switch that much, because even though replacing him with his identical twin brother is visually lazy, his personality was different, his interactions with CB were different, even his fighting style was different. They did a solid job of writing him as a pretty new character
Retro_ said:
A-LAWS is basically 00 copying the Titans from Zeta. Don't try and make sense of it.
What's not to get? I mean that's it, they're the Federation's anti-terrorist secret police, just like the Titans were that Federation's anti-Zeon police.
Here are some awful photos of the SD Command Gundam I made. It comes with tons of weapons (Rifle, submachine gun, missile pack, knife, grenades) which can be used in a bunch of different ways. You can even combine the rifle, gun, missile pack and knife into one single mounted weapon. Love how all the armor pieces can come off too. I'm really impressed with the two SD kits I got so far (SD Knight and SD Command), they're a TON of fun to play with, and for the size and price there's a lot more customization gimmicks than I expected.
To be honest, I am in love with the SD kits. Got both Freedom and Perfect Strike and they are great. I'm going to the London Comic Con in a few weeks and will probably pick up other SEED SD kits if they have them.
Prince Ali crazy is he Ali-Al Sanchez (Sorry had to do that) but seriously though he's like a Gundam version of Guaron without the sexual lust for the main character (so far)
Please tell me there's a reason for having Louise and Saji around. The former is beginning to grate on me and both serve no purpose so far.
Either Billy is going to join Celestial Being, get killed because of Sumeragi, or she will join the union.
Allelujah's
Dual personality is handled brilliantly
Nintendoman58 explained better than I could.
Of the three power blocks, the HRL is the one i'm most interested in mostly in mostly due to Sergei and Soma's characters.
Okay so I finally finished my UC run. That's all of 0079, Zeta, ZZ, Char's Counterattack and all of the Unicorn episodes thus far in the past few weeks. Scattered thoughts (I'm not sure what the spoiler policy is in this thread, but to be safe I've spoiler tagged anyways):
- I would say ZZ was definitely helpful in my understanding of what's going on in Unicorn, but it is a bit gray. Frankly, I think that you can go into Unicorn just ignoring everything beforehand and enjoy it for what it is, but considering how much the plot reflects back on everything thats happened in the UC, you would lose a bit of the satisfaction. But only a bit; I think even if you've watched more than one of these series you'll come to terms with the fact that its different permutations of the same themes over and over and over and over and over.
- Overall, Unicorn seems to have the most consistently awesome designs. I see there was a grunt discussion earlier, and I have to say I like the Federation grunts (Rezel?) quite a fair but over all of the others, they seem to at least look as if there was more than minimum effort put into developing them especially relative to flagship Gundams. If I can include SEED, I would have to say the M1 Astray is probably still my favourite (and probably my favourite design period)
- Throughout history, it seems fairly arbitrary to me what is designated a Gundam, at least according to plotlines. What is stopping anyone from making a Gundam-look-a-like and suddenly people bowing down to it in awe and it being crowned Gundam-class? Not sure if supplementary media has an explanation for this. Doesn't really matter, I guess, but it is weird to me, especially when this was the case with the Unicorn Gundam once more.
- It's hard to rank 0079, Zeta and ZZ. 0079 clearly had the most originality and every series afterwards was heavily derivative, returning to similar locations and scenarios, but the battles, suit design and diversity improved as it went on. I'd probably put 0079 on top for that reason primarily, but watching Zeta afterwards was a bit more satisfying. I'd put Zeta above ZZ because I liked the main Gundam better, and generally the cast and relationships between different cast members were stronger. I still couldn't muster up any fucks for
Iino, Beecha, Elle, etc.
but I could for
Kotz, Quattro, Fa and co
. I also am partial to the
AEUG/Titan/Zeon
power struggle versus what you find closer to the end of ZZ, it seems like they handled corruption a bit better.
