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[ThoseDeafMutes]

The suicide mission and the killing/resurrection of Shepard are the two things that stick out in my mind as being poorly thought out/planned for the series as a whole. Then again the SM was part of what inspired the design of a lot of the characters (ragtag bunch of misfits; people nearing the end of their lives like Mordin and Thane) so as a whole it probably gave us more good than bad.

 

[JohnnyFootball]

They should have tabled it and done it for ME3. At that point they could just go buck wild killing people left and right, and it would have leant the ending a lot more weight.

Yes, it would have given much more weight to the ending of ME3.

 

[Altairre]

Kai Leng was terrible. That being said I thoroughly enjoyed the way he gets offed if you hit the prompt.

 

[Caboose]

Why kill Shepard anyway? Why not have him in a coma or whatever for two years? Why go with the silly "you were a bag of goo and we rebuilt you completely through SPACE SCIENCE"?

It's not like they did anything interesting with the concept of Shepard 's resurrection anyway.

 

[ThoseDeafMutes]

Why kill Shepard anyway? Why not have him in a coma or whatever for two years? Why go with the silly "you were a bag of goo and we rebuilt you completely through SPACE SCIENCE"?

It's not like they did anything interesting with the concept of Shepard 's resurrection anyway.

The shepard KIA reveal, I guess. They probably thought they could go somewhere interesting and then just never did.

 

[EatChildren]

They could have handled "Shepard strongly believed to be KIA, not actually so, found and healed by Cerberus" just fine without resorting to literal "Shepard dead and rebuilt with magic space science money".

But, you know, BioWare.

 

[a916]

They could have handled "Shepard strongly believed to be KIA, not actually so, found and healed by Cerberus" just fine without resorting to literal "Shepard dead and rebuilt with magic space science money".

But, you know, BioWare.

Kind of gives weight to the fact that he's now half synthetic and half living tissue... makes it feel better that someone who's a combination of both is essentially the fate of the galaxy and not just a human.

 

[ThoseDeafMutes]

Shepard dies during what looks like planetary reentry, and they rebuild him from that. Truly ridiculous lol.

I'm sure there's some kind of comic where we find out he was just in orbit and died from air loss and was perfectly preserved.

 

[MrTroubleMaker]

Kai Leng was terrible. That being said I thoroughly enjoyed the way he gets offed if you hit the prompt.

yup

Why kill Shepard anyway? Why not have him in a coma or whatever for two years? Why go with the silly "you were a bag of goo and we rebuilt you completely through SPACE SCIENCE"?

It's not like they did anything interesting with the concept of Shepard 's resurrection anyway.

yeah, I would have preferred that or had the council say something like " you're to famous to do your undercover work, here is a procedure to change your appearance / skills"

 

[inky]

But he had to die and be reborn to fulfill his destiny. It's like poetry so that it rhymes.

 

[Complistic]

Why kill Shepard anyway? Why not have him in a coma or whatever for two years? Why go with the silly "you were a bag of goo and we rebuilt you completely through SPACE SCIENCE"?

It's not like they did anything interesting with the concept of Shepard 's resurrection anyway.

Probably the first Idea pitched when someone asked "how we going to to reset the player"?

 

[Altairre]

But he had to die and be reborn to fulfill his destiny. It's like poetry so that it rhymes.

Say whatever you want about Mass Effect but it's not that bad.

Spoiler

Palpatine's behind it all.

 

[wolfhowwl]

I wonder if it was a remnant of some other discarded plot that was kept for coolness and being a convenient transition into ME2.

"There was some ideas that maybe Shepard gets his essence transferred into some kind of machine, becoming a cyborg and becoming a bridge between synthetics and organics - which is a theme that does play up in the game," Karpyshyn concluded. "At one point we thought, maybe that's how he survives into Mass Effect 2."

Source

(there's also a hilariously terrible idea in that article)

 

[Roulette]

Let's just be glad he wasn't magically revived by

Spoiler

the starchild

.

 

[RyanDG]

They should have tabled it and done it for ME3. At that point they could just go buck wild killing people left and right, and it would have leant the ending a lot more weight.

I've always thought that the game was always a bit too safe with how easy it was to save everyone both in Mass Effect 2 and Mass Effect 3. Just through normal play, I was able to save everyone during the suicide mission, and never really had to deal with too many of the 'tough choices' in Mass Effect 3, since I had enough points built up that I could tell my crew mates 'Fuck you all, I'm Shepherd', and everything was alright.

