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The General Star Trek Thread of Earl Grey Tea, Baseball, and KHHHAAAANNNN
- Thread starter The Librarian
- Start date
Sir_Crocodile
Member
It gets big play in the roman & gangster episodes.
rykomatsu
Member
I swore I'd never watch ST:ENT, but succumbed to some boredom and watched it...Season 4 of ST:ENT was surprisingly good. The Xindi/sphere builder stuff wasn't my cup of tea, but S4 and its mini-arcs and stories regarding UFP member civs were pretty enjoyable to the point where I kinda wished there was another season. It was nice to see man's best friend along for the ride too.
If there's ever a TV series reboot, I actually wouldn't mind seeing the years between Terra Prime and These are the Voyages...
If there's ever a TV series reboot, I actually wouldn't mind seeing the years between Terra Prime and These are the Voyages...
Look up the S5 NX refit designs. Also, Shran was going to join the crew. Would have been great...
GameplayWhore
Member
http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/The_Return_of_the_Archons_(episode)
Near the end of Season 1.
I was the same. Season 3 did nothing for me, but I ate up Season 4 like it was chocolate. Mind you, I had given up during season 3 on the original run, and I only saw season four about three years ago. I think I particularly like it because they finally stopped paying mere lip service to the intent of the series. Suddenly, the development of the Federation, though fasttracked, became something that they were obviously giving heavy attention to.
edit: Also, "Beta III" is an incredibly lazy name for a planet.
DrForester
Kills Photobucket
For any daring parties, John de Lancie returned on My Little Pony today, and they basically did a pony version of Deja Q.
Frankfurter
Member
Currently watching Voyager episode 4/11 (Concerning Flight) and I'm literally shouting at my TV. Voy gets attacked and as so often they are like "Hmm, what's going on... hmm, sb. is attacking us, what are we gonna do... hmm... let's just wait until sth. bad happens... hmm.... hmm... hmm, oops, they just stole half of our ship..."
*PicardFacepalm*
*PicardFacepalm*
DrForester
Kills Photobucket
Buy you get John Rys Davis.
Escape Goat
Member
ST Enterprise bluray cover. Oh dear...everyone's head has been shopped in. And Tpol is emaciated.
Escape Goat
Member
I think the most exciting thing about the new TNG blurays, even more so than the HD transfer, is who gets the honor of being put on the cover with Picard.
First it was Riker and Data. And then Troi and Worf. I wonder whos next?!
They all look bad to me. The second looks like the Enterprise is crashing. The third looks like its trying to hide Archer's face. And the first just looks lazy.
First it was Riker and Data. And then Troi and Worf. I wonder whos next?!
They all look bad to me. The second looks like the Enterprise is crashing. The third looks like its trying to hide Archer's face. And the first just looks lazy.
DrForester
Kills Photobucket
Those all look decent. I'm partial to the ship one.
Red Liquorice
Member
I'm rewatching Enterprise at the moment, having only skimmed through it before.
I'm only two thirds through season 2, but the casting or character choices just seem so off putting.
Scott Bakula is a dreamboat. He's one of my teenage wank fantasies, but I feel like they give him so little to work with. It's like "he has a dog" is his only personality trait. Maybe he has too much baggage with Quantum Leap, but even without that they did such a bad job of writing a unique Captain.
The rest of the crew are like half a dozen Harry Kim's, and the storylines all feel like Voyager rejects. I feel sorry for them as I'm watching because I know they will only get 4 seasons of regular pay when they probably expected seven!
I'm not fan enough to know if the races they meet in Enterprise have any fan service to the original series - other than the Andorians - but it feels like they missed so much story opportunity and they went for the occasional strip/kiss scene as some way to link the show back to the original. Whilst the rest of the time the usual action shows dominated. I would've liked to see more backstory on the hows and whys of the Next Gen era.
So far my favourite episode has been the T'Pol has a disease episode, it felt like they were referencing something relatively modern in the same style as the old series and it worked emotionally.
I'm only two thirds through season 2, but the casting or character choices just seem so off putting.
