Support NeoGAF

[Patryn]

Honestly, I'm probably in the absolute minority when I say that I'd rather that we didn't control the ship and instead went back to something closer to ME1 where we simply pick a destination and go there automatically.

The whole thing about controlling the Normandy in ME2 and ME3 struck me as being really stupid and really shallow. I'm not 100 percent certain why they even had fuel, beyond a money sink which ME2 and 3 didn't really need, seeing as it was a closed system with a ceiling on the amount of money you could actually earn, as opposed to ME1 where you could earn infinite amounts (although you could only hold so much at one time).

Sure, they could devote more time and create all new systems revolving around flying the ship, but I'd rather they spend that time and resources polishing and improving the on-foot stuff, and especially the Uncharted Worlds given that it sounds like there will be a LOT of them.

 

[Florida_Man_5000]

Now that I think about it...Mass Effect series has not dealed with gravity all that well, despite it being a major factor (and fantasy) in space travel. I guess its just too hard to program and debug. I hope that changes in ME4.

 

[diaspora]

Honestly, I'm probably in the absolute minority when I say that I'd rather that we didn't control the ship and instead went back to something closer to ME1 where we simply pick a destination and go there automatically.

The whole thing about controlling the Normandy in ME2 and ME3 struck me as being really stupid and really shallow. I'm not 100 percent certain why they even had fuel, beyond a money sink which ME2 and 3 didn't really need, seeing as it was a closed system with a ceiling on the amount of money you could actually earn, as opposed to ME1 where you could earn infinite amounts (although you could only hold so much at one time).

Sure, they could devote more time and create all new systems revolving around flying the ship, but I'd rather they spend that time and resources polishing and improving the on-foot stuff, and especially the Uncharted Worlds given that it sounds like there will be a LOT of them.

TBH, I wouldn't mind being able to warp wherever the hell I want.

 

[K.Jack]

Honestly, I'm probably in the absolute minority when I say that I'd rather that we didn't control the ship and instead went back to something closer to ME1 where we simply pick a destination and go there automatically.

Actually, I'm pretty sure you (and I) are in the majority with that feeling.

 

[Nostremitus]

I dunno, I kind of enjoyed the thrill of trying to balance scanning and collecting as the Reapers chased me.

 

[JeffZero]

EA don't read this:

Spoiler

bringing back other species as playable squad later would make for attractive DLC

Haha. Well, BioWare did come right out ahead of DAI's launch and say that it no longer wants to do squadmates/companions as DLCs in its games, because the idea has gotten such a bad rap from the fans. I think the bad rap is just from Day 1 DLC, but there was this big press release about how the Day 1 DLC squadmates had gotten such negative reaction, plus it's so hard to integrate new characters into the game's world and narrative properly anyway, that it's just not something they want to touch with a nine foot pole anymore. It was an interesting read.

...that said, agreed!

 

[Poodlestrike]

I dunno, I kind of enjoyed the thrill of trying to balance scanning and collecting as the Reapers chased me.

Ditto. It was a simple mechanic, but it could make for some fairly tense moments.

 

[JohnnyFootball]

I don't care if I'm "no better than The Illusive Man" when Destroy as an emotional piece falls flat on every level for me. I legit cannot stand that ending. I know how unpopular a statement that is, but seriously. Hackett's monologue is the weakest of them all, Shepard flinching in the rubble actively infuriates me (go all the way with it or leave them dead; that five seconds is perhaps the worst in the Trilogy) and I lose my favorite squadmate (EDI; no, I'm being serious here) while slaughtering the memory of what another of my favorites (Legion) died for.

Destroy just bores me while frustrating me. Not a great combination. And as I said in my previous post, I'm a firm believer that the Reapers as we've known them are effectively "dead" no matter the ending (sans Refuse, that is) so not nuking them explosion-style doesn't have me losin' any sleep.

Synthesis may be a bit of a cheesy freakshow and husks gaining consciousness is an abomination of a thing to depict, but it hits me in all the feels anyway. Tricia Helfer has me in tears with that last line. "I am alive and I am not alone." Stunningly beautiful way to end the series.

