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The General Star Trek Thread of Earl Grey Tea, Baseball, and KHHHAAAANNNN

F

funkystudent

Member
Watched "Chaos on the Bridge" on Netflix which is a fun little 1 hour thing about the creation of TNG and the first 2 seasons being a trainwreck and Gene being a nutter.

Nothing super insightful if you know enough but a fun watch. It talks to writers, TV execs a few of the cast etc...



Also I think I might try and watch some Enterprise. Not ALL of Enterprise, just the good bits. Havent really sat down and watched the good bits of S4 when they went a bit nuts with mining the lore since it aired. Might as well do a quick pass on memorable episodes of the other seasons while I am at it I guess.

Var said:
100%
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jiji said:
Yeah, I might know a thing or two about that.
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giphy.gif
 
B

BorkBork

The Legend of BorkBork: BorkBorkity Borking
I've been following @PicardTips, @WorfTips, @RikerGoogling, and @realRealDukat on Twitter. They're really good and probably by the same guy.
 
S

SL128

Member
BorkBork said:
I've been following @PicardTips, @WorfTips, @RikerGoogling, and @realRealDukat on Twitter. They're really good and probably by the same guy.
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They are all by the same guy, but @realRealDukat is the best.

Dominion just said the unverified report paid for by political opponents is "A COMPLETE AND TOTAL FABRICATION, UTTER NONSENSE." Very unfair!
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Intelligence agencies should never have allowed this fake news to "leak" into the public. One last shot at me.Are we living on Romulus?
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Having a good relationship with the Dominion is a good thing, not a bad thing. Only "stupid" people, or fools, would think it is bad!
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Thank you to Quark of Quark's Bar & Grill for your great support and courage. People will support you even more now. Buy Quark's. @QuarkTips
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N

Noema

Member
GAMEPROFF said:
Are there Star Trek YouTube Channels that habe wiki-eske approach? Like videos that explain us the Borg, whats the deal with Romolus and Remus and what happened in the first Dominion War?
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Something like this?

It's not completely focused on Star Trek (they also have Game of Thrones and LotR and MCU videos) but I think the Trek videos they do have are good.
 
D

DBT85

Member
So I now just have to watch Endgame and my Voyager binge is complete. I've enjoyed it overall but there is some crap in there. The Doctor and Seven were the standouts by a mile.
 
F

Fuchsdh

Member
It's kind of funny, but I think Voyager did a much better job of the "ghost from the past hoses the heroes" schtick with "Worst Case Scenario" than DS9 did with "Civil Defense". Sure, you have to buy into Seska being such a dick that she'd booby-trap one of Tuvok's holodeck programs, but it's less ridiculous than Dukat apparently pre-recording footage in the case of Bajoran revolt in every section of the station, complete with branching if|and dialogue trees like he was in a goddamn video game, and the fact that they apparently didn't find this until three years after taking over the station.

Also, I almost wish they made Kira a Cardassian in "Second Skin" like they seem to be verging on doing once or twice in the episode (and apparently originally wanted to keep at the very least ambiguous.)
 
S

Stallion Dan

Member
Worst Case Scenario is just an all round great episode of Trek, easily one of my favourites.

Voyager probably the worst ghost from the past with Fury though (return of Kes). What a waste of a character, an episode slot and my bloody time.

I guess she wasn't really a ghost, but whatever.
 
B

BorkBork

The Legend of BorkBork: BorkBorkity Borking
Fuchsdh said:
It's kind of funny, but I think Voyager did a much better job of the "ghost from the past hoses the heroes" schtick with "Worst Case Scenario" than DS9 did with "Civil Defense". Sure, you have to buy into Seska being such a dick that she'd booby-trap one of Tuvok's holodeck programs, but it's less ridiculous than Dukat apparently pre-recording footage in the case of Bajoran revolt in every section of the station, complete with branching if|and dialogue trees like he was in a goddamn video game, and the fact that they apparently didn't find this until three years after taking over the station.

Also, I almost wish they made Kira a Cardassian in "Second Skin" like they seem to be verging on doing once or twice in the episode (and apparently originally wanted to keep at the very least ambiguous.)
Click to expand...

Civil Defense is super fun though, even though it's completely ridiculous. I love it when Dukat's smug ass beams aboard only to realize his superiors had a contingency plan for his contingency plan.
 
D

DBT85

Member
So after my recent TNG and Voyager binges, and having already done DS9 a few years ago, I'm finally doing Enterprise. I've seen the first season but nothing beyond that.

Just half way through the pilot and we've gone past the crazy decontamination scene of nipples and nipples.
 
W

Walshicus

Member
Watching classic TOS and got to Whom Gods Destroy.

"I'm the most beautiful woman on this planet"
"You're the *only* woman on this planet, you stupid cow!"

