Henchmen21
Banned
I think he knows what it means. I think he means that calling
Macduff
Riker is XO
Macduff
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The General Star Trek Thread of Earl Grey Tea, Baseball, and KHHHAAAANNNN
- Thread starter The Librarian
- Start date
I think he knows what it means. I think he means that calling
Been a while since I saw the episode but I vaguely remember a cut to commercial with him on the bridge but no focus on him after the memory wipe, wouldn't remember if it was the teaser though.
If there's a 2nd in command then what the heck does Riker become?
edit: I'm spoilering because others are.. and I think someone on thread is still watching TNG for first time still
Henchmen21
Banned
Rofl I was questioning that myself as I was typing. Battersea Power Station is going on his first watch though so never hurts to be nice.
The comp refers to him as just Commander Riker in the episode when it's reading the senior staff list
Probably not.
I tend to be over-careful in threads where people are known to be going through a series for the first time, though.
I'd still spoiler certain older things in the Doctor Who thread if I didn't think it would piss certain people off.
Choppasmith
Member
So I just watched Code of Honor on my S1 TNG set. Man, what is up with that episode? I mean I heard from this thread that the cast and Gene hated it because of racist overtones/depictions, but even the music was so flamboyant and over the top, sounded more like TOS music. It sounded so different than what you hear in the rest of TNG.
Yea, I felt he was in a pre-commercial thing for sure... like some subtle thing that you wouldn't notice unless you're paying attention.
Battersea Power Station
Member
Heh, just realized that the second season of TNG ends in episode 48, Shades of Gray. Fitting it would be Riker's, the cad.
If only each season had 25 episodes...
If only each season had 25 episodes...
Henchmen21
Banned
Blame the '88 writers strike for that one. As clip shows go though it's not that bad. At least it comes up with a novel way to have it's clips instead of just having the characters reminisce. It's not all clip show either. 3/4th's of it is still original plot with the last 1/4 being clips.
SpoonyBard
Banned
Weird thing about that was that the strike had been over for a while when that episode was made, but they still ran out of scripts. Of course many of the Season 2 scripts were already made before the strike, and several S2 eps were also recycled from Stre trek Phase II scripts...
And saving money seems to be as big reason for this episode as the strike (from Memory Alpha):
Director Rob Bowman commented, "It was Paramount saying, 'We gave you more money for "Elementary, Dear Data" and the Borg show. Now do us a favor and give us a three-day show.' So that's what you do. It's an accepted part of the medium."
SpoonyBard
Banned
I finally got the TNG Season 1 bluray set, and watched the first disc. The effect shots look really nice, but man does the extra detail make the sets look bad. And Data's makeup gets messed up in couple of scenes (look at his hands after he plays with the Chinese finger trap). But yeah, can't really complain too much 
Escape Goat
Member
I finally got the TNG Season 1 bluray set, and watched the first disc. The effect shots look really nice, but man does the extra detail make the sets look bad. And Data's makeup gets messed up in couple of scenes (look at his hands after he plays with the Chinese finger trap). But yeah, can't really complain too much
I thought the sets looked bad even before the HD. It was very boring set design and very much mired in 80s design.
SpoonyBard
Banned
Yeah, I didn't really mean the disign (which gets better later on, espesially the corridors will look much better when they are less reflective). But the quality of workmanship is somewhat shoddy:
http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/observations/thelastoutpost/05a-thelastoutpost-r.jpg
Of course that detail was never meant to be noticeable, it was meant to look good enough in NTSC, but still...
I just watched the episode for the first time and I thought the same thing at first, I figured considering how they were concentrating on him that he was introduced on an earlier episode and I missed it or they were going to kill him. That is till they brought up the officers list and then it was pretty obvious what was going on, lol.
Battersea Power Station
Member
I was just making a "50 Shades of Gray" joke
Yea, watching through TNG now she was a pretty interesting character, it is a shame she didn't return for DS9, I think she would have been pretty good next to Sisko and a quick read of the Wiki says she was offered a place on Voyager too which would have worked out considering how she left, a shame we never saw her again.
