never studied a grammar book for that, my friend had a lot of Japanese friends telling him the 3kyuu grammar had some rarely used stuff. 2kyuu, although, I asked about to friends and teachers and they all found it to be useful stuff. Hell, I find a lot of it popping up in Dragonball, even.
As far as the grammar in 3kyuu actually being that, I don't know. But I know my friend was told that on more than one point more than once.

Honestly for all of the talking and patting himself on the back he has done in this topic, I would have thought his level was better than "maybe passing 2kyu"

Well, my Japanese has been getting better over the past year since I started studying like this.
Plus, I'm that kinda douchebag that would say he felt like he failed his final exam and ended up with an A in the class.

 

[FINALFANTASYDOG]

at times it seems like the questions and grammar was lifted straight from my second year university textbook.

I think this whole thing was started by people who think very highly of their Japanese abilities yet didn't do as well as they hoped on the JLPT.

That was my point, using the methods outlined in this thread, you can literally become an expert at reading novels/manga/watching tv shows/casual conversation, basically many things that aren't text-books/academic non-fiction writing and not have a clue about some of the more academic grammar.

Perhapses it's just because in my own spare time I've been studying up on the 2-kyu Grammar, but I didn't end up seeing most of the grammar till I started using texts that were designed for study abroad students in Japan and textbooks that were classified as "Upper level Japanese) /Taking my sentences from more academic works.

(aka books that had grammar that seemed to be mainly 3kyu based were - Genki, Japan times Intermediate book, the Minna no Nihongo Series Intermediate Japanese 301 and 501. which would pretty much compleate a 3 year Japanese non-full time university program, what in the world 2nd-year textbook were you using?)

 

[Synth_floyd]

FYI: The JLPT is mainly a way for that test taking company to make money as few people/groups in the real world actually give a shit about it. Levels 3 and 4 are not even worth taking because the ability is so low in them that it's pointless to even bother, unless you want a shiny certificate from a test taking company. Levels 2 and 1 actually require some real ability in the language but even level 2 is too low for most bilingual jobs and if you have level 1 ability then you don't need a piece of paper to prove that you know the language.

 

[rotaryspirit]

That was my point, using the methods outlined in this thread, you can literally become an expert at reading novels/manga/watching tv shows/casual conversation, basically many things that aren't text-books/academic non-fiction writing and not have a clue about some of the more academic grammar.

Perhapses it's just because in my own spare time I've been studying up on the 2-kyu Grammar, but I didn't end up seeing most of the grammar till I started using texts that were designed for study abroad students in Japan and textbooks that were classified as "Upper level Japanese) /Taking my sentences from more academic works.

(aka books that had grammar that seemed to be mainly 3kyu based were - Genki, Japan times Intermediate book, the Minna no Nihongo Series Intermediate Japanese 301 and 501. which would pretty much compleate a 3 year Japanese non-full time university program, what in the world 2nd-year textbook were you using?)

The Japan Times Intermediate book and the 501 were what we used for 2nd year. I was looking at the questions from two year's previous 2-kyu and they seemed practically lifted from the Japan Times Intermediate book. All of the grammar points are there. The Genki books prepare you pretty much to ace 3-kyu.

FYI: The JLPT is mainly a way for that test taking company to make money as few people/groups in the real world actually give a shit about it. Levels 3 and 4 are not even worth taking because the ability is so low in them that it's pointless to even bother, unless you want a shiny certificate from a test taking company. Levels 2 and 1 actually require some real ability in the language but even level 2 is too low for most bilingual jobs and if you have level 1 ability then you don't need a piece of paper to prove that you know the language.

Almost any translation job listing I've seen has required ore recommended a 2-kyu or 1-kyu certificate. Japan likes documentation.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

That was my point, using the methods outlined in this thread, you can literally become an expert at reading novels/manga/watching tv shows/casual conversation, basically many things that aren't text-books/academic non-fiction writing and not have a clue about some of the more academic grammar.

