Support NeoGAF

[milanbaros]

Annuity rates have dropped a lot though, hence drawdown. At least there is that option now.

Yes, annuity rates have dropped but his pension pot (which I assume would have almost been all bonds at date of retirement if he was intending to purchase an annuity) should have had a significant increase in value over the past few years.

If I have a £100k bond paying 4% in perpetuity, and interest rates on similar risk bonds fall to 2% my bond will double in value to £200k. If annuity rates have also halved then my net effect is nil.

 

[Dougald]

Yes, annuity rates have dropped but his pension pot (which I assume would have almost been all bonds at date of retirement if he was intending to purchase an annuity) should have had a significant increase in value over the past few years.

If I have a £100k bond paying 4% in perpetuity, and interest rates on similar risk bonds fall to 2% my bond will double in value to £200k. If annuity rates have also halved then my net effect is nil.

Unfortunately its not a large pot to begin with (see above: equitable life). I haven't seen what he has so I can't really comment where it's invested I'll have a word the next time I'm over

 

[Ucchedavāda]

From Nature, today:
E-mails show how UK physicists were dumped over Brexit

Researchers dropped from EU grant proposal because UK inclusion would ‘compromise’ project.

Paul Crowther, who heads the physics and astronomy department at the University of Sheffield, has shared e-mails from late July that explain why researchers in his department were suddenly dropped from an EU collaboration. The European coordinator for the consortium felt that Brexit put UK-based researchers in a “very awkward position” and that their participation would “compromise the project”.

It absolutely sucks for scientists in the UK, but I am not surprised that people don't want to risk their grant applications, which often take a huge amount of work to prepare, especially for the bigger, more competitive grants, on account of uncertainty due to Brexit.

But on the bright side:

In a blogpost on the Institute of Physics website, Crowther contrasts this attitude with the words of Carlos Moedas, the EU research commissioner, who told an audience at the EuroScience Open Forum in Manchester, UK, last week that Horizon 2020 projects would continue to be evaluated on the basis of merit, not nationality.

“I urge the European scientific community to continue to choose their project partners on the basis of excellence,” Moedas said.

 

[Hazzuh]

So amongst all the doom and gloom I thought we could do with a laugh. The Telegraph have an article titled "Don’t blame Brexit for this rate cut. Blame Project Fear"

There are, however, worries that consumer confidence will be hit. Hit by what? Hit by Project Fear’s warnings that Britain would go to the back of the queue in trade deals, that migrants will all be sent home, that tariff walls would suddenly appear cutting the British economy off from the rest of the world, and so on. It is to this weight of paranoia that Mark Carney has felt forced to respond.

lol

 

[Hasney]

I wonder how long they can ride the project fear wave for. Probably a long ass time.

 

[Jisgsaw]

So amongst all the doom and gloom I thought we could do with a laugh. The Telegraph have an article titled "Don’t blame Brexit for this rate cut. Blame Project Fear"



lol

You left out this little gem in your quote:

Rather it is due to the pessimism of the previous government, the Labour Party, Barack Obama, global institutions, sections of the media and, of course, the Bank itself.

Thanks Obama!

 

[tomtom94]

You left out this little gem in your quote:


Thanks Obama!

I think they left out the Jews

 

[Camp Freddie]

OK, I need to vent a bit.

One of my EU colleagues just announced that she's leaving the UK. She just doesn't feel welcome here any more, and doesn't want to spend the rest of her life getting funny looks and justifying the benefits of immigration to ignorant locals, especially since those conversations tend to end with a begrudging, "well, I guess you're okay but you're one of the good ones that work hard and don't scrounge our benefits - unlike some of those [other nationality]".

That's two out of two since Brexit was announced. Arguably three since one guy turned down a contract offer after Brexit.
The UK office is now a local office for local people. Well, technically we still have a scotsman so maybe we'll gain an EU foreigner in the future

Finding replacements will be very hard, and the job will probably move to France.
Thanks Obama!

 

[tuxfool]

The UK office is now a local office for local people.

 

[Jackpot]

"We didn't burn him!"

 

[RedSparrows]

I wonder how long they can ride the project fear wave for. Probably a long ass time.

Years. It's a gift in that it's so nebulous it can never die. Furthermore it alleviates all onus on the part of pro brexiters to actually come up with positive, useful suggestions.

 

[Mr. Sam]

 

[anonymous_abc]

.

