Support NeoGAF

[FerranMG]

Spoiler

1) You can beat Mom's Heart 9 times and get 9 different endings along with a new item unlock for each. After that, you can go on the next level(s) every time.

2) You get new items and achievements by beating the game with each character. Every time you complete a run for the first time with a new character, you unlock something.

3) There is 1 alternate boss to Satan and 2 more beyond him. You have to do some special things to get to them, yes.

4) Every time you complete a run, you get 1 Eden token.

Hope that helps!

Awesome, thanks!

One more thing:

Spoiler

You say beating the game with each character unlocks something.
Is it ok to beat the game only once with each character to unlock these items, or several runs are required?
Also, beating the game means beating Mom's Heart?

 

[aku:jiki]

If I'm playing for fun I usually pass brimstone up.

I just don't find it enjoyable. I value high tears above everything. It's just fun.

Soy milk was a little TOO weak for me though.

My favorite type of build has always been just a good, old-fashioned tears build too. Give me an early Wire Coat Hanger and I'm already enjoying the run right there, some damage ups on top and I'm loving it. Brimstone, Technology, Ipecac, Fetus and so on runs can be a lot of fun too, of course, but my favorite is always going to be a tears-based run.

I am starting to fall in love with the scythes, but they're just a reskin for the tears so they count!

Plenty of mid-game questions regarding bosses and progression:

You should try to get rid of Azazel like a smoker giving up cigarettes, man. He can ruin your impression of the game since he's far too easy to use.

He should've been a much more difficult unlock so he doesn't show up so easily and early for beginner players, because the temptation to use him every time is going to be too strong. You might not learn to love Isaac, Judas and Eden that way.

 

[YianGaruga]

I'm kind of annoyed by all this talk about an expansion while the Vita and PS4 versions still don't work properly.

 

[lucablight]

Did this get a disc release or is it only available via psn? Also is there cross buy for ps4/vita?

 

[Duxxy3]

After a good amount of time, I must say that I prefer the flash game. There's a ton more to rebirth, but I'm not sure that's for the better. It's still a fun game, but it's not the same as the flash game. It's more cramped. The big rooms are hit or miss. The new bosses don't really fit in with the game. I don't know if they are Edmund's own additions, but they don't feel like it.

I'm not necessarily a speed runner of Isaac, but I have been known to time myself. Rebirth is not a speed running game, at all. Maybe seed running, but not random runs like you would see in the balls of steel tournament. The item pool is now too large and random for any consistency.

The soundtrack... oh boy. I'll be blunt with this one. I hate the new soundtrack. It's awful. Went through a mom's heart run and have kept it on mute since then. Thankfully there is a way to swap the original soundtrack back in.

Before you start to roast me, It's not all bad (not even close)...

But there's a lot to do in the game, a lot to unlock. The built in controller support is fantastic. The movement with controllers is smooth. The game runs well, there's no jerkiness to it. I don't mind the look of the game. I think both versions are visually appealing in their own way. Some big rooms work well. I think the boss rush is fantastic for those runs where you're completely overpowered and just want to cut loose.

I'll keep playing both because they're both good games. But if I had just one to play... it would be wrath of the lamb. Less is more in this case, at least in my opinion.

 

[Linkstrikesback]

Did this get a disc release or is it only available via psn? Also is there cross buy for ps4/vita?

PSn only at the moment, yes. Supposedly no cross buy, but they did give both vita and ps4 editions away for PS+ subscriptions, so who knows.

 

[A Link to the Past]

After a good amount of time, I must say that I prefer the flash game. There's a ton more to rebirth, but I'm not sure that's for the better. It's still a fun game, but it's not the same as the flash game. It's more cramped. The big rooms are hit or miss. The new bosses don't really fit in with the game. I don't know if they are Edmund's own additions, but they don't feel like it.

