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The General Star Trek Thread of Earl Grey Tea, Baseball, and KHHHAAAANNNN
- Thread starter The Librarian
- Start date
Delta Assault
Member
Wow.
RIP.
RIP.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
She was one of the recurring characters in TOS right? Isn't she the one with the shore party in the imagination turns real episode?
firehawk12
Subete no aware
She also reprised her role on Voyager during that flashback episode.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
What ep?
DrForester
Kills Photobucket
Tim Russ explains May the Fourth.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=56&v=M_ZRsf9sneQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=56&v=M_ZRsf9sneQ
Hearing Timm Russ talk normally is... really, really weird. "The girl character" is also hilarious and sad at the same time.
"and his boss the garbage octopus"
"but not before dark vader turns obi into laundry"
Rhomega Beta
Member
i think i heard they were hack frauds
SpoonyBard
Banned
For some reason I decided to give New Voyages an another shot. I picked episode In Harms Way because it seemes action packed compared to lot of fan episodes. But still... this is pretty painful. And I don't usually compain about special effects, but in this everything seems to even move in 1.5x speed in computer generated shots.
Are there any fan made Star Trek episodes that are actually any good?
Are there any fan made Star Trek episodes that are actually any good?
Well, that friend of mine is now up to the end of the first season of Enterprise. It's been fun revisiting the show for the first time since it ended. (Speaking of which: the last television episode of the Star Trek franchise aired 10 years and 4 days ago, FYI! Craziness.)
She kind of gave up on Voyager for now; found the early episodes kinda painful. Can't say as I blame her, especially given her tastes. She's not much for total shlock, and Voyager can be pretty impressively cheesy with its scriptwriting. Enterprise is no golden goose, of course, but I share her opinion -- as relatively rare as it apparently is -- that is has one of the better initial years across Trek. It's not good, but none of the spinoff series have good first seasons. Which... yeah, no doubt didn't help Trek convert new fans in the mainstream even during its heights.
As I recall, the second season disappointed even some stalwart early defenders by veering wayward of the serialized episodes even more for a while. UPN must have figured Enterprise was leaking viewership in part thanks to its degree of connectivity, which sounds crazy when you consider there really wasn't much, but recall, it was 2001-2002. American television was not the same back then. I was... let's see... 14, going on 15 at the time. Coming up on 16 when the second season ended. I was getting into shows like Farscape, Stargate SG-1, and soon, Battlestar Galactica. And by the end of the second year of Enterprise, I, too, was getting frustrated. I wanted more to happen, and I wanted fewer retread plotlines. I would have kept watching even if that hadn't occurred, but not terribly enthusiastically.
The third season's where Enterprise got good, although I'm well aware there are many who find its shift jarring and unenjoyable. I'm curious to see how I respond to it now; back then I ate up everything "dark and edgy" without realizing when it was uninspired and drawn-out. It'll be unfortunate if that's how I react to it now, all these years later, because I have very solid memories of the third year at current.
But that'll come later. For today, my friend and I are headed into Enterprise's second year, and I can't say I'm especially eager about it, but given our relatively cordial view of the first, maybe we'll appreciate its only true "successor season" as well.
She kind of gave up on Voyager for now; found the early episodes kinda painful. Can't say as I blame her, especially given her tastes. She's not much for total shlock, and Voyager can be pretty impressively cheesy with its scriptwriting. Enterprise is no golden goose, of course, but I share her opinion -- as relatively rare as it apparently is -- that is has one of the better initial years across Trek. It's not good, but none of the spinoff series have good first seasons. Which... yeah, no doubt didn't help Trek convert new fans in the mainstream even during its heights.