<3

 

[nickcv]

For whoever loves cheap fanfics

http://www.express.co.uk/comment/ex...it-EU-Referendum-Paolo-Barnard-Brussels-Italy

Go for the comment section if you really want to test your faith in humanity

 

[*Splinter]

For whoever loves cheap fanfics

http://www.express.co.uk/comment/ex...it-EU-Referendum-Paolo-Barnard-Brussels-Italy

Go for the comment section if you really want to test your faith in humanity

I made it about through about 10 comments before I had to stop.

Love how the author of the article gives the absolute briefest possible mention of Berlusconi in an article thats 90% about him.

 

[nickcv]

I made it about through about 10 comments before I had to stop.

Love how the author of the article gives the absolute briefest possible mention of Berlusconi in an article thats 90% about him.

Of course it didn't!

Some comments around the Web are real masterpieces though:

If the EU restrict access for British exporters, the main sufferers will be consumers in the other EU countries. No more Fishermen's Friends, Fuller's London Pride, baking potatoes, Blue Stilton, Spear and Jackson garden tools and home-brew supplies of malt and hops. Expats will also complain when they can't buy Marmite.

The Germans will also want to continue to sell their cars into what is their biggest market. Hopefully the UK government will not be so stupid as to impose a tariff against them.

 

[Dougald]

Of course it didn't!

Some comments around the Web are real masterpieces though:

Ah yes, the gigantic European fishermans friend market. The French will be crying out for their disgusting menthol tablets

Love the obligatory German carmakers

 

[SporeCrawler]

So are german car makers so dependent on the UK market? I feel like people assume the german car manufacturers only sell in the UK and not like.. Everywhere world wide

 

[*Splinter]

So are german car makers so dependent on the UK market? I feel like people assume the german car manufacturers only sell in the UK and not like.. Everywhere world wide

The weirdest part of that talking point is that people are still going to want to buy German cars. It'll just be slightly more expensive to do so.

I guess that could have an effect on sales for the cheaper Volkswagens etc. But Audi/BMW/Mercedes are luxury cars already, and I don't think they have a huge amount of competition in that market(?)

 

[PJV3]

The weirdest part of that talking point is that people are still going to want to buy German cars. It'll just be slightly more expensive to do so.

I guess that could have an effect on sales for the cheaper Volkswagens etc. But Audi/BMW/Mercedes are luxury cars already, and I don't think they have a huge amount of competition in that market(?)

It's crazy talk, the other day Nissan UK were talking about not deciding about their future until a deal is done.

The car industry at risk isn't going to be the German one.

 

[Dougald]

The weirdest part of that talking point is that people are still going to want to buy German cars. It'll just be slightly more expensive to do so.

I'd be willing to bet most are bought on PCP these days and most people will just see a few quid added to the monthly payment of their next car. Hardly going to stop them

 

[*Splinter]

I'd be willing to bet most are bought on PCP these days and most people will just see a few quid added to the monthly payment of their next car. Hardly going to stop them

Maybe true, although I'm assuming that even in those cases people look at the total price when deciding what car to buy, and cars from European manufacturers are going to get a price bump in comparison to UK/other manufacturers.

The point is that any extra costs due to tariffs will be passed onto customers, loss of market share will be little to none, and the "German car manufacturers" couldn't give less of a shit about Brexit.

 

[PdotMichael]

The German manufactors know the best that the UK isn't worth to break the tight relationship with the various political circles on national and local levels.

 

[Plum]

That guy is right. Everyone knows blue cheese and baking potatoes are to Britain what oil is to Saudi Arabia. Dynasties have been made and wars fought over who can grow the best Jacket Potatoes. The matriarchal Bessie family is a perfect example of this.

 

[Theonik]

That guy is right. Everyone knows blue cheese and baking potatoes are to Britain what oil is to Saudi Arabia. Dynasties have been made and wars fought over who can grow the best Jacket Potatoes. The matriarchal Bessie family is a perfect example of this.

Don't forget cakes!

 

[-Plasma Reus-]

The German manufactors know the best that the UK isn't worth to break the tight relationship with the various political circles on national and local levels.

lol

 

[Ucchedavāda]

The baked potatoes thing is weird. According to this page, based on 2013 numbers, the UK is behind Germany, France, the Netherlands, Poland, and Ukraine (if we count the DCFTA), in terms of potato production.

Personally, I've never seen a British potato in a supermarket, they are almost all locally produced. Looking at a couple of online supermarkets, the only exception is sweet potatoes, which are not sourced from the UK either.