Control's alright too.

Synthesis is beyond stupid for the simple fact that the whole first game was about killing a guy who wanted that exact thing...

 

[JohnnyFootball]

Sorry it wasn't candy and flowers.

So was I. I worked my ass off to get a great Disney ending.

I wanted blue babies.

 

[JeffZero]

Synthesis is beyond stupid for the simple fact that the whole first game was about killing a guy who wanted that exact thing...

Doesn't bother me.

Saren's vision of the sentients of the galaxy as machine-slaves to a Reaper mentality that was never going to happen is not quite the same thing as repurposing all life to a sort of transcendent unity, including the Reapers themselves, anyway. This argument has never really made me flinch. The only thing I'd change re: similarities is that it would be nice to retroactively allow Shepard the chance to tell Saren "no" in better, less popcorn-movie terms than "that's crazy lol." But it'd never happen, because for every fan with my opinion, there are three who think it's fan fiction garbage.

And maybe I'm wrong. Maybe you're right, and it's the Saren Ending. But I could probably still live with headcanoning otherwise if it meant avoiding the ending I absolutely detest. And really, that's what most of us have done no matter our choice, isn't it? Think up a few ways to make whatever we picked a little less mediocre? I just happen to do it in green.

The most awkward thing about being pro-Synthesis is that, in any discussion on the endings I've ever partaken in, there's a general undercurrent of, "all the people picking that ending are casuals who aren't thinking much because they aren't as invested." I see that said often, and loudly. Well, I know a fair few pretty hardcore Mass Effect fans who, like me, only wish there were a way to exorcise that dreadful little sequence where the husk regains some semblance of consciousness.

...because yeah, even I will admit, that is horrifying.

It's also a very personal matter. I would sacrifice a bit of logic in pursuit of a bit of emotional completeness any day of the week. Examine Synthesis beyond its cursory ideals and it doesn't make a lick of sense. It should have been drastically rewritten, sure. But when I'm choiced between the ending "everybody" else picks because Synthesis is bonkers and the ending I pick because Destroy makes me feel like reloading every single time I pick it (seriously, I did an entire Trilogy run with the express intent of picking it last year and had to reload out of revulsion... and yes, I'm aware how many people have said the same re: Synthesis!) I'm going to roll with the ending that makes me feel better.

Sorry for the rant. I've watched this discussion without participating for a good two years, now. On other sites I felt like I had definitely said my piece. But it got brought up here, so heck with it, figured I would talk about it once on GAF, too.

 

[half a moon]

Is this a good place to ask questions about the first game? I'm going to start a PC play-through after it downloads.

 

[JeffZero]

Is this a good place to ask questions about the first game? I'm going to start a PC play-through after it downloads.

Certainly! I'd be happy to help.

Just... don't read anything else on this page. We're discussing the endings, lol.

 

[half a moon]

Certainly! I'd be happy to help.

Just... don't read anything else on this page. We're discussing the endings, lol.

lol.

Is there a minimap/quest helper mod? Toggling the journal, map, and hovering over each doorway is getting tedious. Is this fixed in ME2 or ME3? I'm loving everything else about the game tho.

 

[Bisnic]

lol.

Is there a minimap/quest helper mod? Toggling the journal, map, and hovering over each doorway is getting tedious. Is this fixed in ME2 or ME3? I'm loving everything else about the game tho.

There isn't much mods for this game other than highres textures mods I think.

But if you need help for maps and quests, there is the Wiki:
http://masseffect.wikia.com/wiki/Mass_Effect_Wiki

And a full map of the Citadel, showing quest givers(note that some quests will only become available after you advance in the main story) and keepers:
http://images.wikia.com/masseffect/images/3/37/Mass_effect_citadel_keeper_map.png

 

[Ralemont]

Doesn't bother me.

I'd also point out that there's nothing really wrong with what Saren wanted in the context of trying to save the galaxy. His problem - and the sticking point for Shepard - was that the dude was obviously being lied to by the Reapers but couldn't realize it because he was indoctrinated.

