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The Witness |OT|

That room in a basement in the town, where you have to
solve two panels correctly lit by red, green and blue light simultaneously, is killing me. Well, I did the "easy" one with just black and white squares, but the one with pair symbols, maaan. I sort of cheated by photographing the boards in all colors so I could at least see them simultaneously, but it's still SO HARD. I don't know, am I thinking about it wrong? Should I somehow be trying to see it as one solution instead of three that have to work with a single line?

There are actually several possible solutions to the pair symbols puzzle. So you're very unlikely to find three "separate" solutions that can fit together, because they will most likely go with different "full" solutions, if that makes sense.
 

Tobinishi

Member
Treehouses?
I think. Have you found
the boat? The map has hints for what is taught where.

I'm at the Treehouses right now, had no issues with the Stars and suddenly a Tetris puzzle and I'm stuck :/. Good tip with the boat, haven't really used it so far and completely forgot about it. Thanks for the tip
 

RoadHazard

Gold Member
There are actually several possible solutions to the pair symbols puzzle. So you're very unlikely to find three "separate" solutions that can fit together, because they will most likely go with different "full" solutions, if that makes sense.

Hmm, yeah. Guess I'll just have to keep trying, because I don't quite see how I could just figure it out by looking at it.
 

Exuro

Member
But
different squares are "wrong" in different colors.
Sure, so make sure the different colored squares aren't grouped together. I wrote out what each square/star color was with a number system and solved that puzzle. It's not too bad once you know what each color is on each tile.
 

RoadHazard

Gold Member
I'm at the Treehouses right now, had no issues with the Stars and suddenly a Tetris puzzle and I'm stuck :/. Good tip with the boat, haven't really used it so far and completely forgot about it. Thanks for the tip

Yeah, I remembered wrong, it's not there. But yeah, use the second tip! It helped me quite a bit.

Sure, so make sure the different colored squares aren't grouped together. I wrote out what each square/star color was with a number system and solved that puzzle. It's not too bad once you know what each color is on each tile.

That's not possible though.
In one color an entire 2x2 corner is black in one color and white in another. They'll have to be together
.
 

Exuro

Member
Yeah, I remembered wrong, it's not there. But yeah, use the second tip! It helped me quite a bit.



That's not possible though.
In one color an entire 2x2 corner is black in one color and white in another. They'll have to be together
.
I don't think you're understanding what I'm saying. You're not solving the puzzle for each color'd light. You're looking at each colored light and see how the tiles change color. So for example if tiles 1 - 4 are black on r, g and b then they are the same color. If tile 5 is black on r and g but white on b then it is a different color than tiles 1 - 4. Figure out which tiles are which color(you don't need to know the actual color, just if they're the same or different, I labeled them with numbers) and then you'll have a single board that shouldn't be too hard to solve.
 

Inkwell

Banned
Someone please help me find my last audio log. It's driving me nuts, and I'm not sure if it's a bug or if I'm just being stupid. I need to 100% this game. There's end game spoilers so read at your own risk. Here is the info:

It's the audio log nearest to the monastery according to the lake. I've gotten desperate enough to use noclip, and found that there is a cave chamber directly under where it is supposed to be. It's the area right between the maze and the 4th puzzle in the challenge sequence. I've looked everywhere. I even triggered the alternate ending area, activated all of the audio logs, and then used noclip to get to the lake to see if it made the flower bloom. I swear I've been flying around with noclip for about an hour and still can't find it.

For those avoiding spoilers, I believe the audio log is either in or right next to the monastery with the big red tree, more on the side next to the hub or town. It might be just outside the structure too.
 
Someone please help me find my last audio log. It's driving me nuts, and I'm not sure if it's a bug or if I'm just being stupid. I need to 100% this game. There's end game spoilers so read at your own risk. Here is the info:

It's the audio log nearest to the monastery according to the lake. I've gotten desperate enough to use noclip, and found that there is a cave chamber directly under where it is supposed to be. It's the area right between the maze and the 4th puzzle in the challenge sequence. I've looked everywhere. I even triggered the alternate ending area, activated all of the audio logs, and then used noclip to get to the lake to see if it made the flower bloom. I swear I've been flying around with noclip for about an hour and still can't find it.