I will, however, miss Fisherman's Friends. Those are pretty nice.

 

[*Splinter]

When someone lists Fisherman's Friends as an export I have to assume they're trolling. And I say that as someone that quite likes Fisherman's Friends.

Of course, they will most likely continue to be available anyway, at a 5-10 cent markup.

 

[Phantast2k]

So are german car makers so dependent on the UK market? I feel like people assume the german car manufacturers only sell in the UK and not like.. Everywhere world wide

No. Quick google search (on VW & BMW):

http://www.statista.com/statistics/267252/key-automobile-markets-of-bmw-group/

http://www.manager-magazin.de/unternehmen/autoindustrie/bild-1031502-842981.html

The British car industry, on the other hand, IS dependent on the EU market:

http://www.smmt.co.uk/2016/01/best-...r-manufacturing-as-exports-reach-record-high/

And none of their industry leaders are British owned (Jaguar Land Rover is a Tata Motors subsidiary, Vauxhall belongs to GM and Mini is produced by BMW). So it's hard to imagine that they keep up their production levels when UK ceases to be part of the single market.

 

[Kathian]

He thing is underlying the single market chat there seems to be people who genuinely believe it would block goods. When really it will just mean small tariffs. Remain did a piss poor job of explaining this and what a 'trade deal' even is; so many Brexiters just find blocking trade ridiculous and they are right.

But for German car makers there is only really an issue if Britain gets good deals with other mass car makers. I.e. the US or Japan. Even then both of those countries will have greater cost of transport.

So really their main competitor is British car manufacturers. And that's when they start laughing. Meanwhile at home in the UK prices rise.

In other news the telegraph has an interesting piece;

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business...itting-the-single-market-as-city-rejects-nor/

The Government has begun considering leaving the single market for the first time, as the Treasury and the newly created Brexit department hold detailed talks with finance leaders over the best way to pull out of the EU.

A series of discussions have been held between the Chancellor Philip Hammond and top business lobby groups including the Confederation of British Industry (CBI), the British Bankers’ Association (BBA) and City of London Corporation to determine the value of the single market and whether so-called passporting rights are worth “fighting for”.

Officials say the talks have revealed a willingness among some top figures to scrap passporting despite early calls to stay in the single market from some quarters.

“We are not calling for membership of the single market – what we want is full two-way access to EU markets. The so-called Norway option would provide greatest continuity for banks and their customers, because basically the current passporting regime would continue to apply,” said the BBA’s chief executive Anthony Browne.

“However, it would mean the UK has to accept financial services regulation that it has no control or influence over.

“Being the financial capital of Europe and the world’s leading international financial centre without any say over how we are regulated would cause major problems in the future, and could be a threat to financial stability.”

It's a difficult situation. The UK basically needs to compete with Europe for the best trade deals internationally and then use that to make itself valuable to Europe. I think more likely banks will just Operate from the continent.

 

[Jisgsaw]

In other news the telegraph has an interesting piece;

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business...itting-the-single-market-as-city-rejects-nor/





It's a difficult situation. The UK basically needs to compete with Europe for the best trade deals internationally and then use that to make itself valuable to Europe. I think more likely banks will just Operate from the continent.

to determine the value of the single market and whether so-called passporting rights are worth “fighting for”.

Is that a serious question they are asking?
In what world do they live?

 

[EmiPrime]

"Top City figures want Britain to leave the single market, to avoid being subject to EU rules"

"Officials say the talks have revealed a willingness among some top figures to scrap passporting despite early calls to stay in the single market from some quarters."

Telegraph in making shit up shocker.

 

[Halph n Halph]

Is that a serious question they are asking?
In what world do they live?

They are the experts. If they feel passporting isn't worth fighting for, we should believe them.
But then again "I think we've all had enough of experts"
The vote didn't go as I'd wished, but we are where we are now.
However, I don't think Britain should bend over and take a shafting on other issues just to keep the financial passport to the EU at all costs.

 

[mclem]

When someone lists Fisherman's Friends as an export I have to assume they're trolling. And I say that as someone that quite likes Fisherman's Friends.

They're actually exported a bit more internationally than many people think. It's still hard to think of it as a lynchpin of a future economy, though!

 

[Jisgsaw]

However, I don't think Britain should bend over and take a shafting on other issues just to keep the financial passport to the EU at all costs.

