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The UK votes to leave the European Union |OUT2| Mayday, Mayday, I've lost an ARM

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nickcv

Member
Well brainless scum existed before the referendum and always will I'm sorry to say.

Definitely!
The difference is that now they feel entitled to act like that. But I'm sure you can explain that to the school kids who received notes telling them to pack and leave the country.

You are entitled to your vote, it is your country after all, and I hope you guys will find the better future you wanted, but what you did has consequences and you cannot just dismiss your responsibility.

Like it or not the racism was at the very least a by product of the leave vote. If you claim that you voted leave not because of racism than start moving and fix this mess.

I'm not asking this for myself: I've already decided to leave uk as soon as possible.
I'm asking this for the people that now have a life in Britain and have no other option but remain.

The least you could do, if you didn't vote leave because of racism, is make sure that this shit won't happen and that whoever does it will be held accountable for it.

If you won't do anything you won't be any better than the racist you so no want to be associated with.
 
Definitely!
The difference is that now they feel entitled to act like that. But I'm sure you can explain that to the school kids who received notes telling them to pack and leave the country.

You are entitled to your vote, it is your country after all, and I hope you guys will find the better future you wanted, but what you did has consequences and you cannot just dismiss your responsibility.

Like it or not the racism was at the very least a by product of the leave vote. If you claim that you voted leave not because of racism than start moving and fix this mess.

I'm not asking this for myself: I've already decided to leave uk as soon as possible.
I'm asking this for the people that now have a life in Britain and have no other option but remain.

The least you could do, if you didn't vote leave because of racism, is make sure that this shit won't happen and that whoever does it will be held accountable for it.

If you won't do anything you won't be any better than the racist you so no want to be associated with.
I voted to remain. However saying everyone who voted leave is racist because some leave supporters are racist is like saying every labour voter is communist because some Jeremy Corbyn supporters are communist
 

nickcv

Member
I voted to remain. However saying everyone who voted leave is racist because some leave supporters are racist is like saying every labour voter is communist because some Jeremy Corbyn supporters are communist

I'm not saying they are, and I thought my post was clear.

I'll do a better analogy to explain myself in a better way.

A bunch of people is trapped in a cage with a bunch of lions. They decide they want to be free again and open the cage. Now they are free and the lions are eating alive the rest of the population.

The people are not eating the population but because they opened the cage it is their damn duty take care of the lions
 

Nicktendo86

Member
The fall in the pound has seen a rise in flights to the UK, a good boost for tourism

BBC said:
Flight bookings to the UK jumped since the EU Referendum, driven by the pound's 10% fall against the dollar.

Overall, there were 4.3% more fights booked to the UK in the 28 days following the leave vote than in the same period last year.

Bookings from Hong Kong leapt by 30.1%, while they were up by 9.2% from the US and 5% from Europe.

Travel researcher ForwardKeys said Brexit had had an "an "immediate, positive impact" on tourism to the UK."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-37009735

Consumer spending has also gone up in July year on year, and the FTSE 100 is around 6,800 now. There are a lot of uncertain days ahead, but we're far from fucked.
 

jorma

is now taking requests
I'm not saying they are, and I thought my post was clear.

I'll do a better analogy to explain myself in a better way.

A bunch of people is trapped in a cage with a bunch of lions. They decide they want to be free again and open the cage. Now they are free and the lions are eating alive the rest of the population.

The people are not eating the population but because they opened the cage it is their damn duty take care of the lions

What a shit analogy. Surely you'd blame the cunts who put all those people in a cage with hungry lions? There's some serious victim blaming going on in your analogy.
 
Amusing how many Leavers online talk about joining the EEA, putting in the migration brake and try to leave the EEA later. And talk about 'compromise'. Not compromise if your idea is to 'slowly get what you want'.
 

nickcv

Member
What a shit analogy. Surely you'd blame the cunts who put all those people in a cage with hungry lions? There's some serious victim blaming going on in your analogy.

Oh sorry about that. I will shut my smelly immigrant mouth. I didn't want to dare responding back, master. It's my fault if I'm getting abused by your brothers. I should have behaved better.