Perhapses it's just because in my own spare time I've been studying up on the 2-kyu Grammar, but I didn't end up seeing most of the grammar till I started using texts that were designed for study abroad students in Japan and textbooks that were classified as "Upper level Japanese) /Taking my sentences from more academic works.

(aka books that had grammar that seemed to be mainly 3kyu based were - Genki, Japan times Intermediate book, the Minna no Nihongo Series Intermediate Japanese 301 and 501. which would pretty much compleate a 3 year Japanese non-full time university program, what in the world 2nd-year textbook were you using?)

I'm just not seeing it. Nothing on JLPT1 really stood out as particularly academic to me. It was all stuff that is just a part of normal life in Japan. Pretty much if you are decently fluent in Japanese and can understand most newspaper articles, which I don't find particularly academic, then you will have no problems with JLPT1. I really can't see anyone becoming an "expert" at reading novels/manga/watching tv shows/casual conversation like you said without understanding the stuff in JLPT1. Now I haven't really looked at the other levels of the JLPT, but I assume the grammar and vocabulary is cumulative. Do you think you could post some examples of things that are "purely academic" and not used in normal life?

 

[FINALFANTASYDOG]

I'm just not seeing it. Nothing on JLPT1 really stood out as particularly academic to me. It was all stuff that is just a part of normal life in Japan. Pretty much if you are decently fluent in Japanese and can understand most newspaper articles, which I don't find particularly academic, then you will have no problems with JLPT1. I really can't see anyone becoming an "expert" at reading novels/manga/watching tv shows/casual conversation like you said without understanding the stuff in JLPT1. Now I haven't really looked at the other levels of the JLPT, but I assume the grammar and vocabulary is cumulative. Do you think you could post some examples of things that are "purely academic" and not used in normal life?

Okay, including novels in there was too far.　And Reviewing My JLPT2 Grammer books, I actually think you've basically won this argument.

But, My main point was using the all Japanese all the time method, you can trick yourself into being very good at what amounts to colloquial language, but be garbage at real reading comprehension/grammar.　Espically in Knowing the slight differences between Gramma With Similar Function. I mean how often in Manga/ Tv shows/ casual conversation do you ever seen even The most Simple JLPT2 Grammer　Like において,　のみならず、 (let's pretend you didn't live in Japan and just got all your Japanese from Manga/Tv shows)

 

[Deleted member 17706]

Okay, including novels in there was too far.　And Reviewing My JLPT2 Grammer books, I actually think you've basically won this argument.

But, My main point was using the all Japanese all the time method, you can trick yourself into being very good at what amounts to colloquial language, but be garbage at real reading comprehension/grammar. I mean how often in Manga/ Tv shows/ casual conversation do you ever seen even The most Simple JLPT2 Grammer　Like において,　のみならず、 (let's pretend you didn't live in Japan and just got all your Japanese from Manga/Tv shows)

All the time.

I guess I could pretend I didn't live in Japan and happened to get all of my grammar from Manga / TV shows, but such a person really has no place claiming to be an expert at anything in terms of Japanese language and is disqualified from being able to claim that something "is never used".

 

[RevenantKioku]

Well, Zefah, for one, one of the warnings in my JLPT2 grammar book on one point is "Warning: This is only used in conversation." which kind of implies that most of the points are intended for not conversation, neh? I can't remember which one nor be arsed to find it but it did make me laugh.
I also go to a study session hosted by some of my elementary school teachers on Saturday. When I was there, I do remember them saying that some of these points rarely turn up in conversation, and if we are going to assume one is reading manga, which is mostly conversation, well...
It's not like it was even 30% or 20% but still, point is you do get hit with some, although that number may be exaggerated.
Anyway, no point in arguing about it.
I'd encourage some of you, and you know who you are, to be a tad more positive in this thread. The negativity isn't really needed.

