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[KingKong]

The thing I most dislike about this game is its complete lack of challenge or thought to the gameplay. It's fine if they don't want to do tombs or puzzles, but why does platforming have to be so completely brainless?

It feels like the 2008 Prince of Persia was more complex than this


They don't even try to hide it. For example in that burning temple, you climb into a room and the exit is set on fire. Do they give the player time to think about the problem and find the solution? No, they orient Lara torwards the only climbable box that stands between her and the exit.

 

[Brick]

Just finished it this morning. Loved the game overall (though I was a bit underwhelmed by the ending). I consider Uncharted 2 one of my favorite games of this generation, and while I wouldn't call this better, it is definitely on par. Well done, Crystal Dynamics. Looking forward to what comes next.

 

[Andrew.]

Over the course of the game, Lara goes from scared and incapable to reluctant yet determined and finally to capable and brave.

Her interactions with Roth kick off the eventual realisation that's she has the desire and capability to save her friends and leave the island, despite initially feeling like she wouldn't be able to do it without him.

I felt the evolution was quite clear over the entire game and I was affected by it.

Thanks for answering that for me. I wasn't sure when the due date was, or how long my answer should be.

 

[DukeBobby]

Guess I'm going back to hoping Last of Us can fulfill some of those targets.

For your sake, don't get your hopes up.

 

[Teleporter]

U guys think theres gonna be mods for this game? Like gameplay stuff kinda like Skyrim needs, hunger, thirst and so on? Kinda lame have to kill innocent animals just for XP!

 

[Fine Ham Abounds]

Isn't this like giving someone fame by murdering them and giving someone that bears their resemblance their name?

 

[antitrop]

I would have been happy if this game was an actual survival/exploration game instead of simply pretending to be one while in reality just being another Uncharted game. Guns and ammo should be precious commodities and hard to find, AI should be smart enough that stealth and melee combat should actually be challenging, platforming should have a whiff of difficulty to it instead of press A in the general direction of the target.

Guess I'm going back to hoping Last of Us can fulfill some of those targets.

I think all of your points certainly would have made Tomb Raider a better, but completely different game. Which is fine, obviously there are plenty here who do not want Tomb Raider the way it is.

The Last of Us is my most anticipated game of the year, other than Heart of the Swarm. Every time I watch the trailers for that it excites me in a way that few games do.

I believe Naughty Dog will truly outdo themselves, could end up being the straight up GOTY.

 

[RagnarokX]

This all goes back towards user preference. I mean I loved the last three Tomb Raider games, but they fact people were getting tired of it showed they needed to try something else. Granted they could have done it differently. I think this sets the ground work for a new way forward in the series. One that hopefully attracts more people then the older Tomb Raiders did. I can't tell you how many times when telling people at Gamestop about the new Tomb Raider, just rolled their eyes and said they're tired of them. It was the majority of customers.

But correlation does not imply causation. TR sales were up from TR5 and AoD, which were terrible games, but nowhere near as high as Core's good games. We don't know what exact factors caused this, and claiming it was because fans were tired with the gameplay is a big assumption; there are a TON of factors surrounding these games. To me, CD's TR games always looked like watered down TR experiences, and this game is no different.

 

[sublimit]

I wonder how DMC fans would react if someone who never gave a shit about the series demanded the game to become a cinematic TPS just because he prefered it more than what the old games had to offer.

In Tomb Raider's case we're not just talking about innocent cosmetic changes "or improvements" as some may call them,but we're basically talking about genre change which results in loosing a unique game that has nothing else to serve as a substitute.
It's quite tragic i think.

 

[Derrick01]

For your sake, don't get your hopes up.

I just want the AI they've been selling us with the demos so far. It truly looks like the next step forward in an area that hasn't been worked on in the AAA sector in more than a decade.

The demos showed guns only have 3 or 4 bullets at most and you have to scavenge for supplies to create makeshift weapons and bandages, but that could easily fail. It depends how open the level design is and how carefully they place things. I think it's at least safe to say it won't end up like TR where you become a walking arsenal.

 

[antitrop]

I wander how DMC fans would react if someone who never gave a shit about the series demanded the game to become a cinematic TPS just because he prefered it more than what the old games had to offer.

Oh, please. You're trying too hard.

I didn't demand shit, they gave it to me and I'm willingly accepting it and it's my opinion that they made a correct call to take the franchise down this path. This Tomb Raider reboot wasn't even on my radar until a few weeks ago.