I'm not necessarily a speed runner of Isaac, but I have been known to time myself. Rebirth is not a speed running game, at all. Maybe seed running, but not random runs like you would see in the balls of steel tournament. The item pool is now too large and random for any consistency.

The soundtrack... oh boy. I'll be blunt with this one. I hate the new soundtrack. It's awful. Went through a mom's heart run and have kept it on mute since then. Thankfully there is a way to swap the original soundtrack back in.

Before you start to roast me, It's not all bad (not even close)...

But there's a lot to do in the game, a lot to unlock. The built in controller support is fantastic. The movement with controllers is smooth. The game runs well, there's no jerkiness to it. I don't mind the look of the game. I think both versions are visually appealing in their own way. Some big rooms work well. I think the boss rush is fantastic for those runs where you're completely overpowered and just want to cut loose.

I'll keep playing both because they're both good games. But if I had just one to play... it would be wrath of the lamb. Less is more in this case, at least in my opinion.

I agree that Emund really goofed on certain things. For example, Curse of the Blind can be run-ending. Either you need power but can't take the gamble, or you have to fall behind in your strength ramp-up because you can't afford to pick up a Cursed Charge Shot, or pick up a Dead Cat when you're running on red hearts.

 

[Sarcasm]

Just died and kill mom's heart at same time.

Spoiler

Why no cheevo!? lol..didn't count =(

 

[aku:jiki]

I'm not necessarily a speed runner of Isaac, but I have been known to time myself. Rebirth is not a speed running game, at all. Maybe seed running, but not random runs like you would see in the balls of steel tournament. The item pool is now too large and random for any consistency.

I absolutely adore Rebirth myself, but I can't even begin to say that you're wrong here. I was wary that the item pool would grow too large before release, and I ended up being right.

I really miss the control the original game allowed. Getting map+compass was easy, hell just reading the map without them was easier, and you could use that to maximize your D6 rerolls and end up pulling out maybe 6-10 rerolls in a single floor. Include the high library chance after touching a book and, baby, you had a stew going. Now I get maybe two rerolls a floor, if I play them perfectly, and I've seen like a dozen libraries in 160 hours of play. Boo!

I'm not at all in love with the nerfed D6, the harder-to-read map, the impossibility of finding the Compass/Map/Blue Map all in one run, the boss challenge room nerf, the lower library chance and other small tricks you could pull off in the original. It seems like they sacrificed what I call "newbie breaking" in favor of advanced-level breaking. Like milking a library until it gives non-book items would be "newbie breaking" and isn't really a thing you can consistently do anymore, but the Sharp Plug and some other stuff makes filling a room with items and rerolling them quite a bit easier.

All that said, I do want to repeat that I love Rebirth, but for me it's impossible to claim one as better than the other. They do different things and Rebirth is unfortunately not the "ultimate version" I was hoping for.

 

[Kuroyume]

Only thing I don't like in the remake is the music. I miss the old tunes.

Big rooms are kind of annoying when you're facing like 20+ spiders at once or something annoying like that, but when they toss like a bunch of mini bosses at you in a large room that's awesome.

 

[Puru]

That feeling when you get Dead Boy but the Vita/PS4 version are still not fixed.
Oh well, at least i know i don't have to try that much when i get there with other characters.

 

[Anustart]

Tech works oddly if you also have ludovico technique. I re-rolled in a dice room and ended up with that combo. The laser shoots in the direction of your controlled tear regardless of which direction you're holding. Say if the tear is all the way to the left of you, you'll shoot your laser left even if you're holding right fire.

 

[Leezard]

Tech works oddly if you also have ludovico technique. I re-rolled in a dice room and ended up with that combo. The laser shoots in the direction of your controlled tear regardless of which direction you're holding. Say if the tear is all the way to the left of you, you'll shoot your laser left even if you're holding right fire.

When I got that combo, I just controlled a large laser circle.