 

[Mik2121]

I'm just not seeing it. Nothing on JLPT1 really stood out as particularly academic to me. It was all stuff that is just a part of normal life in Japan. Pretty much if you are decently fluent in Japanese and can understand most newspaper articles, which I don't find particularly academic, then you will have no problems with JLPT1. I really can't see anyone becoming an "expert" at reading novels/manga/watching tv shows/casual conversation like you said without understanding the stuff in JLPT1. Now I haven't really looked at the other levels of the JLPT, but I assume the grammar and vocabulary is cumulative. Do you think you could post some examples of things that are "purely academic" and not used in normal life?

I'd love to see what you consider 'normal life in Japan', because even some of my teachers (Japanese) said the stuff that shows up on the JLPT1 is sometimes not even used AT ALL. I have only tried JLPT3 and JLPT2 two and one year ago and got a good qualification on both and I was going to try JLPT1 but I'm busy with my school so I didn't. But still...

Well, Zefah, for one, one of the warnings in my JLPT2 grammar book on one point is "Warning: This is only used in conversation." which kind of implies that most of the points are intended for not conversation, neh? I can't remember which one nor be arsed to find it but it did make me laugh.
I also go to a study session hosted by some of my elementary school teachers on Saturday. When I was there, I do remember them saying that some of these points rarely turn up in conversation, and if we are going to assume one is reading manga, which is mostly conversation, well...
It's not like it was even 30% or 20% but still, point is you do get hit with some, although that number may be exaggerated.
Anyway, no point in arguing about it.
I'd encourage some of you, and you know who you are, to be a tad more positive in this thread. The negativity isn't really needed.

I'd take care with what some books consider "only used in conversation". I have seen some books back when I went to Spain that said that, for example, "やっぱり" was conversational and "やはり" wasn't, making it look like "やはり" was ONLY for writing, when that's not true at all because "やはり" can (and should) be used with 敬語（けいご）. Of course, this is a JLPT4 or 3 (?) level example, but you get my point..

 

[RevenantKioku]

Found it, it was っけ.
Like I said I have found a LOT of 2級 grammar in Dragonball. So perhaps the as the grammar is more basic, more distilled and more general the lower in the 級s you go, and let's face it, Zefah can't make any arguments about 4級~2級 cause s/he didn't take them, let's just assume for the sake of it that perhaps there is some more formal less used grammar in the lower 級s and get on with our lives?

 

[FINALFANTASYDOG]

All the time.

I guess I could pretend I didn't live in Japan and happened to get all of my grammar from Manga / TV shows, but such a person really has no place claiming to be an expert at anything in terms of Japanese language and is disqualified from being able to claim that something "is never used".

But I do live in Japan(however your Japanese is also ahead of mine by light years) that's why when I went back to my JLPT2 grammar realized that a lot of the grammar was used on even the most basic announcements put out by my company. I Still want to meet youth who use nioite in their casual colloquial conversations.

The whole thing was just a supporting bullet point for my main argument in that initial post, that with the all Japanese all the time, especially with it's method of learning kanji. It can trick you into thinking(gives you skill at grasping the overall concept/outline of what people are saying/meanings) you are far better at Japanese then you really are.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

Well, Zefah, for one, one of the warnings in my JLPT2 grammar book on one point is "Warning: This is only used in conversation." which kind of implies that most of the points are intended for not conversation, neh? I can't remember which one nor be arsed to find it but it did make me laugh.
I also go to a study session hosted by some of my elementary school teachers on Saturday. When I was there, I do remember them saying that some of these points rarely turn up in conversation, and if we are going to assume one is reading manga, which is mostly conversation, well...
It's not like it was even 30% or 20% but still, point is you do get hit with some, although that number may be exaggerated.
Anyway, no point in arguing about it.
I'd encourage some of you, and you know who you are, to be a tad more positive in this thread. The negativity isn't really needed.

