StriKeVillain
Banned
Rumor is that a raid exists but it won't come out/be announced until 2 weeks after launch.
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The Division Open Beta Thread: Is it out yet?
- Thread starter Smash88
- Start date
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Hopefully it's viable, I will play something like that too if stamina scaling isn't as off the hook as it was in betas. In beta it was pointless to try and play rogue style.
fastford58
Member
I don't mind if this is the case. The game appears to be pretty awesome so a couple of bucks for a cool jacket shouldn't bother anyone.I was talking about this
If they add unique guns though or pay to win items, then we can worry.
StriKeVillain
Banned
I know that.From UBI's club thingy.
?? Sounds like gear, with levels. Not cosmetic items.
Still doesn't fit what the development team has been saying (microtransactions only for cosmetics, etc).
Raven Prime
Member
Context is everything. The comment I quoted mentioned you could only get Phoenix Credits with Upoints. I consider that unlikely for multiple reasons. It's far more likely that endgame activities will be the main source of Phoenix cred income.
Pop
Member
Uplay thing is a one time use. And not everyone will have credit to buy it.
Also you can earn Phoenix credits in game.
Woah. If this is true and they've snuck this into the game then that's totally different.From UBI's club thingy.
?? Sounds like gear, with levels. Not cosmetic items.
Might cancel my pre order and wait to see what the g.o is at launch.
Trust no one!
fastford58
Member
Sure. It doesn't fit. But it is pretty clear language per that image. So they need to clarify this, I think.
I felt it was a stretch to be able to buy top gear from the vendor using farmed currency in the beta to begin with. Might as well be a phone game where you are farming currency for stuff.
But my understanding is that the gear in the beta was only there as a test method and that high level gear needs to be dropped in the full release, which is good.
P2W is the wrong decision and surely the devs are aware of how this would negate the entirety of the dark zone and relegate it to a base level COD style pvp arena.
I was impressed with the beta. I hope they wouldn't flub it with something as dumb as this.
StriKeVillain
Banned
Ah gotcha, I would agree with you there.
Right, but the screenshot posted earlier in this thread says PC can be earned with cash.
Kwansu Dudes
Member
I think in this day and age, you can't believe everything development teams say. Hopefully Ubisoft/Massive clears this up.
fastford58
Member
So only certain people can pay to win? Even better! Filthy 99%ers don't deserve the benefit of these things after all.
I think it is a bad idea in ANY circumstance. I don't even think that shit should be in the game as obtainable currency. We already have PVE and PVP zone credits. Why do we need to fragment with another?
Oh right...because real money needs to be made from the devs despite myself (and many others) springing for the Gold edition.
Prove me wrong, UBI/Massive. I can't say I trust any dev as far as I can throw their office building when this stuff starts to crop up.
Raven Prime
Member
Sure, what I wrote in that post is mostly concerning their statements regarding micro-transactions and vanity DLC. I just used that datamined info to infer what might be their original intention, it's not really relevant if that's correct. For me the most important thing is that the evidence seems to support that Phoenix Credits aren't P2W at all.
https://www.reddit.com/r/thedivision/comments/47c76p/list_of_guns_found_in_game_files/
https://imgur.com/a/oxIY2
Both aren't complete lists, but they'll give you a nice idea of what to expect.
StriKeVillain
Banned
I just find it strange that they would kill their own game out of the gate after swimming in the opposite way for the last couple of months.
Logic should tell us this is nothing to be concerned about. But of course you're right, until we get some clear confirmation we shouldn't put any money down. I hope we get some clarity soon. This is cancer right now.
I think only pre-order bonus is hazmat suit.
the screenshot also says pc are for cosmetic items.
I was thinking about this a bit more and I'll laugh if it's true and they've snuck a pay to win model.
I pre-ordered this on PSN here is Australia and it was $100.
If I'm paying this much and I'm forced to play against people who have simply bought all the op guns and gear I'll simply not buy / play this game.
I would encourage others to do the same and I'll spread the word to my friend groups who would've otherwise bought this.