As I recall, the second season disappointed even some stalwart early defenders by veering wayward of the serialized episodes even more for a while. UPN must have figured Enterprise was leaking viewership in part thanks to its degree of connectivity, which sounds crazy when you consider there really wasn't much, but recall, it was 2001-2002. American television was not the same back then. I was... let's see... 14, going on 15 at the time. Coming up on 16 when the second season ended. I was getting into shows like Farscape, Stargate SG-1, and soon, Battlestar Galactica. And by the end of the second year of Enterprise, I, too, was getting frustrated. I wanted more to happen, and I wanted fewer retread plotlines. I would have kept watching even if that hadn't occurred, but not terribly enthusiastically.
The third season's where Enterprise got good, although I'm well aware there are many who find its shift jarring and unenjoyable. I'm curious to see how I respond to it now; back then I ate up everything "dark and edgy" without realizing when it was uninspired and drawn-out. It'll be unfortunate if that's how I react to it now, all these years later, because I have very solid memories of the third year at current.
But that'll come later. For today, my friend and I are headed into Enterprise's second year, and I can't say I'm especially eager about it, but given our relatively cordial view of the first, maybe we'll appreciate its only true "successor season" as well.
SpoonyBard
Banned
Yeah, it's easy to forgive season 1 for being... well, season 1, but season 2 was just boring. That's where TNG started getting some really good episodes, but Enterprise had just similar quality "decent enough" episodes, that it already had in season 1, and it got boring.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
You know, with action and sci-fi shows being big again, I wonder why Star Trek hasn't returned back to television.
I think whether you dislike Voyager or Enterprise more relies on a lot of factors outside of their "objective" quality. Listening to Random Trek has told me that apparently women prefer Janeway even when she's a crazy-ass character because she's still a woman. Likewise I know a lot of people who were psyched for Enterprise, found that Scott Bakula was playing a humorless grump and bailed immediately. Sad sack that Harry Kim is, I prefer him and Neelix and lot more than Reed or T'Pol. I can appreciate they were trying to do different things with Enterprise that broke the mold, yet I think Voyager's episodes were more competent (if repetitive).
SpoonyBard
Banned
Enterprise lacked both the highs and lows of Voyager. Well, the two first seasons did, then it got better. But that made the first two seasons very boring compared to the wackiness that was Voyager.
DrForester
Kills Photobucket
Voyager had a few great episodes that I think can stand near the finest episodes of the franchise. While there was a lot of crap in between those episodes, they existed.
Enterprise at it's best was only ever "good". It was never great.
Enterprise at it's best was only ever "good". It was never great.
I think you can argue that there were great episodes in the final season, and that the third season arc was one of the best of the franchise (although yeah, arcs versus quality of individual episodes is very much a different game.)
SpoonyBard
Banned
In a Mirror, Darkly was pretty close to being great... And there were others in season 4 that I felt like were close to TNG quality. The episodes with Brent Spiner were very good IMO, maybe only Timeless was better in Voyager. I really need to rematch season 4 at some point, looks like I don't remember everything any longer.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
then again, if they were to make a new show, it'd be set in new dimension I guess?
GungHo
Single-handedly caused Exxon-Mobil to sue FOX, start World War 3
CBS probably hasn't decided what to do with it.
Seasons 3 and 4 of Enterprise are entertaining as hell and are better than anything Voyager put out. On the opposite side of the spectrum, Enterprise at its worst was just boring and uninteresting, whereas Voyager managed to get infuriatingly bad.
I actually think Enterprise was better than TOS as well, but my dislike of TOS is more fueled by the fact that it's just hard for me to adapt to watching a show that's built with 1960s television pacing
Seasons 3 and 4 of Enterprise are entertaining as hell and are better than anything Voyager put out. On the opposite side of the spectrum, Enterprise at its worst was just boring and uninteresting, whereas Voyager managed to get infuriatingly bad.
I actually think Enterprise was better than TOS as well, but my dislike of TOS is more fueled by the fact that it's just hard for me to adapt to watching a show that's built with 1960s television pacing
I did notice on rewatching some of the old series that they did seem to drag. I feel like there's a happy medium in between 42-50 minutes where shows should be though, because modern television feels way too fast.
I think TOS' lack of B-story structure is a bigger issue than the length, honestly.
