It's not just a potential outcome. It is literally the best possible outcome. All more sensible outcomes are worse*.
* The United Kingdom Story.
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The UK votes to leave the European Union
- Thread starter Spring Drive
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It's not just a potential outcome. It is literally the best possible outcome. All more sensible outcomes are worse*.
* The United Kingdom Story.
Napoleonthechimp
Member
They wanted out of the EU. That's it. Beyond that there were no firm promises, just "possibilities" as stated by IDS.
They were duped and that's their fucking fault.
Darkstorne
Member
You're not wrong, that's exactly what it was. No viable competition to Cameron. This time we had Boris against Cameron though, championing the people of Britain alongside a bizarrely popular Gove and Farage. Suddenly the people had the viable alternatives they were looking for, but were too angry and desperate for ANY kind of change to really factor the EU into any of this.
ferrasvansen
Member
There will be a recession and there will be an emergency budget, just not when Osborne is there, it would be much more irresponsible to hide what can happen, business would look at the UK as too risky and untrustworthy, unreliable and deceitful. Trust me that's not what you want when looking for future investment. Tell the truth, be open and business respects you more.
But he wants to sell cake.
There's going to be recession even mr leave farage is saying that although he's trying to say it was due anyway and accession will have nothing to do with it
Sorry if you bought into the sunshine and roses
They have even less bargaining power than the UK.
Crazy how far people would risk everything they have (peace, economics stability, strong allies, worldwide bargaining power, unified social rights, ...) for some good old racism.
Who are the un-elected officials?
The EU consists of three bodies, of which the first two have the decisive power:
- Council: Led by the the national governments (AKA Cameron, Merkel, etc.). These are elected/chosen according to the national member state law.
- Parliament: MEPs which are members of parliament that were all voted on during the European elections. No middle-man at all.
- Commission (no decisive power, only proposes things): Led by 28 Commissioners, each from a Member State, which were chosen/co-opted by the national governments and confirmed by MEPs. E.g. Lord Hill who was chosen by Cameron and the Tory party, plus confirmed by the MEPs in the Parliament.
Also the President of the Commission, Juncker, was chosen by the EPP party because they attained the majority in the Parliament. It was quite clear during the election cycle that a vote for the EPP would be a vote for Juncker (and vice versa Schulz for the S&D).
Where do you draw the line between being elected or not? Obviously the Commission is the 'least' elected, as they were not directly voted on by citizens but rather by the national goverments and the European Parliament (who each were directly voted on). The Commission is also the least powerful since everything has to pass through Council and Parliament.
It's the same system in Belgium for instance: I vote for a political group who gets the seats in our House of Representatives and Senate, and they then decide on the Government/Ministers (AKA Commission).
Shitting in the mixing bowl means he is off to a bad start.
Napoleonthechimp
Member
You've got to be a special kind of stupid to think reorganising complex systems of government and renegotiating trade agreements with multiple countries and trading blocks is as simple as making an omelette.
Palette Swap
Member
Another day begins with another mixture of "this is fine" and "congratulations, you played yourself".
After reading Jonhsons article this morning, I've got to wonder what rock he's been under the last 4 days. A lot of fiction here, in fact I'm struggling to find any truths. The idea that the EU will keep an open single market, without free movement is total fiction. The idea that the Scotish people "have no appetite" for a new ref is bizzare. The fact that he thinks that the market is over-reacting is kinda funny.
I guess the only truth is that the country is now deeply divided, and as many GAF'rs have stated -it's likely to get worse as UKIP predictable turns on any negotiation efforts the ruling party has in navigating this mess.
I guess the only truth is that the country is now deeply divided, and as many GAF'rs have stated -it's likely to get worse as UKIP predictable turns on any negotiation efforts the ruling party has in navigating this mess.
Have you ever watched Saturday Kitchen though? I've seen plenty well spoken and educated people fuck up making an omelette.
Since we are about to be castrasted, no
It's not so much "masterful negotiation" as it it would need to be "inhuman mindcontrol powers". The UK just spent months to get a few exemption, mostly about paying healthcare for EU citizens for the first few months. Add to that the special relation that it already has by allowing the City of London to be except from many financial regulations.
And now they want even more goodies, because of a really uninformed vote, mostly based on painting the EU as some sort of evil dictatorship?
Why should most EU countries, that don't have a lot of trade with the UK ever agree to that? Germany has a lot of clout, but there are limits to everything. If you show 27 countries the bird, they won't just shut up because of Merkel.
