Moff
Member
I don't think there's enough interest for that, it's not really necessary either. I agree that it would be inappropriate to discuss the books here.
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The Expanse |S1| Ubiquitous. Mendacious. Polyglottal. Like a couple of donkey balls.
- Thread starter lt519
- Start date
I don't think there's enough interest for that, it's not really necessary either. I agree that it would be inappropriate to discuss the books here.
I can totally see how someone would be lost without all of the books' background.
They haven't even given the name of one of the characters yet (unless I missed it). The woman that Miller talks to at the bar, and then when he's flipping through Julie's files at the end of episode 2.
And I just checked the wiki page, and they have the names for all 10 episodes.
Are they going to try and do the whole first book in 10 episodes? I don't see how they can cram all that in (without skipped/consolidating a whole bunch).
Do we know if they are doing all of the content of the first book?
firehawk12
Subete no aware
Watched the first four episodes. I'm sure all the stories are tied together, but the Holden story is the best part since it's the most "science fictiony".
It's too bad this show was sent to die. It looks better than Dark Matter and Killjoys, it has much more of an interesting story, and probably has the most potential.
It *almost* makes me want to read the books, even though I've sworn off pulp scifi novels ages ago.
It's too bad this show was sent to die. It looks better than Dark Matter and Killjoys, it has much more of an interesting story, and probably has the most potential.
It *almost* makes me want to read the books, even though I've sworn off pulp scifi novels ages ago.
I don't think this show was sent to die- I think they're praying it blows up on Netflix.
firehawk12
Subete no aware
Did they make one of those pre-air deals like they did with Gotham?
It's stupid, but if this was on Netflix, they could pair it nicely with Knights of Sidonia and create some kind of pulp scifi "block".
Sent to die? How so? It looks like they've spent a good deal of money on it, and would seem to be vested in its success.
As for the books. I've only listened to the first one, but it was pretty good. I'm actually hoping the shows ties things together a little better. Some parts of the "conspiracy" were a little odd, and didn't make a lot of sense to me. But maybe the 2nd book helps, I'll find out after Christmas when I get the rest of the books on Audible
.SyFy is certainly putting a lot of eggs in this basket. I think you mis-phrased that a bit, it's likely to die, but it wasn't sent to die. It was sent to revitalize the SyFy brand. Their best chance is word of mouth and rave critic reviews to reel people in to binge watching it when the season is over. Generating a higher view count for Season 2 is more paramount than the Season 1 view count (IMO, people know a lot more about this than me). Most people are in a wait and see mode with TV shows since there are so many and getting someone to invest their time in an unknown is difficult.
If anything, as a company, it's building their image and I'm much more likely to watch other content they are producing now after seeing the quality of The Expanse. Ordering two seasons is basically an admission that they need to be in for the long haul because, like JeffZero said above, the show is starting with a bullet hole in each foot just because of the Network and genre.
GavinUK86
Member
in no way this has been sent to die, quite the opposite in fact. this is the syfy channel's golden egg.
they want everyone and their mother to tune in and watch every week. this is their big push for hard sci-fi again. it's already set for 2 seasons and there are 9 books in total, including the ones not out yet, so they have a lot of material to translate into the show.
edit: and beaten lol. my point still stands though.
they want everyone and their mother to tune in and watch every week. this is their big push for hard sci-fi again. it's already set for 2 seasons and there are 9 books in total, including the ones not out yet, so they have a lot of material to translate into the show.
edit: and beaten lol. my point still stands though.
firehawk12
Subete no aware
Christmas is when shows wind down for the holidays. The thinking is that no one watches anything new during the break, which is why everything is off until January. Hell, even Z Nation ended a couple of weeks ago (I'm still not sure why they didn't just pair up The Expanse with that show and air them throughout November together).
Outside of anime, and that's because Japan doesn't care about Christmas, I can't think of anything else "new" that's supposed to come out around this time. Then there's the fact that, for whatever reason, episode 3 and 4 are out there.