 

[KarmaCow]

RoboBaby 2.0 is a huge downgrade compared to 1.0. Maybe it's decent if you have flight and can camp on a rock but the auto-aim on the familiar is so spotty on it and it's practically impossible to shoot while also controlling the familiar around.

 

[aku:jiki]

When I got that combo, I just controlled a large laser circle.

Anustart probably had Tech .5, since it adds a third eye not directly related to the regular two eyes.

Did I already post about my love for Ludovico? I'll say it again anyway! I hope I find it tonight. I know it's not massively powerful but I just have fun using it... Unless I have shot speed down, that sucks.

 

[autoduelist]

Hard Judas run. Curse of Blindness got me to pick up explosive shells. I had been using Tammy's Head and had large toxic splash bullets, and now I just bombed the whole screen.

I thought it was game ending, lost a lot of health quick, but pulled through. Guppied up and switched to guppy's head at the same time, with the luck that i'd bought bff early on.

Shells still sucked, but now I was doing massive damage, and any hit spawned massive damage flies. Tore through MH, Satan, The Lamb and claimed victory.

I hate those shells, and I hate monstro's lung, and pretty much anything that requires 'charging' time except brimstone and maybe chocolate milk and mom's knife.

Tech works oddly if you also have ludovico technique. I re-rolled in a dice room and ended up with that combo. The laser shoots in the direction of your controlled tear regardless of which direction you're holding. Say if the tear is all the way to the left of you, you'll shoot your laser left even if you're holding right fire.

Makes sense to me. You're moving the endpoint, just like Ludovico Technique always does.

RoboBaby 2.0 is a huge downgrade compared to 1.0. Maybe it's decent if you have flight and can camp on a rock but the auto-aim on the familiar is so spotty on it and it's practically impossible to shoot while also controlling the familiar around.

Useful for something like

Spoiler

The Lost

hard runs. Total camper power up. But if you try to play too it's headache inducing.

 

[aku:jiki]

YASSSSSSSSS! First run of the night and I finally find the Black Lotus in the first floor secret room. I just stood there and admired it for like a minute, hah.

I like that your character actually sticks it in their hair when you pick it up.

 

[Haunted]

Awesome, thanks!

One more thing:

Spoiler

You say beating the game with each character unlocks something.
Is it ok to beat the game only once with each character to unlock these items, or several runs are required?
Also, beating the game means beating Mom's Heart?

Spoiler

Haha, you wish!

Each character unlocks something new every time you complete a run and beat a boss that character hasn't beaten before.

When I said "beating the game", I meant beating the final boss you have unlocked at that time (I should've said "completing a run" so it's not as confusing). The first time you're playing the game, Mom is the final boss. For the next nine runs (unless you get lucky and can circumvent Womb 2 in one of those runs), Mom's Heart is the final boss. After that the final boss is Satan/the boss you meet in an alternate level. After doing that a couple times, there's another two final bosses.

So basically... you need to beat all the final bosses with all characters to get all those unlocks. The tally of what you have done with each character is in the upper left corner of the character select screen (a little heart for Mom's Heart... an inverted cross for Satan... etc etc) - the tally is the thing that makes me decide on a character if I want to unlock something new and not just play for fun.

 

[Corronchilejano]

Spoiler

Does Eden also get Eden tokens? I'm trying to clear Sheol with him (unsuccesfully) and I'm failing everytime once I get there.

 

[aku:jiki]

Oh wow! Has anyone else noticed that sometimes, extremely rarely, random consumables like coins or bombs on the ground can be item pedestals? I've seen that happen about 2-3 times over 160 hours.

I just found a floor with TWO random pedestals on it. What're the odds? Seed is GNY6 AVTR and the floor was Caves 2 for the curious (PC).

Still in the same run as the Black Lotus. The game is trying to hit on me right now, I think.

 

[Haunted]

Actually, listing all the stuff you have to do to unlock new items makes me wonder what the minimum amount of successful runs is to get 100% - assuming you find all items during these runs (you certainly won't, but for the sake of argument... )

With the new characters and new bosses, it must be over 55+ successful runs minimum.