I kind of wish that the third game was a lot more blood thirsty than it turned out being...

I mean, the best moments in Mass Effect 3 ultimately are when you go ham shit on everything and basically kill everyone.

Killing Mordin and Wrex for example is amazing... But most players never witness that because they are too tied up to keeping the game nice and neat. I wonder if rewarding players for making 'bad' decisions would allow for more dynamic and interesting gameplay, since people wouldn't naturally be inclined to try to keep as many people alive as possible?

 

[ThoseDeafMutes]

Failing to make the bad options a serious choice was an endemic problem in the ME morality system, even outside of character deaths. You're haunted by the constant meta-knowledge that things will turn out 100% wonderfully even if you take an idealistic stance on everything and never cave in to pragmatic solutions.

 

[RedSwirl]

Let's just accept that the Mass Effect games were basically like Lost. BioWare winged that shit as it went, and the results show.

 

[Sou Da]

Failing to make the bad options a serious choice was an endemic problem in the ME morality system, even outside of character deaths. You're haunted by the constant meta-knowledge that things will turn out 100% wonderfully even if you take an idealistic stance on everything and never cave in to pragmatic solutions.

The presence of a morality system outside of Star Wars was a problem in itself, but I'm sure you know this.

 

[i-Lo]

We'll finally get her back and all upgraded!

 

[Mindlog]

Why kill Shepard anyway? Why not have him in a coma or whatever for two years? Why go with the silly "you were a bag of goo and we rebuilt you completely through SPACE SCIENCE"?

It's not like they did anything interesting with the concept of Shepard 's resurrection anyway.

And then subjected his body to atmospheric reentry -_-

They could have handled "Shepard strongly believed to be KIA, not actually so, found and healed by Cerberus" just fine without resorting to literal "Shepard dead and rebuilt with magic space science money".

Just like, Johnny Rico.

I wanted Cerberus to remain a small team with extreme measures that gets the job done. Human STG. Instead it was some group that failed up at every moment.
Cerberus Group KIA: PROJECT TERMINATED
Cerberus Group KIA: PROJECT TERMINATED
Cerberus Group KIA: PROJECT TERMINATED
Cerberus Group KIA: Subject Missing; Resources Exhausted
Cerberus Group KIA: PROJECT TERMINATED
Cerberus Group KIA: Army Assembled, Fleet Online, Collector Remnants Recovered, All Outstanding Project Successfully Completed

Failing to make the bad options a serious choice was an endemic problem in the ME morality system, even outside of character deaths. You're haunted by the constant meta-knowledge that things will turn out 100% wonderfully even if you take an idealistic stance on everything and never cave in to pragmatic solutions.

Speak of the Devil. Exactly.

 

[Escape Goat]

I think a lot of people forget that Mass Effect 3's release/review came at the same time IGN had a mysterious site/review format redesign in which Mass Effect 3 ads were prominently displayed all throughout. There's even that famous gif going around.

Almostv s good as the McGriddle fiasco

 

[i-Lo]

Failing to make the bad options a serious choice was an endemic problem in the ME morality system, even outside of character deaths. You're haunted by the constant meta-knowledge that things will turn out 100% wonderfully even if you take an idealistic stance on everything and never cave in to pragmatic solutions.

It's like gravity on earth: you can flail, you dive, you close your eyes and pretend but you will still fall towards the center of the earth.

Could KoTOR (have barely begun the second one) be considered a good example (developed by Bioware) where the morality system had more profound ramifications?

 

[wolfhowwl]

I've always thought that the game was always a bit too safe with how easy it was to save everyone both in Mass Effect 2 and Mass Effect 3. Just through normal play, I was able to save everyone during the suicide mission, and never really had to deal with too many of the 'tough choices' in Mass Effect 3, since I had enough points built up that I could tell my crew mates 'Fuck you all, I'm Shepherd', and everything was alright.

I kind of wish that the third game was a lot more blood thirsty than it turned out being...

I mean, the best moments in Mass Effect 3 ultimately are when you go ham shit on everything and basically kill everyone.

Killing Mordin and Wrex for example is amazing... But most players never witness that because they are too tied up to keeping the game nice and neat. I wonder if rewarding players for making 'bad' decisions would allow for more dynamic and interesting gameplay, since people wouldn't naturally be inclined to try to keep as many people alive as possible?

