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The Black Culture Thread |OT14| Ruthless: The So Well Spoken Story

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D

D i Z

Member
Don't think I even need to ask this here but for those of us that will not be watching DD season 2 immediately, some care with spoilers for all season 2 specific discussion would be greatly appreciated.
 
J

Johndoey

Banned
Kiddizzy said:
Don't think I even need to ask this here but for those of us that will not be watching DD season 2 immediately, some care with spoilers for all season 2 specific discussion would be greatly appreciated.
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Sorry bout that, i'll keep it to general episode reactions.
 
I

Infinite

Member
Kiddizzy said:
Don't think I even need to ask this here but for those of us that will not be watching DD season 2 immediately, some care with spoilers for all season 2 specific discussion would be greatly appreciated.
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Cosign. Like I didn't except dudes to basically start giving play by play commentary in here on it.
 
M

Malyse

Member
People getting mad about KH not having a good story. Most games don't have good stories. Like, not reading books is destroying society. I weep for the death of print.
 
S

Slayven

Member
Malyse said:
People getting mad about KH not having a good story. Most games don't have good stories. Like, not reading books is destroying society. I weep for the death of print.
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There is a difference between a meh story and the Jeb level mess KH story has become.
 
Z

zeemumu

Member
Malyse said:
People getting mad about KH not having a good story. Most games don't have good stories. Like, not reading books is destroying society. I weep for the death of print.
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It's not that the story isn't good. It's that it's complicated as all hell. That's why my usual answer when someone asks me to tell them the story is "A kid, his friends, and some Disney characters need to beat up an old man looking for the key to his heart."

Also it doesn't help that one game (technically 2) is still locked behind the wall that is region exclusivity. Pretty much everything that any of us in KHGAF know about Chi and Unchained comes from you. We shouldn't have to work this hard to decipher the lore of a browser/mobile game. This ain't Frog Fractions.
 
I

Imm0rt4l

Member
Malyse said:
People getting mad about KH not having a good story. Most games don't have good stories. Like, not reading books is destroying society. I weep for the death of print.
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Let's not act like kh isn't in a tier of its own when it comes to bad story telling. Shit is needlessly convoluted trash.
 
M

Malyse

Member
Slayven said:
There is a difference between a meh story and the Jeb level mess KH story has become.
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It's only as complicated as you make it. The series is pretty straight forward if you consume all the material. There are far more convoluted stories in games. That being said, all of that is completely independent of being a good story. Like, if you can't take your story away from the game and have it stand alone? If you have to say it's good "for a game story"? SPOILER: the story isn't actually that good then.
Imm0rt4l said:
Let's not act like kh isn't in a tier of its own when it comes to bad story telling. Shit is needlessly convoluted trash.
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Convoluted and bad aren't necessarily tied to each other. You can have a good convoluted story and a bad simple one.
 
J

Johndoey

Banned
Kingdom Hearts was poorly written from day 1, but Chain of memories was when shit truly went off the rails in a glorious fashion. The series gets by on being very charming.
It's a very simple story, poorly told and written.

All that typed I love KH, I even really like Sora.
 
Z

zeemumu

Member
Malyse said:
It's only as complicated as you make it. The series is pretty straight forward if you consume all the material. There are far more convoluted stories in games. That being said, all of that is completely independent of being a good story. Like, if you can't take your story away from the game and have it stand alone? If you have to say it's good "for a game story"? SPOILER: the story isn't actually that good then.
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if you consume all the material.
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This is the key phrase, here. Prior to the HD Remixes the story was spread out over multiple platforms, and then the Final Mixes came out in Japan with more story which plopped a language barrier on that combined with Square Enix's weird title naming conventions and complex storytelling and it becomes a mess. I mean I got lost during the opening cutscene to 2 to because I hadn't played Chains yet. Still hype for KH3 though.

If you're really interested in learning the story, this is your best bet.
 
D

Deleted member 47027

Unconfirmed Member
KH is a convoluted BAD story, it can be both

Junk tier tales
 
S

Slayven

Member
Malyse said:
It's only as complicated as you make it. The series is pretty straight forward if you consume all the material. There are far more convoluted stories in games. That being said, all of that is completely independent of being a good story. Like, if you can't take your story away from the game and have it stand alone? If you have to say it's good "for a game story"? SPOILER: the story isn't actually that good then.