As a means of saving the galaxy, achieving organic-synthetic symbiosis is pretty far down the horrifying list, especially when you consider the sheer unlikelihood of success that actually fighting the Reapers had.

 

[JohnnyFootball]

IAs a means of saving the galaxy, achieving organic-synthetic symbiosis is pretty far down the horrifying list, especially when you consider the sheer unlikelihood of success that actually fighting the Reapers had.

Huh? Forcing organic to adopt synthetic functions against their will is "far down the horrifying list"?

 

[JeffZero]

I'd also point out that there's nothing really wrong with what Saren wanted in the context of trying to save the galaxy. His problem - and the sticking point for Shepard - was that the dude was obviously being lied to by the Reapers but couldn't realize it because he was indoctrinated.

As a means of saving the galaxy, achieving organic-synthetic symbiosis is pretty far down the horrifying list, especially when you consider the sheer unlikelihood of success that actually fighting the Reapers had.

Indeed.

 

[The Artisan]

Synthesis is beyond stupid for the simple fact that the whole first game was about killing a guy who wanted that exact thing...

So was I. I worked my ass off to get a great Disney ending.

I wanted blue babies.

Johnny, you'd probably be surprised as to how much stuff about ME we agree on.

 

[half a moon]

There isn't much mods for this game other than highres textures mods I think.

But if you need help for maps and quests, there is the Wiki:
http://masseffect.wikia.com/wiki/Mass_Effect_Wiki

And a full map of the Citadel, showing quest givers(note that some quests will only become available after you advance in the main story) and keepers:
http://images.wikia.com/masseffect/images/3/37/Mass_effect_citadel_keeper_map.png

Thanks. It's not as bad as I thought after leaving Citadel. I've barely needed to use the map. I thought that I was going to be spamming it.

How much content did I skip in Artemis Tau by going straight to Knossos?

 

[Abinash117]

How do organics get more synthetic and what does getting more synthetic even mean as in how does the Crucible make people more synthetic? Don't understand that part of Synthesis. I mean I don't see the reason organics need to become part synthetic( whatever becoming part synthetic even means or how that even works), when they they can just do that to just synthetics or just give synthetics a consciousness.

I chose destroy because it made sense if I wanted to end the reapers; didn't really care about EDI or the Geth even if I made peace between them and Quarians .

Control is just silly( becoming space god ).

The crucible was made before the Reapers apparently, so I don't why the creation end up being either using energy to control the Reapers, combining synthetics and organics, or blowing everything up. Assuming all the races over the years somehow, inadvertently, designed it to effect the Reapers ( in such a stupid way). I don't any of the older races that tried to create the Crucible even knew what it did. There is every little explanation for all of that which is like completely the opposite of ME lore which has tons of background and details to how things work.

The whole thing hinges on synthetics rebelling against organics and as a result causes chaos. But that is proven false if you make peace with the Geth .

 

[JohnnyFootball]

How do organics get more synthetic and what does getting more synthetic even mean as in how does the Crucible make people more synthetic? Don't understand that part of Synthesis. I mean I don't see the reason organics need to become part synthetic( whatever becoming part synthetic even means or how that even works), when they they can just do that to just synthetics or just give synthetics a consciousness.

I chose destroy because it made sense if I wanted to end the reapers; didn't really care about EDI or the Geth even if I made peace between them and Quarians .

Control is just silly( becoming space god ).

The crucible was made before the Reapers apparently, so I don't why the creation end up being either using energy to control the Reapers, combining synthetics and organics, or blowing everything up. Assuming all the races over the years somehow, inadvertently, designed it to effect the Reapers ( in such a stupid way). I don't any of the older races that tried to create the Crucible even knew what it did. There is every little explanation for all of that which is like completely the opposite of ME lore which has tons of background and details to how things work.

The whole thing hinges on synthetics rebelling against organics and as a result causes chaos. But that is proven false if you make peace with the Geth .

In otherwords, you like (almost) everyone else thinks the endings were complete and utter garbage.