- Man, going from ZZ to Unicorn is jarring. The dialogue and animation quality is so much better. However, there are way too many characters to follow in a short period of time. Considerable fat could be trimmed as far as influential figures goes. Because I primarily watch these series to see some fucking robots wrecking shit, I think animation is the biggest difference, it's far better and more fluid than even SEED was. I think for the next series I watch, I'll try for one that is more modern and well-animated before I jump back into Wing (which I never finished in my childhood).
- Char's Counterattack sucked. Just seems like it's a lot condensed into a very short period of time. I might be biased after watching these long sagas, but I don't think Char's motivations got the amount of exposition they needed. I get that
Char still had latent motivations for spacenoids to be able to achieve their potential which would mean knocking Earth's power down a notch, but after fighting for mutual survival and, generally, peace, throughout Zeta and seemingly understanding the value of the preservation of Earth in his speech, his complete heel-turn in CCA is off-putting. Even Amuro feels detached from his character and previous relationship from Char.
The entire thing felt like some non-canon sidestory; when Char's actions are referenced in Unicorn it seems like they are referencing two different people, because that's what it seems like. The Sazabi was cool though, I guess. It's almost to the point where I don't even believe Char's character would have taken those actions even if tensions got that extreme. Suddenly, he has this extreme bloodlust, and the rationale for it all is even sillier.
- Since Gundam Build Fighters was the first full series I watched, I can imagine why people were having orgasms over the appearance of certain cameos and designs. For instance, I thought the Qubeley Papillon was ugly as fuck in GBF, but now with the context of the designs it is sourced from, I have grown a bit more appreciation for it (still ugly as fuck tho, esp.compared to the designs it sources). It also makes sense why
Aila
piloted it.
All this Gundam wants me to do is order an MG, but its a bit out of my budget ATM; they're all just way too expensive even before you consider shipping
Okay so I finally finished my UC run. That's all of 0079, Zeta, ZZ, Char's Counterattack and all of the Unicorn episodes thus far in the past few weeks. Scattered thoughts (I'm not sure what the spoiler policy is in this thread, but to be safe I've spoiler tagged anyways):
- I would say ZZ was definitely helpful in my understanding of what's going on in Unicorn, but it is a bit gray. Frankly, I think that you can go into Unicorn just ignoring everything beforehand and enjoy it for what it is, but considering how much the plot reflects back on everything thats happened in the UC, you would lose a bit of the satisfaction. But only a bit; I think even if you've watched more than one of these series you'll come to terms with the fact that its different permutations of the same themes over and over and over and over and over.
All this Gundam wants me to do is order an MG, but its a bit out of my budget ATM; they're all just way too expensive even before you consider shipping
Well it certainly sounds like the second half of ZZ got much better for you as you said that you still rated it near Zeta, and the first third of the show you were saying you detested it.
- Throughout history, it seems fairly arbitrary to me what is designated a Gundam, at least according to plotlines. What is stopping anyone from making a Gundam-look-a-like and suddenly people bowing down to it in awe and it being crowned Gundam-class? Not sure if supplementary media has an explanation for this. Doesn't really matter, I guess, but it is weird to me, especially when this was the case with the Unicorn Gundam once more.
You're fairly right in that, but I think during Zeta and ZZ you do get that, actually. I mean by rights the Gundam is a Federation MS, but then the AEUG decides that fuck it, they stole a Gundam and now they're going to build one themselves, while the Titans go "Oh we don't need to mass produce the MK II we'll just mass produce the Psyco Gundam series instead." And then out of nowhere in ZZ Gundam the Hyaku Shiki is upgraded to Gundam status. 'Course in ZZ the AEUG may as well be the EFSF since they're saddled with fighting the Zeon.
Later on in Victory Gundam the villains will try desperately to convince people that the Victories and EZs are not Gundams, to prevent the legend from being used against them, even though the Victory Gundam is as Gundam as a Gundam gonna get. Then again, Turn A is screwy as hell about it since the Turn A is a Gundam but doesn't look much like one at all.