 

[kingslunk]

Azazel with laser.

So.
OP.

 

[Kunan]

Love this game. I might need to switch to using the buttons to shoot though cause I feel like I'm terrorizing my Vita's right stick when I have charge shot and need to fire a few quick rounds haha

Azazel with laser.

So.
OP.

This. Once you get used to him it's nuts!

 

[Anustart]

I'm hoping I can convert this Lost run into a victory here. First floor is XL, so far I've acquired: Dead Cat, Triple Shot, Attack Fly and Stop Watch! Who should I go for, Lamb of ???

Edit: And on Caves 1 I turned into guppy.

 

[SerTapTap]

Did performance on Vita get a patch? When I did that crazy Groundhog Day style run against

Spoiler

The Lamb

the performance was mostly fine, where before I was getting microstutter every room in just the Cellar.

Is Cursed Charge Shot the worst item in BoI

Spoiler

Yes it is because it can RUIN fucking runs, it's not nearly strong enough to justify being annoying.

Cursed eye is the fucking worst item in the game and best I can tell is almost always a DPS downgradae too

I wish the Machine Gun tears were balanced differently. Such a cool, fun effect - but it never feels like an improvement in dps, sometimes even feels like a step back.

Real shame.

It's a neat idea but extremely hard to make all tears hit, and if they don't, it's a major downgrade. And like I said upthread, it seems to nerf past/future damage upgrades in a really weird way.

I'm hoping I can convert this Lost run into a victory here. First floor is XL, so far I've acquired: Dead Cat, Triple Shot, Attack Fly and Stop Watch! Who should I go for, Lamb of ???

Edit: And on Caves 1 I turned into guppy.

Lamb is harder. Though I recommend fighting it at least once while not OP, it's patterns are actually really cool, despite kind of hating it, the 12x repeat really made me appreciate the boss design. It's my favorite along with

Spoiler

Mega Satan

 

[Anustart]

Did performance on Vita get a patch? When I did that crazy Groundhog Day style run against

Spoiler

The Lamb

the performance was mostly fine, where before I was getting microstutter every room in just the Cellar.



Cursed eye is the fucking worst item in the game and best I can tell is almost always a DPS downgradae too



It's a neat idea but extremely hard to make all tears hit, and if they don't, it's a major downgrade. And like I said upthread, it seems to nerf past/future damage upgrades in a really weird way.



Lamb is harder. Though I recommend fighting it at least once while not OP, it's patterns are actually really cool, despite kind of hating it, the 12x repeat really made me appreciate the boss design. It's my favorite along with

Spoiler

Mega Satan

Oh I've fought the lamb plenty of times while not op. I'm not really interested in fighting the lamb with a gimped Lost lol. Just got punching bag in caves 2. This run is fabulous. Good thing I'm guppy though because my tears suck.

 

[SerTapTap]

Oh right The Lost, that changes things. I just meant generally. I might just ignore The Lost entirely after unlocking it, seems to ruin basically everything I enjoy. Even it's unlock feels like punching yourself in the face

 

[A Link to the Past]

I'd really enjoy it if they buffed The Lost, a lot. Give it Sacred Heart or something :v

 

[aku:jiki]

I'm hoping I can convert this Lost run into a victory here. First floor is XL, so far I've acquired: Dead Cat, Triple Shot, Attack Fly and Stop Watch! Who should I go for, Lamb of ???

Edit: And on Caves 1 I turned into guppy.

If you fail that run, I will personally come to your house and slap you.

I'd really enjoy it if they buffed The Lost, a lot. Give it Sacred Heart or something :v

Eh, that's a little extreme but it should absolutely start with higher than 1 damage. That's just an unimaginative and lame way to raise difficulty.

