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[SCULLIBUNDO]

Fuck what Del Toro wanted. The Hobbit was always going to be an english-language movie and Del Toro can't make a good film in English!

 

[Wiggum2007]

I'd take a Spanish Hobbit

 

[Edmond Dantès]

I really wish Tolkien finished his massive overhaul of The Hobbit he started in the 60's but never completed. Would have been interesting to read. I wonder if he would have included all the White Council and Necromancer material PJ is including. I believe he never got that far in his re-write, just a few chapters in.

He felt that the patronising tone of the narrator of The Hobbit was something certainly worth changing, but when he actually got down to it he had a change of heart and scrapped the whole idea. If he had live longer he would have continued to flesh out the Silmarillion and attempt to give it a stronger narrative focus and maybe toned down the archaic prose so that it would be more accessible to the public. Another trilogy release or even a pentalogy release of a much expanded Silmarillion would have been very welcome.

He also had ideas about a story set in the Fourth Age and an excerpt is available in The Peoples of Middle-Earth.

 

[Kilgore Trout]

He also had ideas about a story set in the Fourth Age and an excerpt is available in The Peoples of Middle-Earth.

I was under the impression that he abandoned that because according to him, the story had already been told and there was nothing in the Fourth Age that would be interesting. I mean, the drama in the excerpt deals with kids in Gondor joining an Orc cult or something. Certainly not as compelling.

 

[Edmond Dantès]

I was under the impression that he abandoned that because according to him, the story had already been told and there was nothing in the Fourth Age that would be interesting. I mean, the drama in the excerpt deals with kids in Gondor joining an Orc cult or something. Certainly not as compelling.

He could have expanded upon the blue wizards and the cults that they supposedly set up after Sauron's defeat and after most of the elves had returned to Valinor. It would have been interesting to set-up two of the Istari as cult leaders influencing men in a different manner to Gandalf.

 

[AngmarsKing701]

When are we getting an expanded trailer? During the summer movies?

 

[Loxley]

When are we getting an expanded trailer? During the summer movies?

Wouldn't surprise me if we got a new trailer with The Dark Knight Rises, likely featuring more dialogue and interplay between Bilbo and the Dwarves if I had to guess.

 

[SCULLIBUNDO]

Wouldn't surprise me if we got a new trailer with The Dark Knight Rises, likely featuring more dialogue and interplay with Bilbo and the Dwarves if I had to guess.

That would make a lot of sense.

 

[BorkBork]

Saw the trailer in the theatre yesterday. The song gave me chills. Just chills.

 

[jett]

Are we ever gonna get 48fps footage of this shit?

 

[SCULLIBUNDO]

Are we ever gonna get 48fps footage of this shit?

In the movie - which I think it the best introduction to it. I don't think I want my first experience of it to be on the computer screen.

 

[apana]

It's fine if some don't want to watch it on a computer screen but I think the rest of us should be able to. What are they trying to hide?

 

[SCULLIBUNDO]

It's fine if some don't want to watch it on a computer screen but I think the rest of us should be able to. What are they trying to hide?

Don't be an idiot.

 

[apana]

Don't be an idiot.

I'm not being all that serious, as in trying to suggest some kind of conspiracy. I just find it strange how little 48 fps content we have gotten to see so far seeing as how at least some in the film industry now seem to be pushing for it. Forget about the Hobbit, I don't think we even have any good examples of what it would look like in any film. There is nothing stupid about wanting to see it for yourself. Considering the age we live in its kind of backwards to suggest our first introduction to it should be in a movie theater.

 

[Loxley]

I'm not being all that serious, as in trying to suggest some kind of conspiracy. I just find it strange how little 48 fps content we have gotten to see so far seeing as how at least some in the film industry now seem to be pushing for it. Forget about the Hobbit, I don't think we even have any good examples of what it would look like in any film. There is nothing stupid about wanting to see it for yourself. Considering the age we live in its kind of backwards to suggest our first introduction to it should be in a movie theater.

Well, also considering how cutting-edge the cameras they're using are, I think Jackson simply wants people to be mesmerized/surprised by what they see when they go to the theater.