/s

You may not like the analogy but you get the point. It's your responsibility to fix that. You can turn your head away and say it is not your problem, but don't start whining when people think you are just as good as they are.

edit:

I'll give you a better one:

a group of friends has no more food and decides to go to the nearby town to find some food.
While they are there one of them starts hitting an homeless black guy with a bat while the other ones are watching while buying food in the store.
People who witnessed the episode starts calling the whole group racist. The other guys reply "I'm not racist, I didn't do anything"
Then they get back in their car together and drive away.
 

jorma

is now taking requests
Oh sorry about that. I will shut my smelly immigrant mouth. I didn't want to dare responding back, master. It's my fault if I'm getting abused by your brothers. I should have behaved better.

what the fuck am i reading?
 
.

e31.jpg
 

nickcv

Member
what the fuck am i reading?

it was sarcastic, and due to the frustration that as always people only cherry pick what to respond to to avoid a proper discussion.

Which is exactly what you did by only responding to two lines out of 11 of my whole reply. Thanks for proving my point.
 

Zaph

Member
Shocking, other countries are going to act in their own self interest. And it has nothing to do with 'punishing' us.
 

Tyaren

Member
I don't think everyone who voted leave is a racist - but I think the majority were...

Someone put it quite well:

"Not everyone who voted for Brexit is a xenophobe, but all xenophobes voted for Brexit."

One can't really argue with that. And that was a good chunk of voters. Without those The UK would be staying in the EU.
 

Rush_Khan

Member
Is it worrying that I still think Brexit is some sort of sick joke? I still can't get my head around the fact that the UK is actually planning to leave the EU.

Also - with regards to the increase in tourism due to the fall of the pound - isn't that kind of ironic for the majority of Leave voters that more tourists will be coming here due to cheaper airline tickets? lol
 

Lime

Member
I was with some male friends the other day and some of them were repeating the "we don't know if the UK will come out worse or better in the future" rhetoric despite me trying to convince them otherwise based on what articles I've read and people in this thread (no matter how you cut it, the UK is in a worse position now and will be). I am pretty certain that I've read that this is irrefutably a bad situation for the UK in terms of the future, no matter what time horizon we are talking about. Is there an article that make a clear-cut analysis of what this means in terms of economy?
 

Calabi

Member
I was with some male friends the other day and some of them were repeating the "we don't know if the UK will come out worse or better in the future" rhetoric despite me trying to convince them otherwise based on what articles I've read and people in this thread (no matter how you cut it, the UK is in a worse position now and will be). I am pretty certain that I've read that this is irrefutably a bad situation for the UK in terms of the future, no matter what time horizon we are talking about. Is there an article that make a clear-cut analysis of what this means in terms of economy?

See I dont know now, there's this guy that I thought was smart he has some interesting theories about debt and economics. He seems to think it will be fine.

http://www.debtdeflation.com/blogs/2016/06/27/what-next-after-brexit/
 

Theonik

Member
I think this whole brexit thing might end with a complete desaster. May triggers art. 50 early next year overestimates britains importance and the EU will tell her to get lost and the UK leaves with both parties in deadlock without any agreement in 2 years
UK's only real trump card for the EU was threatening to leave. It basically is completely useless now. And hell it's one of the reasons that Cameron's plan at re-negotiating over the referendum result was dumb.

His position would be much more compelling had he said 'agree or I call a referendum' vs 'I'm calling a referendum but I'll choose which side I'll be on depending on what you do!' EU basically immediately called his bluff and knew this was a shitty deal, but still gave him something. (the referendum result is not something he controls so he's not going to get much for it)
 

AHA-Lambda

Member
A thought occurred to me earlier,

Given EU sympathy and support for Scotland, could the EU leverage the idea of the U.K. government promising a 2nd independence referendum in negotiation talks?
 
D

Deleted member 231381

Unconfirmed Member
A thought occurred to me earlier,

Given EU sympathy and support for Scotland, could the EU leverage the idea of the U.K. government promising a 2nd independence referendum in negotiation talks?