Convoluted and bad aren't necessarily tied to each other. You can have a good convoluted story and a bad simple one.
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Wouldn't be so bad if it didn't force you to deal with the story every 5 minutes
 
T

TangerineCloud

Banned
M

Malyse

Member
Johndoey said:
Kingdom Hearts was poorly written from day 1, but Chain of memories was when shit truely went off the rails in a glorious fashion. The series gets by on being very charming.
It's a very simple story, poorly told and written.
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I think that 358/2 Days and Birth by Sleep are the two stand outs for story in the series, with [chi]'s ranking depending on how well it sticks the landing. That being said, both BBS and Days require so much background knowledge that it inherently impedes the impact. Like, the tragedy only lands right when you know what happens next. Incidentally, the other game I mention, [chi], is compelling because you know the entire cast is doomed from jump. So no, can't argue for KH's story.

But then again, I generally don't think games have good story, so feel free to cite that as a reason to dismiss me.
zeemumu said:
This is the key phrase, here. Prior to the HD Remixes the story was spread out over multiple platforms, and then the Final Mixes came out in Japan with more story which plopped a language barrier on that combined with Square Enix's weird title naming conventions and complex storytelling and it becomes a mess. I mean I got lost during the opening cutscene to 2 to because I hadn't played Chains yet. Still hype for KH3 though.

If you're really interested in learning the story, this is your best bet.
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Actually, you can just play KH, KH2, and then hop to 3D and read all the game recaps in that.

Or you can ask me. It's one of the five game franchises I know virtually everything about.
 
K

Kid Kamikaze10

Member
The medium can do better. It is possible to make good stories in any medium.

They just choose gameplay over story. And those that don't just don't know how to mix story and gameplay. For instance, To The Moon was a fine story, but the gameplay... Well, it wasn't gameplay.


Undertales may be close though.
 
A

Afrocious

Member
I ain't talking KH with y'all. We'd be brawling and the funny thing is that we'd probably agree with some opinions about it.

Been playing the series since I was 12. Pirating PS2 games on old internet speeds was the worst. It took an entire week to download KH2 FM +. But I did it though.

On other news, I got my credit card statement today. I've learned that I'm on point with budgeting. I feel like an adult for once.
 
Z

zeemumu

Member
Malyse said:
I think that 358/2 Days and Birth by Sleep are the two stand outs for story in the series, with [chi]'s ranking depending on how well it sticks the landing. That being said, both BBS and Days require so much background knowledge that it inherently impedes the impact. Like, the tragedy only lands right when you know what happens next. Incidentally, the other game I mention, [chi], is compelling because you know the entire cast is doomed from jump. So no, can't argue for KH's story.

But then again, I generally don't think games have good story, so feel free to cite that as a reason to dismiss me.
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The artistic medium isn't really an excuse. Something being a kids' show doesn't mean that it can't be clever, deep, or dark, for example.

Malyse said:
Actually, you can just play KH, KH2, and then hop to 3D and read all the game recaps in that.

Or you can ask me. It's one of the five game franchises I know virtually everything about.
Click to expand...

They'll be lost once they hit KH2 and will never get to 3D. Just read the google doc and then play 3D if you want to figure out the story.

Malyse said:
I love FFXIII for a variety of reasons, story being one of them.
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Has the darkness taken you, Malyse?!
 
G

Gordon Shumway

Banned
This dude is using a Dennis Miller post to convince himself Bernard shouldn't drop it of the race. Looks like we got us a future Trump voter lol..

---
Oh FUCK..Kingdom Hearts talk??

giphy.gif
 
M

Malyse

Member
Johndoey said:
People have tried to tell me Final Fantasy 13 is on the whole well written, an opinion that boggles my mind.
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I love FFXIII for a variety of reasons, story being one of them.
Afrocious said:
I ain't talking KH with y'all. We'd be brawling and the funny thing is that we'd probably agree with some opinions about it.