Scott Bakula is a dreamboat. He's one of my teenage wank fantasies, but I feel like they give him so little to work with. It's like "he has a dog" is his only personality trait. Maybe he has too much baggage with Quantum Leap, but even without that they did such a bad job of writing a unique Captain.
The rest of the crew are like half a dozen Harry Kim's, and the storylines all feel like Voyager rejects. I feel sorry for them as I'm watching because I know they will only get 4 seasons of regular pay when they probably expected seven!
I'm not fan enough to know if the races they meet in Enterprise have any fan service to the original series - other than the Andorians - but it feels like they missed so much story opportunity and they went for the occasional strip/kiss scene as some way to link the show back to the original. Whilst the rest of the time the usual action shows dominated. I would've liked to see more backstory on the hows and whys of the Next Gen era.
So far my favourite episode has been the T'Pol has a disease episode, it felt like they were referencing something relatively modern in the same style as the old series and it worked emotionally.
And that's why there was no season 5.
Seriously though, all of those boxes are better than what they went with. The first option looks the most functional, but I like the second one more (which is apparently why I made fun of it).
JoshuaJSlone
Member
I guess the opinion most received was "Screw all of those, I want marching!"
Kai Dracon
Writing a dinosaur space opera symphony
I always felt Enterprise as a child of conflict. It wanted to be "retro" but it wanted the convenience of many Next Generation plot devices, technologies, and tropes. It wanted to have story arcs, but wanted the ease of stand-alone episodes.
Over the course of the first two seasons, there was the occasional episode that seemed conceived with the show's core premise in mind. Those were sandwiched between three or four episodes which were as stated above, rejected Voyager scripts.
The problem with the third season Xindi arc were twofold IMO: 1 the show should have been bold from season 1 and entered the modern era with full arc based seasons from the outset. 2. the Xindi concept, while actually daring in many ways, was mired in the temporal cold war bollocks for its basic premise, and didn't have much to do with the core concept of the show.
As I saw it, Enterprise was supposed to be about examining a very big idea. How humanity could evolve from 20th/21st century psychology, society, and ethics, into the 23rd century "evolved" humanity of Star Trek. Humanity in Star Trek has really put its big britches on. Humans there are so evolved, that they've not only solved all their internal problems, but become a role model to the galaxy and united other civilizations in a common cause.
In the same way that the original series used science fiction as a platform to shove uncomfortable and controversial topics into the face of timid and conservative audiences, Enterprise was the perfect opportunity to recreate the spirit of the original Star Trek. There's a wealth of material waiting to be mined with bold predictions and hypotheses about how human civilization might cut free the dead weight of its varied psychoses and grow to the next tier.
I think my disappointment with Enterprise crystalized in an early episode where a female crew member gets romantic with Phlox because she's got a crush on him. He explores this, and we see the human woman deal with working through some weirdness of his alien nature. And in the end, it falls through - why? Because Phlox clarifies that his society encourages polyamorous relationships and Phlox has multiple partners. And this human woman of the 22nd century freaks. Because she says, that's not the human way of life. Confused and grossed out, and backs away in humiliation. Phlox makes a pithy note to self that humans need to evolve a bit more.
A more daring script might have it that rather than be surprised and grossed, the woman takes it in stride, but informs Phlox that she's not poly; perhaps note that it's too bad he hadn't met a relative of hers who is, they'd have hit it off great. About then I wondered if Enterprise would deal with revealing a crew member was gay by making a big point about it and have Archer pat said crew member on the shoulder, informing them in a fatherly manner that nobody would hold it against them.
I think this has always been the failure of Star Trek in general past the original series. Nobody involved with Trek after Roddenberry really seems to have grasped what Trek was used for in the beginning. So while much of Trek and fun and cool and I have nothing against it, it's kinda represented great wasted potential, given that Star Trek is to America what Doctor Who is to the UK. It's Everybody's Sci-Fi and as such a great platform for ideas.
Sorry, was just thinking about the big Trek picture while browsing the thread.