...no. That would be an absolutely gross breach of international etiquette in every respect. It's de facto a threat to break apart the United Kingdom by an outside power. How do you think Spain would receive it if the UK said "well, we'll talk about Gibraltar, but only if you give Catalunya that referendum"? I think some EU members will be rather sympathetic to indyScot if indyScot actually happens, but until it does, they will remain neutral.
 
See I dont know now, there's this guy that I thought was smart he has some interesting theories about debt and economics. He seems to think it will be fine.

http://www.debtdeflation.com/blogs/2016/06/27/what-next-after-brexit/

I think the single biggest question mark - especially if, like Lime asks, we're looking over varying different time lines - is that how important the EU is to the UK is inextricably linked to how the EU does. The EU has a dwindling share of the world's generated wealth and a dwindling share of the UK's trade. Both of these are still very significant, but in terms of trajectory they're both going down. If the EU continues to do less and less well relative to the rest of the world then the impact of Brexit will be lessened, both as a consequence of the EU being more costly to trade with and theoretically cheaper trading with the rest of the world (which, logically, must have an increasing[ share of the world's wealth). If, on the other hand, the EU is able to turn itself around picks up its growth and job creation, the opposite will be true.
 
New research from the IFS suggests a loss of £70 billion if the UK leaves the EU Single Market:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/201...to-70billion-worse-off-if-it-leaves-the-sing/

Britain could be up to £70billion worse off if it leaves the Single Market after Brexit because of slower growth, the Institute for Fiscal Studies has warned.

The respected economic think tank said that Britain could enjoy an extra 4 per cent in national income if it remains in the single market, equivalent to two years worth of growth.

It comes after European leaders have warned that Britain cannot remain a full member of the Single Market without agreeing to the free movement of EU migrants.

The thinktank said the boost to the country's trade, public finances, growth and living standards far outweigh the costs of single market membership across Europe.

Its report, which was funded by the Economic and Social Research Council, added that just having access rather than membership of the single market was "virtually meaningless".

In its latest study, the IFS warned Britain now faces some "very big choices" in negotiations with the EU.

Ian Mitchell, research associate at the IFS and an author of the report, said: "There is all the difference in the world between 'access to' and 'membership of' the single market.

"Membership is likely to offer significant economic benefits particularly for trade in services.

But outside the EU, single market membership also comes at the cost of accepting future regulations designed in the EU without UK input."

The report claims that while leaving the EU will free the UK from an estimated £8 billion a year of budget contributions, the loss of trade from Brexit could hit tax receipts by a larger amount.

It found new trade deals would be unlikely to make up for lost EU trade, which accounts for 44 per cent of British exports and 39 per cent of service exports.

Official figures from the Office for National Statistics on Tuesday showed the UK exported £12 billion worth of goods and services to the EU in June, an increase of £500 million compared with May.

The IFS said: "Any country in the WTO - from Afghanistan to Zimbabwe - has 'access' to the EU as an export destination. "Single Market 'membership' by contrast involves elimination of barriers to trade in a way that no existing trade deal, customs union or free trade area achieves."

It came as David Cameron's former Director of Communications said that he has no regrets about the failed campaign to keep Britain in the EU.

Craig Oliver told Politico: “Genuinely, I don’t think we would’ve run a different campaign. Even right up to the last minute, most people, most pollsters, most people who’d modeled it — hedge funds, businesses — thought the Remain camp was going to win."

He accused the Leave campaign of "misleading on an industrial scale" by claiming that Britain sent £350million a week to the EU and that Turkey was on the brink of joining the union.

I for one, am sick of these so called economists talking Britain down. /s
 

Walshicus

Member
I think the single biggest question mark - especially if, like Lime asks, we're looking over varying different time lines - is that how important the EU is to the UK is inextricably linked to how the EU does. The EU has a dwindling share of the world's generated wealth and a dwindling share of the UK's trade. Both of these are still very significant, but in terms of trajectory they're both going down. If the EU continues to do less and less well relative to the rest of the world then the impact of Brexit will be lessened, both as a consequence of the EU being more costly to trade with and theoretically cheaper trading with the rest of the world (which, logically, must have an increasing[ share of the world's wealth). If, on the other hand, the EU is able to turn itself around picks up its growth and job creation, the opposite will be true.