Well of course not everything is going to turn up in its exact form in a casual conversation, but I don't think the JLPT exists merely to judge one's Japanese ability in a casual conversation. The original quote I took up in my first post on this topic was this, "it just amazed me the amount of random grammar they have on the 2-kyu that is hardly ever used in non-academic modern day writing or conversations." I hear stuff like this a lot where people dismiss things they didn't understand as "something that is hardly ever used" and seemingly imply that these things have no practical value.

Personally when I think of "academic writing", I think of things like essays on academic topics, research reports, etc... Nothing I saw in the JLPT1 was exclusively academic. Pretty much everything on the test can be found everyday on television, in a novel, a manga, a magazine, a newspaper, etc...

I'd love to see what you consider 'normal life in Japan', because even some of my teachers (Japanese) said the stuff that shows up on the JLPT1 is sometimes not even used AT ALL. I have only tried JLPT3 and JLPT2 two and one year ago and got a good qualification on both and I was going to try JLPT1 but I'm busy with my school so I didn't. But still...

I consider 'normal life' as going to school / going to work, hanging out with friends / co-workers, going to the bank and the post office maybe, watching television, reading books / magazines / newspapers, etc... Do you have any specific examples of what your teachers told you is not used at all? No offense, but I find that highly suspect. I only took the exam once in 2005, but I doubt the material that appears on it changes much between the years and quite honestly it really wouldn't make sense for the company in charge of the exam to put in extremely obscure stuff that isn't actually used in their exam problems. I would think that might hurt their credibility.

Found it, it was っけ.
Like I said I have found a LOT of 2級 grammar in Dragonball. So perhaps the as the grammar is more basic, more distilled and more general the lower in the 級s you go, and let's face it, Zefah can't make any arguments about 4級~2級 cause s/he didn't take them, let's just assume for the sake of it that perhaps there is some more formal less used grammar in the lower 級s and get on with our lives?

You are right I have never taken the other levels of the exam which is why I am asking for specific examples if possible. I just find it highly unlikely that a company would throw in a bunch of obscure stuff in their exam that is supposed to accurately judge a person's Japanese ability. Are you saying that っけ is obscure or am I misunderstanding you?

But I do live in Japan(however your Japanese is also ahead of mine by light years) that's why when I went back to my JLPT2 grammar realized that a lot of the grammar was used on even the most basic announcements put out by my company. I Still want to meet youth who use nioite in their casual colloquial conversations.

The whole thing was just a supporting bullet point for my main argument in that initial post, that with the all Japanese all the time, especially with it's method of learning kanji. It can trick you into thinking(gives you skill at grasping the overall concept/outline of what people are saying/meanings) you are far better at Japanese then you really are.

Sure young people aren't going to be using some of the higher level grammar forms in conversations with their school friends about Monster Hunter or whatever, but I don't see what that really has to do with the JLPT.

I will agree with your second statement, though. I apologize for using your post for my rant, it's just that I see comments about certain words and grammar forms "never being used" all the time on various internet forums and such comments are almost always completely wrong.

 

[Mik2121]

I consider 'normal life' as going to school / going to work, hanging out with friends / co-workers, going to the bank and the post office maybe, watching television, reading books / magazines / newspapers, etc... Do you have any specific examples of what your teachers told you is not used at all? No offense, but I find that highly suspect. I only took the exam once in 2005, but I doubt the material that appears on it changes much between the years and quite honestly it really wouldn't make sense for the company in charge of the exam to put in extremely obscure stuff that isn't actually used in their exam problems. I would think that might hurt their credibility.

Uhm sorry, I guess I came here without reading everything. I thought when you were talking about normal life in Japan, you meant common conversations. Didn't really think about going to the bank, or talking with co-workers. My bad, then!. The only thing left that isn't used all that mach are some really obscure kanjis, at least what I've heard about (I have never taken the JLPT1).