If they want to release some test footage they shot at 48 FPS that has nothing to do with the actual movie, then sure, I'm all for that. But personally, I know I definitely want to be in the theater staring at a gigantic screen the first time I see Hobbiton in 3D at 48 FPS and 5k resolution. Man I just got chills thinking about that...

 

[GDJustin]

I was blown away by the similarities and near identical scenes when I first saw that site. I still am.

Peter and co owe many thanks to Mr Nasmith.

This is really interesting. I've always loved Nasmith's work and love the LOTR films, and I never noticed any of this.

 

[apana]

The closer WETA get to Alan Lee's Smaug the better.

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-eO6PAECsSOA/TkHXc1BgKlI/AAAAAAAAACw/rvkuNRF-PAk/s1600/Smaug2AlanLee.jpg

http://fantasy.mrugala.net/Alan Lee - The Hobbit/Alan Lee - The Hobbit - 20 - Smaug's fury.jpg

Not to take anything away from John Howe though as his Smaug depictions are quite lovely.

http://www.john-howe.com/portfolio/gallery/data/media/1/Smaug.jpg

http://www.dana-mad.ru/gal/images/John Howe/Middle-Earth/john_howe_middle-earth_smaug2_med.jpg

It's massive shame that Ted Nasmith isn't collaborating with The Hobbit production after issues prevented him working on LOTR. He's the best Silmarillion artist out there and his Hobbit/ LOTR related stuff is fantastic.

Simarillion and LOTR examples:

Wow I need to see this concept art actually brought to life in a film. Is this part of LOTR or the Hobbit?

 

[RivalCore]

Wow I need to see this concept art actually brought to life in a film. Is this part of LOTR or the Hobbit?

It's Minas Tirth isn't it?

 

[agrajag]

^ neither, that's from The Silmarillion.

 

[ratcliffja]

It's Minas Tirth isn't it?

Minas Tirith is carved into the side of a mountain.

 

[bengraven]

It's the elf city in the hidden valley from The Silmarillion.

Looking up the name now.

Edit: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gondolin

It's Gondolin. Check out the thumbnail at the top, too.

He felt that the patronising tone of the narrator of The Hobbit was something certainly worth changing, but when he actually got down to it he had a change of heart and scrapped the whole idea. If he had live longer he would have continued to flesh out the Silmarillion and attempt to give it a stronger narrative focus and maybe toned down the archaic prose so that it would be more accessible to the public. Another trilogy release or even a pentalogy release of a much expanded Silmarillion would have been very welcome.

He also had ideas about a story set in the Fourth Age and an excerpt is available in The Peoples of Middle-Earth.

God, I fucking love the Silmarillion. Interesting that he wanted to make it easier to read. I found it less painful to read than I had been warned (people kept telling me it read the like the Bible). People who say Tolkien isn't a great storyteller obviously have only read LOTR and/or The Hobbit.

Also, I knew about the sequel and how there were going to be orc and Sauron cults in Minas Tirith, but I didn't know he intended to have the Blue Wizards play the role as villains. I didn't think his concept interesting when I heard of it, but with that little revelation I'm really upset he was never able to at least outline it.

 

[apana]

Since the Hobbit is being extended into two films perhaps they will manage to put some bits and pieces of other Tolkien stories in there. Someone could be reciting or summarizing a story for the main characters and we could get visuals to match it.

 

[bengraven]

Since the Hobbit is being extended into two films perhaps they will manage to put some bits and pieces of other Tolkien stories in there. Someone could be reciting or summarizing a story for the main characters and we could get visuals to match it.

Kind of related, but I really hope they don't cut anything. The book isn't that long; there's no need to edit anything out since they're ADDING so much. It's like the opposite of LOTR where they did much more cutting than adding.

Things seem to hint that we'll see a fleshed out, at least maybe in a prologue, version of the battle for Moria between Dain's father and Azog the orc.

I'd also like to see maybe a hint of the hunt for Gollum - maybe an Aragorn cameo at the end of the second part.

 

[apana]

Ted Nasmith also does Song of Ice and Fire artwork. Here is his take on Dragonstone, I love it:

http://www.cesspit.net/misc/dragonstone.jpg

 

[Edmond Dantès]

Wow I need to see this concept art actually brought to life in a film. Is this part of LOTR or the Hobbit?