 

[ThoseDeafMutes]

The organic/synthetic hybridization scheme is illogical because it implies that the underlying organic/synthetic conflict is caused by biological or racial type differences. It would be like if the UN tried to solve global conflicts by gathering the dragon balls and wishing for everyone to have the same skin tone. It's a superficial and extremely naive analysis. The Geth didn't rebel against the Quarians because they didn't have circuitry under the skin, and the Quarians didn't use Geth as a slave race because they had a different biological basis. If the Geth were part biological, but otherwise identical, the same events would be expected to happen.

Then again this was the computer whose first solution was to create endless cycles of death and destruction where they intermittently preserve some species they deem worthy, then fly these species preserves into combat in each new cycle because I guess it doesn't really matter if some species' reapers get blown up in combat thus defeating the purpose of preserving them in the first place. Par for the course really.

 

[diaspora]

The organic/synthetic hybridization scheme is illogical because it implies that the underlying organic/synthetic conflict is caused by biological or racial type differences. It would be like if the UN tried to solve global conflicts by gathering the dragon balls and wishing for everyone to have the same skin tone. It's a superficial and extremely naive analysis. The Geth didn't rebel against the Quarians because they didn't have circuitry under the skin, and the Quarians didn't use Geth as a slave race because they had a different biological basis. If the Geth were part biological, but otherwise identical, the same events would be expected to happen.

Then again this was the computer whose first solution was to create endless cycles of death and destruction where they intermittently preserve some species they deem worthy, then fly these species preserves into combat in each new cycle because I guess it doesn't really matter if some species' reapers get blown up in combat thus defeating the purpose of preserving them in the first place. Par for the course really.

The Reapers always struck me as a homicidal VI rather than an actual thinking intelligence.

 

[The Artisan]

The organic/synthetic hybridization scheme is illogical because it implies that the underlying organic/synthetic conflict is caused by biological or racial type differences. It would be like if the UN tried to solve global conflicts by gathering the dragon balls and wishing for everyone to have the same skin tone. It's a superficial and extremely naive analysis. The Geth didn't rebel against the Quarians because they didn't have circuitry under the skin, and the Quarians didn't use Geth as a slave race because they had a different biological basis. If the Geth were part biological, but otherwise identical, the same events would be expected to happen.

Then again this was the computer whose first solution was to create endless cycles of death and destruction where they intermittently preserve some species they deem worthy, then fly these species preserves into combat in each new cycle because I guess it doesn't really matter if some species' reapers get blown up in combat thus defeating the purpose of preserving them in the first place. Par for the course really.

good post. explains how sloppy this thing is.

The Reapers always struck me as a homicidal VI rather than an actual thinking intelligence.

edi's words: reapers are a hybrid of organic and inorganic material. so they are thinking intelligence, as well as artificial intelligence.

 

[diaspora]

good post. explains how sloppy this thing is.
edi's words: reapers are a hybrid of organic and inorganic material. so they are thinking intelligence, as well as artificial intelligence.

Mynpoimt was they were single minded idiots.

 

[The Artisan]

Mynpoimt was they were single minded idiots.

shepard's words: reapers are more intelligent than us.

they're just fucking evil. they don't deserve to be allowed salvation by means of control, nor to be among society integrated with all the rest by means of synthesis. anderson's words: we destroy them, or they destroy us.

 

[diaspora]

shepard's words: reapers are more intelligent than us.

they're just fucking evil. they don't deserve to be allowed salvation by means of control, nor to be among society integrated with all the rest by means of synthesis. anderson's words: we destroy them, or they destroy us.

I'm on board with destroy, but Shepard's analysis on reaper intelligence isn't that useful.

 

[The Artisan]

I'm on board with destroy, but Shepard's analysis on reaper intelligence isn't that useful.

i wrote that to say how they're evil but they're not supposed to come off as idiots.

 

[diaspora]

i wrote that to say how they're evil but they're not supposed to come off as idiots.

I know they're not supposed to, but I find that they do.