Escape Goat
Member
Which is an example of why I liked DS9 best. Not all the characters were Mary Sues that loved each other unconditionally and never disagreed. Ensign Ro marched to the beat of her own drummer. She openly disagreed and would even comment on the decisions of superior officers.
StalkerUKCG
Banned
Which is why I wish she had Accepted the role offered to her to be a Major character in DS9, Originally she was going to replace Kira.
In my dreams DS9 Ignores Wormhole aliens focuses on the Cardassian X Bajaoran Drama Then battles the Borg and The Dominion. Is refitted visually to look like a Starfleet Station and Sisko acts like Sisko. More Appearances from the Enterprise crew docking at the station.
I really like DS9 but the religion aspects of it with Wormhole gods and Power Beam Stuggles between "chosen ones" really gets to me. That is far removed from the Sci Fi Technobable filled Star Trek i enjoy.
I agree with everything but the bolded part. I liked its different look. But yeah, I generally hare it when sci fi gets involved in religion.
Battersea Power Station
Member
Well, Ro and other aliens are one matter, but I don't mind humans behaving in a "post- personal conflict" manner. It doesn't have to be an accurate prediction of our future, but at least it's different from how we relate now. If you were to set a show 400 years in the past, society should be portrayed differently. There's no reason to believe that in the future people will behave as we do now. I like anything that shows a different perspective.
DrForester
Kills Photobucket
She was on the real Law and Order SUV for an episode. Was OK. Honestly, Jeri Ryan did much better as a lawyer for a few episodes.
Watched some episode of TNG last night with a young Tom Paris, well, whatever his name was that he was playing with Wesley Crusher and the Jupiter accident. I thought Doctor Who was bad for using actors then bringing them back, but Star Trek goes overboard, I know the actor of Tuvok is in a later episode at some point too.
If there is any it will be the lead up to the action I imagine or some sort of break but I doubt it will be very long and nothing like in a typical Star Trek series.
It is a film after all and not a TV series, they don't get 20+ episodes per series every year to spend time doing things, they get like 2 hours that needs to bring in as many people as possible, and sadly classic Star Trek wouldn't do that anymore.
What I hope happens is once they get the films out and the actors move on they will start a new series that would hopefully return to the classic style of doing episodes due to series budgets and a little more updated inline with the Films.
If there is any it will be the lead up to the action I imagine or some sort of break but I doubt it will be very long and nothing like in a typical Star Trek series.
It is a film after all and not a TV series, they don't get 20+ episodes per series every year to spend time doing things, they get like 2 hours that needs to bring in as many people as possible, and sadly classic Star Trek wouldn't do that anymore.
What I hope happens is once they get the films out and the actors move on they will start a new series that would hopefully return to the classic style of doing episodes due to series budgets and a little more updated inline with the Films.
classic star trek doesn't work in a 2 hour movie, IMO. the best star trek movies were more about the action.
Henchmen21
Banned
"The First Duty". One of the better ones from season 5.
Dude, it doesn't happen as frequently as you think. And you don know that the Tom Paris character was originally going to be the same character from this ep? They just changed the name so they wouldn't have to pay the writers of this ep royalties every time Paris was on screen.
Star Trek IV begs to differ. Was the highest grossing movie until First Contact came out. Star Trek VI was also light on the action and considered one of the best.
Hyphen
Member
Hi guys. I'm not much of a Star Trek fan, but I must admit to really enjoying the handful of Next Generation episodes that I've caught on tv. I'd appreciate any help in identifying the following couple of episodes that I wouldn't mind watching again -
1) The crew encounter
2) The crew are
3) This next one is a little tricky. All I remember is that Guinan plays a significant part as she knows what's happening, and no-one else does (I think) - Anyway, I vaguely remember it involving some sort of
.