 

[Andrew.]

I believe Naughty Dog will truly outdo themselves, could end up being the straight up GOTY.

He won't like it anyway. And I hope to god he doesn't.

 

[SlasherJPC]

But correlation does not imply causation. TR sales were up from TR5 and AoD, which were terrible games, but nowhere near as high as Core's good games. We don't know what exact factors caused this, and claiming it was because fans were tired with the gameplay is a big assumption; there are a TON of factors surrounding these games. To me, CD's TR games always looked like watered down TR experiences, and this game is no different.

Yet the graph charted posted earlier clearly shows a decline over the years, from the originals and the CD entries. If this one far exceeds those, from a business perspective, this was the way to go.

 

[NullPointer]

I wander how DMC fans would react if someone who never gave a shit about the series demanded the game to become a cinematic TPS just because he prefered it more than what the old games had to offer.

In Tomb Raider's case we're not just talking about innocent cosmetic changes "or improvements" as some may call them,but we're basically talking about genre change which results in loosing a unique game that has nothing else to serve as a substitute.
It's quite tragic i think.

True. As I'm sure the vocal fans of the game here would scream bloody murder if one of their favorite series got this treatment.

 

[toastyToast]

I'm not getting Lara's characterization being interesting. She goes from unsure of herself to killing some dudes then she becomes a remorseless homicidal maniac. She needed boom in her voice, something. I never got the feeling that she snapped and went full survivor mode. Could have been the VA

 

[I'm an expert]

Over the course of the game, Lara goes from scared and incapable to reluctant yet determined and finally to capable and brave.

Her interactions with Roth kick off the eventual realisation that's she has the desire and capability to save her friends and leave the island, despite initially feeling like she wouldn't be able to do it without him.

I felt the evolution was quite clear over the entire game and I was affected by it.

Edit: By the end of the game she has the bravery to venture back into danger voluntarily to save others. At the start of the game she's just doing what's necessary to survive and is much more afraid.

I still haven't played the game but I could have probably guessed this was the character arc for her word for word. Not saying there's anything wrong with that, but did anyone honestly expect anything else than "she goes from being scared to being brave". If they did something else that would have been noteworthy.

 

[Buntabox]

I would have been happy if this game was an actual survival/exploration game instead of simply pretending to be one while in reality just being another Uncharted game. Guns and ammo should be precious commodities and hard to find, AI should be smart enough that stealth and melee combat should actually be challenging, platforming should have a whiff of difficulty to it instead of press A in the general direction of the target.

Guess I'm going back to hoping Last of Us can fulfill some of those targets.

I honestly thought the game was gonna be this way for some reason. I was expecting to rely on the bow and the other weapons be horded for difficult sequences.

I was wrong. Kind of wish there was a difficulty that lowered ammo availability. Would be really fun to worry about EVERY shot.

 

[Slacker]

I enjoyed the old games but in my opinion this is a near perfect reboot. That's not to say it's a perfect game, but that I really like the design idea behind the new Lara. She's young and passionate about what she's doing, but not the dual-pistol wielding sexy assassin acrobat from the original games yet. I assume in future games the character will develop into something more akin to what we're used to (hopefully not too cartoony), but for this game I think they did an excellent job.

After playing for about 6-7 hours, I don't really agree with the compaints about Lara's personality not matching the cold-blooded-killer in the gameplay, either. I feel like the violence from Lara ramps up appropriately with the rage inside her as a result of what's happening. Remember, this isn't a normal college girl waiting tables at IHOP. She mentioned it herself after her first kill

Spoiler

saying that it was easier than she thought it would be. She's got the crazy inside her already, we're just seeing it come out quickly thanks to the circumstances in the first game.

TLDR: They nailed it. I can't wait for the next game with this Lara.

 

[BraXzy]

What settings should I drop on my 670 to get a consistent 60 FPS?

 

[DeadRockstar]

I still haven't played the game but I could have probably guessed this was the character arc for her word for word. Not saying there's anything wrong with that, but did anyone honestly expect anything else than "she goes from being scared to being brave". If they did something else that would have been noteworthy.

You're not wrong, but knowing the destination doesn't preclude the journey from being enjoyable and unique within the given framework.

I'm able to guess how many of the movies I watch will turn out but it's the details and the specific characterisations I'm watching for.

 

[Varna]

U guys think theres gonna be mods for this game? Like gameplay stuff kinda like Skyrim needs, hunger, thirst and so on? Kinda lame have to kill innocent animals just for XP!