*reads the last few pages completely in order to not misunderstand anything else..*

 

[Deleted member 17706]

Uhm sorry, I guess I came here without reading everything. I thought when you were talking about normal life in Japan, you meant common conversations. Didn't really think about going to the bank, or talking with co-workers. My bad, then!. The only thing left that isn't used all that mach are some really obscure kanjis, at least what I've heard about (I have never taken the JLPT1).

*reads the last few pages completely in order to not misunderstand anything else..*

I don't think there are any non-Joyo Kanji used in the JLPT1 without having a reading and definition displayed at the bottom of the page.

 

[Mik2121]

I don't think there are any non-Joyo Kanji used in the JLPT1 without having a reading and definition displayed at the bottom of the page.

Well, then again I have not taken said exam and this is what I've heard from some teachers and they told me some kanjis aren't used. I mean, they CAN be used, it's just nobody uses them.. and I'm not talking about stuff like the kanjis for "takusan" or "budou" or stuff like that, but more complex and really not used at all things.

Can't really give any example so I must stfu, I was just giving my two uninformed cents

 

[RevenantKioku]

Well of course not everything is going to turn up in its exact form in a casual conversation, but I don't think the JLPT exists merely to judge one's Japanese ability in a casual conversation. The original quote I took up in my first post on this topic was this, "it just amazed me the amount of random grammar they have on the 2-kyu that is hardly ever used in non-academic modern day writing or conversations." I hear stuff like this a lot where people dismiss things they didn't understand as "something that is hardly ever used" and seemingly imply that these things have no practical value.

Well, I know a lot of people studying Japanese who have been told that these ３級／2級 grammar points are rare, hardly ever used, or what not. But then again I always have been told how hard Japanese is from Japanese people, and I really don't find it that. I sometimes wonder if it's just a nicety that is making people a bit disillusioned?
I mean, you know how rumors can go. One person hears from a Japanese person that one 3級 grammar point isn't used much (and they would be the authoritative being a native of the language, right?) and passed through enough people and exaggerated, the eventually the idea is that entire grammar must be all obscure points, you know?

You are right I have never taken the other levels of the exam which is why I am asking for specific examples if possible. I just find it highly unlikely that a company would throw in a bunch of obscure stuff in their exam that is supposed to accurately judge a person's Japanese ability.

I think the issue is obscure is probably a relative term. Every single time a Japanese person asks me why I am studying a certain thing that according to them is difficult or rarely used, I asked if they understand it, and since they always say "Yes", I always say "And that's why I'm studying it."
So, again I think it's an extension of having comments made by native speakers about the material who could be exaggerating to make people feel better? I think it's a case of good intentions mucking with the truth.

Are you saying that っけ is obscure or am I misunderstanding you?

A misunderstanding. It was the one (and only one in the book!) tagged with a warning of "Only for conversation." which, made me laugh.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

Well, I know a lot of people studying Japanese who have been told that these ３級／2級 grammar points are rare, hardly ever used, or what not. But then again I always have been told how hard Japanese is from Japanese people, and I really don't find it that. I sometimes wonder if it's just a nicety that is making people a bit disillusioned?
I mean, you know how rumors can go. One person hears from a Japanese person that one 3級 grammar point isn't used much (and they would be the authoritative being a native of the language, right?) and passed through enough people and exaggerated, the eventually the idea is that entire grammar must be all obscure points, you know?


I think the issue is obscure is probably a relative term. Every single time a Japanese person asks me why I am studying a certain thing that according to them is difficult or rarely used, I asked if they understand it, and since they always say "Yes", I always say "And that's why I'm studying it."
So, again I think it's an extension of having comments made by native speakers about the material who could be exaggerating to make people feel better? I think it's a case of good intentions mucking with the truth.


A misunderstanding. It was the one (and only one in the book!) tagged with a warning of "Only for conversation." which, made me laugh.

I definitely think this is the case. This doesn't just happen in Japanese, either. I remember when I was back in college in the U.S. I had a lot of Japanese friends who would ask their American friends for English help. I would constantly overhear the American guy / girl exclaiming that, "oh no one ever uses that word / phrase!" I always remember thinking that just because they might not use the word / phrase doesn't mean that it isn't used by anyone, so whenever I helped anyone with their English, whether they were Japanese or from another country, I would always be careful not to ever say that something is "never used".

