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The GAF POP |OT| of Diversity, Hidden Talent, and Stan Wars

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S

SecretMoblin

Member
Delio said:
Sis you know it's never happening. Not while Selena Godmez is around ;)
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Crumpet Trumpet said:
Selena Gomez Taking A Break From Music
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M

Mumei

Member
Cynosure said:
and you wonder why I didn't try with you.

discrediting Christina's place in the royal vocal kingdom is very like of you pressed lambs; stale, weak and just so tired.
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And true! You forgot to mention true. Christina could not sing the way Mariah could in her prime. And that's not even meant to be shade; simply a statement of fact. Christina struggled to hit her higher belted notes live, and while Mariah sang most of her most challenging songs a half step down, that half step down was still notably higher than Christina was singing anything. Mariah had a more challenging repertoire and she pulled it off with more technical aplomb.

I don't even think Christina's bad in the grand scheme of the pop universe, though; I think she's more upper-middle tier. Better than the "Get-by-on-catchy-melodies-alone" people (Looking at you, Rihanna, JLo, Katy Perry, et al.), not as good technically as singers like Kelly or Beyonce or Leona or Celine, and not nearly as good as once-in-a-generation talents like Whitney or Mariah. It's sort of difficult because there's an intersection between talent, which Christina has a lot of, and discipline and technical ability, which is Christina's failing.

I was talking to royalan about this last night, and I mentioned that I thought that Christina's biggest problem was that of lack of discipline. She has mentioned in interviews that she didn't have any formal training coming into stardom; she learned by listening to the radio and copying her favorites. The problem is that she simply didn't know all of the complicated and frankly counterintuitive things one needs to be doing in order to sing like that (posture, breath support, singing from the diaphragm and not forcing power from your throat, keeping a neutral larynx, etc.). She was relying upon her intuition to do things that, say, Mariah and Whitney had been taught how to do correctly through vocal coaching (either professionally in Whitney's case, or by her mother, in Mariah's case). She was able to get by on that, more or less, because she's got a pretty big voice naturally and even using her instrument incorrectly, she could still do some very impressive things with it. But it seems as though in some cases she simply never took the time to learn the proper way to do things, or in others she knows about them (and you can hear her talk about them as a judge / coach on The Voice), but she does not follow them in her own live performances; in either case, it reflects a lack of discipline.

And I think that she could have been on the same tier as Beyonce, Kelly, etc. in terms of combining sheer natural talent with technically accomplished singing, but for that lack of discipline.

Cynosure said:
Mumei, I'm curious, tell me what you think of Christina's Man's World performance

Zw7Nk.gif
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I really enjoyed it the first time I heard it, both vocally and as a performance. As I've been learning more about vocals, though, now I notice the problems vocally that I didn't before because I didn't know about those things. In particular, as I listened to her more, I realized that things that she did that I thought were stylistic choices on her part vocally were actually things that she was doing incorrectly that were damaging her voice. I still honestly rather enjoy it as performance, but I've never denied that she has good stage presence.

So now the performance doesn't do much for me vocally. I still like most of her performance of Hurt where she was wearing the red dress, though. I generally like her modal voice in this range, and I like her head voice through around middle of the sixth octave.

I don't actually think she has a bad voice, in any case.
 
M

Mumei

Member
Cynosure said:
I was hoping you would be the kind of bitchy stan you were yesterday, not back to your diplomatic ways with the perfect mix of shade, backhand compliments and compliments.

I had a delish reply set up...
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Really?

Well pretend I was bitchy; I want to see it. Though I don't think I was really being all that different tonight and last night. I thought I was still being just as frank in the last post; I just included the fact that she has natural talent (but makes poor use of it) in this post, something I've already said to you in the past. So I think it's pretty much par for the course for my Christina commentary.

Also: Why, thank you. *curtsy*

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1lol.gif
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... I don't get your pictographic writing here. Can you translate?

I mean I get the shade part, but not what about what I said that was being shaded.
 
M

Mumei

Member
Crumpet Trumpet said:
Kelly Clarkson covers P!nk's Perfect


Not bad at all. I would have preferred her inevitable P!nk cover to be Who Knew or something from M!zzundastood, but I'll take it.

P.S. I found the songwriter's demo for What Doesn't Kill You. It's hilarribad. All the little lyrical changes Kelly made were definitely for the best (and she did it without taking credit...Beyonce could never be so diplomatic.)
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I like the Pink cover. Not one of my most favorite Kelly performances or anything, but still.
 
C

Cynosure

Member
Mumei said:
... I don't get your pictographic writing here. Can you translate?

I mean I get the shade part, but not what about what I said that was being shaded.
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j4IE2.gif



You're smart in a lot of ways, and kinda slow in some



that pictograph writing is what would have been my reply if you had answered with the same attitude and stan bias you were giving last night.

and yes, unintentional or not, there is a difference. You're still saying the same thing more or less, but with a much more courteous delivery.




