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[WasabiKing]

All these cracks about Karl Malone have inspired me to go after the true cancer on the team, someone who has clearly lost 5 steps to his game, and will be the reason why the Lakers will not win next year, no matter who comes back.

GRAY Payton has pretty much manufactured a story that he grew up in the streets and lived in the toughest neighborhoods in Oakland when it is a bold faced lie. For starters, he may have played ball in the toughest neighborhoods around (Mosswood Park, also featured in NBA Street Vol. 2) but he went to my alma mater, Skyline High in Oakland. Skyline is a public school, and in order for you to attend, you must live within a certain mile radius of the school in order to attend one. If you're out of the area, you cannot go to that school. There are some bad neighborhoods that Skyline does serve, but nowhere close to the worst part of town, which is West Oakland.

And if you're supposedly from the streets, how stupid do you have to be that in your second year of playing ball, you return to Oakland wearing your gold jewelry (now known by the kids as 'bling') and flashin' it to everyone in the old neighborhood. Does it not shock you that he got robbed at gunpoint?

The guy's a big time gravy trainer, just coming in to win a ring. He said that he would do whatever he took to get that ring. Apparently LEARNING THE TRIANGLE OFFENSE is not one of those things. You had all year long, Gary, to adapt to a differnt, and proven, offensive strategy, but your reluctance cost the team their change at their 4th ring in 5 years. True to form, selfish as ever, and you got what you deserved, NO RING.

Obviously losing a step, "the Match" (named by a local radio host cause he was getting lit up by EVERYONE) resorted to fighting because he could not keep up with Speedy Claxton of the lowly Warriors. SPEEDY CLAXTON.

And now we come to the Finals. Just check out his excellent performance:

32% FG, 4.2 Points, 3 Rebounds, 4.4 Assists

Yeah, that's Hall of Fame Quality right there! That's the winning spirit!

And now, the travesty for the Lakers. Granted GRAY Payton does have the option to leave the Lakers in 2004-05, but he's not going to do it. He has $5.4 million coming to him next year! And it's not like anyone will want to pick him up after the headaches he's caused to the Lakers (and not the opposing team like you're supposed to, GRAY). This fiasco has just made his stock plummet to basement. I don't care who they bring in next year as coach, he's not going to be able to perform cause he's too old, and he'll likely try to get in everyone's face until Shaq lays the hammer down on the side of his head...

Wave goodbye to that ring, GRAY, you're never going to wear it, ever

 

[Bowser]

[Gary Payton with Trademark sneer]Aw come on, das harsh[/Gary]

 

[DMczaf]

Hahaha

Gary Payton, the original WANKSTA

 

[levious]

I still say the blame shouldn't be on the players but on the GM. They had Phil Jackson, whom they knew was adamant about what sort of system he would run... you don't take veteran stars and force them to fit into a system, you do that with role players. Management should have acquired talent more appropiate for this or done something about Jackson. You put this group with someone like Don Nelson, who has shown the ability over his career to adapt to his players, and the results are very different, and the Payton/Malone hate much less.

Not saying they would have had the title in the bag, just that Payton and Malone would not have looked like chumps most of the season. I mean, the two of them are a couple of the greatest Pick and Roll executers in the league... and you could probably count in your head the number of those plays called for them in the entire playoffs.

 

[bjork]

What's your name?

Gary Payton, but the call me the Glove.

Are you feeling the [word I can't remember]

Yo, I'm feeling the love.

 

[Ristamar]

What's your name?

Gary Payton, but the call me the Glove.

Are you feeling the [word I can't remember]

Yo, I'm feeling the love.

Hah, I remember that ad and often think of it when Payton's name is brought up. I believe the line was "How you feelin' tonight?"

 

[dskillzhtown]

Gary Payton played for the Lakers?

Not in my world. GP will always be rememebred in my mind as a Seattle Supersonic. The 1-2 punch of GP and Shawn Kemp.

Let me take you back to 2001:

The Lakers, especially O'Neal and Bryant, were frustrated in losing to Seattle again.
"It's happened because the Sonics are an excellent defensive team," Bryant said. "And it all starts with Gary."
Said O'Neal: "They've just had more fire and intensity than we have. Gary's always been a great player. He gets all his guys involved."

Gary Payton making the Rockets getting Barkley a moot point. After we got the large mound of talk, we turned into Seattle's bitch.