- Overall, Unicorn seems to have the most consistently awesome designs. I see there was a grunt discussion earlier, and I have to say I like the Federation grunts (Rezel?) quite a fair but over all of the others, they seem to at least look as if there was more than minimum effort put into developing them especially relative to flagship Gundams. If I can include SEED, I would have to say the M1 Astray is probably still my favourite (and probably my favourite design period)
Well it certainly sounds like the second half of ZZ got much better for you as you said that you still rated it near Zeta, and the first third of the show you were saying you detested it.
Yeah I definitely agree with the sentiment that it gets a lot better once the per-episode concentration of
ONI-CHAN and purupurupurupuru
decreased. Not sure if I like Judau any more or less than Kamille, though. My problem with Kamille was how his attitude was that of a 4 year old whereas I don't particularly find anything being noteworthy about Judau, and he seemed to
get over the apparent death of his sister, seemingly the only thing he lived and fought for, pretty easily; I expected a greater emotional impact and more difficulty building resolve, even as it seemed he got a definitive newtype "feel" for her death. It just seemed to be over with like that.
You're fairly right in that, but I think during Zeta and ZZ you do get that, actually. I mean by rights the Gundam is a Federation MS, but then the AEUG decides that fuck it, they stole a Gundam and now they're going to build one themselves, while the Titans go "Oh we don't need to mass produce the MK II we'll just mass produce the Psyco Gundam series instead." And then out of nowhere in ZZ Gundam the Hyaku Shiki is upgraded to Gundam status. 'Course in ZZ the AEUG may as well be the EFSF since they're saddled with fighting the Zeon.
Later on in Victory Gundam the villains will try desperately to convince people that the Victories and EZs are not Gundams, to prevent the legend from being used against them, even though the Victory Gundam is as Gundam as a Gundam gonna get. Then again, Turn A is screwy as hell about it since the Turn A is a Gundam but doesn't look much like one at all.
You make good points. I guess a newtype being the primary pilot really is the big after-the-fact qualification for it being a Gundam, but that still doesn't explain Zakus.
This is true. Well, I think this is true for every grunt, but the ReZELs get done much worse than being smashed. Though they look pretty developed, they're seemingly made of styrofoam, getting melted and vaporized with every slice and shot.
Side note: I tried to do a RX-78 version of my Iron Man avatar to celebrate my newfound Gundam obsession and it ended up ghastly D;
This is true. Well, I think this is true for every grunt, but the ReZELs get done much worse than being smashed. Though they look pretty developed, they're seemingly made of styrofoam, getting melted and vaporized with every slice and shot.
YOU'RE NOT LOCKON DAMMIT. YOU'RE NOT THE REAL LOCKON.
Damn it, I'm sorry, but this is just lazy and insulting. Seeing this Lockon in action just fuels my rage on how it demeans how the better Lockon went out. That's basically who S2 Lockon is. Not quite as good as the original Lockon, and that's pretty much it for his character. So far anyway.
Wait what?
Allelujah is no longer with Hallelujah? Well...that's dissapointing. His struggle with his other half is kinda what made me really like his character.
Show still continues to be spectacular with its action sequences with these two episodes.
Yeah I definitely agree with the sentiment that it gets a lot better once the per-episode concentration of
ONI-CHAN and purupurupurupuru
decreased. Not sure if I like Judau any more or less than Kamille, though. My problem with Kamille was how his attitude was that of a 4 year old whereas I don't particularly find anything being noteworthy about Judau, and he seemed to
get over the apparent death of his sister, seemingly the only thing he lived and fought for, pretty easily; I expected a greater emotional impact and more difficulty building resolve, even as it seemed he got a definitive newtype "feel" for her death. It just seemed to be over with like that.
You make good points. I guess a newtype being the primary pilot really is the big after-the-fact qualification for it being a Gundam, but that still doesn't explain Zakus.
Wait, I remember Judau not reacting well to that at all. Like, when
Haman's goons shot Leena Judau got so pissed he emitted a psychic demon and made Haman Khan, Queen of Earth, run away from him in tears. I think he hides a lot of it after that episode because he doesn't want Puru to freak out again. I also remember thinking he was having a mental breakdown toward the end when he started going on about Leena being alive. That made me pretty damn scared because Tomino'd already fucked up my boy Kamille and if he did the same to Judau I'd've flipped.