Hell, you're releasing a science fiction show around the time that Star Wars comes out. That can't help either, because I think we're the only people on the internet who are talking about this show as opposed to whether or not JJ Abrams is a god who saved Star Wars. lol
S2 is guaranteed. Netflix/off-season viewership has changed everything. We're now back to where we were in the '90s and before where shows are getting a lot of leeway to find an audience for the first season.
This definitely has BSG potential so far.
Cornballer
Member
Stick to the broadcast air dates, please. Episode 1 & 2 are fair game since they've already aired on SyFy. Ep 3 & 4 should be under spoiler tags until December 22nd and 29th, respectively. Thanks.
firehawk12
Subete no aware
If they were trying to do the Netflix thing, then maybe they should have just released all the episodes at once to at least create that initial burst of buzz.
By the time this is in mid season, all the bigger shows will be coming back and the start of all the mid-season replacements taking all the oxygen from the room. That's before all the critics give up covering TV because of TCA press week(s).
Could easily spin both those paragraphs as a great reason why this is a good time to release the show. It'd never compete against on season for TV, that's a death wish, SfFy vs HBO/AMC/whatever would be suicide. And the renewed interest in Space from Interstellar, Gravity, The Martian, and Star Wars are all drawing in a main stream crowd that realizes that it actually likes space.
I just think it's pretty cynical to think they sent their highest budget/most advertised show out to die on purpose. They are definitely going to be patient with this one and releasing all four episodes is pretty indicative that they are more interested in growing an audience than Nielsen ratings right now. If you are just questioning their business strategy that's fair considering it hasn't been so great before, but intentions, nah.
For example:
http://www.forbes.com/sites/insertc...xpanse-is-an-oasis-in-this-winters-tv-desert/
Netflix model works only for Netflix.
The "off-season hype-build" model doesn't really care when the initial burst of episodes airs, they expect people to find it over the course of the next year.
firehawk12
Subete no aware
Maybe I'm just old fashioned and living in the past, but I just can't see how airing episodes during the holidays is a going to build interest. If it was a winning strategy, you'd think more networks would try it instead of running A Christmas Story or Home Alone marathons.
It's not, really.
The point is that the initial airing is largely irrelevant to their long-term strategy w/ future seasons.
GavinUK86
Member
They don't care when they release it because they have faith in their work and it shows. This could air any time of the year and still get viewers. It's just getting over the "syfy channel" hump right now because they've had so many years of shitty, campy films that no one, outside of people like me who watch the channel for other stuff, takes them seriously.
But we have at least 2 seasons of this so that's plenty of time for people to realise SyFy is beginning to mean SciFi again.
firehawk12
Subete no aware
But they aren't getting viewers. At least not on their TV broadcast anyway.
But if they don't care about viewer number, then I suppose it's all irrelevant.
But if they don't care about viewer number, then I suppose it's all irrelevant.
I don't quite understand ratings, maybe Jeff can chime in, but it seems positive their second night held the same rating as their premiere. Only having a million viewers isn't great but retaining them is a good sign and with the main stream media glowing about it gives it room to grow. When you start to have non tech sites like Forbes gushing about it you can reach that cultural phenomenon that's a Game of Thrones or Walking Dead. Traditional niche TV genres that the shows break the mold on.
No SyFy show broadcast whenever, wherever, will generate a large initial viewing. Nobody trusts them right now so it's unrealistic to expect high initial numbers.
I think that's the goal, albiet an extremely difficult one (especially coming from SyFy as opposed to HBO or AMC). I know I've already hooked the friends I've told about it, time will tell!
All this talk aside I'm just happy is a show I can enjoy for at least two years!
Well, I've watched the four episodes out there and has a guy who only read the first book and didn't like it that much I have to say the show is pretty good. They did what I hoped, kept the stuff that worked in the book and changed a good portion of the stuff that didn't. I'm not cautiously optimistic about the show, much more so than I was starting out.