NBA Superstars like Jamal Crawford look up to GP: "Gary tells me to keep my head up and to keep working hard and that my time will come. I look at Gary like a big brother and I can talk to him whenever there is a situation that I am having a problem with. "

Who can forget the magical Utah-Seattle 2000 playoff series where in game 2 GP abused Stockton for 20 points?

Lastly, who can forget the defensive whooping GP put on the Pacers in 2002? GP scored 27 points on that glorious night. And these words of wisdom from GP himself: "We rebounded well, we played good defense. We made them do the things we wanted them to do, not what they wanted to do," Payton said. "It worked out to our advantage."



GP will always be "The Glove"

 

[Incognito]

All these cracks about Karl Malone have inspired me to go after the true cancer on the team, someone who has clearly lost 5 steps to his game, and will be the reason why the Lakers will not win next year, no matter who comes back.

GRAY Payton has pretty much manufactured a story that he grew up in the streets and lived in the toughest neighborhoods in Oakland when it is a bold faced lie. For starters, he may have played ball in the toughest neighborhoods around (Mosswood Park, also featured in NBA Street Vol. 2) but he went to my alma mater, Skyline High in Oakland. Skyline is a public school, and in order for you to attend, you must live within a certain mile radius of the school in order to attend one. If you're out of the area, you cannot go to that school. There are some bad neighborhoods that Skyline does serve, but nowhere close to the worst part of town, which is West Oakland.

And if you're supposedly from the streets, how stupid do you have to be that in your second year of playing ball, you return to Oakland wearing your gold jewelry (now known by the kids as 'bling') and flashin' it to everyone in the old neighborhood. Does it not shock you that he got robbed at gunpoint?

The guy's a big time gravy trainer, just coming in to win a ring. He said that he would do whatever he took to get that ring. Apparently LEARNING THE TRIANGLE OFFENSE is not one of those things. You had all year long, Gary, to adapt to a differnt, and proven, offensive strategy, but your reluctance cost the team their change at their 4th ring in 5 years. True to form, selfish as ever, and you got what you deserved, NO RING.

Obviously losing a step, "the Match" (named by a local radio host cause he was getting lit up by EVERYONE) resorted to fighting because he could not keep up with Speedy Claxton of the lowly Warriors. SPEEDY CLAXTON.

And now we come to the Finals. Just check out his excellent performance:

32% FG, 4.2 Points, 3 Rebounds, 4.4 Assists

Yeah, that's Hall of Fame Quality right there! That's the winning spirit!

And now, the travesty for the Lakers. Granted GRAY Payton does have the option to leave the Lakers in 2004-05, but he's not going to do it. He has $5.4 million coming to him next year! And it's not like anyone will want to pick him up after the headaches he's caused to the Lakers (and not the opposing team like you're supposed to, GRAY). This fiasco has just made his stock plummet to basement. I don't care who they bring in next year as coach, he's not going to be able to perform cause he's too old, and he'll likely try to get in everyone's face until Shaq lays the hammer down on the side of his head...

Wave goodbye to that ring, GRAY, you're never going to wear it, ever

What an idiot. First of all, Gary's never been about the money, most recently evident by his salary in LA. In Seattle he wanted to defer most of his contract so they could sign more capable players. Of course, you wouldn't know that. What you know about Payton doesn't extend beyond these past playoffs, thus your analysis of him, (if that's what we can call it) is moot and not funny.

This is a man who played with a BROKEN FOOT in the playoffs. A man who's been on numerous first team all NBA teams and first team all defensive teams. A man who's had to play with two obese alcoholics masquerading as imposing PF's. A man who had management run HIS team into the ground. He's had to deal with a bevy of uncordinated, slow, bigmen.

Yes, let's defame a future Hall of Famer over an admittely shitty playoff showing. But, Wasabi, I guess it didn't hit you that GP after being the focal point for so many years became involved in a system(triangle) that often takes years to truly excel at, yet he was expected to pick it up and learn it in three weeks?. When Malone and Kobe were out, who led them besides Shaq? You do understand the process of growing old, right? You lose some steps and some moves, but you don't lose the heart to compete and perform for your teammates. To say he's only concerned about the money is offensive and stupid.

And guess what, Wasabi? You know who Jason Kidd's mentor is? The guy that TAUGHT him everything he knows?

Gary Payton.

 

[dskillzhtown]

.....

 

[dskillzhtown]

GP was a shadow of his former greatness this entire season. While I loved "The Glove", a huge part of GP's problem in the playoffs was his attitude. He wasn't the only one with an attitude problem in LA this season though.

 

[Incognito]

GP was a shadow of his former greatness this entire season.