Probably means nothing to them as the pay to win model will most likely make them some serious bank, but at least I won't feel dirty supporting that shit.
I pre-ordered this on PSN here is Australia and it was $100.
If I'm paying this much and I'm forced to play against people who have simply bought all the op guns and gear I'll simply not buy / play this game.
I would encourage others to do the same and I'll spread the word to my friend groups who would've otherwise bought this.
Probably means nothing to them as the pay to win model will most likely make them some serious bank, but at least I won't feel dirty supporting that shit.
Can you link that screenshot again by any chance I can't find it.
fastford58
Member
And the other picture say high level equipment...so which is it. This is why we need clarification.
I take a prove me wrong stance with devs in this day and age.
Cabbagehead
Member
Wait to find if its true and then do what needs to be done. Because this would DOA this game.
Right that really does need to be addressed. Is PC for equipment or both or only for cosmetic and looks? or did someone muff up the description.
Don't need another Destiny sliver lynch mob.
Raven Prime
Member
I'm assuming that the person you were responding to used credit to refer to Uplay points. Now you can only get 30 Phoenix Credits from Uplay once.
As you can tell from this picture, a single weapon can cost 148 credits. So you can see that 30 Phoenix Credits aren't a lot at all. Plus the amount of Uplay points needed to unlocked these 30 Phoenix Credits is only 40. You can unlock 40 Uplay points by simply playing The Division itself. So every single person that owns The Division is able to unlock these points. That's not Pay 2 Win, that's simply Play 2 'Win'.
Why don't you read my post where I analyzed some of the statements made by Ubi/Massive?
I think it's wiser to base your judgements on official communications, instead of on information that was hidden in some way.
Cabbagehead
Member
As you can tell from this picture, a single weapon can cost 148 credits. So you can see that 30 Phoenix Credits aren't a lot at all. Plus the amount of Uplay points needed to unlocked these 30 Phoenix Credits is only 40. You can unlock 40 Uplay points by simply playing The Division itself. So every single person that owns The Division is able to unlock these points. That's not Pay 2 Win, that's simply Play 2 'Win'.
To some people its the same difference. *edit
Plus the irony of that picture is gold.
seems to be the case.
Maybe you can trade weapons in for cosmetic items.
fastford58
Member
But you can buy phoenix credits with real money according to the reddit picture, and phoenix credits may be useable to buy high level gear according to the one I posted.
Being able to buy in game credits with real money that can be used to purchase powerful gear is pay to win (if this is indeed the case here). There is no way around it. Am I off base with my definition of pay to win here if this is what is going on? I don't think so, but correct me if I'm wrong.
But, like, why though? What game in the past has burned you so bad you don't trust a Dev that said pretty flatly they weren't doing Pay-to-win?
Cabbagehead
Member
?
maybe
Yes only according to that picture. Which was data mined yet the uplay store does not mention real money, only u points.
Smokey_Run
Member
Cause the Uplay store only deals in Uplay currency. Why would it mention real money?
Thats what im thinking at the rewards vendor.
fastford58
Member
horse armour. Those scars run deep lol.
I'm only having this discussion because there is evidence here that there MIGHT be some sort of pay to win situation.
I would like to get clarification as there is obviously some murkiness about it.
I'm not saying it is one way or the other as there is evidence supporting both and contrary to both scenarios (ie confusion).
I want to know before I spend 130 canuck bucks on something I don't want to support.
Raven Prime
Member
I updated that post you quoted.
We don't know the validity of the reddit picture. That's why I advise to simply limit ourselves to official communications. It seems to me the information from that reddit picture is outdated at best. Massive has made it clear that there will be no pay 2 win micro-transactions. Ubisoft has added that the only purchasable vanity gear will come from the stores, and that doesn't suggest it will be tied to an ingame currency. I have summarized the data in a previous post. But basically those 2 statements together should tell you everything you need to know about Phoenix Credits to remove your concerns.
Is it? For me they are vastly different things. The available data suggests that 30 Phoenix Credits aren't a lot at all.