 

[TC McQueen]

Dunno if this is the right place to post this, but someone came up with something great for ME3: a mod that lets you use some MP powers as bonus SP powers.

 

[JohnnyFootball]

In yalls opinion after all the DLC and everything what is the most OP gun in Mass Effect? Cerebus harrier?

 

[The Artisan]

I know they're not supposed to, but I find that they do.

fair enough. they definitely got stupid by the time their "origins" were revealed via the Me3 ending & leviathan dlc.

In yalls opinion after all the DLC and everything what is the most OP gun in Mass Effect? Cerebus harrier?

revenant was great for Me2 in the insanity run. I also liked the smg you picked up in kasumi's loyalty mission, forgot what it was called. i always tapped the r1 button instead of holding it down. loved the schmitar shotgun too, loved how it was semi automatic.

my favorite assault rifle was probably the geth one though.

man...honestly, i really loved the 3rd person shooting in this game. esp Me2. that game was just the fucking peak of peaks in a trilogy of games.

 

[Ivory Samoan]

In yalls opinion after all the DLC and everything what is the most OP gun in Mass Effect? Cerebus harrier?

Locust IMO... I could do the whole game with Vanguard on Insanity just with the Locust I would say.

Shottys be damned!

 

[Patryn]

In yalls opinion after all the DLC and everything what is the most OP gun in Mass Effect? Cerebus harrier?

Drone and Turret both with the Rocket Upgrades.


.... I'm sorry, was that not an option?

 

[The Artisan]

Locust IMO... I could do the whole game with Vanguard on Insanity just with the Locust I would say.

Shottys be damned!

ah the locust, there we go. I dunno about playing through with it on insanity but it on the vanguard class was damn fun.

 

[Ralemont]

Huh? Forcing organic to adopt synthetic functions against their will is "far down the horrifying list"?

Absolutely, especially considering it was something that had been happening in the galaxy anyway, by and large by choice.

Let's put aside Saren's indoctrination for a moment and assume that the Reapers are actually unbeatable. This is not a far-fetched suggestion at all based on what we know.

Let's also assume the Reapers are telling the truth that serving them with synthetic upgrades (more in the vein of Synthesis than husks, mind you) would spare the galaxy the Reaping.

If we are constructing a hypothetical scenario where those two statements are facts or as close to it as possible, it's fairly easy to arrive at the conclusion Saren did, and be pretty damn justified in getting there.

Considering synthetic augmentation is already a thing in the ME verse and was only becoming moreso, I can think of many many worse fates to inflict on the galaxy, and considering the alternative without the galaxy accepting the deal is death, that choice will still be available to those who don't want it.

Somehow I think you'd be fine with organic/synthetic augmentation as Saren saw it, given Shepard is basically a cyborg at this point and you still want that happy ending with Liara. Clearly the mere fact of augmentation against one's will doesn't lead to despair.

 

[JeffZero]

It's nice to know I'm not entirely alone here on this endless debate. I do recommend we all go back to merrily picking our preferred endings and being (some semblance of) satisfied on all our own, individual terms, rather than beating the dead horse until the dead horse its atoms eventually gave life (followed by, you guessed it, death) is indistinguishable from the ground and en route to an eventual third dead horse. But that's just me, and I've never been one for circulars.

Best gun is the Mattock in ME2 and the Harrier in ME3, IMO. Also, the Widow in ME2. And a solid ten more guns in ME3. Because ME3.

 

[StoppedInTracks]

How do organics get more synthetic and what does getting more synthetic even mean as in how does the Crucible make people more synthetic? Don't understand that part of Synthesis. I mean I don't see the reason organics need to become part synthetic( whatever becoming part synthetic even means or how that even works), when they they can just do that to just synthetics or just give synthetics a consciousness.

Organics get immortality, EDI says it in the DLC ending.

 

[Daemul]

I think people need to stop thinking about Synthesis from our limited point of view and start thinking about it from the view of the Mass Effect Species. Species in the Mass Effect universe already have widespread use of synthetic augmentation and genetic engineering.

