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[DrForester]

Rewatch of DS9 complete.

Outside of the flashback montage, I really, really like the finale. Great wrap up to the war story, and I think the Prophets story wraps up a lot better than a lot of people think. Love the scene in Vic's with all the aliens in the audience sans-makeup.

Also, Avery Brooks knew a cynical internet would be making jokes 20 years later and had that ending changed.

Originally, the episode was to end without any ambiguity as to whether or not Sisko was going to return to his corporeal life – the answer was a definite 'no'. The idea was that Sisko had become a Prophet, and that was how it would remain for all time, thus confirming the Sarah Prophet's warning in "Penumbra" and "'Til Death Do Us Part" that if he married Kasidy Yates, he "would know nothing but sorrow." The sorrow was that he was going to have to leave his unborn child behind, and would never get to be with her after her birth. Indeed, the final scene between Sisko and Kasidy was shot this way, with Sisko telling Kasidy he would never be back. However, a day or two after the shoot, Avery Brooks called Ira Behr and told him he wasn't happy with the scene. He felt that having a black man leave his pregnant black wife to raise their child alone carried certain negative connotations that he wasn't comfortable with. As Terry J. Erdmann puts it in the Companion; "In the 24th century, the situation conveyed only sorrow. However, in the 21st century, there was a secondary social issue that had particular resonance." As such, the scene was rewritten and reshot so as to clarify that Sisko will return some day.

 

[kennah]

Great wrap up to the war story, and I think the Prophets story wraps up a lot better than a lot of people think.

I agree. On my rewatch a few years ago I was surprised to see how tight the overall arc was across the whole series. Hadn't seen it since I was a kid.

 

[DrForester]

Also, that final shot.

All Good Things... will be the GOAT Star Trek Ending, but man did DS9 make a solid run at it.

 

[Effect]

Rewatch of DS9 complete.

Outside of the flashback montage, I really, really like the finale. Great wrap up to the war story, and I think the Prophets story wraps up a lot better than a lot of people think. Love the scene in Vic's with all the aliens in the audience sans-makeup.

Also, Avery Brooks knew a cynical internet would be making jokes 20 years later and had that ending changed.

Ever since I found out that change I've always been glad he got that done. I know some people like to complain about Sisko and the fact that his ethnicity was an overt part of the character's background, personality, etc but that's one of the things I loved about DS9 (especially as a black kid at the time) and why I'm willing to rank it above a LOT of other scifi in general and it's the best of Trek for me. I never believed even that far in the future the issues skin color, etc would go away. Especially when you have aliens that would be judged on how they look at first meeting. Trek has tackled that before but never with the lead character and as often as they did. DS9 did a lot of this regarding religion, ethnicity, race, sexuality, etc. with a lot of it's characters from what I remember. It didn't stop the action, the general scifi-ness, etc.

I hope when the new series is being done they remember they can do all of this and still have an action filled show.

 

[GuyKazama]

The upcoming remastered Director's Cut blu-ray of Wrath of Khan is down to $15 on Amazon

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B01AI7QPM6/?tag=neogaf0e-20

 

[Fuchsdh]

Rewatch of DS9 complete.

Outside of the flashback montage

What bothers me about the montage is that the producers must have really decided to screw Terry Farrell out of a check, because Worf's "remembrance" being a holodeck adventure where it wasn't actually him and not of his late wife was such a colossal bone-headed idea otherwise.

Great wrap up to the war story, and I think the Prophets story wraps up a lot better than a lot of people think.

The Prophet story just ultimately didn't work for me. A lot of teasing and prophecies and dumb stuff like "Reckoning" that turned into a nonsensical battle over a book. The more you think about it, the less sense it makes. It also completely destroys the two most interesting antagonists in the series (Dukat and Winn) in the process. Yuck.

 

[DrForester]

The Prophet story just ultimately didn't work for me. A lot of teasing and prophecies and dumb stuff like "Reckoning" that turned into a nonsensical battle over a book. The more you think about it, the less sense it makes. It also completely destroys the two most interesting antagonists in the series (Dukat and Winn) in the process. Yuck.

I don't think so. Dukat's life was pretty much ruined by the Prophets interfering with the Dominion fleet. Makes sense he would seek out a way to destroy them. Winn had been ignored by the Prophets, never getting a vision. She also hates Sisko.

 

[Fuchsdh]

I don't think so. Dukat's life was pretty much ruined by the Prophets interfering with the Dominion fleet. Makes sense he would seek out a way to destroy them. Winn had been ignored by the Prophets, never getting a vision. She also hates Sisko.

And those turns of Winn into a crazy zealot and Dukat into... just crazy, I guess, are far less interesting turns for me.