No modding tools so probably nothing that extensive. I am hoping for a no HUD mod. Maybe a higher combat difficulty mod as well. If someone could cut the amount of ammo you receive/carry that would be great too.

 

[jet1911]

You don't think you have had enough combat in almost all major video games? Isn't the vast amount of combat-focused titles sufficient for satiating your thirst? Besides, I don't think the combat in TR is particularly noteworthy in terms of player engagement.

Honestly most games that feature combat are pretty bad at it. I like fun combat, good shooting and melee mechanics that are fun to execute. I think TR really nails that. The weapons are fun to use, going from shooting to melee works well and it's useful. Not many game can claim that.

And the you have the great atmosphere, semi open world that gives a Metroid-lite vibe and nice pacing between set-piece and exploration. It's clearly not like the old Tomb Raider though and I can understand why some people are disapointed with the game.

 

[RagnarokX]

Yet the graph charted posted earlier clearly shows a decline over the years, from the originals and the CD entries. If this one far exceeds those, from a business perspective, this was the way to go.

It's not a steady decline, and again, we don't know what factors caused the decline. If I had to guess, since I was there at the time, I would say it was due to a reduction in the quality of the games themselves rather than fatigue. I wanted more, but Eidos wasn't delivering on quality after TR2; TR3 and TR4 were good but tedious. TR4 suffers from the same problem as Mario Sunshine; lack of variety. They released 2 bad games after those, and we see a very sharp decline. Then they followed those with some mediocre but competent games with a rise to good, but not as good as legacy, sales.

 

[Sinatar]

Dunno if this was posted yet (search came up nil) but Rock Paper Shotgun put up their review and as usual for them it's fantastic. Really nails the good and bad of the game.

 

[umberhulk2]

The radio tower was pretty fun everybody!

 

[oktarb]

Okay so I got two solid nights of play in and though I like the game there are some nagging items to attend to. First the salvage create: finding them laying around..ok a tad menial but okay. Now we go and suspend them so you have to lite the net on fire to get...wait for it... glorious salvage points. What the hell is the point? I get it you designed a system where you can lite things on fire. I'm surprised that I don't have to lite the god damn camp fire every time I want to use it. Then they go on to suspend them so you have to swing fires into them for..yayyyy salvage points. Talk about a dull mechanic.

Three birds standing next to each other caw caww caww! So I shoot one, they other crows don't even bother to fly away. At least the deer run away and mew a sad 'you wounded me' sound that makes me feel bad for not getting a clean kill.

QTEs are just bad, been covered here a ton but ya they can go rot in a dick pit. DEVs should boycott QTEs. Hell we should boycott games that continue to make marketing rat bastards think that these sell games.

I get to a narrow crevice they looms into the heights. I approach it and get a cut scene as Lara climbs and shimmies up. A part of my heart dies as flash backs to triple back flips that pull up to a handstand come to mind from previous Tomb Raider games. I get its a prequel but man jumps seem to be very dumbed done and damn near impossible to miss. I guess I'm lucky it wasn't a QTE.

Who had the hair fetish? I mean I get it Lara has long hair and it should move and sway but jesus its like it has a life of its own half the time. It's like someone staples a snake to the back of here head. I actually found I liked it better at lower settings when its more solid and less stringy.

I like the concept and implementation of the camp sites. I feel safe and when she makes a journal entry I'm in heaven. More of that.

Head shots or bullet sponges, not much of a middle ground. Enemies can soak up so many badly aimed shots its jarring. Too many "Really!?! He's getting back up!?"

Tombs are fun but they feel a bit like lip service. 'Okay here you go, go off to your little corner away from out 'Real" game and play your little puzzle.'

Story-wise I'm loving the game, I like seeing her evolve and come into her own. The island is a fun place to explore and finding a journal always excites me. Cut out the QTEs and this game goes way up in score.

 

[I'm an expert]

You're not wrong, but knowing the destination doesn't preclude the journey from being enjoyable and unique within the given framework.

I'm able to guess how many of the movies I watch will turn out but it's the details and the specific characterisations I'm watching for.

I agree. It's just that I do think that having a young, attractive female character to follow on this journey gives it even more of a reason to think a bit outside the box.