The architecture of the First Age was on a wholly different level to the architecture present during the Third Age, much of which was Númenórean. The Elves at the height of their power were more than a match for the Númenóreans on many levels and surpassed them in many others. But most of Beleriand was destroyed after Melkor's final defeat and much of the Elven grandeur was wiped from the face of Arda. The rest of it was destroyed after Númenor's sinking and Ar-Pharazôn and his fleet's total annihilation by Eru himself. The scale of these events make everything in The Hobbit and The Lord of the Rings look very small indeed.

To see it depicted on the big screen would be a dream.


Here's Beleriand during the First Age.

 

[mattp]

Fuck what Del Toro wanted. The Hobbit was always going to be an english-language movie and Del Toro can't make a good film in English!

 

[Retro]

Here's Beleriand during the First Age.

For those unfamiliar with Middle Earth, Ered Luin on the far right side of the map is the Elvish name for the Blue Mountains, which are to the west of the Shire. The harbor from which Frodo, Bilbo and Company depart at the end of LotR is actually close to where "Belegost" is on Edmond's map... North of it actually, if my Atlas is right.

God I love Tolkien. He spent so much time shaping Arda.

 

[bengraven]

For those unfamiliar with Middle Earth, Ered Luin on the far right side of the map is the Elvish name for the Blue Mountains, which are to the west of the Shire. The harbor from which Frodo, Bilbo and Company depart at the end of LotR is actually close to where "Belegost" is on Edmond's map... North of it actually, if my Atlas is right.

God I love Tolkien. He spent so much time shaping Arda.

Yep, what I was about to say.

Everything on that map is west of The Grey Havens, where we said goodbye to characters at the end of the LOTR films. So basically that land there is now under the ocean because of a calamity that I won't spoil here.

Here's a massive map where someone posted the two maps together (lol at Beleriand being in blue as if sunk).

http://tolkiengateway.net/w/images/0/06/Beleriand_and_Westlands.jpg


He had SO much world to play in that he never got a chance to. It's a shame his kids went against his wishes and put an iron fist on the series. Tolkien wanted people to write stories in his world and play there. He basically condoned them being public domain, though I'm sure he would have wanted his kids to have a little piece of the pie.

 

[Loxley]

The closer WETA get to Alan Lee's Smaug the better.

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-eO6PAECsSOA/TkHXc1BgKlI/AAAAAAAAACw/rvkuNRF-PAk/s1600/Smaug2AlanLee.jpg

http://fantasy.mrugala.net/Alan Lee - The Hobbit/Alan Lee - The Hobbit - 20 - Smaug's fury.jpg

Not to take anything away from John Howe though as his Smaug depictions are quite lovely.

http://www.john-howe.com/portfolio/gallery/data/media/1/Smaug.jpg

http://www.dana-mad.ru/gal/images/John Howe/Middle-Earth/john_howe_middle-earth_smaug2_med.jpg



It's massive shame that Ted Nasmith isn't collaborating with The Hobbit production after issues prevented him working on LOTR. He's the best Silmarillion artist out there and his Hobbit/ LOTR related stuff is fantastic.

Holy crap As an artist myself, much less a Tolkien fan, shame on me for never having even heard of this guy before. I mean...



...brilliant work. That Doors of Durin piece is breathtaking, as is the "Riders of Rohan". I love discovering new artists in general, but especially ones who excel in visualizing Tolkien's works. I'm now putting aside the next hour to browse his site and look at all his stuff ('cause I like to party on Friday nights, y'know how it is).

Oh great, there's a compilation book of his paintings too...well, there's another one for the collection.

 

[Edmond Dantès]

Holy crap As an artist myself, much less a Tolkien fan, shame on me for never having even heard of this guy before. I mean...



...brilliant work. That Doors of Durin piece is breathtaking, as is the "Riders of Rohan". I love discovering new artists in general, but especially ones who excel in visualizing Tolkien's works. I'm now putting aside the next hour to browse his site and look at all his stuff ('cause I like to party on Friday nights, y'know how it is).

Oh great, there's a compilation book of his paintings too...well, there's another one for the collection.

He is fantastic isn't he.

These are two of my favourites from him:

A rare depiction of Legolas and Gimli's final journey.