Over the course of the first two seasons, there was the occasional episode that seemed conceived with the show's core premise in mind. Those were sandwiched between three or four episodes which were as stated above, rejected Voyager scripts.
The problem with the third season Xindi arc were twofold IMO: 1 the show should have been bold from season 1 and entered the modern era with full arc based seasons from the outset. 2. the Xindi concept, while actually daring in many ways, was mired in the temporal cold war bollocks for its basic premise, and didn't have much to do with the core concept of the show.
As I saw it, Enterprise was supposed to be about examining a very big idea. How humanity could evolve from 20th/21st century psychology, society, and ethics, into the 23rd century "evolved" humanity of Star Trek. Humanity in Star Trek has really put its big britches on. Humans there are so evolved, that they've not only solved all their internal problems, but become a role model to the galaxy and united other civilizations in a common cause.
In the same way that the original series used science fiction as a platform to shove uncomfortable and controversial topics into the face of timid and conservative audiences, Enterprise was the perfect opportunity to recreate the spirit of the original Star Trek. There's a wealth of material waiting to be mined with bold predictions and hypotheses about how human civilization might cut free the dead weight of its varied psychoses and grow to the next tier.
I think my disappointment with Enterprise crystalized in an early episode where a female crew member gets romantic with Phlox because she's got a crush on him. He explores this, and we see the human woman deal with working through some weirdness of his alien nature. And in the end, it falls through - why? Because Phlox clarifies that his society encourages polyamorous relationships and Phlox has multiple partners. And this human woman of the 22nd century freaks. Because she says, that's not the human way of life. Confused and grossed out, and backs away in humiliation. Phlox makes a pithy note to self that humans need to evolve a bit more.
A more daring script might have it that rather than be surprised and grossed, the woman takes it in stride, but informs Phlox that she's not poly; perhaps note that it's too bad he hadn't met a relative of hers who is, they'd have hit it off great. About then I wondered if Enterprise would deal with revealing a crew member was gay by making a big point about it and have Archer pat said crew member on the shoulder, informing them in a fatherly manner that nobody would hold it against them.
I think this has always been the failure of Star Trek in general past the original series. Nobody involved with Trek after Roddenberry really seems to have grasped what Trek was used for in the beginning. So while much of Trek and fun and cool and I have nothing against it, it's kinda represented great wasted potential, given that Star Trek is to America what Doctor Who is to the UK. It's Everybody's Sci-Fi and as such a great platform for ideas.
Sorry, was just thinking about the big Trek picture while browsing the thread.
Red Liquorice
Member
Agree with all that, especially the last part about the premise of the show.
lastplayed
Member
Finally got my hands on the reissue of this beast last week. Riker's dialogue is pretty cool. Warp 13! I totally forgot about that.
Watched the Documentary Trek Nation by Gene Roddenberry Jr. after hearing some people talk about it and it being on netflix making it easy. Lots of interesting new looks at various things and unique peeks at Gene himself.
He was apparently quite the ladies man. He apparently was well known for having lots of ladies on the side even cheating on Majel the same week he married her.
George Lucas talks a bit about star trek and theres alot of interesting general stuff. Its as much about Jr learning about his dad who died when he was only 17 as it is exploring Trek.
Some sad stuff with alot of recordings near his death and how multiple strokes etc just ravaged him.
He was apparently quite the ladies man. He apparently was well known for having lots of ladies on the side even cheating on Majel the same week he married her.
George Lucas talks a bit about star trek and theres alot of interesting general stuff. Its as much about Jr learning about his dad who died when he was only 17 as it is exploring Trek.
Some sad stuff with alot of recordings near his death and how multiple strokes etc just ravaged him.
krameriffic
Member
So I just queued up TNG, DS9 and Voyager on Netflix.
Looks like I'll have plenty of stuff to watch for the next few weeks.
Looks like I'll have plenty of stuff to watch for the next few weeks.