I think that a lot of people suddenly get into the mindset that they know everything about their language when they are teaching a non-native speaker and anything they are not very familiar with is something that "must not ever be used".

 

[RevenantKioku]

Well, you do have to be careful with what you teach someone.
Otherwise you end up with 30 year old Japanese women who always refer to you as "Bro" in emails. (Not my goddamned fault, mind!)

 

[FINALFANTASYDOG]

Well, you do have to be careful with what you teach someone.
Otherwise you end up with 30 year old Japanese women who always refer to you as "Bro" in emails. (Not my goddamned fault, mind!)

Yeah it's always fun to find your own annoying verbal tendencies reflected back in those you teach.

I have a tendency to over-use "good stuff" as it's own word without modifying anything. I now have a bunch of people that I've thought English to, use good stuff all over the place with no rhyme or reason. This is incredibly annoying.

Likewise for me, a large section of my mid-stage Japanese speaking exposure came from crazy Buddhist cultist folks(don't ask, hey, it was free Japanese lessons) and since forth I really had to kill my tendencies to use koso with just about everything and speak constantly in exaggerated highly emotional terms.

 

[OnWarmerMusic]

So I finished Heisig back in mid-October, and overall I'm very happy with the boost in my reading/learning ability that followed. I've recommended it to the other people I know who are studying as well.

Anyway, RK, if you don't mind my asking, how long did you continue to review flashcards for RTK after you finished the book? Or do you still review? Right now I just do whatever expired cards I have, but I'm wondering if my time would be better spent picking up new vocab.

 

[RevenantKioku]

I do my kanji reviews every day. It's only about 10, 15 minutes of reviewing.

 

[OnWarmerMusic]

Cool, thanks!

 

[abstract alien]

So...i got a note inside of my bag today...
Im not sure who wrote it, or if it is even correct, but could someone help me out? Here is what i got. Im no where near ready to even begin to decipher this yet...please help

 

[zoku88]

Is the thing on the top right of the last character a dot or two lines? Your picture is really blurry.

EDIT: I have no idea what a geddo is, but the note seems to be about some kind of soup?

I could be completely wrong.

 

[MadraptorMan]

Good soup..?

 

[NaughtyCalibur]

It's some of that Ghetto Soup.

 

[USD]

Good soup..?

Pretty sure this is what it is.

 

[Cheesemeister]

Mmm, I love good soup!

 

[MadraptorMan]

Oh, it's definitely グッド・スープ (good soup), I just don't know what the heck that is supposed to be. I guess if it makes sense to the person who asked that is all that matters though.

 

[abstract alien]

Is the thing on the top right of the last character a dot or two lines? Your picture is really blurry.

EDIT: I have no idea what a geddo is, but the note seems to be about some kind of soup?

I could be completely wrong.

I know exactly who wrote this now if it is relating to soup, thanks! I tried to write it out in ms paint so you could see some of the details better, but im not sure if it really helped or not :lol

This my help...it actually says "To me, you areblurry jap pic)"

edit: THANKS everyone!!! Always so helpful!!

It's some of that Ghetto Soup.

:lol

 

[vas_a_morir]

Time for my first stupid question of the year!

Lets say, oh, that I can't drink, and I want to express this in Japanese.

When should I use:　飲めない
And when should I use: 飲むことができない。

If I had to guess, but I have been wrong on this before, nomenai would indicate that I am not able to drink at the moment, where the kotogadekinai form seems to indicate the physical impossibility of drinking. Are they not used interchangeably? If so, is one considered more formal or haughty than the other?

 

[Furoba]

Time for my first stupid question of the year!

Lets say, oh, that I can't drink, and I want to express this in Japanese.