This is pretty much how I envisage Hobbiton in my mind. Just beautiful.

 

[bengraven]

My god, I can't find the words to describe how awesome the last two posts are.

Oh great, there's a compilation book of his paintings too...well, there's another one for the collection.

the last page is costing me money on Amazon, btw.

Bought.

 

[sc0la]

So far I think that all of the CGI creatures they've created at Weta have been fantastic. I trust them to do a great job with Smaug. It is hard to know exactly how though considering we don't really know much about the tone of the movies yet, but certainly by the end it will dovetail with Lotr. To what extent it will be whimsical has yet to be clearly seen. I think that will have a greater effect on Smaug than any shortcomings or artistic differences in comparison to the animation.

Oh definitely. I wasn't implying that their versions were not good or even that I didn't like them. I have liked all their designs so far (save a minor creature or two).

It's just that Smaug with a cat face is ingrained in my mind permanently from chilshood.

 

[Sirius]

Ted Nasmith.. my god, I can't believe I haven't come across his work before...

The Fords of Bruin:

The Argonath:

Luthien:

I have goosebumps... no words to describe the magnificence..

 

[sharbhund]

I have this version of The Silmarillion with paintings by Nasmith. It's great, and it looks like you can get it for cheap used:

 

[Loxley]

The Hollywood Reporter has an interesting article on efforts that are being made by theaters around the US and abroad in order to show The Hobbit at it's proper 48 FPS by the time of it's release, since right now almost none of them can.

After Jackson and James Cameron championed higher frame rates as a solution to exhibition problems, projection manufacturers are working to support the move in time for the movie's December 14, 2012 release date.

The cinema technology industry is working to give moviegoers the opportunity to see The Hobbit: An Unfinished Journey in 3D projected at 48 frames per second when it hits theaters in December.

The question is, just how many theaters around the world will be able to accommodate this sort of presentation of Peter Jackson’s epic fantasy, the first major motion picture to be made at the high frame rate (HFR) of 48 fps.

It is conceivable that it could be tens of thousands, though most manufacturers—at least publicly—are taking a far more conservative wait-and-see approach, noting that theater upgrades will be driven by studio and exhibitors' demand. Frame rates are the number of images displayed by a projector within one second. Twenty-four frames per second (fps) has long been the standard in cinema, but industry leaders James Cameron and Peter Jackson are among those who propose high frame rates such as 48 or 60, reducing or eliminating jutter and other motion artifacts.

Digital cinema auditoriums are currently not equipped to support 48 fps movies, though work is being done to change that. Each projector maker will have its own strategy for high frame rate support. There are roughly 13,000 Sony 4K digital cinema projectors shipped worldwide, and “we expect the majority of those screens to have high frame rate support enabled by the time The Hobbit is released,” Sony told The Hollywood Reporter. Industry leaders explained that Series 2 projectors from Barco, Christie and NEC—all of which used technology from Texas Instruments—would be able to show The Hobbit at a HFR and in 3D with a software upgrade and a piece of hardware call an “integrated media block” (IMB) with 48 fps (and 3D) support. Such IMBs are being developed by several manufacturers such as Christie, whose IMB is expected to be available in June for roughly $10,000.

Don Shaw, senior director, product management, Christie Entertainment Solutions, estimated that worldwide there are between 40,000 and 50,000 installed Series 2 projectors that are capable of being upgraded. While many have an eye on The Hobbit’s December release date for an upgrade, some upgrades might be needed even sooner, since there is speculation that a 48 fps trailer for The Hobbit might be released as early as this summer.

HFRs doesn't just affect exhibition; it also impacts production. Jackson is shooting his movie in 3D with Red Epic cameras (various digital cinematography cameras including those from Red already support 48 fps) and 3Ality Technica rigs. Wellington-based Park Road Post Production has developed a 48 fps postproduction process anchored in color grading and postproduction system Mistika, from a Spain-based equipment maker called SGO. Development of the postproduction process began in 2010. SGO worked closely with Park Road to enhance the system to meet the needs of the production. “We started with one Mistika and rapidly went to around five … Now there are tens of machines,” said Phil Oatley, head of technology at Park Road Post, who explained that the postproduction company also developed proprietary asset management, automation, and an archival system aimed at 48fps support.