SpoonyBard
Banned
There were a couple of season 3 TOS eps, where there were some shots that were obviously there just to make the episode longer. But during the golden era - second half of first season to end of season 2 - the episodes had a good flow, and nothing really dragged. And to tell you the truth, having to always have a B story was annoying as well. Usually I'd rather have a longer and deeper A story instead.
Oh, I agree. I think that sort of formula hurt a few TNG, DS9 and VOY episodes down the line, but with that amount of running time you have more flexibility.
I really love the S8 Twitter accounts for TNG, VOY, and DS9 because they do highlight how ridiculous some of the alternate stories were in not connecting at all to the main plot.
Yeah, the lack of B-story stuff is absolutely what makes TOS episodes feel like they dragon on compared to TNG or DS9 episodes.
I just watched VOY's Unimatrix Zero episode, and while the episode as a whole is decent, I realized how damn silly the plot gets, and how it demonstrates the general devaluation of the Borg as villains throughout the franchise.
That Janeway would let herself and two of her crew get assimilated to infiltrate the Borg already puts my suspense of disbelief to a hard test. But that the three take the process so easily without any sign of psychological distress destroys much of the horror that TNG and First Contact associated with the Borg. Assimilation in that episode is almost trivial. I mean, they are facing potential dismemberment and the injection of all sorts of stuff into their very brains, and still they just wake up as drones and go on about their business? It's just silly.
That Janeway would let herself and two of her crew get assimilated to infiltrate the Borg already puts my suspense of disbelief to a hard test. But that the three take the process so easily without any sign of psychological distress destroys much of the horror that TNG and First Contact associated with the Borg. Assimilation in that episode is almost trivial. I mean, they are facing potential dismemberment and the injection of all sorts of stuff into their very brains, and still they just wake up as drones and go on about their business? It's just silly.
-Minsc-
Member
I just realized I haven't watched Enterprise since the end of it's first run. Hard to believe it's been ten years. Definitely should go back and watch it now that I'm older and won't let the internet cloud my enjoyment of the show. Though, like Voyager, I doubt I'll ever be fond of how they ended.
lastplayed
Member
Finally finished my Enterprise model.
Man did I learn a lot about the original studio model! So many CGI recreations (official and non offical) have so many tiny errors and additions. I tried to make my model a cross between the beat up studio model and the HD Remastered version.
Man did I learn a lot about the original studio model! So many CGI recreations (official and non offical) have so many tiny errors and additions. I tried to make my model a cross between the beat up studio model and the HD Remastered version.
lastplayed
Member
Thanks! No unfortunately I'm not quite at that skill level. It's a kit from Polar Lights:
The bridge crew are just stock 1/350 scale Imperial Japanese Navy figures.
..first, wow, that model looks superb. Well done. 
And now why I'm back!
So, my friend and I are a little over halfway through ENT. Last ep we watched was 3x05. And... yeah, man, this show gets a lot stronger as soon as the Xindi arc opens. I know there are people who hate Season 3, and I feel for them, because I can't imagine not digging this part of Trek. Everything just clicks all of a sudden, even if, sure, it's 25+ episodes of abandoning the show's original aim. Forget the aim, suddenly ENT has vision. Do parts of it make it obvious the post-9/11 world was leaving its mark on Berman's ambitions? Sure, but I love nuBSG; I'm not against that now and I sure as heck wasn't at the time.
3x03 was hilariously bad though. The one where Archer, Reed, and Hoshi get transformed into primitive aliens. That said, Linda Park nailed Alien!Hoshi almost disturbingly well. She was clearly miscast and needs to be a weird alien chick in the next show.
But yeah, ENT has missteps. It has a lack of direction for half the show. It has some bad episodes, but which Trek didn't? I don't know, the only thing that feels ongoingly irksome is the mandate that the series be "sexier"; it's eye-rolly seeing early-2000s network TV pushing the envelope just because it can, because it's so tame and pointless simultaneously. At least the T'Pol/Trip thing that's starting (and yeah, I saw the show when it was airing, so I remember in broad strokes the way things go) is about two of the characters, so the lion's share of the "edge factor" can now at least pertain to characterization to some extent rather than just... "we're rubbing eachother in decon, yo."