For those avoiding spoilers, I believe the audio log is either in or right next to the monastery with the big red tree, more on the side next to the hub or town. It might be just outside the structure too.

The ones I've found closest to that area are
the two at the jungle entrance, the two in the church, the one in the belltower, and the one beside the town obelisk.
Those might all be too far away, though.
 

Maitiú

Member
I'm finding it very annoying once I understand a puzzle concept having to bash out the solution. I've done this three or four times, why are there eight more puzzles that are simply difficult to figure out?
The tetris puzzles, I know what to do, its just not fun to solve so I am looking them up.

The fun is in the overcoming, it's in the leveling up of you the gamer. Every panel is challenging your understanding of the rules as well as the limitations you have brought to each panel.

Read the quote from Jonathan Blow in the OP: "I try to make puzzles in The Witness as simple as they can be. You just don't get it. It's not only that you don't get it, but you don't feel like there's anything to tell you how to get it. It's as much of a brick wall as possible, with no red herrings or anything. So eventually, when you manage to stick your head through that brick wall and see what's past it, it's the most magical. I'm designing to optimize the experience of having those miniature epiphanies over and over again."

You're denying yourself this experience every time you look up an answer. So be it. It's your loss.
 

AngryMoth

Member
Finally giving myself some time to sit down and play this, managed to stay totally spoiler free.

I've beaten the 'first' main area without much trouble but now I've run across 3 new areas and I'm just failing to 'get it' on what are seemingly the tutorial puzzles for new concepts. Quite frustrated!
 

diffusionx

Gold Member
For those who like this game, have you played Talos Principle? What does this game have over this one? What is it doing that Talos isn't, or vice versa?

I ask because I really dig that, but it's still kind of an obscure game, and Witness has much more hype, so I haven't seen anyone talking about the relative merits of both.
 
For those who like this game, have you played Talos Principle? What does this game have over this one? What is it doing that Talos isn't, or vice versa?

I ask because I really dig that, but it's still kind of an obscure game, and Witness has much more hype, so I haven't seen anyone talking about the relative merits of both.

This has hype because of Braid and because it's been in development for 7 years and it's been building all that time. Talos sort of came from nowhere - not that it doesn't have its share of fans.
 
I love this game, but man, fuck The Challenge! After a game of wonder and fun, Jonathan Blow messes it up on the finish line. There's nothing fun about The Challenge, only frustration that has nothing to do with the gameplay so far. A
time limit
is so unlike everything the game has been about up to this point that I wonder what his thought processes were when he added it.

I've tried a bunch of times, including two times where I cheated by using
rest mode
, and I still can't do it. Fuck this!

I can only hope that the game is patched to
double the time limit
or something, because this has quite simply soured me on the game.
 

RoadHazard

Gold Member
I don't think you're understanding what I'm saying. You're not solving the puzzle for each color'd light. You're looking at each colored light and see how the tiles change color. So for example if tiles 1 - 4 are black on r, g and b then they are the same color. If tile 5 is black on r and g but white on b then it is a different color than tiles 1 - 4. Figure out which tiles are which color(you don't need to know the actual color, just if they're the same or different, I labeled them with numbers) and then you'll have a single board that shouldn't be too hard to solve.

Yeah, I've realized I need to think about it this way.
 

louiedog

Member
For those who like this game, have you played Talos Principle? What does this game have over this one? What is it doing that Talos isn't, or vice versa?

I ask because I really dig that, but it's still kind of an obscure game, and Witness has much more hype, so I haven't seen anyone talking about the relative merits of both.

I love both.

Talos has a lot more going on with the story, at least up front. I've finished The Witness, but haven't seen everything it has to offer yet.