Agreed. I think that had to do with the incredible players surrounding him and the learning of a new system more than him actually 'sucking'..

 

[neptunes]

 

[dskillzhtown]

Agreed. I think that had to do with the incredible players surrounding him and the learning of a new system more than him actually 'sucking'..

Trust me, I have followed GP's career from Seattle, to Milwaukee, to LA, with home and away jerseys for all teams, but GP sulking on the bench was a problem. Learning the triangle has nothing to do with letting guys blow past you. Or with him being left wide open and throwing up bricks. I get the feeling that alot was going on in that locker room that GP didn't want to be a part of.

Like he said early in the season, "I didn't come here for this shit!"

 

[bionic77]

Why the hell do you people need to blame someone for the Lakers getting their asses handed to them? When you lose sometimes the other team is just better and it isn't your fault. The Lakers had some bad breaks and that isn't Gary's fault. Granted I hated his attitude during the season, but then again he was getting most of the blame when things went wrong and none of the accolades when they won.

Let it be people, Lakers had no PF and the better team won. Hell, Pistons might have still won even if Karl was healthy, they have like 6 big men to throw at Shaq and Karl, so you never know.

 

[Bowser]

While I do agree that GP shouldn't have to shoulder the blame for the Lakers loss, it doesn't help when you're outscored something like 105-21 in the Finals :/

 

[WasabiKing]

Ah, finally, THE Seattle Supersonic fan replies.

First off, Jason Kidd did not learn EVERYTHING from Jason Kidd. Jason Kidd was playing pickup games with GP, and even GP has said that all he did was help him toughen up his game. Kidd's finesse part of his game was learned from his coaches in high school at St. Joseph's of Notre Dame in Alameda. I was fortunate enough to see him play pickup games at Mosswood and two prep games. He used to be a pure scorer, but when he finished high school, he was a much more complete player. He was throwing passes that people weren't ready for, so I can't really put the turnovers on him.

Kidd's game increased when he played in the Pac-10 at Cal and just devastated players with quickness and drive. The Pac-10 wasn't loaded, but Kidd was taking Arizona to school, with help from Lamond Murray. Payton wasn't on the coaching staff, was he? No, cause when Jason Kidd helped upset Duke in the NCAA Championship, GP was already playing in his 4th year at Seattle.

As an all-star player and eventual hall of famer, you would be expected to roll with the triangle. You are going to play 82 games in the offensive scheme. He's pretty smart, unless that's all been a scam the last 15 years, right? If you know you're not getting it, why don't you practice, get the feeling behind it. After all, you are the POINT GUARD in the system. You can't possibly defend this. But if you truly believe this, then Derek Fisher is a better point guard than GP in this system. After all, Derek Fisher seemed to pick up the system fairly well his first year.

And what heart? Yeah, it really showed after looking at that STELLAR performance during the finals. He's a big time, prime time player now. Nothing says heart like 4.4 assists per game. Says "I'm valuable to the team" like scoring those valuable 4.2 points per game. I know you're stuck in the nostalgia of Payton and the Sonics, but he is not the same player, and he's now become an empty shell of what he used to be.

 

[Bat]

Why not totally criticize him? Lets see....he got totally owned by every single point guard in the playoffs. It was even a big story when Derrick freaking Martin was not torching him in game 3 of the Wolves series. And it wasn't even the Lakers pick and roll defense was at fault as the Pistons ran barely any involving Shaq and Billups still outscored Gary 105-21. Offensively, he was dreadful, making as many good decesions as bad ones. He could not hit any wide open shots, which cost him any playing time in the 4th quarters. And it's not like you can blame all this on adapting to the triangle as the Lakers didnt even use it most of the time. This was a case of a guy not being able to adapt to not having every single play being an iso. for him. He knew he wouldn't be able to shoot 20 times a game when he signed and he still complained. Furthermore, he became a cancer on the bench, not even cheering his teammates.

And the biggest myth is that he gave up a ton of money to sign with the Lakers. The truth is that only one other team (Miami) had interest in signing him above the midlevel exception, and even they wouldn't have once they got Odom. Malone did give up money (as other teams offered him the mid level, which is what Gary got from the Lakers), but Gary couldn't have gotten much more than he did.

 

[BatiGOOOOOOL]

WasabiKing, don't go dissing Speedy on your post. That man was huge for my Spurs in 2003. I wish he was still witht eh team. =(

Oh yeah, Payton can go and suck it. Fucking whiner.