That it was. The bad outcomes on Rannoch were nice as well and probably should have been mandatory. Thematically it would have worked much better with what BioWare was going for if they had been more aggressive about putting the player in situations where they had to get blood on their hands.

Also whoever wrote Renegade Shepard with the Genophage and Geth did a much better job than the previous games. She comes across as regretful yet determined with her tone and can also express remorse later for what she had to do.

 

[Ivory Samoan]

You can avoid Allers, though.

I never really understood Allers... all she did was keep asking if she should get kicked off my boat..I think I didn't pay her enough attention, as she also shot me down when I tried to get it on

Just reboot the damn universe.

No thanks, sounds like my worst nightmare.

The universe is fine

Spoiler

destroy master race has seen to that..

 

[JohnnyFootball]

What would have been nice is if one of the "good" decision made later turned out to be a bad one.

 

[Sou Da]

What would have been nice is if one of the "good" decision made later turned out to be a bad one.

This. It's not just enough to have the pragmatic decisions result in favourable outcomes, the idealistic decisions need to have unintended consequences as well.

This conversation reminds of that one ME2 writer who did Legion, he was spot on in saying Bioware as whole can be too optimistic for their own good when it comes to their worlds.

 

[JohnnyFootball]

This. It's not just enough to have the pragmatic decisions result in favourable outcomes, the idealistic decisions need to have unintended consequences as well.

This conversation reminds of that one ME2 writer who did Legion, he was spot on in saying Bioware as whole can be too optimistic for their own good when it comes to their worlds.

Like the Rachni for instance. I thought it would have been interesting if saving them had turned out to be a bad decision.

Instead, they made the decision 100% irrelevant.

 

[0.1.1.2.3.5.8.13.21.34.55]

For the next game, this is all I ask

 

[ThoseDeafMutes]

Like the Rachni for instance. I thought it would have been interesting if saving them had turned out to be a bad decision.

Instead, they made the decision 100% irrelevant.

Biggest slap in the face in ME3.

There's literally a line of dialogue to the effect of "Didn't you kill the Rachni queen tho?"
"Yes".

 

[Dr Stabbingworth]

"No light? They always said there would be a light" lol

And yeah, Miranda replacing Leng and going against Shepard after ME2 would have been nice.

If Miranda is in your party after you kill the Terminator and you choose to destroy the base, she tells off the Illusive Man.

 

[K.Jack]

If Miranda is in your party after you kill the Terminator and you choose to destroy the base, she tells off the Illusive Man.

What, for real? It's crazy that I've played the games so many times, and there's still things I don't know.

 

[Patryn]

What would have been nice is if one of the "good" decision made later turned out to be a bad one.

They kind of do have this, but hide it. If you reprogram the Geth, which is the top left option for that choice, you get dinged in the math regarding whether you can bring peace to the Geth and the Quarians. However, it's easily to overcome and you need to read guides to understand how you're being punished.

I also believe that if you choose to save the fake Rachni you take a hit to your readiness rating as it turns on you.

What, for real? It's crazy that I've played the games so many times, and there's still things I don't know.

Yeah. She quits Cerberus, too. I don't know, but I suspect she had to be loyal to do it, however.

 

[JohnnyFootball]

Biggest slap in the face in ME3.

There's literally a line of dialogue to the effect of "Didn't you kill the Rachni queen tho?"
"Yes".

I actually hoped that decision would be REALLY big. Ending altering big. I remember I read some fan fiction that the rachni queen actually helped you defeat the Harbinger.

I just wish they would have made decisions from previous games really have an impact, BUT make it such that after your first playthrough you can alter some of your choices so that those who didn't play the first two games can see different decisons.

 

[Patryn]

The Rachni cop out was such bullshit. Having them show up no matter what was stupid beyond belief. Like, why would the Reapers waste resources bringing this dead species back?

 

[JohnnyFootball]

They kind of do have this, but hide it. If you reprogram the Geth, which is the top left option for that choice, you get dinged in the math regarding whether you can bring peace to the Geth and the Quarians. However, it's easily to overcome and you need to read guides to understand how you're being punished.

I also believe that if you choose to save the fake Rachni you take a hit to your readiness rating as it turns on you.

No on both accounts.

For the reprogramming it balances out. If you reprogram them, the geth give a better rating, while the quarians take the hit. If you destroy them, the quarians give a better rating.

Saving the fake Rachni queen is not ever presented as a good option.

 

[Patryn]

No on both accounts.