This seems wildly ignorant of exactly what is behind the growth in the rest of the world. Europe isn't falling behind, China and India and the other poor countries are catching up.

Proximity is a huge factor that isn't going to go away, as is the services aspect that just won't be covered in any deals with the big players who matter.
 
This seems wildly ignorant of exactly what is behind the growth in the rest of the world. Europe isn't falling behind, China and India and the other poor countries are catching up.

Proximity is a huge factor that isn't going to go away, as is the services aspect that just won't be covered in any deals with the big players who matter.

Sure, that's all true. But it doesn't change the fact that those areas - China, India etc - are representing a larger proportion of growth and that our being outside of the EU could potentially make trading with them easier. Even inside the EU, the EU was shrinking as a destination for our trade. Europe isn't falling *back* but it obviously is falling behind.

Either way, it's hard to argue that Britain's future success isn't tied to the EUs in some way, and if in the next 50 years the EU is representing an ever smaller proportion of world GDP, would we be better off having been inside? I dunno.
 

Tuffty

Member
"Dear Theresa

I would like to have my cake and still eat it

Love, First Minister of N.Ireland"


To keep this in mind, the First Minister, Arlene Foster represents the leading political party of N.Ireland, the DUP, who voted to Leave rather than Remain. The Brexit result makes them happy considering the majority of N.Ireland voted to Remain. But leaving the EU whilst retaining all the benefits of being a member was never an option. Why campaign to Leave if that was so important? Seems like she and the DUP now recognises what a shitshow this could be once they no longer get the same level of funding from the EU or benefits of being a member.

Not so surprising though, the DUP wishes to belong to the UK but chooses to push back anything which goes against their staunchly Christian ideals (N.Ireland is the only country in the UK to make gay marriage illegal, even making an executive order to block a proposal for it despite a majority vote for it in the NI assembly).
 

BigAl1992

Member
"Dear Theresa

I would like to have my cake and still eat it

Love, First Minister of N.Ireland"


To keep this in mind, the First Minister, Arlene Foster represents the leading political party of N.Ireland, the DUP, who voted to Leave rather than Remain. The Brexit result makes them happy considering the majority of N.Ireland voted to Remain. But leaving the EU whilst retaining all the benefits of being a member was never an option. Why campaign to Leave if that was so important? Seems like she and the DUP now recognises what a shitshow this could be once they no longer get the same level of funding from the EU or benefits of being a member.

Not so surprising though, the DUP wishes to belong to the UK but chooses to push back anything which goes against their staunchly Christian ideals (N.Ireland is the only country in the UK to make gay marriage illegal, even making an executive order to block a proposal for it despite a majority vote for it in the NI assembly).

Too late. Far, far too late for that now. The DUPs were the stupidest party out of everyone in the referendum, because they went with the leave position despite the EU being so important to NI in order to function, unlike the rest of the UK or anywhere else in Europe AFAIK.

They made that mess for themselves, so they can go drown in it.
 

Paulie_C

Neo Member
"Dear Theresa

I would like to have my cake and still eat it

Love, First Minister of N.Ireland"


To keep this in mind, the First Minister, Arlene Foster represents the leading political party of N.Ireland, the DUP, who voted to Leave rather than Remain. The Brexit result makes them happy considering the majority of N.Ireland voted to Remain. But leaving the EU whilst retaining all the benefits of being a member was never an option. Why campaign to Leave if that was so important? Seems like she and the DUP now recognises what a shitshow this could be once they no longer get the same level of funding from the EU or benefits of being a member.

Not so surprising though, the DUP wishes to belong to the UK but chooses to push back anything which goes against their staunchly Christian ideals (N.Ireland is the only country in the UK to make gay marriage illegal, even making an executive order to block a proposal for it despite a majority vote for it in the NI assembly).

It doesn't even surprise us when the DUP pull this shit anymore. They'd be unelectable anywhere else in the UK but they've little opposition up here.
 
Because the Bank of England cut rates to historic lows. Not because the outlook of the domestic economy is good.