The puzzle style is very different. Talos has puzzles in the world, some break out of the confined areas, but they're still in the world. The world in The Witness is the puzzle.
 
For those who like this game, have you played Talos Principle? What does this game have over this one? What is it doing that Talos isn't, or vice versa?

I ask because I really dig that, but it's still kind of an obscure game, and Witness has much more hype, so I haven't seen anyone talking about the relative merits of both.

The Talos Principle is one of my favourite games of all time and after playing The Witness fully I'd say The Witness is in the same category. Both are completely different in terms of how they play, the only similarities are that they're both puzzle games that both involve tetris shapes in some form.

The Talos Principle is definitely more about objects and how you can use them to solve a puzzle. Obviously The Witness is more about learning the language and mechanics of the world and inputting the solution that way. Talos' mechanics and challenges come in how you can use the provided objects (boxes, lasers, jammers, recorders) to find a solution. Once you've learned the functionality of the objects the puzzles become more challenging and the ways to use the objects get really interesting.

I highly recommend The Talos Principle if you like puzzle games. The world and sense of exploration is great and it's worth your time. You can also download the demo on Steam to try it out but I recommend just picking it up and playing it without reading or watching too much about it.
 

Mindlog

Member
Yeah I reaaaally didn't like a lot of the endgame puzzles. So much of it is just taking puzzles mechanics I already know and making them obnoxious to complete. It was like the video game equivalent of trying to draw a line through a maze while someone is physically shaking you.
That's specifically why I enjoyed them so much. I thought it was pretty funny.
I love this game, but man, fuck The Challenge! After a game of wonder and fun, Jonathan Blow messes it up on the finish line. There's nothing fun about The Challenge, only frustration that has nothing to do with the gameplay so far. A
time limit
is so unlike everything the game has been about up to this point that I wonder what his thought processes were when he added it.
You just have to refine. Figure out where you are the most wrong and just build up that skill until it's second nature. The one major point for me (end-game stuff)
I would always restart if the second puzzle was a mess. I did not want to bother getting lost in the labyrinth so if that puzzle was too wonky I would just start over.
 

GhaleonEB

Member
I have to say, of all the puzzle types in the game, the shadow types
in the golden forest and now the desert (just figured out the first two) are the ones I enjoy the least. They're less about figuring out a puzzle language and more about trying to trace lines over increasingly distorted paths around the panels.
It's not really fun and there's not been any enjoyment in solving them. I'm stuck at one in the forest where
the shadows seem to be offset from the actual panel, and then partially obscured. It's been very frustrating trying to re-create the broken path. #5 or so on the series behind the lumbermill.
 

roytheone

Member
I'm stuck on the same puzzle, can't seem to figure it out, I guess we're both misinterpreting the rules

This puzzle set is weird, because it feels like the sequence is wrong, since the next one you get is kinda a tutorial for this mechanic. It feels like that puzzle should have come before this one.
What I did was to first find a way for the spikey ball to not flash red, and only then try and solve the whole panel.
 

Mindlog

Member
I have to say, of all the puzzle types in the game, the shadow types
in the golden forest and now the desert (just figured out the first two) are the ones I enjoy the least. They're less about figuring out a puzzle language and more about trying to trace lines over increasingly distorted paths around the panels.
It's not really fun and there's not been any enjoyment in solving them. I'm stuck at one in the forest where
the shadows seem to be offset from the actual panel, and then partially obscured. It's been very frustrating trying to re-create the broken path. #5 or so on the series behind the lumbermill.
I didn't dislike them, but they were largely in my bottom tier.
The one exception it the one that probably took me the most time, but was the most interesting and clearly laid. (mid-game shadow spoilers) (you probably shouldn't read it) (I'll be specific, but vague)
The monastery shortcut.
 
I didn't dislike them, but they were largely in my bottom tier.
The one exception it the one that probably took me the most time, but was the most interesting and clearly laid. (mid-game shadow spoilers) (you probably shouldn't read it) (I'll be specific, but vague)
The monastery shortcut.

