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[Blader]

Finally finished it. Overall, I'm happy with the game and I'm glad I chose

Spoiler

revenge instead of deal. Killing Dimitri and Pegerino seems a lot more satisfying and meaningful in the revenge story than the deal story. Also, "A Dish Served Cool" was really fucking awesome.

And oh man, Packie's call at the end.

Spoiler

=(

 

[bigmakstudios]

Does anyone else think some of these missions are just poorly designed? I expect a lot of "you should stop sucking" or something of the sort, but I've failed missions so many times...

Spoiler

The helicopter mission with Little Jacob, for instance, was a total pain in the ass. On one of my attempts, he took three shots at the other helicopter and missed each time, then the helicopter turned back to land.
Three Leaf Clover and other missions like it are also kinda fucked up. Should I be shooting the cops that are right behind my back, or just moving on with Packie and the others? According to the game, it's the latter, but logically, I should need to eliminate the cops behind me first. And the scripted car chases. Oh christ wtf.... All excitement and immersion is lost when I'm driving right next to the enemy for much of the chase, emptying entire clips right into him, with no effect.
The cover system doesn't work sometimes too. If you point the analog stick in just the wrong direction, Niko won't crouch down behind a low wall that bisects another... he'll just turn his back to the adjacent wall and get shot like a dumbass.

Also, I don't care what anyone says about this... there should've been checkpoints.

Spoiler

I don't know how the fuck anyone else finished Three Leaf Clover... I failed the first time during the car chase, then gave up on doing it normally, and instead, ran back through the subway. How could you get into a car before getting shot a bunch of times by the cops? And why the hell do Packie and his friends act like such idiots? aurgh....

I've had another technical problem with it too. The game has frozen every day that I've played it. Ejecting it than putting it back in fixes it, but won't stop the game from randomly freezing. I just cleared the 360 cache though... will that fix it?

 

[endlessflood]

How can you get on the rollercoaster with a car??

Drive east along the road that runs east-west in front of the coaster, chuck a hard U-turn at the first break in the fence at the eastern end, and then hug the inside of the fence. There's a break in the rollercoaster railing that you can get a car through where the rollercoaster track comes down near the ground (this is on the northern side of the rollercoaster itself).

You need to hit with enough force to propel your car so that each set of wheels are roughly lined up with the coaster tracks, otherwise your car can end up bottomed out on one of the tracks with wheels hanging off each side. It takes a fair bit of messing around to get it.

Note that some cars fit better than others. Also some cars which fit in down the bottom will be too wide to take the turns at the top.

 

[bigmakstudios]

I can't do the fucking Undertaker mission. I don't know if it's due to the game's design or my own skill, but I've failed most missions at least once. Here, I can't find any good cover. If I take cover behind the cars, the enemies still hit me in the head.

Spoiler

Actually, while typing this post, I figured it out. The problem is that the game is ostensibly open ended, but the solutions in these missions are almost invariably singular. I needed to stand behind one specific car to prevent Niko from getting his head shot off, even though three or four were there, all in a row. Retarded design, if you ask me.

 

[Blader]

I can't do the fucking Undertaker mission. I don't know if it's due to the game's design or my own skill, but I've failed most missions at least once. Here, I can't find any good cover. If I take cover behind the cars, the enemies still hit me in the head.

Spoiler

Actually, while typing this post, I figured it out. The problem is that the game is ostensibly open ended, but the solutions in these missions are almost invariably singular. I needed to stand behind one specific car to prevent Niko from getting his head shot off, even though three or four were there, all in a row. Retarded design, if you ask me.

Rocket launcher.

 

[bigmakstudios]

Now it's Museum Piece that's fucking me over. Fuck this wtf. I've failed it twice now because in one of the last rooms, the cover system fails miserably. I swear, I've failed because of the same exact cover system glitch twice now. I enter a room, and an enemy walks just beyond the area I could hit within the cover system, so I get shot a few times before I could kill him. It's such bullshit.

 

[raYne]

Now it's Museum Piece that's fucking me over. Fuck this wtf. I've failed it twice now because in one of the last rooms, the cover system fails miserably. I swear, I've failed because of the same exact cover system glitch twice now. I enter a room, and an enemy walks just beyond the area I could hit within the cover system, so I get shot a few times before I could kill him. It's such bullshit.

So don't use it.