Duane Cunningham
Member
I'm still slooowly working my way through TOS. I just watched The Apple. Okay episode, but a bit of a letdown after just seeing the crazy iconic Mirror, Mirror the episode before. It seems like the "Prime Directive" concept is still developing in this. In fact, it's a big part of it. The premise is that the people on this planet are all under the control of a nearby machine in a cave. The machine keeps them all immortal, healthy, attractive, etc. And they're happy. They don't reproduce or anything... they don't even know how. They just bask in the sun eating exotic fruit, smiling and joking.
When they get there, Spock and McCoy get into a big philosophical argument about it. Spock says they have no right to interfere, and McCoy says fuck that, these people are slaves and it's unnatural. Kirk sides with McCoy, and has Scotty fire up the lasers and blow the hell out of the machine from space. The episode ends with Spock still a little uneasy about what they did, and Kirk and McCoy respond by cracking jokes at his expense. The end.
Meanwhile, Chekhov is part of the landing party along with a one-off blonde crew member, and oh my god, it's just instant make-out city from the second they hit the ground. Kirk even has to tell them to cool it. Definitely not behavior that would fly later in the series. Or in any military ever.
Next up the The Doomsday Machine, which I'm aware is one of the signature episodes of TOS, won a bunch of awards, etc.
When they get there, Spock and McCoy get into a big philosophical argument about it. Spock says they have no right to interfere, and McCoy says fuck that, these people are slaves and it's unnatural. Kirk sides with McCoy, and has Scotty fire up the lasers and blow the hell out of the machine from space. The episode ends with Spock still a little uneasy about what they did, and Kirk and McCoy respond by cracking jokes at his expense. The end.
Meanwhile, Chekhov is part of the landing party along with a one-off blonde crew member, and oh my god, it's just instant make-out city from the second they hit the ground. Kirk even has to tell them to cool it. Definitely not behavior that would fly later in the series. Or in any military ever.
Next up the The Doomsday Machine, which I'm aware is one of the signature episodes of TOS, won a bunch of awards, etc.
Duane Cunningham
Member
Okay, excuse the double post. I just watched Kirk vs Unicron, aka The Doomsday Machine on my lunch break. Man, that was great. Beginning to end, that was a fantastic representation of TOS. I guess it was meant to be based on Moby Dick a little bit? Whatever the case, that was one of the best ones yet. Commodore Decker was a great tragic character, all the regular crew was at their best, the pacing tension and acting were all top notch. So good.
I'm really digging TOS right now. S1 took me several months of just watching an episode here and there, but it really has clicked with me lately.
EDIT: Okay now it's the next day. Just saw Catspaw. Dumb Halloween themed episode, haha. Fun, though, kind of. Same ol' "we got trapped on a planet by aliens with psychic powers" shtick, though.
EDIT: Last night I watched the next one, too: I, Mudd. Another kind of comedy relief episode, but a good one for sure. It was cool to see Harry Mudd come back from season 1. He is an awesome character, just a hilarious scumbag. I feel like I've seen Kirk "talk a computer to death" several times now, but this time was pretty good... the whole gang just goes crazy and turn into the Animaniacs, irritating the androids until they just spark and smoke and shut down.
Metamorphosis is next.
I'm really digging TOS right now. S1 took me several months of just watching an episode here and there, but it really has clicked with me lately.
EDIT: Okay now it's the next day. Just saw Catspaw. Dumb Halloween themed episode, haha. Fun, though, kind of. Same ol' "we got trapped on a planet by aliens with psychic powers" shtick, though.
EDIT: Last night I watched the next one, too: I, Mudd. Another kind of comedy relief episode, but a good one for sure. It was cool to see Harry Mudd come back from season 1. He is an awesome character, just a hilarious scumbag. I feel like I've seen Kirk "talk a computer to death" several times now, but this time was pretty good... the whole gang just goes crazy and turn into the Animaniacs, irritating the androids until they just spark and smoke and shut down.
Metamorphosis is next.
Ein Bear
Member
So I'm making my way through Enterprise for the first time, have just started Season 3.
