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[ANDY_098]

The Mercedes engine did not turn the 09 Brawn into a winner, it merely helped it. The Brawn was already class of the field without the Mercedes engine. Likewise with Force India, their partnership with McLaren has aided them greatly, along with natural team progression.

You don't get anywhere quickly without taking risks. Ferrari played it safe over the winter building a reliable car, and look where they are now. Honda have had more than enough time to get their act together and produce a good engine, they have no need to 'prove themselves again' because the precedent is already there.

McLaren aren't yet in a position to build their own engines. They've already built a top-class standard car engine, but building an F1 engine is a whole different ball game, especially with the exhaust rules changing every other race at this point. Staying with Mercedes just wont let them be competitive enough in the constructors. They've had their exclusive partnership thing with Mercedes for many years now, and effectively, were the Mercedes representative in F1. Now that Mercedes has their own team, and are more concerned over their own efforts rather than that of McLaren, McLaren need to find an engine supplier (whether it be their own, or a third party) that will provide them with the advantages they need.



There's a red/white Malboro skin for the Williams F1 car in iRacing, and it doesn't look anywhere near as good as on the 80's & 90's cars.

There will be very little risk involved if MRL ever move engine suppliers. They wouldn't sign up for an engine deal anywhere else until the new supplier has extensively tested an engine on a dyno and will simply stay with MBHPE if the new engine is not as good.

McLaren's engine deal also includes KERS and they have a technical partnership until at least 2015 which involves a lot of dedicated testing work which I doubt they would get elsewhere.

If McLaren ever decide to build their own engine then they have a lot of work to do. Never mind the technical knowledge and personnel, at a very basic level, I doubt they have the space in their current building to house the whole infrastructure required for it.

 

[navanman]

I've been looking for one too, at a reasonable price. I'm only interested in canvas though, I found a store through Amazon that do good sizes & quality for reasonable prices. Tempted to buy this one at the moment, but I'm looking around for an actual F1 canvas.

Hmm, that is very nice. Love the Rossi yellow highlights.

 

[ANDY_098]

As far as Mclaren building their own engines, I'm pretty sure thats the route they're most interested in at the moment. New engine rules aren't expected to come into play til 2014, which gives them plenty of time.

There is no way they will be building their own engine for 2014, there is no where near enough time to design and then develop an engine in 2 years. As I said to Ark, I doubt they even have the infrastructure in place for manufacturing or testing an engine.

Its not a huge risk to switch to Honda in 2014.

Totally new engines starting that year, a whole new design philosophy means the order of the grid could be greatly changed.
Hi-pressure turbo and limited fuel supply means the engine builder with best power to fuel ratio would be the new leader.

If Honda haven't already started on the V6 for 2014 then they are already at a disadvantage to other teams I'd imagine.

 

[ANDY_098]

I've been looking for one too, at a reasonable price. I'm only interested in canvas though, I found a store through Amazon that do good sizes & quality for reasonable prices. Tempted to buy this one at the moment, but I'm looking around for an actual F1 canvas.

The one you've linked is really, really awesome, but not for £74.

EDIT:

I think I'm going to order myself a new T-Shirt.

Check out http://www.sutton-images.com/ for prints. No idea how prices compare, but there is a massive selection to choose from.

 

[Xun]

There will be very little risk involved if MRL ever move engine suppliers. They wouldn't sign up for an engine deal anywhere else until the new supplier has extensively tested an engine on a dyno and will simply stay with MBHPE if the new engine is not as good.

McLaren's engine deal also includes KERS and they have a technical partnership until at least 2015 which involves a lot of dedicated testing work which I doubt they would get elsewhere.

If McLaren ever decide to build their own engine then they have a lot of work to do. Never mind the technical knowledge and personnel, at a very basic level, I doubt they have the space in their current building to house the whole infrastructure required for it.