Because of how clumsy it is, I barely ever used it after a few hours into the game. I'd just use the dive/slide into cover moves and detach myself as soon as I got into postion. It's far more trouble than it's worth.

 

[Zeouterlimits]

So don't use it.

Because of how clumsy it is, I barely ever used it after a few hours into the game. I'd just use the dive/slide into cover moves and detach myself as soon as I got into postion. It's far more trouble than it's worth.

Agreed, I felt the cover, in that mission especially made killing the dudes really awkward.
Are you getting the health/vest {I cannot which it was} at the bottom of the stairs on the desk? Using the M4 I just brutally murdered everyone in there {I just did it yesterday, so it's fresh in my mind}.

 

[bigmakstudios]

Agreed, I felt the cover, in that mission especially made killing the dudes really awkward.
Are you getting the health/vest {I cannot which it was} at the bottom of the stairs on the desk? Using the M4 I just brutally murdered everyone in there {I just did it yesterday, so it's fresh in my mind}.

I was mostly fine in that room. It was that small room afterwards where I got shot a few times.

 

[bigmakstudios]

My failed mission count is at 128 now. I just thought it was an interesting stat. >_>
edit: Now I'm at 129. I was doing one of those chase missions where the enemies could damage you but they're totally invulnerable.
Also, I completely lost track of the story when the diamond plot was introduced. Too many characters are introduced too quickly with too many motivations and loyalties. It's all just a big blur.

 

[raYne]

Dude.. I probably have <20 in two and a half playthroughs. What're you doing?! :lol

 

[bigmakstudios]

I don't know. I failed missions over and over again because of enemies shooting at me while Niko just stands there like an idiot, not moving into cover, or moving to the wrong wall or object. Shit like that, and the scripted chases... in which enemies whittle down your health while you can do nothing to damage them. You're told to chase the enemies, but if you get too close, apparently, they could kill you. It's shitty. Also, I guess I just suck, or I haven't been able to acclimate myself to the shitty controls. I found free-aim worked pretty well at first, and I much preferred it to lock on, but I eventually needed to use lock-on because of the sheer amounts of enemies. Lock on still sucks though. It's very faulty. It doesn't lock on to the enemy nearest to your cursor. It just seems to randomly choose a single enemy to shoot at.
So yeah, I regret defending this game. It's been extremely frustrating, not very fun, and the story became convoluted, in my opinion, when it started introducing a bunch of different families and characters almost all at once.

edit: And the driving controls are pretty terrible. It's way too difficult to make sharp turns, and cars tip over like a house of cards.

 

[Twig]

Dude.. I probably have <20 in two and a half playthroughs. What're you doing?! :lol

Not everyone is as good at games as you are! O:

Plus I can completely understand. I didn't have anywhere near as many failures as he did, but a lot of my successes seemed like they were just pure luck that I managed to do it the first time without losing.

Especially those fucking invincible-car chases.

 

[CoG]

I love when you complete a mission with a wanted level, then Niko just MUST call the guy who hired you for it, all the time the cops or shooting at you and you can't do anything about it. You can hang up but you miss all the dialog. Stupid stupid stupid.

 

[dskillzhtown]

Rocket launcher.

Pretty much, there is a reason they give you an insane amount of money towards the end of the game. Rocket launcher comes in handy for pretty much every mission after a certain point.


bigmak, you might want to get a vest before every mission. It gives you alot more wiggle room on missions. Also, I find that in most missions, trying to rush through them does not work at all. Take your time, even with most of the chase missions, if you just stay reasonably close, that is good enough.

 

[bigmakstudios]

I think I'm improving. A little.
But I can't comprehend the story. Did anyone else get lost during the diamond heist? I couldn't figure out who was stealing from who, why they were stealing, why the diamonds were in trash bags, and I generally just had no idea what was going on from the point Niko was asked to collect the diamonds onward. If anyone could explain that shit to me, I'd appreciate it.

 

[endlessflood]

I think I'm improving. A little.
But I can't comprehend the story. Did anyone else get lost during the diamond heist? I couldn't figure out who was stealing from who, why they were stealing, why the diamonds were in trash bags, and I generally just had no idea what was going on from the point Niko was asked to collect the diamonds onward. If anyone could explain that shit to me, I'd appreciate it.

I found the exact same thing. They even talk about it later in the game, and it still doesn't shed any light.

 

[disappeared]

Well, I traded my copy in the other day for credit at EB. Sorry, Rockstar, there just wasn't enough to keep me occupied after the end credits rolled.