Moff
Member
episode 2 was relaly good, too, on the level of the first.
really like the ship design and that there are many exposition shots. I can never get enough of ships in space. the fixing of the antenna dragged a bit, but I guess it served a good reason for some character exposition and showing the dangers of space.
julies tinder profile was really fun, maybe I just don't remember everything but I feel they add a lot of little details that were not in the books. everything looks nicely crafted and like a believable world.
biggest problem is still the belters, though. now there are belters who look like earthers, that will add tons of confusion, they should have found a better solution.
really like the ship design and that there are many exposition shots. I can never get enough of ships in space. the fixing of the antenna dragged a bit, but I guess it served a good reason for some character exposition and showing the dangers of space.
julies tinder profile was really fun, maybe I just don't remember everything but I feel they add a lot of little details that were not in the books. everything looks nicely crafted and like a believable world.
biggest problem is still the belters, though. now there are belters who look like earthers, that will add tons of confusion, they should have found a better solution.
Mighty Chin
Banned
Caught the first two episodes. I'm in.
Crimson Clown
Member
Are they really not going to use the awesome opening credits from the pilot in the rest of the season? A shame.
TV shows like TWD, Breaking Bad, Dexter, etc- they all build audiences year over year now as people catch up via Netflix and other streaming sites that people actually watch (aka those that aren't named Amazon.) It's a pretty strong pattern at this point and networks are playing into it- you only get cancelled if you really suck now.
Dominican Power
Member
I like how realistic humanity's expansion of the solar system is. Love the tension between Earth, Mars, and the Belters.
Moff
Member
most of the time the show looks really good, costumes, ships, enviroments. I really like it so far. I was afraid they put all the effort in the first episode, but it looks like the whole season can keep the quality
watched the first 4 episodes and if anyone who is into scifi doesnt like this after the first 4 I don't know what to tell them, this is a legit good show.
a lot better than the book, too, in my opinion
watched the first 4 episodes and if anyone who is into scifi doesnt like this after the first 4 I don't know what to tell them, this is a legit good show.
a lot better than the book, too, in my opinion
firehawk12
Subete no aware
Do they explain why they are airing episodes during Christmas though?
I suppose maybe that's why they just tossed out episodes 3 and 4. Perhaps they're assuming no one will watch those during broadcast, so they might as well let people watch them now.
I mean, I like the show. Which is why I find it odd that they're airing it in a time where, conventionally, the thinking is that no one is watching TV. (It's probably the last two weeks in the calendar where this is the case)
No mention, but that is quite possible. It seems to me though that the first two episodes still have some people on the fence and confused but a lot of the reviewers were hooked after 4 and had a clearer picture. They may figure they'll lose more viewers if they play this out over the holidays instead of just hooking them now by giving them a good chunk to chew on.
Anyway, we don't need to drown the thread out in this talk, I'm mostly just doing it for the friendly banter and education. Let's let everyone enjoy it for now
I found Episode 2 to be a bit of a dud honestly. Could have skipped all the antenna/oxygen cliches and not missed much since the character development was threadbare. And those five aren't exactly likable or even that interesting anyway.
The Ceres stuff was more interesting, but for me anyway a little more focus on the major narrative would go a long way. We have this interesting missing persons case which is clearly very important so let's break it up with some stuff about Belters siphoning water. I get that the world building is important, and plotwise these side stories may very well tie into everything, but so far they just scream filler.
I'll stick with it. I really liked the first episode.
The Ceres stuff was more interesting, but for me anyway a little more focus on the major narrative would go a long way. We have this interesting missing persons case which is clearly very important so let's break it up with some stuff about Belters siphoning water. I get that the world building is important, and plotwise these side stories may very well tie into everything, but so far they just scream filler.
I'll stick with it. I really liked the first episode.
GavinUK86
Member
the second episode was definitely the weaker one of the bunch. they spent way too long on the knight crew fixing the antenna. i've read the books so i expected them to be
.
four episodes in and they've only covered a few chapters so unless they cut or skip a lot further down the line, i can't see this being one book, one season kinda setup, even though that's what they've said.
picked up by the martian navy, attacked and shed's head blown off all in episode 2
four episodes in and they've only covered a few chapters so unless they cut or skip a lot further down the line, i can't see this being one book, one season kinda setup, even though that's what they've said.