As to the second part, your army is required by space law to use Zakus if you're going to be a bunch of arrogant losers. If you're some goddamn winners, though, you use GMs. Because mass produced sorta Gundams are for the side that wins the war.
Forgot to do a GameFAQs-esque list of my favourite suits :3
0079
- MS-07B Gouf (Very menacing, it's presence was immediately felt when it entered the battlefield)
Zeta
- RMS-099 Rick Dias (Don't really like Rick Doms, but the Dias has a fantastic combination of looking bulky yet streamlined; love the spoiler on the head too)
- MSZ-006 Zeta Gundam (I think a lot of the personality of Gundam models comes from the chest vents, and I think Zeta has one of the best)
- MSN-00100 Hyaku Shiki (There's something badass about Mr. Red Comet piloting a shining golden ball of hope)
ZZ
- AMX-104 R-Jarja (A nice mix of hellish and very knight-esque design)
- AMX-107 Bawoo (Like it for the same reasons above)
CCA
- MSN-04 Sazabi (A nice predecessor to the Sinanju)
Unicorn
- RX-0 Unicorn Gundam (Looks a lot better not in destroy mode :x)
- MSN-06S Sinanju (Probably the best villain suit I've seen, so menacing yet so beautiful and regal, very fitting for CharFull Frontal)
- MSA-005K Guncannon Detector (Nice updated design of the original)
- MSN-001A1 Delta Plus (Hnnnngghhh, it's like a ghost unit, I love it)
- ReZELs (Fantastic designs for all types; Type-C has a great, elite colour scheme)
Wait, I remember Judau not reacting well to that at all. Like, when
Haman's goons shot Leena Judau got so pissed he emitted a psychic demon and made Haman Khan, Queen of Earth, run away from him in tears. I think he hides a lot of it after that episode because he doesn't want Puru to freak out again. I also remember thinking he was having a mental breakdown toward the end when he started going on about Leena being alive. That made me pretty damn scared because Tomino'd already fucked up my boy Kamille and if he did the same to Judau I'd've flipped.
Maybe it was how it was presented that threw me off, because
when Haman shot Leena, there was a definite outbears of psycho energy that conveyed his dismay, but when she actually died after, there was no real release. On top of that, I thought it was awkward how he responded to Puru after Leena's death, I thought he would have insta-smacked her after she was still requesting that Puru become his sister even after Leena had just passed; it did not really come across to me like him and Puru's bond strengthened immediately after Leena's death or even after the "we're all a family" speech. I don't think I completely followed how Judau's way of coping with Puru evolved over time. I guess perhaps you could chalk it up to him maturing emotionally, but I still expected him to respond much more emotionally and informally, especially in such a situation where even Puru would set aside her selfish desires.
What makes a Gundam a Gundam in these shows mostly comes down to a combination of prototype reasons (Gundams are usually testbeds for something intended for mass production) and propaganda reasons. Technically, you could slap that face and V-fin onto any suit and call it a Gundam, but then it kind of devalues its purpose, both inside and outside the show.
For example, the reason the Unicorn actually transforms into a Gundam is because the image inspires fear, and the Federation wants that symbol associated with their Newtype-killing machine.
Maybe it was how it was presented that threw me off, because
when Haman shot Leena, there was a definite outbears of psycho energy that conveyed his dismay, but when she actually died after, there was no real release. On top of that, I thought it was awkward how he responded to Puru after Leena's death, I thought he would have insta-smacked her after she was still requesting that Puru become his sister even after Leena had just passed; it did not really come across to me like him and Puru's bond strengthened immediately after Leena's death or even after the "we're all a family" speech. I don't think I completely followed how Judau's way of coping with Puru evolved over time. I guess perhaps you could chalk it up to him maturing emotionally, but I still expected him to respond much more emotionally and informally, especially in such a situation where even Puru would set aside her selfish desires.