Well they've just gotten bigger, although this is focused on their sports cars.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-surrey-15772873

 

[Wax Free Vanilla]

If Honda haven't already started on the V6 for 2014 then they are already at a disadvantage to other teams I'd imagine.

haven't honda been working on formula spec v6 turbo engines for years now? indy car teams will run their new 2.2 litre v6 turbo engine next year. i'm sure they could make a competitive/leader of the pack (f1 spec) turbo engine for mcLaren.

i hope this happens.

Now that we're nearly at the end of the season with one race left, intriguing to see what it would have looked like under 10-6-4-3-2-1:

Drivers' Championship
01 - 141 pts - Sebastian Vettel
02 - 79 pts - Jenson Button
03 - 70 pts - Fernando Alonso
04 - 68 pts - Lewis Hamilton
05 - 62 pts - Mark Webber
06 - 15 pts - Felipe Massa
07 - 12 pts - Michael Schumacher
08 - 8 pts - Nico Rosberg
09 - 6 pts - Vitaly Petrov
10 - 4 pts - Nick Heidfeld
11 - 2 pts - Kamui Kobayashi
12 - 1 pt - Paul di Resta
13 - 1 pt - Adrian Sutil

Constructors' Championship
01 - 203 pts - Red Bull
02 - 147 pts - McLaren
03 - 85 pts - Ferrari
04 - 20 pts - Mercedes
05 - 10 pts - Renault
06 - 2 pts - Sauber
07 - 2 pts - Force India

Massa, lol

 

[Myoclonic Jerk]

haven't honda been working on formula spec v6 turbo engines for years now? indy car teams will run their new 2.2 litre v6 turbo engine next year. i'm sure they could make a competitive/leader of the pack (f1 spec) turbo engine for mcLaren.

i hope this happens.





Massa, lol

Woow! I would like to know how Massa works out to this low!!!

 

[Myoclonic Jerk]

Massa's Season

GP	 Date	         Team Grid	Race Points   Total	
Austr	27 Mar 2011	Ferrari	8	7	6	6
Malays	10 Apr 2011	Ferrari	7	5	10	16
Chinese	17 Apr 2011	Ferrari	6	6	8	24
Turkish	08 May 2011	Ferrari	10	11	0	24
Spanish	22 May 2011	Ferrari	8	Ret	0	24
Monaco	29 May 2011	Ferrari	6	Ret	0	24
Canada	12 Jun 2011	Ferrari	3	6	8	32
Europe	26 Jun 2011	Ferrari	5	5	10	42
British	10 Jul 2011	Ferrari	4	5	10	52
German	24 Jul 2011	Ferrari	5	5	10	62
Hungary	31 Jul 2011	Ferrari	4	6	8	70
Belgian	28 Aug 2011	Ferrari	4	8	4	74
Italian	11 Sep 2011	Ferrari	6	6	8	82
Singap	25 Sep 2011	Ferrari	6	9	2	84
Japan	09 Oct 2011	Ferrari	4	7	6	90
Korea	16 Oct 2011	Ferrari	5	6	8	98
Indian	30 Oct 2011	Ferrari	6	Ret	0	98
Dhabi	13 Nov 2011	Ferrari	6	5	10	108

Ok if we take these positions and the old points system I'm almost certain it would workout to more than 15

EDIT:

Old points system 10, 8, 6, 5, 4, 3, 2, 1

His positions are 7,5,6,6,5,5,5,6,8,6,7,6,5
Points earned: 2,4,3,3,4,4,4,3,1,3,2,3,4 - Total = 37

 

[Chris R]