When should I use:　飲めない
And when should I use: 飲むことができない。

If I had to guess, but I have been wrong on this before, nomenai would indicate that I am not able to drink at the moment, where the kotogadekinai form seems to indicate the physical impossibility of drinking. Are they not used interchangeably? If so, is one considered more formal or haughty than the other?

If it's physically impossible to drink (which is unlikely) you use 飲む事ができない。
In other cases, you say　お酒が弱い／強い (osake ga yowai/tsuyoi) 'I can't hold... '

 

[vas_a_morir]

If it's physically impossible to drink (which is unlikely) you use 飲む事ができない。
In other cases, you say　お酒が弱い／強い (osake ga yowai/tsuyoi) 'I can't hold... '

Lolz, you misunderstood my question. Nomu was just a random verb I was positive everybody knew. Replace "nomu" with any other verb on Earth. It was a grammar question rather than a phrase question.

 

[zoku88]

For some reason, I thought you were asking about drinking specifically too :lol

 

[Furoba]

Lolz, you misunderstood my question. Nomu was just a random verb I was positive everybody knew. Replace "nomu" with any other verb on Earth. It was a grammar question rather than a phrase question.

Well, …ことができない is much less colloquial and not always interchangeable with the potential form. It points more to abilities, rather than potential actions.

 

[zoku88]

I gots a question. We were taught, sometime over the semester, how to talk about a previous experience. Like, saying something like, I've never gone to a foreign country before.

Uh, but I forgot how to do it >.>

Is it something like

外国に行ってことありません。

I remember koto aru was in there somewhere, but I forgot about everything else T_T

 

[Zoe]

It's past plain form + koto (ga) aru/nai.

 

[zoku88]

It's past plain form + koto (ga) aru/nai.

What's 'plain' form?

Is that with -masu

or is that the same as dictionary form (-ru, -u) ?

 

[Zoe]

or is that the same as dictionary form (-ru, -u) ?

This.

So, 日本へ行ったことがありません

 

[zoku88]

This.

So, 日本へ行ったことがありません

Ok, thanks a lot ^^

It's been bugging me, for at least two months XD

I was just embarrassed to ask T_T

 

[baka kitsune]

I think I'm going to give the Remembering The Kanji method a try. I'm starting my second semester of intermediate Japanese (which covers Genki II Lessons 18-end of the book) and I still feel my Kanji skills are lacking. Reading them isn't that bad but when it comes to writing them I have a lot of trouble remembering without looking them up. This doesn't work for tests of course and I get dinged for writing words in hiragana. Writing them multiple times doesn't always help with all of them so I think using Heisig's method might help a lot according to what the opening post was saying. :3

 

[Benjamin_MFF]

Very cool thread. Bookmarked for later readings.

 

[test_account]

I got a message that said this:

"idesuyo

watashi de yokereba oshiemasyou"

What does it mean? It was written in romaji ("normal" letters). I guess that idesuyo means something like "that is good!", but what about the last sentence?

EDIT: By the way, it seems to be an spelling error in the last word "oshiemasyou", but that is how the word is written in the messsage.

 

[Furoba]

I got a message that said this:

"idesuyo

watashi de yokereba oshiemasyou"

What does it mean? It was written in romaji ("normal" letters). I guess that idesuyo means something like "that is good!", but what about the last sentence?

EDIT: By the way, it seems to be an spelling error in the last word "oshiemasyou", but that is how the word is written in the messsage.

"That's ok.
If you are fine with me, let's teach (?)"
(could be different depending on the context)

In standard Hepburn romanization it should be:
ii desu yo
watashi de yokereba oshiemashou

 

[zoku88]

Yea, whoever wrote that for some reason romanized いい　as i, which doesn't make sense, since ii is twice length of i. (I think it's called mora?)