Jolene Blalock sure is a sexy lady, but damn if it isn't really creepy just how much time the show spends ogling T'Pol. It's like they can't go a single episode without putting her in that decontamination room, or have someone trying to have sex with her, or making her go all crazy and sex mad, or having her get naked, etc, etc. It's kind of uncomfortable.
Jolene Blalock sure is a sexy lady, but damn if it isn't really creepy just how much time the show spends ogling T'Pol. It's like they can't go a single episode without putting her in that decontamination room, or have someone trying to have sex with her, or making her go all crazy and sex mad, or having her get naked, etc, etc. It's kind of uncomfortable.
It's really dumb.
I feel like they get much better about that in Season 4, but buckle up because Season 3 is easily the worst in that "CHECK OUT HOW SEXY SHE IS, BRO" department.
The Elite
BOSS
Looks a lot different than I remembered. Need to watch that episode again. It's been so long.
The Librarian
Banned
Robert Hewitt Wolfe is doing another Q&A on Twitter. Follow him!
Finally got my hands on the reissue of this beast last week. Riker's dialogue is pretty cool. Warp 13! I totally forgot about that.
If I had received this for christmas between age 5-12 I would have started crying with unbounded joy.
unknownhero
Member
seeing that all good things future enterprise model makes me remember that next generation enterprise model I had as a kid. I still would have it if it wasn't for a damn break in that happen the summer after I got it. I couldn't prove it but I thought it was a former neighbor's kid. bad memories aside, i think i'll look for something like that on amazon, just for kicks.
SpoonyBard
Banned
Robert Hewitt Wolfe is doing another Q&A on Twitter. Follow him!
DS9 mainly recycled the same themes that were in TNG, being a spin off series after all. TNG episode The High Ground was even not aired in UK and Ireland fpr many years, because Data had a line "Ireland was unified in 2024 after a successful terrorist campaign". Of course American politics used to support terrorism as a viable political tool more openly in the 80's...
davidcotton
Member
On a slightly DS9 related note, big finish have released the first of a new audio for Ds9 actress Chase Masterson called Vienna. Apparantly it's sold well enough to go to series as there's at least one box set coming later.
bigfinish.com
cheers
bigfinish.com
cheers
Just watched that movie the other day. Uniform changes also annoyed me.
Whole movie feels like a big episode on TNG really. Even has the episode like B plot with Data's emotion chip stuff. Doesn't seem so bad when you view it that way.
Sound track is the highlight.
The Librarian
Banned
I don't understand what recycling a theme has to do with how hard a type of character would be to have on the air, and I disagree. Just because one series deals with one theme for a couple of episodes out of its 178 or so, and one series takes that same theme and makes it a major part of itself, doesn't mean it's recycling.
SpoonyBard
Banned
Well, not necessarily, but ds9 doesn't really do that much to examine the complexity of the situation, outside the feelings of some individual characters. Kira and Bajorans are always shown as being the good guys (outside the religious nuts), and Dukat and Cardassians always as the evil race (outside a couple of exeptions, like the guy in Duet).
In TNG Bajorans attacked Federation in order to get them involved and help them against their enemy. Why not make Kira guilty of death of number of Federation people, and show that the Cardassian actually did a lot of good in Bajor before being forced to fight back against the hostile Bajoran separatist? The situation was pretty black and white as it was...
The Librarian
Banned
I disagree that the show painted either races as completely good or evil. Maybe more good for the Bajorans and more bad for the Cardassians, but it was definitely a more matter-of-fact tone for both of them. As early as S2 the show was airing faults of the Bajorans, and way towards the end you feel more sorry for the Cardassians than anything. As early as S4 you feel sorry for them.
And the show did try to emphasis the good the occupation did through Garak and Dukat. The show had more complex Cardassians than it did Bajorans. It did a great job of humanizing both races.
And the show did try to emphasis the good the occupation did through Garak and Dukat. The show had more complex Cardassians than it did Bajorans. It did a great job of humanizing both races.
Synth_floyd
Banned
He was banging Nichelle Nichols for a few years before he married his wife.