Massa's Season

GP	 Date	         Team Grid	Race Points   Total	
Austr	27 Mar 2011	Ferrari	8	7	6	6
Malays	10 Apr 2011	Ferrari	7	5	10	16
Chinese	17 Apr 2011	Ferrari	6	6	8	24
Turkish	08 May 2011	Ferrari	10	11	0	24
Spanish	22 May 2011	Ferrari	8	Ret	0	24
Monaco	29 May 2011	Ferrari	6	Ret	0	24
Canada	12 Jun 2011	Ferrari	3	6	8	32
Europe	26 Jun 2011	Ferrari	5	5	10	42
British	10 Jul 2011	Ferrari	4	5	10	52
German	24 Jul 2011	Ferrari	5	5	10	62
Hungary	31 Jul 2011	Ferrari	4	6	8	70
Belgian	28 Aug 2011	Ferrari	4	8	4	74
Italian	11 Sep 2011	Ferrari	6	6	8	82
Singap	25 Sep 2011	Ferrari	6	9	2	84
Japan	09 Oct 2011	Ferrari	4	7	6	90
Korea	16 Oct 2011	Ferrari	5	6	8	98
Indian	30 Oct 2011	Ferrari	6	Ret	0	98
Dhabi	13 Nov 2011	Ferrari	6	5	10	108

Ok if we take these positions and the old points system I'm almost certain it would workout to more than 15

The 15 points was using the OLD (1991-2002) system of 10-6-4-3-2-1. Massa has 15 points under that system. Under the 2003-2009 system he would have more points, because it was 10-8-6-5-4-3-2-1.

 

[Myoclonic Jerk]

The 15 points was using the OLD (1991-2002) system of 10-6-4-3-2-1. Massa has 15 points under that system. Under the 2003-2009 system he would have more points, because it was 10-8-6-5-4-3-2-1.

oh sorry.. I thought the one before the current system..

 

[DrM]

I think that these Honda - Mclaren rumors are more connected to Mclarens next roadcar, codenamed P12

Ron Dennis said at the grand opening of new part of MTC that they already have over 2000 orders for MP4-12C

Pics of the new Mclaren Production Centre
Video of MPC

And they are expanding even further, with huge Mclaren Applied Technology Centre across the road.

 

[Myoclonic Jerk]

I think that these Honda - Mclaren rumors are more connected to Mclarens next roadcar, codenamed P12

Ron Dennis said at the grand opening of new part of MTC that they already have over 2000 orders for MP4-12C

Pics of the new Mclaren Production Centre
Video of MPC

And they are expanding even further, with huge Mclaren Applied Technology Centre across the road.

that video is fantastic..

I love McLaren, They've always been my favorite team..

 

[Xun]

I think that these Honda - Mclaren rumors are more connected to Mclarens next roadcar, codenamed P12

Ron Dennis said at the grand opening of new part of MTC that they already have over 2000 orders for MP4-12C

Pics of the new Mclaren Production Centre
Video of MPC

And they are expanding even further, with huge Mclaren Applied Technology Centre across the road.

There's also talk of a P13 as well.

The P12 is meant to be a hypercar, whereas the P13 is meant to be the low-end model.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McLaren_Automotive#Upcoming_models

Also remember to tune into BBC Two at 8pm this evening!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b017t722

 

[Omiee]

I think that these Honda - Mclaren rumors are more connected to Mclarens next roadcar, codenamed P12

Ron Dennis said at the grand opening of new part of MTC that they already have over 2000 orders for MP4-12C

Pics of the new Mclaren Production Centre
Video of MPC

And they are expanding even further, with huge Mclaren Applied Technology Centre across the road.

man that factory looks good.

 

[Wax Free Vanilla]

I think that these Honda - Mclaren rumors are more connected to Mclarens next roadcar, codenamed P12

McLaren:

P12's engine, and transmission, will be built in house.

http://forums.autosport.com/index.php?showtopic=157462&view=findpost&p=5407302


McLaren and Honda back together in F1

 

[Xun]

McLaren:


http://forums.autosport.com/index.php?showtopic=157462&view=findpost&p=5407302


McLaren and Honda back together in F1

That's what I assumed would happen.

The MP4-12C is using their own engine.

 

[Xun]

Also remember to tune into BBC Two at 8pm this evening!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b017t722

Anyone manage to watch it? It was a good insight.

 

[S. L.]

Anyone manage to watch it? It was a good insight.

watched half of it before i fell asleep
many parts felt like a "hey look at our purdy factory" promo documentary, but it was alright for what it was i guess.