Delio said:
Speaking of Man's World. Katherine Mcphee did a cover of it on Smash this week.

http://youtu.be/QlGN7R_LPdQ
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wow, that was pretty good. No nearly as good as Christina's
wqWw8.gif
, but I really liked it.

I don't watch the show, even though I want to. I'm avoiding it because I'm pretty sure NBC would cancel it if ratings don't pick up.
I hate getting invested into shows only for it to be canceled too soon. I don't want to have to go through another Community anxiety :(
 
M

Mumei

Member
Cynosure said:
j4IE2.gif


You're smart in a lot of ways, and kinda slow in some

that pictograph writing is what would have been my reply if you had answered with the same attitude and stan bias you were giving last night.

and yes, unintentional or not, there is a difference. You're still the same thing more or less, but with a much more courteous delivery.
Click to expand...

Well, it's just that the gif you used to stand in for my post didn't really work, so I wasn't sure what it all meant since you misread my reaction last night. It was almost as if you were reacting to what you wanted me to have said; now I see that you were.

Also, I've been wondering: Who are your other faves besides Christina?
 
R

royalan

Member
Koodo said:
Trash for adults is still trash.

ifjXHtOg5BCJ0.gif
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Truth. I love Smash for the musical performances alone, but that is the ONLY area in which it is competent at this point. Which is a shame, because there's some seriously TOP NOTCH talent on that show that's being absolutely wasted.

Megan Hilty OBLITERATES anything Glee ever did in this ONE performance. She's winning something for this come award season...

Cynosure was banned? :(
Sure, his stanning was a little neurotic at times (ok. most of the time), but it did my poor heart good to see somebody throw shade in defense of Queen Xtina. :(
 
R

royalan

Member
Cosmic Bus said:
Huh, I had no idea that Smash was set in anything but the current era. Oddly, I'm not sure if that's a success or failure on the part of NBC's advertising.
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It is set in the current era. But since the show is about them crafting a musical, sometimes the musical numbers will switch over to a fantasy theater "this is what it'll look like in the show" scene. It actually works really well.
 
M

Mumei

Member
I just remembered that a few days ago was the anniversary of one of my favorites passing away; Dusty Springfield died of breast cancer March 2, 1999 at the age of 59. :(

She was great; she had such a strong, beautiful voice and a good variety of songs (and in addition to her own songs, she did quite a few covers of Motown hits (and folk songs, for that matter) and was instrumental in the introduction of Motown artists to the UK by covering their songs and then creating / hosting a television special program introducing Motown singers), which there are plenty of live covers of from her hit television show, though she's probably best known for ballads / torch songs. And for POP-GAF credibility:

By 1966, she was the best-selling female singer in the world, and topped a number of popularity polls, including Melody Maker's Best International Vocalist.[5] She was the first British singer to top the New Musical Express readers' poll for Female Singer.[6] Her image, supported by a peroxide blonde beehive hairstyle, evening gowns, and heavy make-up, made her an icon of the Swinging Sixties.[4]

The marked changes in pop music in the mid-1960s left many female pop singers out of fashion. To boost her credibility as a soul artist, Springfield went to Memphis, Tennessee, to record an album of pop and soul music with the Atlantic Records main production team. Released in 1969, Dusty in Memphis has been ranked among the greatest albums of all time by Rolling Stone and VH1 artists, New Musical Express readers, and the Channel 4 viewers polls.[7] The album was also awarded a spot in the Grammy Hall of Fame.
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And naturally she was a camp icon who had several romantic relationships with women in the 70s and 80s. She struggled with alcoholism and drug addiction during that period as well, but she managed to kick the habit.

Some favorites:

Born This Way
You Don't Own Me
If Only Want To Be With You
Anyone Who Had A Heart
You Don't Have to Say You Love Me
Wishin' and Hopin'
Someone to Watch Over Me
Nothing Has Been Proved
What's It Gonna Be
Poor Wayfaring Stranger
I Just Don't Know What To Do With Myself
Can I Get A Witness
The Windmills of Your Mind
The Water is Wide
Goin' Back (definitive version of this song. Sorry, Freddie.)
Heat Wave
Think It's Going To Rain Today
My Lagan Love
Everybody Needs Somebody to Love
Son Of A Preacher Man
 
C

Crumpet Trumpet

Banned
C

Crumpet Trumpet

Banned
Fiona Apple's new album is called The Idler Wheel is Wiser than the Driver of the Screw, and Whipping Cords will Serve You More than Ropes will Ever Do.
 The album is slated for a June release through Epic. Next week Apple is set to appear at SXSW and will begin her U.S tour.




It's not quite

When the pawn hits the conflicts he thinks like a king
What he knows throws the blows when he goes to the fight
And he'll win the whole thing 'fore he enters the ring
There's no body to batter when your mind is your might
So when you go solo, you hold your own hand
And remember that depth is the greatest of heights
And if you know where you stand, then you know where to land
And if you fall it won't matter, cause you'll know that you're right


but I'm excited!
 
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