Saw this on my twitter feed. Thought you guys might enjoy it. No idea what's going on, but I love Picard's reaction.
Its the gag reel from the season 2 blue-ray. There is some great stuff in that video.
Escape Goat
Member
Plinkett pointed it out in his review but I remember as a kid thinking it didn't make any sense but it was about the probe on Veridian 3. i understand why its fucked; you dont want your characters sitting around for 8+ minutes while the probe travels at sublight speeds to the sun. Keep in mind while this scene is going on you have Riker having a senior moment and allows a Bird of Prey to blast the Federation flagship out of the stars. So its a Hollywood decision that shits on common sense.
Anywho, the probe didn't have a warp drive so it would have taken a lot longer than 8 minutes. So that was pretty stupid. But they were pretty consistent in their stupidity.
Anywho, the probe didn't have a warp drive so it would have taken a lot longer than 8 minutes. So that was pretty stupid. But they were pretty consistent in their stupidity.
lunchtoast
Member
So I started watching TNG for the first time. Seen bits and pieces and the movies over the years, but never been into Star Trek.
It's pretty awesome. I imagine it would great being a fan of Star Trek and watching it when it first aired. I was thinking of making a lttp thread when I got into the later seasons then saw this thread. Only more than half way through the first season so far but I know it's just going to get better.
I prefer the episodes that take place on the ship rather than cheaply built planets. Wouldn't mind taking some time off on that planet where everyone is blonde and runs around everywhere.
It's pretty awesome. I imagine it would great being a fan of Star Trek and watching it when it first aired. I was thinking of making a lttp thread when I got into the later seasons then saw this thread. Only more than half way through the first season so far but I know it's just going to get better.
I prefer the episodes that take place on the ship rather than cheaply built planets. Wouldn't mind taking some time off on that planet where everyone is blonde and runs around everywhere.
Had the season 2 gag reel ever been leaked or available elsewhere before the Blu-Ray? I never remember seeing any of it before so I was literally LOLing a few times at it since it was all new.
To go back to ENT for a minute and it's "conflicted" nature. Someone mentioned how it wanted to show how Humans went from 20th/21st centure concepts to move into the TOS era. Actually, I think the more interesting time frame in the ST timeline (either prime or 2009 timeline since it's before ENT) is the era of the past from First Contact and immediately after. It's always seemed to me like the backstory assumes an amazingly fast turn-around from what looks like a rather dystopian future (as seen in the Q-judge scenes in the TNG pilot and finale) and the refuge camp-looking society of Cochran in First Contact to the society of ENT where things look pretty hunk-dory for for the most part. That's supposed to be a difference of what? Seventy years?
Then again, maybe I'm overestimating what the damage to society was supposed to have been from the third World War just based on what we've been shown.
StalkerUKCG
Banned
The Uniform thing was sem-intentional they did make original uniforms for the movie but for what ever reason they where cancelled so the decided to use both sets as a way to phase in the new uniforms.
Jonathan Frakes had to borrow Avery Brooks' uniform and LeVar Burton had to borrow Colm Meaney's uniform from Star Trek: Deep Space Nine, neither of which fit the actors very well.
Cut Uniform
I actually really like the mixed look
Professor Renegade
Banned
I was never into Star Trek for a long time, but 2 years ago I had to watch and episode from TNG called The Measure of a Man. It was such a great episode that I found myself watching the reruns on TV. TNG is a great science fiction series, and personally Data is my favourite character.
lastplayed
Member
Maybe. But the TV show never had anything as epic as these scenes:
I didn't mind the uniform thing. It felt chaotic and transitional, which kinda matched what was going on in the larger Trek universe.
lunchtoast
Member
lunchtoast
Member
So I watched the episode where Wesley takes an entrance exam for starfleet with 3 others. We already know he's some genius as well as the other candidates. Starfleet is the officer program right? Are they saying you have to be some genius to enter and it's incredibly hard to be an officer? Or in the future are people just overall smarter since in a previous episode they had some 10 year old complaining about calculus.