Cracked me and the missus up.
 
F

Fuchsdh

Member
Walshicus said:
Watching classic TOS and got to Whom Gods Destroy.

"I'm the most beautiful woman on this planet"
"You're the *only* woman on this planet, you stupid cow!"

Cracked me and the missus up.
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That entire episode has some great lines. Especially when Marta recites 'her' sonnet, and he yells at her about Shakespeare having done it first.
 
D

DBT85

Member
14 eps in to Enterprise and it seems I never got as far as I thought, or maybe I just remember a few episodes. Only had T'pol in the decon room twice so far this season.

Enjoying it all so far, making me feel some hope and stuff with everything else going on!

Also it seems to be making me want to Kerbal again, even when TNG and VOY didn't.

firehawk12 said:
http://memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/Macet

I guess I never noticed that Marc Alaimo played a Cardassian on TNG... and of course the books just made him Dukat's cousin. lol

It almost feels like TNG was basically an audition for the other shows at this point.
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Ha. I like playing spot the recurring actor in StarTrek. Fuck, in Scifi in general!
 
The Hamburglar

The Hamburglar

Banned
Was Tom Paris related to that guy in tng where wez had to stand up and tell the truth because if he didn't, he didn't deserve to wear the uniform?

Paris backstory is very similar to that cadet
 
P

Pop-O-Matic

Banned
The Hamburglar said:
Was Tom Paris related to that guy in tng where wez had to stand up and tell the truth because if he didn't, he didn't deserve to wear the uniform?

Paris backstory is very similar to that cadet
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It's the same actor and the originally wanted to use the same character outright, but they thought they'd be legally obligated to pay royalties to the writer of that TNG episode so they just changed his name and literally nothing else and that apparently was enough for him to count as a legally distinct character.
 
F

Fuchsdh

Member
The Hamburglar said:
Was Tom Paris related to that guy in tng where wez had to stand up and tell the truth because if he didn't, he didn't deserve to wear the uniform?

Paris backstory is very similar to that cadet
Click to expand...

The idea is that Tom Paris was supposed to be Locarno, but doing so would have meant paying out royalties to the writer of "The First Duty" for the entire series run of Voyager. I don't believe I've ever heard it from a reliable source, though, nor do I know enough about royalties and writers guild rights to know if that's true or not.

EDIT: Beaten, that's what I get for not refreshing the page.
 
M

maharg

idspispopd
Wouldn't be a problem now. TV show writers generally have to sign away their right to characters they introduce nowadays afaik.

Honestly, it's pretty gross that they weaselled out of paying for the character that way.
 
P

Pluto

Member
The royalties may have been part of the reason they didn't use Nick Locarno but I read another story thatbthe producers thought Locarno was too unlikable and irredeemable. An important difference in their backstories is that Locarno blamed the dead guy for the accident and only Wesley confessing revealed the truth, Paris falsified records but ultimately confessed himself.
 
C

Cheerilee

Member
Pluto said:
The royalties may have been part of the reason they didn't use Nick Locarno but I read another story thatbthe producers thought Locarno was too unlikable and irredeemable. An important difference in their backstories is that Locarno blamed the dead guy for the accident and only Wesley confessing revealed the truth, Paris falsified records but ultimately confessed himself.
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The Locarno-led team (including Wesley) thought too highly of their abilities, bit off more than they could chew, and one of their group died because of their arrogance. Faced with uncertain disciplinary actions, the Locarno-led team (including Wesley) decided to put the needs of the living ahead of the dead, and blamed pilot error on the part of the dead guy (which might not be entirely wrong, but didn't tell the entire story). Wesley eventually came around on wanting to tell the truth, but Locarno resisted. Wesley initially thought that Locarno was selfishly trying to protect himself above all others, but after Locarno threw himself on his sword, saving his team by claiming that he alone pressured the team into the stunt, and that he alone pressured them into lying about it, Wesley realized that he was wrong about Locarno, that he wasn't being selfish, he really was putting the team ahead of his own interests.

Tom Paris made a piloting error, directly killed three people, lied about it, got away with lying about it, felt bad about the killing and lying and turned himself in, and was thrown out of Starfleet as punishment.

TNG decided that Sito Jaxa (the Bajoran girl in Locarno's group) was worthy of redemption (
and being killed by Cardassians offscreen
). It seems quite ridiculous that the Voyager producers would have decided that Locarno was beyond redemption, when they character they created to replace him was essentially the same thing. But Voyager producers are known for being stupid. Being able to see Tom's backstory would have been a good thing (like O'Brien in DS9 having a history on TNG). They could've even worked Sito Jaxa
's death
into the story as part of Nick/Tom's motivation to join the Maquis. But that might've made the Maquis on Voyager slightly more interesting, so they couldn't do that.
 