 

[Puru]

Did performance on Vita get a patch? When I did that crazy Groundhog Day style run against

Spoiler

The Lamb

the performance was mostly fine, where before I was getting microstutter every room in just the Cellar.

Not really, it's just that some area seems to work better than others, Cellar is mostly fine but can get bad with a few items/big rooms, Depths and Necropolis are by far the worst areas.
After that it's mostly good unless you end up against

Spoiler

mama gurdy

and sometimes for absolutly no reason

Spoiler

Isaac

.
Funny thing is the Secret unlock section on the Vita, most of the time the pages move super slowly but randomly it's extremly smooth.

 

[maty]

YASSSSSSSSS! First run of the night and I finally find the Black Lotus in the first floor secret room. I just stood there and admired it for like a minute, hah.

I like that your character actually sticks it in their hair when you pick it up.

Nice, I'm missing Black Lotus and Godhead to finally collect all items. It's going to take a while :/

 

[Anustart]

Beat the Lamb. Unlocked The Mind, The Soul and -0- Baby. Just need an isaac and ??? on hard, plus the boss rush. Shoulda done boss rush this run, but I was too slow.

 

[Robert J. Sullivan]

pretty good read if you're interested in tboi's themes and overall meaning (spoilers obviously) :
http://www.reddit.com/r/bindingofis...am_the_author_of_the_isaac_endings_explained/

 

[Corronchilejano]

Ipecac crashes my game is big rooms, anyone else suffering with problems like that?

 

[TurboLibre]

I literally followed all the instructions to the T, and the

Spoiler

Lost still didn't unlock

. What the hell?

Spoiler

No seeds, Isaac died to the spider spitting guy, Maggie blew herself up, Judas got stomped and Azazel got projectiled by the second form of Satan. Is it just bugged sometimes? Because this is a big waste of time for a gamble.

 

[Leezard]

I literally followed all the instructions to the T, and the Lost still didn't unlock. What the hell?

No seeds, Isaac died to the spider spitting guy, Maggie blew herself up, Judas got stomped and Azazel got projectiled by the second form of Satan. Is it just bugged sometimes? Because this is a big waste of time for a gamble.

spider spitting guy? IIRC you need to die to a bomb mulligan enemy. They don't spit spiders.

 

[TurboLibre]

spider spitting guy? IIRC you need to die to a bomb mulligan enemy. They don't spit spiders.

Damnit. They're so vague on the enemy names I assumed they were all the crying fat babies.

Any good seeds to make it easier this next time? On the PC.

 

[Chronoja]

Damnit. They're so vague on the enemy names I assumed they were all the crying fat babies.

Any good seeds to make it easier this next time? On the PC.

To their discredit the original Isaac had a "bestiary" instead of traditional end credits so you didn't have to go looking up wikis to know what each enemy was called. And removing that shows quite a bit due to the number of people finding it difficult to refer to specific enemies (e.g. "those red mole things in the womb" - Lumps) or in your case getting killed by a Mulligan as opposed to a Mulliboom. Would be nice if they put it back in, just put a credits option on the main menu or something instead (or vice versa). Tbh, the lack of a more functional UI, like think of all the actual statistics and an improved collection / bestiary that could have been put in the game but just wasn't, sort of a big missed opportunity imo. But that's just nitpicking really.

 

[Caderfix]

Man... I thought I'd never need to live through the nightmare that is beating It Lives with blue baby ever again

God dammit, I hate that fucking character

 

[SerTapTap]

Man... I thought I'd never need to live through the nightmare that is beating It Lives with blue baby ever again

God dammit, I hate that fucking character

That's not the worst part, if you're only doing it to unlock D6 it's not too bad.

Watch for items to give yourself more soul hearts though, you will get tons of devil deals (though they will be expensive). If you see The Nail absolutely get it, great item for blue baby. Also anything that can give Sin/Faith up as that ups your black/soul heart drop rate respectively. Some devil deal items are effectively reduced price due to giving black/soul hearts too.