 

[Blader]

I think I'm improving. A little.
But I can't comprehend the story. Did anyone else get lost during the diamond heist? I couldn't figure out who was stealing from who, why they were stealing, why the diamonds were in trash bags, and I generally just had no idea what was going on from the point Niko was asked to collect the diamonds onward. If anyone could explain that shit to me, I'd appreciate it.

Here's the diamond plot (as I understand it). SPOILERS for up to, and including, the final diamond mission.

Spoiler

The diamonds originally belonged to Ray Bulgarin, the man Niko used to work for back in Bosnia. They were stolen by a club owner in Liberty City named Gay Tony. Ray Boccino worked out a deal with the Lost biker gang (his wife is friends with the Lost), in which the Lost would steal the diamonds from Tony, hide them trash bags, and then Ray would collect them (Ray worked it out this way so if anything bad happened, the Lost would get all the heat for stealing the diamonds). Ray's guards try to rip him off and keep the diamonds for themselves, but Ray has Niko kill them and return the jewels.

Ray sends Niko to meet with Johnny, leader of the Lost, to sell the diamonds to a dealer named Isaac. The deal is ambushed, so Johnny runs off with the money, the diamonds find their way back to Tony, and Isaac runs off empty-handed. The botched deal causes a rift between Ray and Isaac, so Ray sends you to kill Isaac while sending his own men to deal with Johnny and reclaim the money (we're never shown what comes of this).

Ray and the McRearys work out a new way to get the diamonds (again) from Tony. They kidnapped Gracie Ancelotti, the de facto head of the Ancelotti family, because she's friends with Tony. Niko and Packie arrange to exchange Gracie for the diamonds, which they do, until Bulgarin shows up and ambushes them. Bulgarin leaves his men to reclaim the diamonds and kill Niko, but the guy who picks up the diamonds decides they'd all be better off if they were gone forever, and so throws the diamonds into the back of a garbage truck.

A little later, a homeless man is reported to have found the diamonds at the dump, and he uses them to leave to Vice City and open up a business.

 

[dskillzhtown]

It took me five tries to beat that mission, and I discovered that you don't need to aim at all. Actually, you don't even need to fire the guns - just dodge the incoming RPGs for a pre-determined amount of time and a cutscene will trigger.

Really? I will try that when I get home. Because I am getting shot down trying to shoot the boat and not really dodging.

 

[tha_con]

I seriously need to finish this game...I put it down because it felt so 'rinse repeat' but I really really want to finish it.

Does Niko's story get more compelling (i.e. do they flesh out his past?).

 

[clutha]

I seriously need to finish this game...I put it down because it felt so 'rinse repeat' but I really really want to finish it.

Does Niko's story get more compelling (i.e. do they flesh out his past?).

I may be in the minority but I'm finding the story fairly compelling from the get-go on this one... although I may one of few who IV is their first taste of GTA.

 

[Struct09]

I seriously need to finish this game...I put it down because it felt so 'rinse repeat' but I really really want to finish it.

Does Niko's story get more compelling (i.e. do they flesh out his past?).

Sadly, no. As much as I love the game, the story tanks

 

[bigmakstudios]

WHAT THE FUCK
Why does he always put his fucking weapon away when he leaves his car?

 

[Jedeye Sniv]

WHAT THE FUCK
Why does he always put his fucking weapon away when he leaves his car?

Um, he doesn't. Equip the weapon you're gonna want before you get in the car and voila, it's there when you get out. The foot-section and vehicle-section weapon systems are different.

 

[bigmakstudios]

Uh.... whenever I get out, it automatically switches to hand to hand.
edit: I have over 150 failed missions now. I don't know how anyone could get used to the game play.

 

[Blader]

Uh.... whenever I get out, it automatically switches to hand to hand.
edit: I have over 150 failed missions now. I don't know how anyone could get used to the game play.

You have to be halfway competent at video games.

 

[MMaRsu]

I seriously need to finish this game...I put it down because it felt so 'rinse repeat' but I really really want to finish it.

Does Niko's story get more compelling (i.e. do they flesh out his past?).

No.

 

[Kydd BlaZe]

I may be in the minority but I'm finding the story fairly compelling from the get-go on this one... although I may one of few who IV is their first taste of GTA.

I felt that the story was pretty compelling all the way through. Although, i'm probably the only one left on GAF that actually liked the game.