But the big issue is the Book of Kosst Amojan. I love this review from David Sluss because it distills my issues with it perfectly:

For instance, if the Fire Caves are a prison for the Pah-Wraiths, and the book is the key, why was there a key in the first place, and who made it? Did the Prophets intend to let the Pah-Wraiths out on parole after a certain amount of time (not that they understand time, of course)? Did the imprisoned Pah-Wraiths mind-control some starving writer into writing the book? If so, there's no reason why it couldn't happen again. And how does any of the Pah-Wraith business square with last season's "The Reckoning," in which an event billed as the Final Battle between Good Glowing-Eye Possessed Bodies and Evil Glowing-Eye Possessed Bodies was short-circuited? I don't recall the Book of the Kostawhatsit being of any importance then.

The whole idea of the wormhole aliens themselves actively interfering and meddling with the Bajorans (and Sisko) and yet somehow not understanding the concept of time was always a bunch of bullshit, and it got worse with the series as time went on, so I guess I shouldn't have been surprised it deflated like a bad souffle by the end... but it was still a drag on everything else going on in the finale (literally what must be days goes by and Winn and Dukat are still in the fire caves while the entire destruction of Cardassia and Peace Accords are signed.)

 

[Escape Goat]

Winn's was perfect. She gives into her ambition and compromises herself by becoming allies with Dukat. When you look at her life and how she was imprisoned for teaching about the Prophets she is a tragic figure. She was beaten by her captors during her imprisonment and the thing that got her through it all was her belief in her gods. And when it looked like the Prophets had returned to Bajor, they select a non believer, an outsider to be their Emissary. Winn had never spoken to the Prophets, but they did to Sisko many times. It was this resentment that fueled Winn's character and her evolution into a villain.

The Reckoning is where it all comes together. Sisko was willing to sacrifice his own son because he ad absolute faith in the Prophets. Winn's faith was overcome by her resentment towards Sisko and so she prevented the Reckoning from taking place. The role reversal was complete.

 

[maharg]

And those turns of Winn into a crazy zealot and Dukat into... just crazy, I guess, are far less interesting turns for me.

But the big issue is the Book of Kosst Amojan. I love this review from David Sluss because it distills my issues with it perfectly:



The whole idea of the wormhole aliens themselves actively interfering and meddling with the Bajorans (and Sisko) and yet somehow not understanding the concept of time was always a bunch of bullshit, and it got worse with the series as time went on, so I guess I shouldn't have been surprised it deflated like a bad souffle by the end... but it was still a drag on everything else going on in the finale (literally what must be days goes by and Winn and Dukat are still in the fire caves while the entire destruction of Cardassia and Peace Accords are signed.)

No, no. Don't you understand, They Have a Plan. This Has All Happened Before and It Will All Happen Again.

 

[ThLunarian]

I'm rewatching DS9 with my girlfriend, who has never seen it before but was a huge fan of TNG.

Right now we're at the very end of Season 4. I forgot how long the slow boil goes on before the real fireworks start. I can't wait to get into the tail end of Season 5, when the war actually starts up and payoffs start happening from all the character development we've been going through so far.

Best Star Trek of the entire franchise.

 

[DrForester]

 

[Stumpokapow]

Took me a non-trivial amount of time to figure out that the bearded guy was a Trek cast member, not a fan. Hahaha. When did he grow the beard?

 

[DrForester]

Took me a non-trivial amount of time to figure out that the bearded guy was a Trek cast member, not a fan. Hahaha. When did he grow the beard?

Yeah, it's kind of a "wow" moment when you realize who it is, especially since Wang doesn't look much older.

 

[Fuchsdh]

At least he's been doing a fair amount of directing. Honestly aside from the top-billed cast members he's probably one of the most successful.

 

[Henchmen21]

Wow is that Robert Duncan McNeill? Not aged well.

 

[Walshicus]

Wow is that Robert Duncan McNeill? Not aged well.

Still sounds a lot like he used to though, he voiced Tom again in the MMO recently.

 

[firehawk12]

The Asian family one is great.

 

[ElTorro]

Wow is that Robert Duncan McNeill? Not aged well.

Don't know, I think the great exodus of hair from the top of his head to the front is the biggest change.

 

[8bit]

This just in! The new #STARTREK TV series will set course for Toronto and begin filming this fall. #CBSAllAccess

https://twitter.com/CBSTVStudios/status/727195980865503232

--

Robert Duncan McNeill looks pretty good there, imo.

 

[teiresias]

Just rewatched "In the Pale Moonlight" from S6 of DS9. Lord, that last scene between Sisko and Garak in his shop is amazing and Garak just lays it all out and is completely bad ass!!!

 

[Effect]

Figured I'd repost this here for those interested if they don't see the thread for the trailer.