I hope my descriptions will help name the episodes that I'm after. And if anyone can point me in the direction of similar episodes that would be great.
1) The crew encounter
an entity of some sort in space. This entity declares that the entire crew must die because they have invaded the entity's space. Or something like that. Anyway, Picard pleads for a chance at survival, to which the entity agrees to wiping their memory of the last 20 or so minutes, and sending them on their way. However, the memory wipe won't work on Data, so Picard instructs him to never reveal the events that have just occurred before the memory wipe. Data does so, the entity wipes the crew's memories of the encounter and sends them away. However, the crew can't shake the feeling that something significant has happened, and Data will not reveal anything, despite Picard's best efforts.
2) The crew are
stuck in a time loop which continues to repeat the day's events. I remember them paying Poker, and various characters thinking that they've experienced certain events before. Geordi comes up with the notion that they are indeed in a time loop. I think the crew also encounter another ship that was caught in the loop, and they end up crashing into it (I think) and the ships are destroyed. At which point the loop begins again. Or something along those lines.
3) This next one is a little tricky. All I remember is that Guinan plays a significant part as she knows what's happening, and no-one else does (I think) - Anyway, I vaguely remember it involving some sort of
time travel. Or atleast some kind of 'other' dimension where there's another Enterprise ship, but this one is different in look (I think), crew (one of whom should be dead) and everything. Everyone is oblivious to the change/events, except Guinan who feels that something is wrong, and that the ship she is on and everything that is going on around her is wrong. I remember there being a great scene where Guinan asks Picard to do something significant, and it was all based on him trusting her judgement
I hope my descriptions will help name the episodes that I'm after. And if anyone can point me in the direction of similar episodes that would be great.
http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Clues_(episode)
http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Cause_and_Effect_(episode)
http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Yesterday's_Enterprise_(episode)
No time to think of recommendations at the moment, perhaps Disaster or Parallels, but the episodes you named are among the best in the series so your taste is good!
Edit: other similar episodes off the top of my head would be Phantasms, Night Terrors, Genesis maybe? (bit scientifically unsound, but a fun episode sort of along those lines).
All sort of 'wtf is going on' type episodes. There are plenty more I didn't think of.
DrForester
Kills Photobucket
I'm sorry, that's just not true.
This just blows it out of the park.
Think all the original films had great posters, heck, even 5.
benjipwns
Banned
1. Clues
2. Cause and Effect
3. Yesterday's Enterprise
EDIT: Beaten.
I think it and Nemesis could have been saved if the right person stepped in.
EDIT2: Has any kind of original script/plot for V been released? I read Piller's book on Insurrection and was wondering if there was any kind of information on V. I know Shatner says he got it butchered and without any budget.
III has a just great poster.
2. Cause and Effect
3. Yesterday's Enterprise
EDIT: Beaten.
Five has a number of good things going for it, it's a shame about the rest, and even more of a shame about the execution.
I think it and Nemesis could have been saved if the right person stepped in.
EDIT2: Has any kind of original script/plot for V been released? I read Piller's book on Insurrection and was wondering if there was any kind of information on V. I know Shatner says he got it butchered and without any budget.
III has a just great poster.
Hyphen
Member
benjipwns said:
Thanks benjipwns, much appreciated.
TheYanger said:
Thanks alot. If these NG episodes are among the best in the series then I guess I should count myself lucky for catching them amongst the few others I've seen. I'll also check out your recommendations.
Thanks again to both of you.
I think you're understating the action in VI a bit. There's some Khan inspired space battles, several brawls on the prison planet, and a massacre of a Klingon ship complete with floating blood globs. There's even the famous 'surgery on a torpedo' nail-biter scene.
It is easily the most genuinely thinky of all the Trek films, but it's still more actiony than the series was most of the time, and it plays out on a pretty grand stage. They stretched their budget pretty far, given that they were at that point using TNG hand-me-downs for sets.
Escape Goat
Member
Henchmen21
Banned
Outside of Yesterday's Enterprise, those aren't even the best episodes.