M

Master Thespian

Member
Cheerilee said:
The Locarno-led team (including Wesley) thought too highly of their abilities, bit off more than they could chew, and one of their group died because of their arrogance. Faced with uncertain disciplinary actions, the Locarno-led team (including Wesley) decided to put the needs of the living ahead of the dead, and blamed pilot error on the part of the dead guy (which might not be entirely wrong, but didn't tell the entire story). Wesley eventually came around on wanting to tell the truth, but Locarno resisted. Wesley initially thought that Locarno was selfishly trying to protect himself above all others, but after Locarno threw himself on his sword, saving his team by claiming that he alone pressured the team into the stunt, and that he alone pressured them into lying about it, Wesley realized that he was wrong about Locarno, that he wasn't being selfish, he really was putting the team ahead of his own interests.

Tom Paris made a piloting error, directly killed three people, lied about it, got away with lying about it, felt bad about the killing and lying and turned himself in, and was thrown out of Starfleet as punishment.

TNG decided that Sito Jaxa (the Bajoran girl in Locarno's group) was worthy of redemption (
and being killed by Cardassians offscreen
). It seems quite ridiculous that the Voyager producers would have decided that Locarno was beyond redemption, when they character they created to replace him was essentially the same thing. But Voyager producers are known for being stupid. Being able to see Tom's backstory would have been a good thing (like O'Brien in DS9 having a history on TNG). They could've even worked Sito Jaxa
's death
into the story as part of Nick/Tom's motivation to join the Maquis. But that might've made the Maquis on Voyager slightly more interesting, so they couldn't do that.
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Exactly. They didn't want to pay the royalties and those "irredeemable" Locarno explanations are just a smokescreen.
 
D

DBT85

Member
Just thinking, apart from Worf and Nelix, did they ever have any uggo aliens as regular members of any crew? Did the federation only let sexy races in?
 
S

Stallion Dan

Member
DBT85 said:
Just thinking, apart from Worf and Nelix, did they ever have any uggo aliens as regular members of any crew? Did the federation only let sexy races in?
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Odo?

Is amazing how human aliens look, aside from a nose ridge, pointed ears, spots, if any difference at all, so many who don't even manage that level of distinction.

Imagine that Ba'ku milf in Insurrection had 3 eyes and tentacles where her boobs should be, Picard probably woulda been all "Screw these people". Luckily she looked 100% human.
 
D

DBT85

Member
Stallion Dan said:
Odo?

Is amazing how human aliens look, aside from a nose ridge, pointed ears, spots, if any difference at all, so many who don't even manage that level of distinction.

Imagine that Ba'ku milf in Insurrection had 3 eyes and tentacles where her boobs should be, Picard probably woulda been all "Screw these people". Luckily she looked 100% human.
Click to expand...

Meh Odo hardly gets in to the uggo catagory. He's just featureless man.

I'm thinking the proper fucked up looking races like Nausicaans for example. With the horns and mangled faces.
 
F

Fuchsdh

Member
DBT85 said:
Meh Odo hardly gets in to the uggo catagory. He's just featureless man.

I'm thinking the proper fucked up looking races like Nausicaans for example. With the horns and mangled faces.
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Just got into the big Founder stuff in S3, did they ever explain why the Changelings took Odo's features? Because Odo sucks at shapeshifting, apparently, which is why he looks all roughly hewn, but it makes no sense for the Founders to run around (even when they aren't around Odo) looking the same way.

And no, there's no real "uggo" aliens as regular features. Part of that has less to do with their "ugliness" (I mean, the only thing that is monstrous about Klingons is their teeth... at least that we can see) and more with the fact that I imagine doing A-level makeups for a character like a Nausicaans would be a bitch and a half.

I was thinking the other day about how they could do more far-afield aliens these days with good character CG finally trickling down to the TV level, but I can't think of many established races that would actually be that much of a fit. There'd be an interesting aspect to explore to Starfleet whether it tends to essentially become a humanoid power structure just because they're the ones building ships and thus excluding non-humanoids or those with very atypical living environments. Or even more directly, how Starfleet clearly seems to mostly be filled with humans.
 
W

weemadarthur

Member
Fuchsdh said:
Just got into the big Founder stuff in S3, did they ever explain why the Changelings took Odo's features? Because Odo sucks at shapeshifting, apparently, which is why he looks all roughly hewn, but it makes no sense for the Founders to run around (even when they aren't around Odo) looking the same way.
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Presumably it's to make Odo feel as welcome as possible. After all, they hate all humanoids, so there's no reason for them to bother looking like one.
 
T

TheYanger

Member
weemadarthur said:
Presumably it's to make Odo feel as welcome as possible. After all, they hate all humanoids, so there's no reason for them to bother looking like one.
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Definitely this. The importance they place on getting Odo back is miles beyond any other concern they ever show in the series. Everything they do in that regard is for Odo.
 