This ignoring the depreciation of the pound, which is below $US 1.30 again.

And ignoring that the 250 was outperforming the 100, and is now underperforming it.

And ignoring the companies that are driving the 250 up aren't those that make their earnings mainly in the UK.
 

Audioboxer

Member
When will the shoe be eaten. Do you think GAF has forgotten?!

I'd worry about GAF attempting to force Havel* to do anything.

I mean he can just turtle up and pancake us to death if we try.

*Havel is the name of the GAFer that lost the bet if anyone is wondering what the fuck I'm talking about.
 

PJV3

Member
my poor savings... Will trie to transfer some money back to italy before it gets worse.

It's all going to be fine, we have an exit strategy and an economic and industrial plan that the Conservatives have been working on for years. The Tories are well known for using the state to get things done, look at Heathrow or the energy sector.

Bring all your money here and convert it to glorious British pounds.
It's all marvelous.
 
When will the shoe be eaten. Do you think GAF has forgotten?!

If you want some additional political based shoe eating, may I point you in the direction of Duncan Weldon. He was economics editor of Newsnight for a bit, but now he's not working there he's a lot more opinionated and interesting on Twitter in the wake of Brexit. He also failed at cooking a Christmas dinner, and when the turkey was a bit underdone he threw it in the bin.

ANYWAY, last September he said:
If the Bank of England's next move is a cut rather than a hike, I will eat my shoes. And put it on YouTube,
https://twitter.com/DuncanWeldon/status/644859015013507072

But circumstances changed, and uh, the shoe was to be eaten.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gGNcxLDKeZ0&feature=youtu.be
 
@ChukaUmunna
Here's Liam Fox & his Trade Dept's announcement today that the UK will seek to trade with the EU under WTO rules


wr1SNYr.jpg


Trading with the EU under WTO rules would be a hammer blow for the economy, and would demonstrate the hollow nature of Vote Leave’s promises

Leave campaigners promised repeatedly we would get a free trade agreement with the EU - now Fox seems to admit this will not be achievable

Fox's WTO strategy would devastate vital export industries, like car manufacturing, and lead to higher prices in the shops for families

To put Liam Fox's announcement today in context - trading under WTO rules with the EU means 10% levy on cars, 12% on clothes and more. Crazy

Ministers should be doing everything they can to stay in the Single Market and get the best trade deal for Britain not throwing in the towel
 

kmag

Member

Despite the brexit blurb, we don't just default to WTO rules, there's going to be a huge amount of horse trading with the EU (as we're currently under their schedules) and the rest of the WTO to get there.

The UK’s membership in the World
Trade Organisation may significantly
complicate the process of Britain’s
exit from the EU in another way
– evento the extent of giving a
significant number of other WTO
Members a say in how it is done.
This is because many of the Britain’s
market access commitments under
WTO law are in fact subsumed
under European-wide market access
obligations. For example, the EU’s
scheduled annual quota of frozen
bovine meat products is 34,300
tonnes across the entire European
market, and this quota is allocated in
specific shares to five main exporting
countries. If the UK left the EU, this
quota would have to be reorganised
in a number of ways: the EU quota
would have to be changed to reflect
the reduced size of its market as well
as historical net trade flows between
the UK and the rest of Europe; some
of the European quota would have
to be allocated to the UK; the UK
itself would have to impose its
own quota and allocate it between
different beef exporting nations.
Disentangling the UK’s from the
EU’s commitments in this way
would count as a modification of
both the EU’s and the UK’s GATT
schedules and therefore, according
to GATT Article XXVIII, must be
done by negotiation and agreement
with certain other WTO members.
Failing agreement, any modification
is subject to reciprocal withdrawal
of market access concessions from
affected parties. The result of this
process is that a potentially large
number of other WTO Members
would have the ability to significantly
impede the process of the UK’s exit
from the EU – a powerful concern
given the current decision-making
dynamics within the WTO.
 
Despite the brexit blurb, we don't just default to WTO rules, there's going to be a huge amount of horse trading with the EU (as we're currently under their schedules) and the rest of the WTO to get there.
Ok, seems plausible (and also like a huge cluster fuck).
 
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