I liked that one a lot, and discovered the solution
by accident.
 
I didn't dislike them, but they were largely in my bottom tier.
The one exception it the one that probably took me the most time, but was the most interesting and clearly laid. (mid-game shadow spoilers) (you probably shouldn't read it) (I'll be specific, but vague)
The monastery shortcut.

The
forest shadow puzzles
have a special place for me just because that was the first area that drew me in, and I got through it in half an hour. I just found them completely intuitive.

Wasn't the
monastery shortcut a perspective puzzle
?
 

CloudWolf

Member
Currently working my way through the tree house area, and I came across one that I have no idea how to solve. I even resorted to just trying various solutions, but no luck.

The puzzle in question: http://i.imgur.com/lg7bQdJ.jpg

I don't want a solution or a hint, I just want to know if I should know what to do with
a single 8-point star
. Am I missing a rule, a hint, something obvious, or what?

I'm stuck at the exact same puzzle, I even tried
if the second star was mirrored, like with the mirrored line puzzles early on where the second line suddenly becomes invisible
. but no dice.
 

Spoo

Member
I'm stuck at the exact same puzzle, I even tried
if the second star was mirrored, like with the mirrored line puzzles early on where the second line suddenly becomes invisible
. but no dice.

Pretty sure this "kind" of puzzle is the first you've seen, and is designed to act as a kind of tutorial for this "special case." If you want a hint (vague):

The color of the sun is not coincidental
 

AngryMoth

Member
I'm only early but I think a critisism I have is that the first puzzle you encounter with a new mechanic is often slightly too complex to easily intuite what's going on. The first one in the
shipwrexk
area and the ones with
tetris pieces
in them have me totally stumped at moment.

Or maybe I'm just too dumb :p
 

Kaiken

Banned
I have to say, of all the puzzle types in the game, the shadow types
in the golden forest and now the desert (just figured out the first two) are the ones I enjoy the least. They're less about figuring out a puzzle language and more about trying to trace lines over increasingly distorted paths around the panels.
It's not really fun and there's not been any enjoyment in solving them. I'm stuck at one in the forest where
the shadows seem to be offset from the actual panel, and then partially obscured. It's been very frustrating trying to re-create the broken path. #5 or so on the series behind the lumbermill.

Yeah. The Desert was the least fun of all areas.
 

diffusionx

Gold Member
I highly recommend The Talos Principle if you like puzzle games. The world and sense of exploration is great and it's worth your time. You can also download the demo on Steam to try it out but I recommend just picking it up and playing it without reading or watching too much about it.

Thanks. I own Talos and was trying to figure how Witness compared to it. Sounds like they are in the same wheelhouse but differ a bit in style and world design.
 

Bowlie

Banned
Can somebody explain to me the three-white-line-triangle-thing mechanic? I get stuck on the last tutorial and I don't even know how I got the other ones. http://i.imgur.com/yIbvqjc.png

straight-up answer:
It eliminates one icon in its area that would cause the puzzle to be wrong. Try leaving it and one (only one) black hexagon in the same area and watch what happens.

This is the puzzle type I had the most problem of understanding; the tutorials felt limited to fully convey the purpose of this icon.

I'm only early but I think a critisism I have is that the first puzzle you encounter with a new mechanic is often slightly too complex to easily intuite what's going on. The first one in the
shipwrexk
area and the ones with
tetris pieces
in them have me totally stumped at moment

the first area you mention is not supposed to introduce any mechanic; you have to go there after learning several rules (and for me was one of the hardest puzzles).

I don't know what is the second area you're talking about, but it may not be the one that introduces such rule as well.
 
It definitely seems that there's ***Spoilers for after you finish the game***

two categories of puzzle:

gimmick mechanics:
desert (reflection)
greenhouse (color)
jungle (sound)
monastery (perspective)
castle (walking the path)
shady (shadow)

logic mechanics:
swamp (tetromino)
treehouse (stars)
quarry (negator)
symmetry island

The categorization is pretty reductive, but it's no wonder the more complex puzzles use a combination of the last 4 the most.
 