The effort also involved Christie and Barco. Park Road is testing projectors from both companies, running beta software to enable the 48fps capabilities. A huge challenge across the board is the volume of data that is required for HFRs. Oatley reported that for The Hobbit production shoots 6-12TB of camera data per day. And the shooting schedule (for both parts of the two-part film) involves 265 days of principal photography. (There are roughly 50 days to go).

Oatley said a key aim was to keep the filmmaking process “as familiar as possible.” As an example, the film is being edited on an Avid Media Composer at 24 fps in 2D. Park Road has developed a method of taking that edit information into post at 48fps 3D. With the 48fps system now in place, Oatley said Park Road Post is now prepared to handle future 48 fps productions.

James Cameron, who conducted a high-profile demonstration of the potential of HFRs last year at CinemaCon, has said that he intends to make Avatar 2 and 3 at a HFR. To support these efforts, standards bodies are looking to add HFRs to digital cinema specifications.

 

[Gila]

Are there any pics of Luke Evans in character? Or will we only start to see him in There and Back again?

 

[zoukka]

So.... which kind of projector tech is required to show this movie in 48fps glory?

 

[jett]

The Hollywood Reporter has an interesting article on efforts that are being made by theaters around the US and abroad in order to show The Hobbit at it's proper 48 FPS by the time of it's release, since right now almost none of them can.

Weird, 48fps is part of the DCI specification, it should already be supported across the board.

 

[Amir0x]

so great you guys discovering Nasmith for the first time

i have as many of his works as possible in art books and whatnot, dude almost as defined my image of Middle Earth as Alan Lee. His Argonath is actually what I pictured the Argonath to look like, and it was partially why I loved the film's depiction so much. Felt it was very close to that.q

 

[Edmond Dantès]

Are there any pics of Luke Evans in character? Or will he be mainly in There and Back again?

He could show up in The Unexpected Journey in some manner, but frankly I doubt it, all of his screen time will be in There and Back Again. There's no real reason to have him appear before Lake-Town unless they're greatly expanding his character.

 

[apana]

48 FPS trailer for the Hobbit this summer will be sweet. I am guessing it will be with the Dark Knight Rises. Going to see DKR in real Imax so I won't have to wonder about the trailer being 48 fps or not.

 

[Kubricks Ghost]

Weird, 48fps is part of the DCI specification, it should already be supported across the board.

24fps/3D=48fps

48fps/3D=96fps would require upgrade because the input bandwidth is doubled.

 

[PhoncipleBone]

48 FPS trailer for the Hobbit this summer will be sweet. I am guessing it will be with the Dark Knight Rises. Going to see DKR in real Imax so I won't have to wonder about the trailer being 48 fps or not.

It would not be at DKR. Not a 48fps version at least. It would need to be on a big 3D release that requires the digital projectors if they put out a 48fps trailer.

Perhaps a Hobbit day like with Avatar. Just show some footage one showing only.

 

[Kubricks Ghost]

It would not be at DKR. Not a 48fps version at least. It would need to be on a big 3D release that requires the digital projectors if they put out a 48fps trailer.

Perhaps a Hobbit day like with Avatar. Just show some footage one showing only.

I suppose you could see a 48fps 2D trailer as the projectors can already do that.

 

[PhoncipleBone]

I suppose you could see a 48fps 2D trailer as the projectors can already do that.

IF it is a digital showing. Which for the real IMAXs would not be happening.

 

[Kubricks Ghost]

IF it is a digital showing. Which for the real IMAXs would not be happening.

Missed the 'real IMAX' part lol

 

[PhoncipleBone]

Missed the 'real IMAX' part lol

Yeah. Get that LieMAX shit out of here. So mad that my local theater is a LieMAX. It pains me every day.

 

[Kubricks Ghost]

It pains us all.

 

[PhoncipleBone]

It pains us all.

It burns us!

 

[SCULLIBUNDO]

Yeah. Get that LieMAX shit out of here. So mad that my local theater is a LieMAX. It pains me every day.

LieMAX is great for everything that isn't a 2D film shot in IMAX. It is my preferred choice for seeing The Hobbit. I see it in 48fps or I don't see it!