Can't wait to get through the rest of S3 and S4. I'm remembering why I was so depressed when the series ended.
And now why I'm back!
So, my friend and I are a little over halfway through ENT. Last ep we watched was 3x05. And... yeah, man, this show gets a lot stronger as soon as the Xindi arc opens. I know there are people who hate Season 3, and I feel for them, because I can't imagine not digging this part of Trek. Everything just clicks all of a sudden, even if, sure, it's 25+ episodes of abandoning the show's original aim. Forget the aim, suddenly ENT has vision. Do parts of it make it obvious the post-9/11 world was leaving its mark on Berman's ambitions? Sure, but I love nuBSG; I'm not against that now and I sure as heck wasn't at the time.
3x03 was hilariously bad though. The one where Archer, Reed, and Hoshi get transformed into primitive aliens. That said, Linda Park nailed Alien!Hoshi almost disturbingly well. She was clearly miscast and needs to be a weird alien chick in the next show.
But yeah, ENT has missteps. It has a lack of direction for half the show. It has some bad episodes, but which Trek didn't? I don't know, the only thing that feels ongoingly irksome is the mandate that the series be "sexier"; it's eye-rolly seeing early-2000s network TV pushing the envelope just because it can, because it's so tame and pointless simultaneously. At least the T'Pol/Trip thing that's starting (and yeah, I saw the show when it was airing, so I remember in broad strokes the way things go) is about two of the characters, so the lion's share of the "edge factor" can now at least pertain to characterization to some extent rather than just... "we're rubbing eachother in decon, yo."
Can't wait to get through the rest of S3 and S4. I'm remembering why I was so depressed when the series ended.
I really liked Hoshi; I think she was my favorite character on the show. She was probably out of her depth, but she was always trying, and she just didn't come off like an ass as some of the other characters did.
Also I realized yesterday she's in Jurassic Park III for about four seconds, so there you go.
Also I realized yesterday she's in Jurassic Park III for about four seconds, so there you go.
firehawk12
Subete no aware
I just noticed that Adam Nimoy, Leonard's son, is trying to do a kickstarter for a film about Spock and his father:
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/adamnimoy/for-the-love-of-spock-a-documentary-film?ref=hero
Given that the Roddenberry kickstarter barely made it, I'm not sure what will happen with this one. You'd think someone at some studio somewhere would be fine with funding a Spock documentary, but I guess not.
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/adamnimoy/for-the-love-of-spock-a-documentary-film?ref=hero
Given that the Roddenberry kickstarter barely made it, I'm not sure what will happen with this one. You'd think someone at some studio somewhere would be fine with funding a Spock documentary, but I guess not.
Escape Goat
Member
I'm watching a made-for-TV zombie movie that has Levar Burton as one of the characters. He plays one of the scientists studying the infection on Alcatraz island. It also has French Stewart but I think hes also a supporting character.
From Kunta Kinte and Geordi LaForge to shameless CHILL shit shows.
From Kunta Kinte and Geordi LaForge to shameless CHILL shit shows.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
Finally watched Khan's ep from TOS.
I gotta say, why was he brought up as "Kirk's rival" in WoK? It feels more like he's the "adversary of the week" than an actual rival. Most of his great accomplishments are in WoK than in the episode he was from.
I gotta say, why was he brought up as "Kirk's rival" in WoK? It feels more like he's the "adversary of the week" than an actual rival. Most of his great accomplishments are in WoK than in the episode he was from.
firehawk12
Subete no aware
Bennett basically went through the entire series when he was hired to do the second movie and picked Khan as the villain.
Rhomega Beta
Member
In our universe: "Oh cool, Khan's back! How's Kirk going to deal with him this time?"