Been playing the series since I was 12. Pirating PS2 games on old internet speeds was the worst. It took an entire week to download KH2 FM +. But I did it though.

On other news, I got my credit card statement today. I've learned that I'm on point with budgeting. I feel like an adult for once.
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We don't have to fight. Just accept that I'm right about everything. 😏
zeemumu said:
The artistic medium isn't really an excuse. Something being a kids' show doesn't mean that it can't be clever, deep, or dark, for example.
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Agreed. There are a few people trying, but those are rarely very popular.
 
S

Slayven

Member
Gordon Shumway said:
This dude is using a Dennis Miller post to convince himself Bernard shouldn't drop it of the race. Looks like we got us a future Trump voter lol..

---
Oh FUCK..Kingdom Hearts talk??

giphy.gif
Click to expand...

Didn't you say you listen to talk radio some times? Well I tune into Dennis Miller once in a while and dude is crazy. Not to mention he is on like 1600 am. My radio almost doesn't go up that high
 
A

Afrocious

Member
Slay gets it. The junction system was great.

12 was the apex of Final Fantasy. 13 was a sad joke. 14, while good, is an MMO - a different entity.

I don't even expect 15 to be as good or as fun as 12 despite the open areas and combat.
 
S

Slayven

Member
Afrocious said:
Slay gets it. The junction system was great.

12 was the apex of Final Fantasy. 13 was a sad joke. 14, while good, is an MMO - a different entity.

I don't even expect 15 to be as good or as fun as 12 despite the open areas and combat.
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The Junction System, and Chrono Cross' color system were the GOAT battle systems.
 
A

Afrocious

Member
EscoBlades said:
Lots of people shout 7 at me.
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7 is great too.

Infinite said:
Tactics.

And 10 has better characters and mythos than 13 which makes its story far more bearable.
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The thing is 10 didn't need an encyclopedia to explain shit. Not to say reading things in games is bad (12 had the best bestiary) but FF13s terminology was awful.

Imm0rt4l said:
Umm....no
FF9 was the last truly great ff game
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I can never finish 9 because of how slow it is.
 
M

Malyse

Member
Johndoey said:
Well I definitely can't say I understand but fair enough. I think Con Air and Ghost Rider are fantastic so I can't say shit to anyone.

Edit: How do you feel about Killer 7 though?
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I love everything Suda51 has made and would hurt entire countries for NHM3 and Lollipop Chainsaw 2 (provided Marvel loosens James Gunn's leash long enough for him to write it)

I would love for all his games to actually be some kind of Cosmere thing.
Afrocious said:
Loving FF13s story just contradicted that reply to me.

I can't.
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It was a dumb convoluted mess and it was hilariously glorious. I can enjoy something and be objectively aware of all its problems. Plus Lightning was a fun character; when she hauled off and punched Snow in the face I was sold.

FF6 > your fave.
 
B

bobbychalkers

Member
Wasn't directed towards me but I can enjoy a good obtuse plot time to time but FFXIII had way too many made up proper nouns and unlikable characters. I picked up FF Type-0 around Black Friday and the second they mentioned "Fal'Cie" my eyes glazed over and I haven't touched it since. I plots like Killer 7 and Metal Gear so I do have a high tolerance for some bullshit.
 
S

Sch1sm

Member
Malyse said:
Your first mistake was playing a Besthesda game for the story.

-----

Watch this: https://vimeo.com/122076401
Kickstart this: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/blueforestcollective/kariba-the-graphic-novel
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Ehhh. I knew what I was getting into, which is exactly why I borrowed it from a friend rather than purchase it myself. FO3 was just as bad for it, so my expectation were low to start, but come on. What's the point in this whole wasteland drop back if you can't make something fun out of it?
 
M

Malyse

Member
EscoBlades said:
Lots of people shout 7 at me.
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2451325-2443793-7547886474-ffplo.gif
Except Kefka pulled off his end game and Sephiroth lost to a dude who was pretending to be a hero when he was really a loser grunt.

RE:XIII

The cocoon setting is literally my ideal neofuturistic utopia setting so I was already invested. I always wanted more games in that type of world and it also why I'm still interested in Killzone Shadowfall in spite of FPS.
 
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