 

[Myoclonic Jerk]

Things have been quiet for few days..

Except for this stupid rumor about Hamilton to Ferrari on a stupid website

 

[Adamm]

Things have been quiet for few days..

Except for this stupid rumor about Hamilton to Ferrari on a stupid website

Yeah i read this story.

Basically it says, Hamilton is unhappy this season & Massa is rubbish this season. so...Hamilton is going to Ferrari.

Flawless logic!

 

[Myoclonic Jerk]

Yeah i read this story.

Basically it says, Hamilton is unhappy this season & Massa is rubbish this season. so...Hamilton is going to Ferrari.

Flawless logic!

lol.. every fuckin year, last year it was Redbull, the year before BrawnGP


Anyway, this is for Webber's fans - http://en.espnf1.com/redbull/motorsport/story/64863.html

Vergne says he "would do no worse than Webber" if he was given a seat

 

[olore]

This has been lying on my desk at work for a few days demanding to get glued together. I`ll get to it... eventually.

 

[Psychotext]

Is it wrong that I thought that was some sort of jock strap?

 

[S. L.]

Anyway, this is for Webber's fans - http://en.espnf1.com/redbull/motorsport/story/64863.html

Vergne says he "would do no worse than Webber" if he was given a seat

Vergne sure has low standards

 

[brotkasten]

Things have been quiet for few days..

Except for this stupid rumor about Hamilton to Ferrari on a stupid website

Drivers in the top 3 teams won't change for 2012. It will be Massa's and Webber's last chance, though.

 

[olore]

Is it wrong that I thought that was some sort of jock strap?

A brazilian one

 

[Psychotext]

Vergne sure has low standards

Ice cold.

 

[DrM]

Rubens still thinks, that Williams will not replace him.

I think that we will see tears this weekend. River of tears.

 

[Psychotext]

I hope he gets a reasonable result. Home GP and all.

 

[Adamm]

Martin Brundell tweeted that Pedro de las rosa will drive for HRT for the next 2 years!
...why?

 

[S. L.]

Martin Brundell tweeted that Pedro de las rosa will drive for HRT for the next 2 years!
...why?

Spanish driver for Spanish team? Dunno

 

[Adamm]

Spanish driver for Spanish team? Dunno

I justt cant see why he would want to go to HRT. He will spend 2 years struggling to get inside the 107% & is unlikley to bring any serious sponsorship money to the team.

Who benifits out of this? Surely there are some new up & coming drivers that would bring sponsorship money and have something to gain by getting thier foot the F1 door.

 

[S. L.]

I justt cant see why he would want to go to HRT. He will spend 2 years struggling to get inside the 107% & is unlikley to bring any serious sponsorship money to the team.

Who benifits out of this? Surely there are some new up & coming drivers that would bring sponsorship money and have something to gain by getting thier foot the F1 door.

he has loads of development experience from McL, so he is a good choice from HRT if they have some ambition in not being back-markers forever. (falls in line with the long term contract)

and being a spanish driver for a spanish team probably meant it was easier to get some sponsors.

 

[Adamm]

he has loads of development experience from McL, so he is a good choice from HRT if they have some ambition in not being back-markers forever. (falls in line with the long term contract)

and being a spanish driver for a spanish team probably meant it was easier to get some sponsors.

Didnt Sauber drop him in 2010 because he wasnt as good with development as they would have hoped?

 

[Psychotext]

Didnt Sauber drop him in 2010 because he wasnt as good with development as they would have hoped?

Only so much you can polish a turd.

 

[Ark]

Who benifits out of this? Surely there are some new up & coming drivers that would bring sponsorship money and have something to gain by getting thier foot the F1 door.

The man gets to drive a Formula 1 car for two years in a Spanish team as a Spanish driver and he has a tonne of experience from McLaren, why not? Sure beats being a reserve driver for McLaren.

 

[AcridMeat]

Only so much you can polish a turd.

Mythbusters taught me you can polish a turd pretty well...