J

JoshuaJSlone

Member
Crazy non-human characters is one thing books have been able to pull off better for obvious reasons. Book Titan was said to be specifically made to be accommodating for all kinds of species. Off the top of my head I can think of crew members that were described as like dinosaurs, spiders, teddy bears, little bipedal deer with cybernetic arms.
 
C

Cheerilee

Member
Cheerilee said:
TNG decided that Sito Jaxa (the Bajoran girl in Locarno's group) was worthy of redemption (
and being killed by Cardassians offscreen
). It seems quite ridiculous that the Voyager producers would have decided that Locarno was beyond redemption, when they character they created to replace him was essentially the same thing. But Voyager producers are known for being stupid. Being able to see Tom's backstory would have been a good thing (like O'Brien in DS9 having a history on TNG). They could've even worked Sito Jaxa
's death
into the story as part of Nick/Tom's motivation to join the Maquis. But that might've made the Maquis on Voyager slightly more interesting, so they couldn't do that.
Click to expand...

I was just thinking about how Voyager could've used Nick Locarno's backstory for Tom Paris' first meeting with Harry Kim, and how he could've warned the naive rising-star Harry about how Starfleet has low tolerance for failure, even among superstars, and how they'll chew you up and spit you out if you screw up. Locarno and Nova Squadron were superstar ace pilots, and Locarno took the hit so the rest of them could still have careers. Ensign Sito was the strongest of the group, having grown up without a childhood, training to fight back against her oppressors, and she barely made it into Starfleet as a security officer
before being killed in peacetime by those same oppressors, the ones he ended up joining the Maquis to fight, while Starfleet literally did nothing about her death
.

Locarno would've heard that Wes washed out of Starfleet Academy a month later, and immediately dropped off the map. He's just gone. It's like the guy doesn't even exist anymore.

All they have to do is include Jean Hajar scrubbing plasma conduits somewhere, and Locarno's strong backstory/cautionary tale could be complete.
 
B

BorkBork

The Legend of BorkBork: BorkBorkity Borking
SL128 said:
They are all by the same guy, but @realRealDukat is the best.
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The UFP has a 6000 gram trilithium trade deficit with Bajor. It has been a one-sided deal from the beginning of AQFTA with massive numbers of replicators and ships lost. If Bajor is unwilling to pay for the badly needed field, it would be better to cancel the upcoming meeting.
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Ungrateful TRAITOR Michael Eddington, who should never have been released from prison, is calling President Sisko a weak leader. Terrible!
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I will be asking for a major investigation into VOTER FRAUD, including those registered to vote on two planets, those who are synthetic and even, those registered to vote who are in stasis (and many for a long time). Depending on results, we will strengthen up voting procedures!
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Signing orders to move forward with the relocation of the North American Indian colony on Dorvan V out of Cardassian space.
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Laugh crying at these latest ones.
 
D

DBT85

Member
funkystudent said:
Production teaser for Discovery dropped.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pu_W_5oZf7c

Doesnt reveal much. You get a bit of a shot of the uniform and some half made sets.

Also they are sticking with that ugly ass ship I guess.
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I still can't understand the design shift between NX01, Discovery and 1701.

But I'm looking forward to more Trek.

As I'm currently just starting Season 3 of Enterprise (and I'm enjoying it all to be fair) It's mad that it;s taken this long.
 
F

Fuchsdh

Member
DBT85 said:
I still can't understand the design shift between NX01, Discovery and 1701.

But I'm looking forward to more Trek.

As I'm currently just starting Season 3 of Enterprise (and I'm enjoying it all to be fair) It's mad that it;s taken this long.
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Not looking like the uniforms make much sense, either, either as a bridge between Enterprise and TOS or even the Kelvin stuff.

One of the things I really liked about the TOS-TNG time jump was that (combined with budget requirements) they ended up coming with a pretty elegant uniform evolution over time as the TWOK-era navy uniforms became more and more streamlined.
 
D

DBT85

Member
The first comment in the video is about the insignia being wrong and how Enterprise did everything wrong too.

a) I didn't know about the insignia, I love trek a lot but don't delve too deep as there's so much mishmash
b) I'm enjoying enterprise =/
 
N

Noema

Member
Just finished my TNG rewatch. Liked it even better than the first time I watched it through, almost 12 years ago.

There are some real stinkers in there, but when it's good, it's so good.

On to DS9.
 
D

DBT85

Member
I have to say, I wasn't particularly annoyed with the theme music of Enterprise. It wasn't obviously to the same kind of scale of the others, but it kind of felt full of hope and stuff which is what its all about anyway.

Then they seem to have upped the tempo in S3. My ears.
 
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