I'd agree, but:
1) Free movement of EU citizen is actually a net positive for the Uk economy (iirc, correct me if I'm wrong)
2) They aren't asking if they should bend over everything to keep the passports, they are literally asking if it is worth fighting for. As in, if the proposal they get for keeping the passports would make them bend over, should they not better just give up on the passports without trying to negotiate hard to get them on better terms.

 

[Royal_Phalanx]

There goes my hopes to leave the country then.

 

[Joni]

However, I don't think Britain should bend over and take a shafting on other issues just to keep the financial passport to the EU at all costs.

It could all be resolved easily when people actually realize staying in the European Union is the best deal that doesn't involve the resurrection of the British colonial domination.

 

[Royal_Phalanx]

Oh, they won't. Nevermind that trade deals will take years to make with countries that don't really trade as much with you either. Full membership of the EU is really the best deal there is. I hope that May's talk about being for 'unity' will mean that compromises will be made to avoid angering almost half of us who like the EU and want freedom of movement. Free movement is beneficial for both people and government. People can work elsewhere and gain opportunities they may never have got otherwise whilst government gets tax revenue and hard working people, at a time where population growth will only reverse.

 

[Halph n Halph]

Oh, they won't. Nevermind that trade deals will take years to make with countries that don't really trade as much with you either. Full membership of the EU is really the best deal there is. I hope that May's talk about being for 'unity' will mean that compromises will be made to avoid angering almost half of us who like the EU and want freedom of movement. Free movement is beneficial for both people and government. People can work elsewhere and gain opportunities they may never have got otherwise whilst government gets tax revenue and hard working people, at a time where population growth will only reverse.

Free movement was probably the issue that caused the leave vote to win and cannot be compromised on to gain full access or the passport.
It isn't good for everyone, certainly not for me personally or young school leavers hoping to gain apprenticeship places in construction or engineering. No need to train youngsters when there is a huge supply of cheap labour available from eastern Europe.
Of course it will be a net benefit to the economy at large but the personal benefits generally are felt by employers and shareholders.
If there was a high demand for employees, conditions would improve, zero hour contracts and victorian work practices wouldn't be as widespread due to the need to keep hold the staff you have.

 

[Royal_Phalanx]

Free movement was probably the issue that caused the leave vote to win and cannot be compromised on to gain full access or the passport.
It isn't good for everyone, certainly not for me personally or young school leavers hoping to gain apprenticeship places in construction or engineering. No need to train youngsters when there is a huge supply of cheap labour available from eastern Europe.
Of course it will be a net benefit to the economy at large but the personal benefits generally are felt by employers and shareholders.
If there was a high demand for employees, conditions would improve, zero hour contracts and victorian work practices wouldn't be as widespread due to the need to keep hold the staff you have.

Free movement is also good for the young, educated middle-classes as well. They tend to be more mobile. This is also a large part of why I voted Remain, as well as the economic issues. Call me selfish for not understanding the working class and looking out for my own interests? Perhaps. But a bad economy isn't going to help the working class anyway. Hell, a Tory government wouldn't help the working class. I could also be called cowardly for wanting to run away and live in another country under their laws instead of staying and fighting for a better country and laws that I personally agree with, but I don't see how the UK will ever change for the better.

 

[anonymous_abc]

Yes Minister 2016

An office. There is a knock on the door.

Sir Humphrey Come in.

Minister I’m told I can find the new permanent secretary of the new Brexit ministry in here.

Sir Humphrey Indeed you can. Sir Humphrey Appleby at your service.

Minister I’m the new Minister.

Sir Humphrey Which one?

Minister Which one?

Sir Humphrey Well, I know you’re not the foreign secretary – the hair, you know, big give-away – and you’re not Mr Davis nor Dr Fox.

Minister I’m shocked. I thought the civil service would be better prepared than this.

Sir Humphrey Normally we are. But normally the prime Minister puts one person in charge of a new policy initiative, not a job lot.

Minister There is only one secretary of state for exiting the European Union.

Sir Humphrey So where is Mr Davis? We haven’t seen him yet.

Minister He’s over at Chevening.

Sir Humphrey Oh yes, the official residence the PM has ordered him to share with Boris and Liam.

Minister Yes. They’re squabbling over who gets the best bedroom.

Sir Humphrey So you’re one of the junior Ministers.

Minister In charge of all legal matters.

Sir Humphrey Are you a lawyer?

Minister Unfortunately not.

Sir Humphrey On the contrary, that is most fortunate. The civil service has always opposed the appointment of anyone with specialised knowledge.

Minister Why?

Sir Humphrey Their preconceived ideas may not be compatible with government policy.