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
Hopefully any negative growth is reported before Article 50 is triggered; any front loaded shit news is good news right about now.
frontieruk
Member
Echo chamber that is Google's algorithms, if you're looking at that type of thing you get shown more and more of it, doesn't mean it's a large enough sentiment to achieve what happened here.
YianGaruga
Banned
There are always people who hate the government because "reasons". Any government. Always were, always will be.
The only thing that changed is that they have a more or less unified voice now because of the internet and a common enemy that they can complain about across borders. Doesn't mean they're any more correct.
Once they leave the EU they will complain about their own government once things stay just as "bad" or get worse. What then?
Commander Jameson
Member
The problem with that is that the Leave voters cover a multitude of differing and, sometimes, conflicting views, so no solution will work for every Leave voter. Also, any solution needs to work for both Leave and Remain voters alike.
For example, is a Norway-style solution going to placate those people that voted Leave to stop immigration? No, because there won't be any change in immigration rules because of that solution. So you'll still get the social unrest that you are talking about.
People will dismiss it as project fear 2.0.
Stiflers Mom
Banned
Gurgelhals
Member
At the moment, I can't help but thinking that the EU will come out of all this stronger than before. On Friday, the narrative was that the EU will have to set an example of the UK in order the dissuade other member states from exiting, which would, however, only further cement the eurosceptic view of the EU as a bureaucratic monster. Turns out that they probably won't have to do that at all, because the UK (well, UK politics) seems perfectly able to set the example all by itself and without the EU having to lift a finger.
Fucking hell, what a clusterfuck.
Fucking hell, what a clusterfuck.
http://www.independent.co.uk/voices...ive-eu-referendum-jeremy-corbyn-a7104016.html
10 reasons to be positive about Brexit. Look on the positive side GAF.
10 reasons to be positive about Brexit. Look on the positive side GAF.
And herein lies the issue.
It will take a number of years and several economic disasters that are unequivocally linked to us leaving the EU before a lot of people will even begin to entertain the idea that this might have been a mistake.
Agreed but the other shoe will drop in many sectors only in Q3. Retail management are claiming consumer demand should be ok but if you look at the market, it disagrees...
RBS and Lloyd's smacked again today, guess we won't be selling those stakes for a while yet.
Burgess_101
Member
Really that is on the leave side to sort that out, it was in Cameron's best interest to basically leave and say, there you go, good luck.
Of course, unsurprisingly, leave didn't think that far ahead which is to be expected from such a campaign. Or rather, no one wants to touch this with a ten foot pole because it will most probably destroy your career.
Sounds great in theory, but I'm not sure I have faith in any of our current politicians to deliver anything close to that.
Even if people in other countries call for a referendum, I doubt the powers at be will call for a vote. At least not until they see how all of this shakes out.
cormack12
Gold Member
Part of me would really like to cause a shitstorm and to see all the 'Remain' campaigners call Boris out on his lies. Provoke a bit of friction by saying 'Hang on, you said we were out the EU. You lied.' And really kick up an issue.
On the other hand, I'm glad sense is prevailing and it looks like this will be a change in semantics only, and a hollow victory in the meantime.
The most important thing is that there are true democratic, legislative and legal ways of stopping this madness. Whether we engage them or not, is up for debate, but it's not all done and dusted as the saying goes.
To echo what people were saying earlier, I really cannot identify with half the country now. They are either ill-informed, ignorant, bitter or xenophobic. There are no other camps on the 'Leave' side as far as I'm concerned. You know, the prevailing message here now seems to be let's all work together. The reality is those who have the best chance of fixing this also have the best chance of fleeing for better opportunity. Those with social or geographical mobility, those in established jobs with options of moving with companies, the new graduates over the next two years. Leaving behind the elderly and infirm, those with young children and those with poor work ethic. There won't be enough 'good' left to salvage this mess.
The 'Leave' vote has sent a message that some people want to rock the boat, and burn the world. Now there is an expectation that those who are hurt will knuckle down and get on board with them. You went after the establishment and hurt the people. Now the shoe is on the other foot and quite frankly, I'm going to stop worrying and watch the backpedalling and mess with a sad satisfaction.
I don't think the referendum should be ignored. Part of me wants people to know that a vote on proper issues has consequences. It's not just some facebook poll that disappears into obscurity from your news feed. People need to feel these consequences (at least partially) or a politician needs to come clean and say 'Listen this was a disastrous idea.' It might make people actually realise how much their vote means and how much it can help/hinder the country.