 

[UtadaBarkley]

What an idiot. First of all, Gary's never been about the money, most recently evident by his salary in LA. In Seattle he wanted to defer most of his contract so they could sign more capable players. Of course, you wouldn't know that. What you know about Payton doesn't extend beyond these past playoffs, thus your analysis of him, (if that's what we can call it) is moot and not funny.

This is a man who played with a BROKEN FOOT in the playoffs. A man who's been on numerous first team all NBA teams and first team all defensive teams. A man who's had to play with two obese alcoholics masquerading as imposing PF's. A man who had management run HIS team into the ground. He's had to deal with a bevy of uncordinated, slow, bigmen.

Yes, let's defame a future Hall of Famer over an admittely shitty playoff showing. But, Wasabi, I guess it didn't hit you that GP after being the focal point for so many years became involved in a system(triangle) that often takes years to truly excel at, yet he was expected to pick it up and learn it in three weeks?. When Malone and Kobe were out, who led them besides Shaq? You do understand the process of growing old, right? You lose some steps and some moves, but you don't lose the heart to compete and perform for your teammates. To say he's only concerned about the money is offensive and stupid.

And guess what, Wasabi? You know who Jason Kidd's mentor is? The guy that TAUGHT him everything he knows?

Gary Payton.

IWHAWTP. I whole heartedly agree with this post. People that are dissing Gary are simply uninformed. True he didn't have a good showing in this round of playoffs, but to basically diss his whole career proves your ignorance. Simple as that. The NBA did not start at the 2003-2004 season.

 

[Shinobi]

Nobody's dissing his whole career...people are simply dissing this past season with the Lakers, and particuilarly in the playoffs where for the most part he was invisible. He was outplayed in every single series on both ends of the floor...that's just a fact. And to say that didn't help cost the Lakers is to be a fool.

Oh yeah, let's not forget that pending assault charge on Payton that he got up here in Toronto last year. He's been a disgrace on and off the court.

 

[DJ Sl4m]

I'm NOT a fan of Paytons, but I do respect his game after watching him match up against Jordan in the playoffs years ago.

He has a huge mouth on the court and a shitty attitude, but he's a damn hard worker who plays very good disaplined ball.

Changing teams is always going to be a hard transition, especially in his and Malones case, where they go from high minute (on the court) players to limited time (less ball time) and role players.

Trying to fit a new system is always a little awkward and hard to adjust to, anyone who's changed jobs can probably attest to this.

Shaq and Kobe were the key players, and nothing was going to change that at the time, they were the Lakers future.

Less time on the court = lose thier edge and efficiency
New system = slower to meld and find thier fit

Then therers the whole ego booster of it all, and you can't discredit how huge this could be considering both were treated like gods on thier old teams.

Age didn't help at all considering, look at Jordan in his years with the Punk ass warriors, great in his time, but in a new system not set up for his talents with new people around him, and the team not having the same mindset was a disaster.

Basicly what I'm trying to say is, the potential was there, both are/were great players, but everything didn't fall into place.

Blaming Payton and/or Malone for the Lakers loss is wrong, they tried, it just didn't happen in time, and injuries didn't help.

I still have huge respect for both players talents, this year just wasn't a year for them to show it, maybe with another year under thier belts to blend in better, but since all confidence seems to be lost I'm sure it's over now.

 

[Incognito]

Oh yeah, let's not forget that pending assault charge on Payton that he got up here in Toronto last year. He's been a disgrace on and off the court.

Please. He was protecting his teammates from an unruly stripper who thought punching and clawing was simply part of her routine. In times like those, I'd want the consummate teammate next to me for protection and guidance. I'd slap the bitch, too.

 

[open_mouth_]

While I did lose alot of respect for him for joining the Lakers for a cheap chance at a ring and for the way he didn't battle hard in the playoffs even though he is old, It still doesn't change the fact that he was one of the best point guards of our time before these past 2 seasons. He used to avg like 17 pts, 9 assists, 5 boards and led his team deep into the playoffs several years. He was also one of the best defensive players of his time.

 

[Shinobi]

Please. He was protecting his teammates from an unruly stripper who thought punching and clawing was simply part of her routine. In times like those, I'd want the consummate teammate next to me for protection and guidance. I'd slap the bitch, too.

What are you, their lawyer? Everyone knows that Payton was the ring leader of the group. Goddamn criminal.

Anyway, I have liked Glove for his career...but I've got no time for the Lakers in any fashion (not the current ones anyway... the 80's Lakers owned). Malone has also had a great career, but I despise his dirty play.