 

[bigmakstudios]

You have to be halfway competent at video games.

I haven't ever had this sort of trouble with a video game before Grand Theft Auto IV.

 

[newsguy]

I felt that the story was pretty compelling all the way through. Although, i'm probably the only one left on GAF that actually liked the game.

I still play it and enjoy it. In the grand scheme of things GAF is such a small and hardcore niche demographic that I wouldn't put any weight into all of the hate.

 

[Twig]

Just because we recognize that there are flaws in the game does not mean we hate it. It's still a game worth playing. The number of people who actually "hate" the game is a minority, even on GAF.

You have to be halfway competent at video games.

The game is flawed in many ways that could be frustrating and cause problems for any number of different people in different ways. Just because you found ways to adapt to said flaws doesn't make you some gaming king.

 

[Aladuf]

I need to get back into playing this. I got 16 hours in and took a break. And it wasn't the kind of break where "I hated GTA and never wanted to touch it again" I just never have gotten around to it since I stopped.

 

[Kydd BlaZe]

I need to get back into playing this. I got 16 hours in and took a break. And it wasn't the kind of break where "I hated GTA and never wanted to touch it again" I just never have gotten around to it since I stopped.

I'd definitely recommend finishing it. Although it can get a bit repetative at times, the game is still all sorts of awesome.

 

[Aladuf]

I'd definitely recommend finishing it. Although it can get a bit repetative at times, the game is still all sorts of awesome.

Oh yeah definetly, I had a hell of a good time when I played it. I'm not too sure why I stopped playing it really, probably I just overplayed it right off the bat. Or maybe I've just been playing too much Gears lately :lol

 

[Blader]

The game is flawed in many ways that could be frustrating and cause problems for any number of different people in different ways. Just because you found ways to adapt to said flaws doesn't make you some gaming king.

I'm not insinuating that I'm really good at games, but rather, that bigmakstudios is really bad.

 

[endlessflood]

Here's the diamond plot (as I understand it).

Thanks for that mate, I finally understand what the hell happened. But even just reading it in summary is confusing. What the hell were the developers thinking?

 

[RotBot]

I don't like how you have to fail every mission once to get all of the pre-mission dialog. If you're good and don't fail often, you only hear half of the mission backstories. I've started failing the first run on purpose now.

 

[bigmakstudios]

What about

Spoiler

the deal with Dmitri?

It seemed pretty straight forward on the surface, but

Spoiler

Dmitri gets the H, and who does he kill? The buyer? He's the buyer, isn't he? So then why does he say he kills the people he was going to sell it to?

edit:

Okay, I really need some help with the final mission,

Spoiler

Out of Commission

. I've checked FAQs and this thread and I still can't do it. I haven't been this frustrated with a game in a long, long time. Talk about shitty design.... ARG!

So...

Spoiler

I'm trying to follow Jimmy Peg in the helicopter, but he either shoots me down with a 1-hit instant kill (yeah, that's fun) or if I manage to keep up with him until I get shot with a non-head on shot and slowly crash, I lose total control of the helicopter and can't do anything as it spins and eventually hits the water. When exactly does he hit you with the mandatory missile that initiates the cutscene and how the hell do you manage to control the helicopter so you don't end up in the water? And if I stay too low, he gets me with a perfect dead on hit that's an instant kill and if I go to high the game tells me he got away. This has got to be the most annoying mission design I've ever seen. You HAVE to get hit? How are people supposed to know that? Don't you usually make games where you avoid stuff like that that? ANGER!!!

Please help

This is the kind of stuff that made me fail over 150 missions. >_> I was playing

Spoiler

Out of Commission, and I just got killed instantly when I came up behind Pegorino in the helicopter. Although, I'm pretty sure Little Jacob said to go down to his level.

How the fuck are you supposed to avoid that, or anticipate it? It's just frustrating game design. The first 2/3 of that missions are a breeze for me, but then I got stuck on one section that I just can't do, and I fail repeatedly.

 

[ckohler]

I practically never play online. On Sunday I decided to play a round of team co-op with a friend out of the blue. Only two minutes into match and we both end up getting the "Let Sleeping Rockstars Lie" achievement. :lol

 

[Salmonax]

I don't like how you have to fail every mission once to get all of the pre-mission dialog. If you're good and don't fail often, you only hear half of the mission backstories. I've started failing the first run on purpose now.