Cabbagehead
Member
wow that makes the most sense, its not for buying weapons. But to sell for phoenix credits for cosmetic items and looks? maybe.
Might to say some people.
fastford58
Member
This is acceptable.
Again, I don't see the point of a third currency. It a thing that makes me go hmmmm. But if they are used only for cosmetic stuff and not actual stat boosting items, then fine. Charge all the real money you want.
Increasing the health of your horse in Oblivion, 10 years ago, broke the game so much that you consider it Pay-to-win?
Look, we'd all love to get the Dev's to weigh in on this and I'm sure they will but people are being really quick to pick up their torches. Massive have been nothing but cool and communicative about The Division. Additionally they said there wouldn't be pay-to-win literally less than two months ago, why are we all ready to burn their houes to the ground?
fastford58
Member
No, of course not.
I am simply asking questions about recent information for clarity. I am not picking up a torch by any means. But questions have been raised, and I would like them definitively answered.
That's all. It's not like I've run and cancelled my preorder or anything yet.
Cabbagehead
Member
Either way i think we all both agree that the 'High Level Equipment" needs to be cleared up because it sounds like weapon boosting and they put trading and the black market on the shelf, since people would naturally "abuse" equipment boosting. Thus a real black market would appear outside the game.
Smokey_Run
Member
We're about to learn how cool and communicative they are in the next 24-48 hours.
fastford58
Member
As an aside, there are some salty buggers on the ubi forum over the Dark Zone lol.
I think it is fine as is (although the rogue system needs refinement so people can't be "baited" by turrets and stuff into going rogue).
It's like PVE/PVP worlds colliding over there. People melting down over it. It's good stuff.
I think it is fine as is (although the rogue system needs refinement so people can't be "baited" by turrets and stuff into going rogue).
It's like PVE/PVP worlds colliding over there. People melting down over it. It's good stuff.
Raven Prime
Member
I just think it's a currency for endgame gear. I don't think they'll be easy to earn and I really don't see how it sounds like boosting. But at the end of the day we know very little about Phoenix Credits and it all amounts to speculation. We'll have to wait for the devs to further clarify the issue. I'm just convinced that all available evidence clearly supports that Phoenix Credits won't be P2W in any way.
Are we? No one seems to have started a thread in their forums. Doesn't look like anyone has asked on Twitter.
It seems to me like we're going to see a bunch of people on Reddit and GAF saying that game developers should never be trusted and everyone's out to screw us. Then we'll all find out when the game comes out.
Looks to me like everyone just wants to get mad...
Cabbagehead
Member
Right and i agree
Phoenix Credit being useful for end game makes the most sense to me as well.
Lets hope they can just go ahead and post stuff about this, without need to go through red tape that is Ubi's PR department because marketing plans.
Edit:
I tried to ping few devs over Twitter, but it was already quite late in EU.
Smokey_Run
Member
Let's be honest, most of those devs are on reddit and here looking at stuff. Honestly, some probably follow reddit more than their official forums.
fastford58
Member
To be fair, UBI has a history of not being super forth-coming in pre release media. I treat them like politicians. Until they do what they say they will, I take nothing for granted.
I don't think anyone wants to "just get mad". There is nothing to be mad about. If the game ends up doing something I don't like, I won't buy. Nothing to be angry about.
Kind of a strange accusation to make.
Raven Prime
Member
To be honest I find it more interesting than the endless reposting of Sarah Hyland avatars and all the other nonsense that's been filling these pages.
Well that's good to know.
I'm sorry for getting my dander up in here. I just don't understand some of the reactions. If my local supermarket had two contradictory signs, I wouldn't assume that the worst of all options was true...
Yeah. Stuff went up on uClub way after workday was over in EU. Massive is based in Malmö, Sweden afterall. If we get response from devs it's on Friday earliest, no matter how much they get pinged on Twitter tonight.
Unrelated to issue at hand, but I wonder how Ubi is going to handle reviews. Will there be pre-release review copies, especially when game is already leaked and available in certain region(s)? Sure they could just wipe everything on eve of release.
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