New trailer for Star Trek Beyond. MUCH BETTER then the last one.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bzD8H6o1awQ

Also seems the lawsuit toward Star Trek: Axanar is being dropped.

http://deadline.com/2016/05/star-trek-axanar-lawsuit-ending-jj-abrams-paramount-1201760721/

 

[DrForester]

Deep Space Nine ended 17 years ago today.

 

[lastplayed]

Deep Space Nine ended 17 years ago today.

Back in the dark days when it took months for new episodes to reach NZ, you could actually buy them on video before TV got around to airing them.

Except I had this American friend I met on some Trek message board who'd send me recorded tapes within a week or two, and that's how I saw season 7, with all the commercials included. We fell out of contact soon after that, wish I knew how to find her again.

 

[whiterabbit]

I just watched Star Trek '09 and Into Darkness (which I saw in theaters but didn't really remember). As mainly a Star Wars fan, I was surprised how much I enjoyed these movies, and I want to see Beyond in theaters.

 

[TheYanger]

Deep Space Nine ended 17 years ago today.

Glad you didn't start it zoomed all the way in, that shot makes me super teary eyed.

 

[Boss Doggie]

I still hold Star Trek as a prime example of sci fi over Star Wars which really is more of a fantasy series with future tech elements.

 

[Walshicus]

Deep Space Nine ended 17 years ago today.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=1&v=1LRouOzliXY

 

[blahness]

Didn't know where else to post this, but I was at a Karl Urban q&a today at Awesomecon in DC and he stated that he just played a new Star Trek VR game being created by Ubisoft. He described it as being a member of a bridge crew and that it was very immersive. I never saw this announce but I hope it turns out decent.

 

[Nudull]

Didn't know where else to post this, but I was at a Karl Urban q&a today at Awesomecon in DC and he stated that he just played a new Star Trek VR game being created by Ubisoft. He described it as being a member of a bridge crew and that it was very immersive. I never saw this announce but I hope it turns out decent.

Bridge Commander revival?

 

[Henchmen21]

Watched Generations again recently. Man, 22 years later and I'm still pissed they destroyed the D. Thing looked so beautiful on the big screen.

 

[OneEightZero]

Watched Generations again recently. Man, 22 years later and I'm still pissed they destroyed the D. Thing looked so beautiful on the big screen.

It doesn't really bug me they did the D, but how it happens isn't the greatest.

 

[Escape Goat]

Took me a non-trivial amount of time to figure out that the bearded guy was a Trek cast member, not a fan. Hahaha. When did he grow the beard?

Its Welshi.

 

[Henchmen21]

It doesn't really bug me they did the D, but how it happens isn't the greatest.

Really? The best Enterprise. That thing was made for the big screen. Hell, they had to make a smaller model for much of the tv shows run because the bigger one wasn't made for the smaller cameras.

That and Moore had been aching to destroy the thing for years going as far back as the 5th season finale. What's funny is you'd thing Berman, with how much of a studio shill he was, would nix the idea since I'm sure he'd rather save money on not having to build new sets since they already had preexisting sets up already. I don't buy that excuse that the sets "weren't made for movies". Look how good the sets looked in Generations. Hell, ten foward was such a good set they used it in V and VI (redressed as a lounge and the president of earths office respectively). Nick Meyer reused sets in II and VI because he was a competent director who new how to film.

 

[The Technomancer]

Started watching TOS with my girlfriend, first time she's ever seen any of it. First episode we watched was the one with the Horta, which went okay although it didn't really grab her. The next night though I put on The Trouble with Tribbles

Man

There's that scene where Kirk has found that they've eaten all of the grain. And he's chest deep in tribbles, talking to the other characters for an extended five minute scene and the entire time its super obvious some stage crew member was given orders to chuck another tribble at his head every thirty seconds and so its just "bonk...bonk...bonk". And it just. Keeps. Going
She was absolutely cracking up, I think that's when she got really into it

Since then we've done Mirror Mirror, Space Seed, the one with the Nazis and the one where we meet Sarek for the first time. Super happy she seems into it

 

[OneEightZero]

Really? The best Enterprise. That thing was made for the big screen. Hell, they had to make a smaller model for much of the tv shows run because the bigger one wasn't made for the smaller cameras.

That and Moore had been aching to destroy the thing for years going as far back as the 5th season finale. What's funny is you'd thing Berman, with how much of a studio shill he was, would nix the idea since I'm sure he'd rather save money on not having to build new sets since they already had preexisting sets up already. I don't buy that excuse that the sets "weren't made for movies". Look how good the sets looked in Generations. Hell, ten foward was such a good set they used it in V and VI (redressed as a lounge and the president of earths office respectively). Nick Meyer reused sets in II and VI because he was a competent director who new how to film.

They needed to shake it up. The Galaxy class was a design lingering from the late 80s and it was starting to show. It was time to try something new.

I do like the Sovereign class, so there's that.