Governments provide free gene therapy to remove genetic diseases(Ashley had her nearsightedness removed for example), the Alliance provides their soldiers with gene therapy to improve them, the Quarians have integrated extension cybernetic augmentations into their bodies, Cerberus made Shepard and Kai Leng half machine and people are able to enhance the intelligence, strength and attractiveness of their kids, something which is common among the rich.

To us, where we're still struggling to deal with the moral implications of many of the things listed above, Synthesis may seem like a step too far, but to the Mass Effect species, it's just the next logical step in what they've already been doing, and some have nearly achieved it.

The things that bother me about Synthesis are the dumb explanation for it and the green glow. Like really, who wrote the Catalyst's exposition for synthesis? A New DNA? Wat. All synthesis is meant to do is organics part machine and give synthetics understanding of organics, not change their damn DNA. All the Catalyst had to say is Synthesis makes organics the same Shepard and makes synthetics the same as EDI and left it at that, but someone, who clearly didn't know have any knowledge about what they were writing about, tried to be clever and wrote some mystical bullshit, probably the same guy who came up with the "human essence" and "Not just any Reaper, a Human Reaper" lines from ME2.

On the green glow, I know Bioware added it as a sort of visual indicator to show Synthesis had made some sort of difference, because if they hadn't added it some people would have been wondering what had changed since all the changes were internal, but it was a dumb decision on Bioware's part, the glow looks stupid.

Organics get immortality, EDI says it in the DLC ending.

What? No. She says they may transcend mortality not that they do.

 

[JeffZero]

On the green glow, I know Bioware added it as a sort of visual indicator to show Synthesis had made some sort of difference, because if they hadn't added it some people would have been wondering what had changed since all the changes were internal, but it was a dumb decision on Bioware's part, the glow looks stupid.

I will agree with this. I headcanon it that a few weeks after the ending, as everyone is kind of coming to grips with things, there's a collective "you know, we should figure out how to not glow green right this instant."

 

[The Artisan]

did anyone besides me think of commander shepard when first seeing jeremy meeks' mugshot?

Popular video game forum, wouldn't work.

he's a real person. it's a coincidence that the first 3 letters of his last name are the same as the last 3 of this forum.

 

[kpzero]

Is it sad that I have had Aaryn's neogaf profile page as a permanent browser tab for months hoping for any random update on a collection?

Personally, I am going to give up on it ever happening if there is nothing at E3.

 

[JeffZero]

I might well do the same, honestly. It feels kinda... now-or-never-esque.

 

[Patryn]

Ditto.

If there's no mention of it at EA's press conference, I'm starting up Mass Effect and doing my full playthrough again. I've been holding off on the possibility it was coming.

 

[Patrick S.]

That Garrus is mildly frightening. lol, I think it's the uncanny valley effect of seeing a video game character in person. Really great work though.

I felt the same way about it :O

 

[JohnnyFootball]

So many negative nancys here.

Wait until E3.

 

[StoppedInTracks]

What? No. She says they may transcend mortality not that they do.

Sounds the same to me.

Problem is what about new machines created post-Synthesis. Like... can you even create a new "machine"/"robot" in the post-Synthesis world? Does a CPU some wires and a piece of metal are already "synthesised" with human DNA?

The whole ending is pure bullshit.

 

[BeauRoger]

Have there been any indications that they are planning another trilogy, or if the next ME is going to be a standalone game?

 

[Patryn]

Have there been any indications that they are planning another trilogy, or if the next ME is going to be a standalone game?

I don't believe they've indicated that they're doing another trilogy, they've just said they're doing another game.

I suspect they don't want to handcuff themselves in the same way as the last trilogy. Remember that they've admitted that they basically went into Mass Effect 2 with no plan of what it would be.

 

[diaspora]

I don't believe they've indicated that they're doing another trilogy, they've just said they're doing another game.

I suspect they don't want to handcuff themselves in the same way as the last trilogy. Remember that they've admitted that they basically went into Mass Effect 2 with no plan of what it would be.

Wouldn't it make more sense to plan a trilogy then?