On the other hand, I'm glad sense is prevailing and it looks like this will be a change in semantics only, and a hollow victory in the meantime.
The most important thing is that there are true democratic, legislative and legal ways of stopping this madness. Whether we engage them or not, is up for debate, but it's not all done and dusted as the saying goes.
To echo what people were saying earlier, I really cannot identify with half the country now. They are either ill-informed, ignorant, bitter or xenophobic. There are no other camps on the 'Leave' side as far as I'm concerned. You know, the prevailing message here now seems to be let's all work together. The reality is those who have the best chance of fixing this also have the best chance of fleeing for better opportunity. Those with social or geographical mobility, those in established jobs with options of moving with companies, the new graduates over the next two years. Leaving behind the elderly and infirm, those with young children and those with poor work ethic. There won't be enough 'good' left to salvage this mess.
The 'Leave' vote has sent a message that some people want to rock the boat, and burn the world. Now there is an expectation that those who are hurt will knuckle down and get on board with them. You went after the establishment and hurt the people. Now the shoe is on the other foot and quite frankly, I'm going to stop worrying and watch the backpedalling and mess with a sad satisfaction.
I don't think the referendum should be ignored. Part of me wants people to know that a vote on proper issues has consequences. It's not just some facebook poll that disappears into obscurity from your news feed. People need to feel these consequences (at least partially) or a politician needs to come clean and say 'Listen this was a disastrous idea.' It might make people actually realise how much their vote means and how much it can help/hinder the country.
Far right nationalistic parties != whole member states
And I certainly hope our politicians have a little common sense and won't make decisions that could have huge consequences just to prove they have "the balls" to do it.
Leaving the EU is no Doomsday. But there needs to be a great leader to get the UK there. I really hope everything will be OK in the end.
Plus I think there's only 9, not 10. Ripoff!
YianGaruga
Banned
frontieruk
Member
Because the people wanting brexit weren't in power, those wanting to stay didn't want to any part of the destruction of the UK. The ones making the claims to leave didn't really think they would win so spouted shit they couldn't guarantee and didn't plan for the eventuality of winning
God this is terrible. The amount of 'could' and 'if' in there.
11. Jesus could come back exclusively to the UK, boosting our Tourism sector.
That article is a big a pile of shitty lies as the Leave campaign. Seriously - out of the EU fishing will return to Cornwal and we can nationalise the steel industry? This is supposed to be a good news story?
Shutting our eyes and believing in the tooth fairy might feel good but it isn't going to help us one bit. I love the comment about food prices - as if food wasn't already at historically low prices, with a wider range of food stuffs in the shops than we have ever had before!
We are relying on the civil service to keeps things running, to be honest, there is effectively no leadership or opposition. Sturgeon seem to have it together and thankfully, Carney did OK to calm things down slightly.
So remain also have a part to play in the whole "what the fuck happens now" thing?, they should have all got together and figured out what was going to happen before Thursday, rather than playing my dad's bigger than your dad and slinging shit at each other like schoolkids.
TBH, the whole lot of them are a shower of shit, we have a country literally split down the middle, we have people shouting "immigrants out", we have the labour party in disarry, we have a PM who has resigned, we have the leave campaign saying their promises were just possibilities, what a mess.
The EU Commission is the most powerful, since it's the only one that has the power to say what the law may or may not be. They have the sole right of initiative and the sole right of repeal. The Parliament is a rubber stamp body. It can only accept or reject proposals. The Democratic chamber not having any say in the legislative agenda, and zero power to repeal legislation that their constituents may disagree on is the number one problem with the process.
It's not nearly the same thing as Belgium, MPs in Belgium are able to propose their own laws. I'm also guessing that the Prime Minister of Belgium is himself a member of Parliament? He has to be voted in as a member of Parliament before he is allowed to be the PM?
Update: Jesus' agent issues a statement and has denied these claims. stating his Second Coming was only 'a possibility and not a promise'
BossDarkseid
Member
Lol.
Fucks sake some of those comments are exactly why in my lesser moments I feel Democracy was a mistake.
/s
"We have the fifth largest army in the world, we won two world wars, had the biggest empire. Why does no one think we'd be ok!?"
Well. It's not like we won two world wars on our own, or at a stupidly high cost.
"It's only the lazy and workshy that would hold us back"
HOLD THE FUCK UP. Is someone from a side who voted to curb immigration (not that it'd happen) because immigrants took jobs (saintly took a lot of jobs that no one would want like cleaning toilets etc) and they're complaining workshy would hold us back? They're right, but immigrants saved us.
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