 

[Boss Doggie]

Its Welshi.

I thought that was only a Futurama joke.

 

[Cheerilee]

I thought that was only a Futurama joke.

It was only a Futurama joke. Scotty, born in Scotland, was replaced by Welshy, born in Wales. Futurama was making fun of the way TV can just replace people whenever it becomes convenient.

The unrecognizable guy hanging out with Garrett Wang (Harry Kim) in those Star Trek convention photos is Robert Duncan McNeill (Tom Paris), not Welshi. Escape Goat was making a Futurama reference.

 

[DarthWoo]

The box sets dont look as bad as I thought they would.

Picked my TNG set up at Best Buy today; still $99.99 if anyone's looking to get it. It looks to be the same discs as the individual season sets, with six discs per season. Inside the cardboard outer packaging are two massive plastic cases, divided between season 1-4 and 5-7. They're loaded up on the typical hinged flaps that most big cases have, with four discs per flap, two on each side. Was worried about damage after another thing I ordered last week arrived in the mail with the sound of loose plastic immediately (though BB made it pretty easy to just return that at the store and have another one reordered, which arrived intact), so I had cancelled my original shipping order and reordered it for store pickup. I figure a lot can go wrong with these kinds of cases.

 

[dalin80]

Watched Generations again recently. Man, 22 years later and I'm still pissed they destroyed the D. Thing looked so beautiful on the big screen.

It was only really shown from a few angles in the movie as it was literally designed for older TV aspect ratios, when framing for the movie getting angles and perspectives which didn't make the D look fat and dumpy was tricky and the ship wasn't well proportioned for filling the screen. The Robins egg blue paint scheme was also toned down as it didn't project very well.

The stark jump to the 'sleeker' E was because of this, they needed a hero ship that could fill a wider screen so we got a longer ship, the lore explanation of 'we needed a battleship because the D with all it's luxuries kept getting it's ass handed to it' also worked.

 

[Fuchsdh]

Only thing I've never really liked about the -E is its hull paint scheme, specifically when they went all-digital models in Insurrection and afterwards.

 

[Escape Goat]

When they say that te ship is low on power what are they low on? I know its just a way to create drama but in the context of the show's science whats going on?

 

[Fuchsdh]

When they say that te ship is low on power what are they low on? I know its just a way to create drama but in the context of the show's science whats going on?

I feel like the science has always been inconsistent but seems like they have two resources that are important—dilithium and heavy water. The latter (deuterium) being scarce in most of Voyager's run except when they had a smart writer on board was always stupid—it's pretty easy to find what you need to make heavy water for a faction as advanced as the Federation.

I've always assumed that the main limitation of the Federation being a true post-scarcity utopia, besides the reality that people still need places to live and how that has to be handled, is that replication must take a massive amount of power, to the point where starships aren't large enough to be self-sufficient on that scale.

 

[BobTheFork]

Every Saturday morning for the last ~2 months, I've been starting my day with a Ferengi episode of DS9. I call it breakfast at Quark's

I'm almost done with my total rewatch of DS9. By far my favorite Trek series and I think most of my favorite characters are from Ds9. Gul DuCat might be my favorite character in anything

 

[Escape Goat]

Every Saturday morning for the last ~2 months, I've been starting my day with a Ferengi episode of DS9. I call it breakfast at Quark's

I'm almost done with my total rewatch of DS9. By far my favorite Trek series and I think most of my favorite characters are from Ds9. Gul DuCat might be my favorite character in anything

Gul DuCat was purrrrrfect.

 

[whiterabbit]

Every Saturday morning for the last ~2 months, I've been starting my day with a Ferengi episode of DS9. I call it breakfast at Quark's

I'm almost done with my total rewatch of DS9. By far my favorite Trek series and I think most of my favorite characters are from Ds9. Gul DuCat might be my favorite character in anything

Nice Zelda map!

 

[Jackpot]

When they say that te ship is low on power what are they low on? I know its just a way to create drama but in the context of the show's science whats going on?

Pretty much means what it says. Output power is low from the warp core and fusion generators so power-intensive systems like shields and weapons are offline unavailable.

 

[Fjordson]

Picked up the TNG series blu-ray set. So happy to own my favourite Trek show on blu <3

These cases are fuckin' crazy though lol. Wish they had just put each season in individual cases, not cram multiple seasons into these behemoth ones.

 

[whiterabbit]

I watched JJ Abrams' Star Trek last night. It's great. His movies always have interesting cinematography.

 

[Effect]

Wasn't able to cancel the Next Generation set in time so I'll have to send it back. Things came up and the budget can't take the hit at the moment. Debating if I should keep the TOS set though since it's significantly cheaper by comparison.

If it was a DS9 set I'd take the hit but doesn't seem like they want to offer that.