Can somebody explain to me the three-white-line-triangle-thing mechanic? I get stuck on the last tutorial and I don't even know how I got the other ones. http://i.imgur.com/yIbvqjc.png

These puzzles don't follow the same rules as other puzzles. Which rule are they breaking?

I'm only early but I think a critisism I have is that the first puzzle you encounter with a new mechanic is often slightly too complex to easily intuite what's going on. The first one in the
shipwrexk
area and the ones with
tetris pieces
in them have me totally stumped at moment.

Or maybe I'm just too dumb :p

A good rule of thumb when you don't understand how a particular symbol works, and the puzzle throws up red indicators on each symbol that isn't used correctly: try deliberately incomplete solutions until you figure out what conditions need to be satisfied for each different symbol.

This won't help you with every kind of solution (the
shipwreck
in particular, but also certain
tetris
puzzles), but it's good general advice when you're stuck and you think the issue is that you don't know how to use the symbols.
 

Spoo

Member
I'm only early but I think a critisism I have is that the first puzzle you encounter with a new mechanic is often slightly too complex to easily intuite what's going on. The first one in the
shipwrexk
area and the ones with
tetris pieces
in them have me totally stumped at moment

I felt like it was the other way around, for me. The tutorials were so "simple" that you couldn't intuit how you solved them, or -- as was the case with the t
etris pieces
, you would only derive half of the mechanic.

I don't think it's a bad thing, since the mechanics themselves are probably complex enough that trying to communicate their language is difficult to start with, and they do a good job, but yeah, left me scratching my head for a long while.
 

RoadHazard

Gold Member
I don't think you're understanding what I'm saying. You're not solving the puzzle for each color'd light. You're looking at each colored light and see how the tiles change color. So for example if tiles 1 - 4 are black on r, g and b then they are the same color. If tile 5 is black on r and g but white on b then it is a different color than tiles 1 - 4. Figure out which tiles are which color(you don't need to know the actual color, just if they're the same or different, I labeled them with numbers) and then you'll have a single board that shouldn't be too hard to solve.

Did it. Aaaand that did nothing (both solved)? Oh well.
 

lionpants

Member
These end-game puzzles can fuck right off.
It seems like the game has run out of ideas so it just throws a bunch of bullshit at you to cause you actual physical pain. My eyes actually started to hurt when doing some of them, and some even require a bit of agility. Seems to go against what the game's about IMO. I would've preferred brand new puzzle types with existing mechanics mixed in.
 

roytheone

Member
I'm stuck at the exact same puzzle, I even tried
if the second star was mirrored, like with the mirrored line puzzles early on where the second line suddenly becomes invisible
. but no dice.

Don't try to solve the puzzle immediately, first try to find a way to not make the spikey ball flash red, only after you got that, try and solve the full puzzle.
 

Wok

Member
It definitely seems that there's ***Spoilers for after you finish the game***

two categories of puzzle:

gimmick mechanics:
desert (reflection)
greenhouse (color)
jungle (sound)
monastery (perspective)
castle (walking the path)
shady (shadow)

logic mechanics:
swamp (tetromino)
treehouse (stars)
quarry (negator)
symmetry island

The categorization is pretty reductive, but it's no wonder the more complex puzzles use a combination of the last 4 the most.

Why would you
put symmetry in logic mechanics? And what do you mean by the "shady" place? Edit: Got it the forest next to the quarry and the keep.

I skimmed through logic but had a harder time with some gimmicks.
 
Why would you
put symmetry in logic mechanics? And what do you mean by the "shady" place?

the shady woods is the place outside the quarry with the shadows created by branches.

And yes symmetry could go in either category in my opinion.