For the reprogramming it balances out. If you reprogram them, the geth give a better rating, while the quarians take the hit. If you destroy them, the quarians give a better rating.

Saving the fake Rachni queen is not ever presented as a good option.

Wrong math. I'm talking about the calculation to get peace, where you need 5 points. Destroying the heretics is 2 points, while reprogramming is worth nothing. I believe you have to import with at least 3 points to have peace.

 

[RyanDG]

The Rachni cop out was such bullshit. Having them show up no matter what was stupid beyond belief. Like, why would the Reapers waste resources bringing this dead species back?

The only justification I could come up with is as a psychological weapon (knowing the history of the Rachni and the space-faring civilizations of the age). But then I thought about it more, and realized... Wait... It's the fucking Reapers... Who already have waves and waves of enemies that are designed to look like friends, and take advantage of the inherent strengths of each species (what could be scarier?)... And then I was left with nothing.

 

[Dennis]

For the next game, this is all I ask

All I ask for is a return to a feeling of exploration and glorious sci-fi visuals.

Enough of the grimdark shooter shit.

 

[RedSwirl]

Eh, this is a thing: https://twitter.com/macwalterslives/status/574597005822963713

Spring-Forward Poll: What new feature, system or gameplay would you add to the next #MassEffect ?

Naval combat.

And further ship customization towards that end.

 

[inky]

They've been talking about space combat since ME2 so I'd hope that was a lock already.

 

[prag16]

Naval combat.

And further ship customization towards that end.

They've been talking about space combat since ME2 so I'd hope that was a lock already.

Eh. Not sure I'm really interested in ship to ship combat in my Mass Effect. But if they do include something, I'll reserve judgment until I experience it.

 

[ThoseDeafMutes]

Ship combat should be abstract IMO, more like you giving orders rather than controlling the ship directly. And shouldn't be a central pillar of gameplay. In general I'd like the spacecraft to be more than just a battle taxi that drops your 3 man squad off into a combat zone then get away. It should be possible to have it integrated much more tightly with the game, call for an orbital bombardment on something as part of a ground mission, use it as a distraction or have it drop supplies somewhere. More missions should take place in part from the metaphorical Captain's chair, putting you in scenarios where you have put your ship and crew to the test in a battle, or hide from a dangerous opponent etc. Not just picking a way point for the next destination of the game. A spacecraft should not just be a hub to get between worlds it should be one of the most important and powerful tools in your arsenal. It carriers munitions capable of precision strikes or leveling cities. It should be exciting, and dynamic!

 

[DOWN]

Eh. Not sure I'm really interested in ship to ship combat in my Mass Effect. But if they do include something, I'll reserve judgment until I experience it.

Same. I don't really see a calling for spaceship action.

But I'd take a few scenes if they were like Halo Reach's "Long Night of Solace" mission. That was nice space atmosphere and chatter.

 

[Bisnic]

What would have been nice is if one of the "good" decision made later turned out to be a bad one.

Well... if you destroy Maelon's data in ME2, Eve dies in ME3. Destroying the data felt like a "good" decision in ME2, no?

 

[Bornstellar]

Same. I don't really see a calling for spaceship action.

But I'd take a few scenes if they were like Halo Reach's "Long Night of Solace" mission. That was nice space atmosphere and chatter.

Yeah it was.

Miss this Bungie.

 

[Bornstellar]

Well... if you destroy Maelon's data in ME2, Eve dies in ME3. Destroying the data felt like a "good" decision in ME2, no?

If you save the honor of Tali's father and save the heretic geth in ME2 you lose Tali.

 

[EatChildren]

If you save the honor of Tali's father and save the heretic geth in ME2 you lose Tali.

Pretty sure I did both of those and Tali survived. There's a few opportunities to get the required points to satisfy both parties. From memory completing the Rannoch side missions before the main mission, and encouraging the bond between Legion and Tali, gives you enough to negate the loss of saving the heretics and keeping her father's secret.

 

[Kabouter]

If you save the honor of Tali's father and save the heretic geth in ME2 you lose Tali.

If you save the honour of Tali's father by doing the coloured response thing during the trial, you can still save the heretics so long as you do everything correctly in ME3 prior to Priority: Rannoch

 

[ThoseDeafMutes]

My first and only complete playthrough of ME3 was without an import due to circumstances I cbf going into. But basically Tali and the Quarians burned and I didn't feel bad about it.

 

[Dennis]

Judging from the last three posts being into Mass Effect seems like a NeoGAF mod requirement.