The world building and politics of the world are much more interesting than the main narrative missing persons case.
Freezasaurus
Member
Man, I'm up to episode 4 and I'm really enjoying this. Seems to be exactly the kind of science fiction that I like. Are the novels worth reading?
I'll try to find a review I did of the first book in some thread a while back but all I can give you is my impressions of the first book, in sum it's not great. That said, it could have gotten better in the following books but the first one did not leave me craving for more. On the other hand, as I've said before, I have a much more cautiously optimistic feeling about the show.
EDIT:
I know a did a more lengthier review somewhere I'll just have to keep looking but I did a quick summary of my thoughts in the early trailer thread for the show, I will say that my fears about how the show would looked based on the trailer were wrong. Show looks pretty fantastic to me.
I don't really spoil anything in that post besides calling the characters and plot "generic." You can take away from that what you will.
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=148006019&postcount=189
EDIT, EDIT:
I found my more lengthier review, it was on Amazon. I'm just going to provide the link to the Amazon review than post it here since this thread is focused on the show. I will say that this review does contain some very light spoilers:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/review/R12BR45KM8YPZ7?ref_=glimp_time_1rv_cl
GavinUK86
Member
yes, 100%. the books are fantastic. the first is my favourite, they get a bit too militaristic and political as they go on but they're still great.
lol. she ate some pistachios though!
David Incorporated Esq.
Member
Just finished episode 3:
Do you like hard sci-fi (mostly) and kick-ass adventures with a rag-tag band of daring misfits? Then heck yeah. The books rule.
Mediocre review. Not great, not bad, just mediocre.
Book stuff, not a spoiler of any plot points, only discussing general world building as it relates to Earth, Mars and the Belt:
I'm really liking this show and its treatment of the source, but aw man, poor Havelock. :'(
Do you like hard sci-fi (mostly) and kick-ass adventures with a rag-tag band of daring misfits? Then heck yeah. The books rule.
Mediocre review. Not great, not bad, just mediocre.
Book stuff, not a spoiler of any plot points, only discussing general world building as it relates to Earth, Mars and the Belt:
Okay sarcasm aside. I think you're nitpicking waaaay too much on the world-building comments. This isn't Phillip K. Dick where he spends 90% of the story masturbating about details of some neat technology he thought of and oh shit there are supposed to be fucking characters fuck, fuck I forgot to put the characters in, it's an adventure book based in hard sci-fi. The things about the world that you think were left out are things the characters don't discuss because it would be like us spending time in normal, daily conversations discussing the introduction of microwave ovens and radios.
Here's an example, think about how we discuss satellites and probes zipping around the solar system now. We'll talk about their neat little ion drives and where they're going, what they're looking at, but does anyone ever really ask how they communicate back to Earth? No, because even now that's the sort of thing that's standard fare--it's fairly complicated but it's still based on technology that's relatable to every day equipment. Wondering how we can manage 3-10g of constant acceleration requires an explanation because it's completely outside the realm of technology we have, and explaining how belters can take that sort of acceleration requires some high-g drugs and the like. (Note: It's just regular old radio waves and laser-based communications, tight-beam comms come up all the time in the books, and there's no FTL comms)
The Belters having their own language and Mars not is an okay question, but if you think about it Earth is likely to develop a more standardized language over time and Mars being its child remaining in stable communication (culture sharing) would explain them being unified, while the belt having a mish-mosh of individuals with a more loosely defined government presence would leave them with more influences from different languages. Could the books talk about that some more? Yeah maybe, but I think it gets into Belter culture and its development ways better in its bread-crumb style.
Edit: In short, just because something is hard sci-fi doesn't mean it has to get into minutia of every day space-life, it just has to have its foundation in legitimate physics.