You're overstating the action in VI though. There's all of one space battle (Kronos I being fired on twice doesn't constitute a space battle). There's one battle down on the prison which we cut into halfway through which lasts all of five seconds once Kirk kicks the guy in the knee-testicles. The fight with Marta is equally as short and keeps cutting away during most of it. The massacre aboard Kronos I isn't a battle since it's literally one-sided. And the surgery on a torpedo happens during the space battle I mentioned above so singling it out as a separate scene doesn't count.
Look VI is a great movie. The last great Trek movie in fact. But it's not all that actiony if you think about it.
DrForester
Kills Photobucket
I don't know. VI, and I'd even say II were not action films. They had action sequences, but they didn't make the film. Kirk and Khan never even met face to face.
And the TNG set redressing on VI were amazing.
Henchmen21
Banned
Lol guy in the chair on the left looks like he's falling asleep.
"huh? wha? Kirks on trial? mmmm...wake me when it's over...zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz"
"huh? wha? Kirks on trial? mmmm...wake me when it's over...zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz"
I just rewatched Timescapes, one of my faves and definitely similar to those.
Just watched "Interface" where LaForge's mother disappears/dies (I guess it is never confirmed that she dies).
Occurred to me that almost every single cast member accross all the shows has at least 1 dead parent. Is it easier to write characters that way?
Occurred to me that almost every single cast member accross all the shows has at least 1 dead parent. Is it easier to write characters that way?
Ask Disney.
SpoonyBard
Banned
It's a cheap way of getting emotional response from audience. I hated how they killed Picard's family in Generations, it was totally unnecessary plot device...
I remember I heard a writer once saying that when you have a properly fleshed-out character, it's a piece of cake to imagine the world that gave birth to that character, and then it becomes easy to give them parents that make sense. And when you see a character that doesn't have parents, especially when the story calls for them to appear and they conspicuously don't, it's a good indication that the writer took at least one shortcut somewhere.
If a writer makes a thin character, maybe it's hard for that writer to make parents for that character, so maybe creating just one parent is a major achievement, and then they give up and say the other parent is gone for whatever convenient reason.
For Trek, I think it makes sense for most of the characters to rarely bring up the subject of their parents, because they're mostly all adults, and soldiers on assignment.
I think Worf made the most immediate sense to have obviously dead parents, because he's an orphaned alien. But then his adopted parents are both still living, and I think they were a good fit for "a world that could've created a Worf", so I don't think Worf was a case of laziness.
Picard had two dead parents, but I think they hardly went there, it was just something that was in Picard's past, and they chose to focus on Picard's brother and their sense of family responsibility. I don't think that Picard was a lazy character either. (Until the movies, of course.)
Edit: So it can be easier to write dead parents, and I've seen at least one person suggest that it can be an indiaction of lazy writing, but that's by no means certain.
Molly O'Brien - parents alive (on screen)
Julian Bashir - parents alive (on screen)
Harry Kim - parents alive (mentioned)
Nog - parents alive (mother abandoned him)
But yeah, it's hard to find many examples! I think Bashir's about the only case I can think of where both his parents have a big role to play in at least one episode.
Julian Bashir - parents alive (on screen)
Harry Kim - parents alive (mentioned)
Nog - parents alive (mother abandoned him)
But yeah, it's hard to find many examples! I think Bashir's about the only case I can think of where both his parents have a big role to play in at least one episode.
Ben Sisko's parents are accounted for.... Quark and Rom's...I don't see a single dead parent as laziness, that reads more to me as just saying 'oh their parents are dead' and not describing them. Moogie is clearly fleshed out and Quark and Rom's father is definitely mentioned enough to get an idea that he was a traditional ferengi and influenced Quark a lot, to the point that Rom is clearly the mama's boy and Quark takes after his dad.
Ezri's family is there even though she's barely in the show.
Ezri's family is there even though she's barely in the show.