I'm not sure what you mean - does the dialog change when you retry missions?

 

[AstroLad]

I'm not sure what you mean - does the dialog change when you retry missions?

yes

 

[bigmakstudios]

Anyway, I just finished. In some ways, it's incredible, but in others, it frustrates the hell out of me, and I hate it. I guess it says a lot about the game's accomplishments that I stuck through it even after I had failed over 150 missions.

The world itself is amazing. There isn't much in the city to interact with, but it's so huge, and I think I'm going to like exploring it for a while now that I'm finished with the story. But I really hated the mission design, for the most part. The game teaches you to take cover behind walls, etc, and then all of a sudden someone will jump right in front of you, or shoot you, despite you being completely hidden by the wall. Or an enemy might sneak up behind you from off camera. I don't think the game's controls work very well at all in those situations.

And I think one of the biggest problems is that there are missions where you need to do things in a very specific manner, but you aren't given very specific instructions. In the scripted chase sequences, you should be following a certain distance behind... often, the enemies could damage you, but you can't damage them. So, if you follow too close, you'll be killed. But how would a player know that they shouldn't attempt to kill the enemy? It just doesn't make sense. And the story, well... I thought it got kinda convoluted in a couple points.

If anyone wants to add me to play online at some point, my gamertag is lolwot. I can't play now though.

 

[Salmonax]

yes

Weird - I never noticed. Guess I didn't miss it.

 

[MercuryLS]

Wait, someone failed 150 missions here? WTF?

I failed maybe 15 missions tops. The game really wasn't that hard, body armor people. Use it.

The backlash here is hilarious, the game is tops. Easily my favorite game this gen, nothing comes close, not even MGS4.

 

[bigmakstudios]

Wait, someone failed 150 missions here? WTF?

I failed maybe 15 missions tops. The game really wasn't that hard, body armor people. Use it.

The backlash here is hilarious, the game is tops. Easily my favorite game this gen, nothing comes close, not even MGS4.

Yes. Although, I only failed the A Dish Best Served Cold mission once (and I wouldn't have even failed it once if I was a bit more cautious), and I never have this severe a problem with video games. Ever. Except with Grand Theft Auto IV. There were certain specific points where I would just fail missions over and over again. Do people use body armor for every mission? Because I rarely picked it up from one of the weapons stores before starting a mission.

 

[dskillzhtown]

Yes. Although, I only failed the A Dish Best Served Cold mission once (and I wouldn't have even failed it once if I was a bit more cautious), and I never have this severe a problem with video games. Ever. Except with Grand Theft Auto IV. There were certain specific points where I would just fail missions over and over again. Do people use body armor for every mission? Because I rarely picked it up from one of the weapons stores before starting a mission.

Definitely used body armor for every mission. Once the game got to the point where money was plentiful, I got armor for even the most mundane missions.

 

[RadarScope1]

It's been extremely frustrating, not very fun, and the story became convoluted, in my opinion, when it started introducing a bunch of different families and characters almost all at once.

Dude - I'm feeling the same way. The game infuriates the hell out of me, and I'm only about halfway through it. I cannot fucking stand replaying through the mundane parts of missions when it's the parts at the very end tripping me up. The chase missions are beyond old at this point. I'm fighting the controls the whole way. The story is spread WAY too thin -- give us 4 or 5 great characters rather than 45 paper-thin ones.

I just have too much other shit to do and too little time to play games in my life to keep replaying this shit that pisses me off. Bottom line is I feel like this game is simply wasting my time about 2/3 of the time I play it. That's now how this is supposed to work ... I want to finish it just to see it through and because of all the hype, but I don't know if I can do it.

bigmakstudios, since you seem to feel (or felt) the same way, I want to ask: I'm at the UL Paper missions. Does it get any better? Is there anything besides "chase" and "kill" after this? Do you really feel it was worth finishing?

 

[FightyF]

My bro just popped in this game, and it updated. As I'm watching him play, the framerate looks a lot smoother. Am I hallucinating?

I've been playing lots of Saint's Row recently, so maybe it's just the contrast between the two games, GTA4 looks smoother. Or maybe, the update did something? Since when did the 360 version get the update? I don't see any mention of it in the last couple pages here...

 

[BakedPigeon]

Has anyone had any trouble finding the random character brian? I cant find him the third time. I know where he is suppose to be but he is never there and I have met the prerequisites to cue this mission.