Here's an example, think about how we discuss satellites and probes zipping around the solar system now. We'll talk about their neat little ion drives and where they're going, what they're looking at, but does anyone ever really ask how they communicate back to Earth? No, because even now that's the sort of thing that's standard fare--it's fairly complicated but it's still based on technology that's relatable to every day equipment. Wondering how we can manage 3-10g of constant acceleration requires an explanation because it's completely outside the realm of technology we have, and explaining how belters can take that sort of acceleration requires some high-g drugs and the like. (Note: It's just regular old radio waves and laser-based communications, tight-beam comms come up all the time in the books, and there's no FTL comms)
The Belters having their own language and Mars not is an okay question, but if you think about it Earth is likely to develop a more standardized language over time and Mars being its child remaining in stable communication (culture sharing) would explain them being unified, while the belt having a mish-mosh of individuals with a more loosely defined government presence would leave them with more influences from different languages. Could the books talk about that some more? Yeah maybe, but I think it gets into Belter culture and its development ways better in its bread-crumb style.
Edit: In short, just because something is hard sci-fi doesn't mean it has to get into minutia of every day space-life, it just has to have its foundation in legitimate physics.
soulassssns
Banned
So far I am enjoying this show. Hope it lasts longer than 1 or 2 seasons though.
Thought the whole gravity torture thing was crazy though. I thought they were just hanging the guy in the first episode because that'd be rough regardless. I didn't know it was a twisted way of hurting someone even more when they weren't used to the full G of Earth. More polite, but still a shark. Her boss made it seem like it was akin to something like waterboarding, being banned.
Freeza Under The Shower
Member
The equivalent of that bullshit, yes. Some kind of focus drug (shown by extreme close-ups on the target, while regular on the interrogator), with the supposed intent of being able to 'tell' based on the same principles as a lie detector, as far as I can tell. Unfortunately the US puts the confession above every other means of providing proof, so that's where that obsession (and the B.S.) comes from. edit: interestingly the fourth episode downplays it into a 'are you hiding something' ability, not so much lie detection. Which is more reasonable in realistic terms.
what kind of space travel would feature loose worker equipment - a wrench of all things - during EVA? Modern NASA doesn't do that, yet two centuries from now they would have? It makes for a very silly 'oh no, lost my thing to space' shot, which is just awkward. Then there is how the military gets people out of cells: "you" (seriously, that was your best take or something?) and grabbing people, giving them the change to get your assault weapon. A military culture two centuries into the future making rookie mistakes that no trained soldier today makes?
And yes, it is definitely confusing to basically be dropped in the middle of B5 S3 and having to figure who is what and having to figure out (without any help from scene juxtaposition) how they relate. Only now, at the end of the third episode, is some kind picture starting to form, but that is -imo- really too far into the game. Oh well. Now it's more focused, I do enjoy the Thomas Jane bits (oh hey, it's
movie Moriarty
edit: And done with episode four. Haha,
that's one down. Two more to go. I like the Mars guy. Bus driver is growing on me too. Returning to details: the padding on the wall there was nice. Few sets here, but well hidden in the action, and finally we're moving somewhere with the combined plot.
dying guy returns / survived is not going to become a regular occurrence though.There is also only so much dynamite in the solar system to shove up characters' asses to blow them up on-screen resulting in final perma-death. It's a precious resource.
Eh, I really don't feel like getting into a discussion over the novel in the show thread. I will say I think you are missing a lot of my points as those were just a few examples of a larger problem which is just one of several other larger problems. Suffice to say a good story knows how to add exposition and general lore into a story without it feeling like an info dump. Mass Effect, even though it is a video game and not a novel, introduces its audience to its setting and lore brilliantly. Even if you never crack open the Codex or choose to really "Investigate" everything you need to understand the universe is given to you in a manner that doesn't feel like an info dump. But again, that is one complaint out of many I had with the novel. The show looks as though it seeks to rectify many of these mistakes.
Ingueferroque
Banned
Thomas Jane looks great in this.