Two other mechanics that I feel are more logical, but don't specially have a zone attached to them, are:

- Dots on the path that you have to collect.
- Separate cubes by color
 

Bowlie

Banned
I got a question about a certain environment puzzle in the fields near the lake:

I lined up the clouds above me to see a line puzzle, but there's a black cloud in the middle (in fact, that one black cloud bothered me since the beginning). What can I do to fix that?
 

*Splinter

Member
I got a question about a certain environment puzzle in the fields near the lake:

I lined up the clouds above me to see a line puzzle, but there's a black cloud in the middle (in fact, that one black cloud bothered me since the beginning). What can I do to fix that?
If only there were some powerful light source that could be pointed or otherwise redirected to that cloud
 

HoodWinked

Member
finished one
obelisk
yesterday, and have one
obelisk
with one remaining and i spent hours in and around the
treehouse
trying to find it :/
 

Wok

Member
Someone please help me find my last audio log. It's driving me nuts, and I'm not sure if it's a bug or if I'm just being stupid. I need to 100% this game. There's end game spoilers so read at your own risk. Here is the info:

It's the audio log nearest to the monastery according to the lake. I've gotten desperate enough to use noclip, and found that there is a cave chamber directly under where it is supposed to be. It's the area right between the maze and the 4th puzzle in the challenge sequence. I've looked everywhere. I even triggered the alternate ending area, activated all of the audio logs, and then used noclip to get to the lake to see if it made the flower bloom. I swear I've been flying around with noclip for about an hour and still can't find it.

For those avoiding spoilers, I believe the audio log is either in or right next to the monastery with the big red tree, more on the side next to the hub or town. It might be just outside the structure too.


You are welcome.
 

MThanded

I Was There! Official L Receiver 2/12/2016
I'm finding it very annoying once I understand a puzzle concept having to bash out the solution. I've done this three or four times, why are there eight more puzzles that are simply difficult to figure out?
The tetris puzzles, I know what to do, its just not fun to solve so I am looking them up.
If you don't learn the concepts you will be forced to look up a largeness majority of future puzzles.

You might as well just stop playing honestly. Game is very thin unless you solve the puzzles on your own.
 
For those who like this game, have you played Talos Principle? What does this game have over this one? What is it doing that Talos isn't, or vice versa?

I ask because I really dig that, but it's still kind of an obscure game, and Witness has much more hype, so I haven't seen anyone talking about the relative merits of both.
I love both of these games, for reasons that are similar and different.

The big difference is just how organic everything feels in The Witness. The puzzles, how they are integrated into the world, how they impact and are impacted by the world around you, how you learn how to solve them, how you learn more about the world through solving them, and how your experiences on the island shape your interpretation of the puzzles -- it is breathtaking how well these things go hand-in-hand with each other. Yes, this game was in development for a very long time, but it's reflected in how well-designed and thought out everything is.

Whereas Talos is very structured by comparison. The world certainly plays a role in the game's story, but not quite as much from a gameplay standpoint. It has clearly demarcated hub worlds, levels and puzzle chambers. There are occasions where things cross over a bit, but it's not the game's focus. Each level and each individual puzzle within largely feel detached from everything else around it. And whereas puzzle solutions in The Witness are largely governed by your knowledge of one or more rule sets, the limiting factor in Talos are the objects you have to play with in each puzzle chamber.

The puzzles are generally great in both games, even if the execution is different. Talos is much more hands-on, Witness is more observational. In Talos, you have blocks, and lasers, and fans, etc. that you have to manipulate to reach the solution; in The Witness, you're always drawing lines on a panel. But while there's more variety in Talos in terms of how you interact with each puzzle, in The Witness each puzzle plays a part in a much greater whole, and there's a ton of variety here as well in terms of how each puzzle factors into the world.

In the end, I find The Witness to be a more impressive game and a special experience, whereas I'd call Talos Principle a great puzzle game and probably stop there. Obviously I highly recommend both to anyone even remotely interested in puzzle games, whether we're talking about something like Myst or more like Portal. It's awesome and we're very fortunate that these two games exist.
 
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