In another universe: "Oh, it's this guy..."
In another universe: "Oh, it's this guy..."
A lot of stuff must have happened off screen. Like the meeting between Khan and Chekov.
*cough*
Khan was never Kirk's rival. He really was just "adversary of the week" until Harve Bennett thought he had potential to become something more.
Khan was a former King and an alpha male. He had a run in with Kirk and tried to be more alpha than Kirk, but he lost (all he won was one of Kirk's women, and she wasn't even Kirk's type). And then Kirk spared his life, and pondered the consequences of letting someone like Khan live.
20 years later, and Kirk has never given Khan a second thought. Starfleet has never given Khan a second thought. A planet blew up, and Starfleet never cared. "Which planet blew up? Was it the one with the dangerous criminals living on it?" "Who cares, just list one of them as destroyed and move on."
Khan meets Chekov and he's mad that "Admiral" Kirk has forgotten him and moved on with his life. He's even mad that Chekov didn't remember him enough to tell tales of Khan's epic battles to his new Captain. Khan has been living with dreams of vengeance, but his "rivalry" with Kirk is entirely one-sided. Khan is Captain Ahab, driven by defeat to chase Kirk, the White Whale, a foe who's out of Khan's league and who isn't really even attacking. It's all in Khan's head.
Even Kirk's famous/infamous "KHAN!!!" scream was a lie. Khan wanted Kirk to suffer, and tried to leave him buried alive. Kirk knew he wasn't beaten, and there was no real rage (or whatever mix of emotions) in that scream, he just knew that Khan was desperate to hear Kirk cry out, and this would let Khan think he won, and make him drop his guard, while Kirk calmly plotted Khan's defeat. So Kirk said (yelled) what Khan wanted to hear.
Khan was never an equal, he was always Kirk's bitch. Khan thought he could kill Kirk if he paid with his own life, but all he succeeded in doing was killing Spock (who willingly sacrificed himself to save the crew). And left Kirk pondering his own arrogance.
Space Seed doesn't hold up as "the prequel to Wrath of Khan", it's just that when WoK came out, some people could point to it and say "Hey neat, continuity."
Yeah I think the fact that writer Carey Wilbur &c. never intended "Space Seed" to have a sequel actually plays into the strengths of Wrath of Khan. It's just another moment in Kirk's life that frankly doesn't stick out that much"clubbed an ancient superhuman who was trying to take my ship" isn't a huge entry in a captains log that includes "destroyed another supercomputer running a civilization", "fought an ancient being masquerading as an ancient Earth god", "destroyed a planet-eating cornucopia", and "was forced to kill my squeeze to prevent the complete destruction of my timeline."
Khan: I stole your woman! This... "librarian" is highly sought after in your society, yes?
Kirk: I once had sex with a gas cloud of no recognizable gender. The ship's computer got jealous.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
wait, kirk did those two?
Nah, I was stretching. There was a gas cloud that fell in love with Zephram Cochrane, and I remember one other one which smelled like honey but Kirk wanted to kill that one. Probably more intelligent gas clouds that I'm not remembering.
And there was one time when the computer became female and got pouty with Kirk.
JoshuaJSlone
Member
I was originally going to come to this thread to ask for help in finding this, but since I finally found it on my own I'll share it for those who haven't seen it before--or at least haven't seen it in 9 years: fanmade "STAR TREK: Enhanced" which predates the HD+CG remaster of the original series but is along the same lines. Watching the official version of The Doomsday Machine recently reminded me of this.
On another note, New Frontier is finally back. The first short ebook part released today, with the other two parts coming early August and September.
On another note, New Frontier is finally back. The first short ebook part released today, with the other two parts coming early August and September.
Hmm. I think I need to go back and reread the original runs. Back in high school I loved those books, but the last thing I read of Peter David's was Halo: Hunters in the Dark and it just... wasn't that good. Now I'm concerned that my enjoyment of New Frontier might have been predicated on my age...