Haha, well I'm not gonna go and say that the presentation of it was perfect, since it has been a good while and I don't remember how it went down. But I'll keep it in mind for when I get to ZZ Gundam again.
Or was the Methuss destroyed early on. Anyway, they give the Hyaku Shiki sorta honorary status there. Otherwise it wouldve just been the MS team, right?
Or was the Methuss destroyed early on. Anyway, they give the Hyaku Shiki sorta honorary status there. Otherwise it wouldve just been the MS team, right?
Eh. Seems pretty clear they wanted the HS to have that honor, or again, it would've just been the MS squad. I mean when there were two Gundams they didn't call it the Gundam squad then. I'm not saying the HS is a Gundam, but it's pretty obvious they accorded it some similar status since they grouped it in.
But whatever. It isn't a big deal either way here.
They're not Gundams but they along with the Gundam are part of Project V, the Federation's weapon plan to win the One Year War.
As for 00, well Setsuna is devoid of emotion most of the time but Lockon's pretty fun at times, Allelujah's an interesting guy and as for Tieria, well he needs getting used to but he does get better.
Before this year I had only seen Gundam Wing: Endless Waltz. Over the past several weeks I've watched all of both Gundam Build Fighters and Gundam Seed. I've really been missing out on a great franchise all these years.
Before this year I had only seen Gundam Wing: Endless Waltz. Over the past several weeks I've watched all of both Gundam Build Fighters and Gundam Seed. I've really been missing out on a great franchise all these years.
As for 00, well Setsuna is devoid of emotion most of the time but Lockon's pretty fun at times, Allelujah's an interesting guy and as for Tieria, well he needs getting used to but he does get better.
Yeah, I think I like some of the character archetypes thus far (stressed female alcoholic boss, young teenage male that could smang his hot GF but is too whipped to do shit), but not the characters themselves. Allelujah is just annoying TBH.
I'm rapidly losing interest in 00. I think it might be the mecha designs. I though the Exia looked cool at first because it has a pretty unique silhouette, but all of the Gundams and Flags look a bit soulless. Fairly decent premise for the conflict but the back and forth about it all is sort of boring.
The thing I always liked about the Tallgeese line is that all three of them are Titanium Alloy mobile suits, just like most of the fodder mechs in that universe. Gundanium in the Wing Universe is extremely strong and they basically shrug off everything below beam weapon hits. The Tallgesse's only real defense is a light ablative coating of that anti beam nonsense and being piloted by people with plot armor. In the end they are just big ass Leo's with giant rocket boosters strapped to them and a whole lot of swag.
Mark III backs it up with a penis envy mega beam cannon but that's a whole nother story.
The thing I always liked about the Tallgeese line is that all three of them are Titanium Alloy mobile suits, just like most of the fodder mechs in that universe. Gundanium in the Wing Universe is extremely strong and they basically shrug off everything below beam weapon hits. The Tallgesse's only real defense is a light ablative coating of that anti beam nonsense and being piloted by people with plot armor. In the end they are just big ass Leo's with giant rocket boosters strapped to them and a whole lot of swag.
Mark III backs it up with a penis envy mega beam cannon but that's a whole nother story.
Hahaha, I have the TGIII and its cannon juts out waaaaaaay past the end of my shelf. It's like Zechs hated that the Epyon didn't have any guns, let alone one as big as the WZ, so he put them all together into one super gun.
I do remember the episode where Zechs first pilots the TG being awesome because it was all "This ride is so fast he can barely remain conscious." Probably the first time I'd ever considered what a toll piloting a mech would be on a body.
Hahaha, I have the TGIII and its cannon juts out waaaaaaay past the end of my shelf. It's like Zechs hated that the Epyon didn't have any guns, let alone one as big as the WZ, so he put them all together into one super gun.
I do remember the episode where Zechs first pilots the TG being awesome because it was all "This ride is so fast he can barely remain conscious." Probably the first time I'd ever considered what a toll piloting a mech would be on a body.