Minister What if the ideas are good?

Sir Humphrey Most good ideas are incompatible with government policy.

Minister Were you in favour of Brexit?

Sir Humphrey I, Minister? I am neither in favour of nor against anything. I am just a humble vessel into which Ministers pour the fruits of their labour and their remarkable intellectual endeavours. So tell me – what are we trying to achieve here?

More at the link.

 

[Theonik]

Free movement was probably the issue that caused the leave vote to win and cannot be compromised on to gain full access or the passport.
It isn't good for everyone, certainly not for me personally or young school leavers hoping to gain apprenticeship places in construction or engineering. No need to train youngsters when there is a huge supply of cheap labour available from eastern Europe.
Of course it will be a net benefit to the economy at large but the personal benefits generally are felt by employers and shareholders.
If there was a high demand for employees, conditions would improve, zero hour contracts and victorian work practices wouldn't be as widespread due to the need to keep hold the staff you have.

So how do you feel at construction plunging to its levels right after 2008?
Also 'Victorian work practices' don't really have that much to do with immigration either. For most unskilled labour employers will always have vast supply of labour and they really have no incentive to be better even without immigration. Even if it wasn't the case, employers hold all the cards in any situation where unions are not involved unless there is a huge shortage of people in your trade.
For construction employers usually pay people from Eastern Europe more than they do their British counterparts because there was not enough people that were qualified and training people is much more costly and not practical when you have project deadlines to meet.

 

[Halph n Halph]

So how do you feel at construction plunging to its levels right after 2008?
Also 'Victorian work practices' don't really have that much to do with immigration either. For most unskilled labour employers will always have vast supply of labour and they really have no incentive to be better even without immigration. Even if it wasn't the case, employers hold all the cards in any situation where unions are not involved unless there is a huge shortage of people in your trade.
For construction employers usually pay people from Easter Europe more than they do their British counterparts because there was not enough people that were qualified and training people is much more costly and not practical when you have project deadlines to meet.

And this post pretty much explains why 52 % of Britain voted to leave.
Total detachment from what is really happening.
The trade unions themselves have said that free movement has a downward pressure on wages and conditions for workers and yet trade union members deplore racism or any other form of discrimination.
We should have worked with Europe to solve these issues rather than leave, but it seemed to much of the UK that the European commission didn't want to listen.

 

[Maledict]

And this post pretty much explains why 52 % of Britain voted to leave.
Total detachment from what is really happening.
The trade unions themselves have said that free movement has a downward pressure on wages and conditions for workers and yet trade union members deplore racism or any other form of discrimination.
We should have worked with Europe to solve these issues rather than leave, but it seemed to much of the UK that the European commission didn't want to listen.

The majority of leave voters voted to leave because they are racist bigots. Same reason as 40% of Americans voting for Donald Trump. I don't see why we have to pretend otherwise.

 

[Halph n Halph]

The majority of leave voters voted to leave because they are racist bigots. Same reason as 40% of Americans voting for Donald Trump. I don't see why we have to pretend otherwise.

You may think that but I disagree. Many leave voters I know voted out self interest but not racism

 

[nickcv]

You may think that but I disagree. Many leave voters I know voted out self interest but not racism

Whether they voted because of racism or not they enabled racist to act the way they are doing right now.

A widow who married a British doctor called a radio in tears after the vote because she was afraid to leave her own house while people were throwing bags of shit to her window.

And this is just one episode out of way too many.

Maybe they genuinely didn't vote that way because they are racist but the weight is on their shoulders as well.

 

[Halph n Halph]

Well brainless scum existed before the referendum and always will I'm sorry to say.

 

[Plum]

Well brainless scum existed before the referendum and always will I'm sorry to say.

Voting to say "we agree with you, go ahead and be brainless scum!" doesn't help either.

 

[Maledict]

You may think that but I disagree. Many leave voters I know voted out self interest but not racism

~WE know that the majority of leave voters did so because of immigration.

We know that post-brexit vote, a wave of racism and bigotry has swept the country.

We know that the leave campaign absolutely used racism and bigotry to win.


I don't think everyone who voted leave is a racist - but I think the majority were, and I think that if you stand next to racists and vote with them then there's no difference in the end result. Same as republicans in the USA - at some point you have to accept that if you "side" includes racists and shitheads then you are on the wrong side.

 

[Halph n Halph]

Voting to say "we agree with you, go ahead and be brainless scum!" doesn't help either.

Do you think that's what people voted for?