 

[navanman]

Polish media reporting that Kubica will begin testing of Formula Renault 2 & 3.5 cars in January/February next year.

http://f1.autoklub.pl/news/w-styczniu-testy-formula-renault,39597

 

[brotkasten]

Polish media reporting that Kubica will begin testing of Formula Renault 2 & 3.5 cars in January/February next year.

http://f1.autoklub.pl/news/w-styczniu-testy-formula-renault,39597

Sounds too late for 2012.

 

[DrM]

Sounds too late for 2012.

Indeed, I think that he is lost for 2012

 

[SunhiLegend]

Sounds too late for 2012.

I hope he gets the Ferrari seat when they get rid of Massa in 2013. Hopefully Kubica's done some serious testing in a formula 1 car by then.

 

[operon]

I hope he gets the Ferrari seat when they get rid of Massa in 2013. Hopefully Kubica's done some serious testing in a formula 1 car by then.

Massa will keep his seat warm for him

 

[Chris R]

Just saw Senna last night, really a great film. Sucks about some of the video quality, but what can you do really. Also, I don't understand why the onboard lap at Donnington wasn't included, but whatever. Shame I had to wait so long to watch the movie in a theater, but at least the single showing here in my town was mostly sold out (maybe 10 open seats). Pretty cool to be there with other fans, and with people who didn't know about Ayrton before the film.

 

[navanman]

Massa will keep his seat warm for him

Yep. Sounds like he has cooled on the idea of rejoining Renault and is virtually certain of the Ferrari seat if he can prove his fitness and skill levels next year.

 

[operon]

Yep. Sounds like he has cooled on the idea of rejoining Renault and is virtually certain of the Ferrari seat if he can prove his fitness and skill levels next year.

Would love to see him fit and in a top car

 

[Ark]

To be honest, Kubica probably dodged a bullet by not driving the Renault this year, it wouldn't have done his career any good except for a maybe win in Melbourne or Malaysia.

 

[Wax Free Vanilla]

Sky Sports, who are expected to announce their F1 line-up for next year’s coverage after the Brazilian Grand Prix, have former world champion Nigel Mansell in their sights as lead pundit.

Martin Brundle and David Croft will commentate, with Ted Kravitz the paddock reporter after his BBC colleague Lee McKenzie opted to stay put. Sky rugby presenter Simon Lazenby is expected to host the programme, while Steve Rider is line to do a series of legends interviews.

.


Legard and DC for commentary anyone?

 

[Seanspeed]

Just saw Senna last night, really a great film. Sucks about some of the video quality, but what can you do really. Also, I don't understand why the onboard lap at Donnington wasn't included, but whatever. Shame I had to wait so long to watch the movie in a theater, but at least the single showing here in my town was mostly sold out (maybe 10 open seats). Pretty cool to be there with other fans, and with people who didn't know about Ayrton before the film.

I thought the movie was terrible. Horribly one-sided if you're not a Senna fanboy. Prost deserved to be respected, not made to look like some arch-villain, which he wasn't at all.

To be honest, Kubica probably dodged a bullet by not driving the Renault this year, it wouldn't have done his career any good except for a maybe win in Melbourne or Malaysia.

It doesn't matter how competitive the car was. So long as he thrashed his teammate, he would have come out looking good. A win would be icing on the cake and would have done his reputation plenty of good. His win in the BMW/Sauber at Montreal 08 was already something special; a win in this year's Renault would have been even better.

I desperately hope the guy comes back in top-form. Anything else would be an absolute travesty. He was destined for greatness, and if he doesn't get to acheive that, it'll be one of the great sob-stories of F1.

 

[AcridMeat]

To be honest, Kubica probably dodged a bullet by not driving the Renault this year, it wouldn't have done his career any good except for a maybe win in Melbourne or Malaysia.

You're right, he's in a much better state instead.

 

[Foliorum Viridum]

Hahaha.

A life threatening crash is "dodging the bullet". Jesus fucking Christ.