 

[test_account]

"That's ok.
If you are fine with me, let's teach (?)"
(could be different depending on the context)

In standard Hepburn romanization it should be:
ii desu yo
watashi de yokereba oshiemashou

Great, thanks for the help! I think the context is right about teaching, since i told this person that i wasnt so good at japanese. And maybe the "idesuyo" was a reply to when i said that i wasnt so good in japanese?

Yea, whoever wrote that for some reason romanized いい　as i, which doesn't make sense, since ii is twice length of i. (I think it's called mora?)

Ye, i dont the person who wrote me this message is this person is japanese. I got the message on my PS3 . The user who sent me the message had a username written in hiragana, so i asked if he/she is japanese, and he/she said yes. When i check the profile for this person, then 3 languages are listed, but japanese isnt one of them. And it seems that some of the words are spelled wrong, so i dont know if this person really is japanese, but who knows?

By the way, is it possible for a japaense to not be good at writing romaji, but that are good to write hiragana, katakana and/or kanji? I mean, i guess that it is possible, but do the japanese people learn how to write romaji just as well as they learn to write hiragana, katakana and/or kanji too?

Thanks for the help!

 

[KTallguy]

I think I'm going to give the Remembering The Kanji method a try. I'm starting my second semester of intermediate Japanese (which covers Genki II Lessons 18-end of the book) and I still feel my Kanji skills are lacking. Reading them isn't that bad but when it comes to writing them I have a lot of trouble remembering without looking them up. This doesn't work for tests of course and I get dinged for writing words in hiragana. Writing them multiple times doesn't always help with all of them so I think using Heisig's method might help a lot according to what the opening post was saying. :3

I tried to learn the Heisig method midway and it ended up contradicting a lot of what I DO know, so it's hard for me to recommend it to someone unless they are just starting out.

However, it's worth trying once.

 

[Zoe]

And it seems that some of the words are spelled wrong, so i dont know if this person really is japanese, but who knows?

By the way, is it possible for a japaense to not be good at writing romaji, but that are good to write hiragana, katakana and/or kanji? I mean, i guess that it is possible, but do the japanese people learn how to write romaji just as well as they learn to write hiragana, katakana and/or kanji too?

Eh... that isn't really spelled wrong. There are several methods to transliterating to romaji. Some people write 'syo' because the character is a combination of 's(h)i' and 'yo'. Just type it in Windows, and you'll see that it displays properly: しょ

(Even though I tend to write things in romaji as they're pronounced, it's faster to take shortcuts when writing in Japanese)

 

[test_account]

Eh... that isn't really spelled wrong. There are several methods to transliterating to romaji. Some people write 'syo' because the character is a combination of 's(h)i' and 'yo'. Just type it in Windows, and you'll see that it displays properly: しょ

(Even though I tend to write things in romaji as they're pronounced, it's faster to take shortcuts when writing in Japanese)

Really? I had no idea. If there are several of ways to translate to romaji then i withdraw what i said earlier, i am sorry about the missinformation!

I thought that しょ was only properly translated to "sho", i didnt know there were several of ways to translate into romaji. I found it wierd that japanese wasnt listed as one of his/hers language, only english, norwegian and swedish were listed if i remember correctly. And when i thought the romaji was spelled wrong, i thought this person wasnt japanese. This person did however had his username written in hiragana (i dont know if it is possible get hiragana "fonts" on an european PS3, or is it? Maybe he/she has a imported PS3 though, i dont know.)

But if this is a correct way of spelling, then maybe this person is japanese afterall Then i have learned something new today, thanks for the info!

The person also used underlines instead of spaces when writing, is there any reason for this?

 

[Cheesemeister]

Eh... that isn't really spelled wrong. There are several methods to transliterating to romaji. Some people write 'syo' because the character is a combination of 's(h)i' and 'yo'. Just type it in Windows, and you'll see that it displays properly: しょ

(Even though I tend to write things in romaji as they're pronounced, it's faster to take shortcuts when writing in Japanese)

Yeah, that drives me up the wall whenever I see it.

Seriously, Romaji is the devil. Avoid at all costs.