It does depend a bit more on luck than most characters, since hearts are useless and it's entirely possible you won't get enough hearts for good devil deals/just to live. But it's not as bad as I thought it would be.

Honestly I probably hate playing blue baby less than Maggie. Soooo sloowwwww

 

[Robert J. Sullivan]

That's not the worst part, if you're only doing it to unlock D6 it's not too bad.

Watch for items to give yourself more soul hearts though, you will get tons of devil deals (though they will be expensive). If you see The Nail absolutely get it, great item for blue baby. Also anything that can give Sin/Faith up as that ups your black/soul heart drop rate respectively. Some devil deal items are effectively reduced price due to giving black/soul hearts too.

It does depend a bit more on luck than most characters, since hearts are useless and it's entirely possible you won't get enough hearts for good devil deals/just to live. But it's not as bad as I thought it would be.

Honestly I probably hate playing blue baby less than Maggie. Soooo sloowwwww

Also, learn to love your Dark Bum. With other characters it's bordering on OP but with Blue Baby it's an invaluable item.

 

[SerTapTap]

I honestly wonder if Dark Bum wasn't made specifically for blue baby. Singlehandedly fixes the character and lets you take a ton of devil deals if you get it early.

 

[thequickandthedead]

How do you mean? I mean, there's Tammy's Head for a single burst of tears in all direction, there's items for flight, there's Crack The Sky, but there's no "turn into OP boss mode" item

I was mainly referring to when he shoots out tears in every direction "bullet hell" style.

 

[SerTapTap]

I was mainly referring to when he shoots out tears in every direction "bullet hell" style.

Oh, not really no, though certain items help you become kinda close! You can make tears move in a halo with Tiny Planet, move around erratically with some of the ____worm items, fly back at you with My Reflection, but no one thing to make you play just like that, no.

 

[Leon Belmont]

I was playing the challenge "Solar System" and Conquest gave me the last piece of meat but the Super Meat Boy achievement didn't unlock... does anyone knows if you can unlock achievements on challenges?

 

[arts&crafts]

I just beat

Spoiler

Mega Satan!

for the first time but there is no achievement or anything. So really there is no point in doing him again I guess. Hard mode too. Oh well back to the bad characters now.

I was playing the challenge "Solar System" and Conquest gave me the last piece of meat but the Super Meat Boy achievement didn't unlock... does anyone knows if you can unlock achievements on challenges?

Nope well i get 4 bandages in a challenge and didnt work.

 

[Leon Belmont]

I just beat

Spoiler

Mega Satan!

for the first time but there is no achievement or anything. So really there is no point in doing him again I guess. Hard mode too. Oh well back to the bad characters now.



Nope well i get 4 bandages in a challenge and didnt work.

Damn, I thought that I could get the Super Meat Boy achievement in a challenge... well it seems that I need to play it more!

Thank you my friend!

 

[Impeccable]

Good night tonight - I love how you start to see there is a genuine skill cap as you progress from -52 streak to where I'm at today...

Progress:

Spoiler

Killed Satan with Isaac and then Killed Satan with Cain. Two more trophies and unlocks down! Not terribly OP runs either which shows to me I'm getting better at using items and stuff appropriately and not just "Oh Devil Deal... Yoink until no HP". On my Cain run I actually got Mega Satan for the first time ever. Not sure if it's always pitch black or I just got cursed on the wrong floor but I couldn't see shit and ultimately that's what killed me. Still a very intense fight and was scary because of how "under powered" my Cain was compared to some of my runs.

Can't wait to play more tomorrow

 

[HadesGigas]

This combo I got is awesomely broken. Ipecac, Dr. Fetus, Inner Eye.

 

[SerTapTap]

This combo I got is awesomely broken. Ipecac, Dr. Fetus, Inner Eye.

Why aren't you taking damage? I don't see Pyro?