 

[TGO]

That dual weilding part about old Lara, I said it before

Spoiler

but takes Roths gun when he dies which are Lara's trade mark ones and they drawed attention the he had two

I think it will be dual weilding in future titles and thats how she got them and is their importance to her

 

[Deleted member 17706]

You guys are making it awfully hard to wait for a sale on this.

I got it from Green Man Gaming for like $34 flat.

 

[Fine Ham Abounds]

Dunno if this was posted yet (search came up nil) but Rock Paper Shotgun put up their review and as usual for them it's fantastic. Really nails the good and bad of the game.

I liked this part:

it’s actually remarkably similar to the previous Tomb Raiders from the developer. There are puzzle-climbing sections, and there are shooty-bang sections. No one ever wanted the latter in any of the previous eight hundred Tomb Raider games, but they were darned well included anyway. This time, while I’m pretty sure no one on Earth would have cared if they were ditched entirely, instead they’ve had the rather bright idea to make them actually decent.

 

[I'm an expert]

Odd..Amazon is still offering a $5 credit for buying it from them new.

 

[Dahbomb]

I wonder how DMC fans would react if someone who never gave a shit about the series demanded the game to become a cinematic TPS just because he prefered it more than what the old games had to offer..

I would never buy that DMC game no matter the money hats. DmC is still a DMC game with stylish action and combat. If DMC was made into an Uncharted clone I don't know what I would do.

The people who want every franchise to become that type of game are part of the industry's problem IMO.

By the way my deaths from combat so far in Hard mode: 0

Deaths from random ass QTEs = At least 50

She goes from unsure of herself to killing some dudes then she becomes a remorseless homicidal maniac.

Lara after killing a few people "I was surprised how easy it was".

Seems like she always had homicidal tendencies.

Next Uncharted game to pit Drake against Lara.

 

[Lime]

But if the mechanics work and are better than what they were inspired by, then who gives a shit who copied from whom?

If you didn't have fun, then thats you and the other half dozen. Im having a blast and so are most of the people here =P

I guarantee the next Uncharted will have Drake talking about each artifact he picks up. Oh shit, look who he aped that off of!

It isn't about copying in itself, it's about change, which your original post was touching upon. I pointed out that there are several options of changing the series besides copying already existing gameplay from other titles. You are changing or misunderstanding the topic to be about whether or not copying already existing down-worn mechanics in itself is good or not, which is not what your initial post was about.

Also, please stop using the word 'fun' as a valid descriptor of the game. The word holds no meaning whatsoever in a discussion between two parties about the elements of a game.

Over the course of the game, Lara goes from scared and incapable to reluctant yet determined and finally to capable and brave.

Her interactions with Roth kick off the eventual realisation that's she has the desire and capability to save her friends and leave the island, despite initially feeling like she wouldn't be able to do it without him.

I felt the evolution was quite clear over the entire game and I was affected by it.

Edit: By the end of the game she has the bravery to venture back into danger voluntarily to save others. At the start of the game she's just doing what's necessary to survive and is much more afraid.

Thanks for answering that for me. I wasn't sure when the due date was, or how long my answer should be.

You're just doing a description of the development. It's simply "A, B, and C happened, therefore it is good." You do not give reasons for *why* it is "strong" or "good". Nor do you explain why the form or ways through which this development are considered to be good. Ask yourselves the questions: How does the game portray the development Lara as a character? Do the dialogue and events adequately support this development? Do the game actions correspond to this development? In what ways do the game portray the character Lara (and are they executed in a good way)? Why is this portrayal of her development good?

 

[SlasherJPC]

I liked this part:

Yep. Was replaying the older games the other day. Combat is just pretty damn bad overall in those.

 

[NullPointer]

Dunno if this was posted yet (search came up nil) but Rock Paper Shotgun put up their review and as usual for them it's fantastic. Really nails the good and bad of the game.

Solid review.

And truly, there have been fleeting moments where I've felt like I was playing a Tomb Raider game. The occasional shimmy to a side jump, or when revisiting previous locations to scout for loot boxes. In the game proper I feel it for a few moments here and there, and outside of the narrative (fast traveling back to previous camps to explore) where I'm free from combat and just get to run and jump and climb around looking for stuff.

 

[DieH@rd]

No most of the game is running about, climbing and collecting and finding stuff, exploration if you will
Uncharted has way more combat

This. And its combat is more frustrating.

 

[Lime]

Dunno if this was posted yet (search came up nil) but Rock Paper Shotgun put up their review and as usual for them it's fantastic. Really nails the good and bad of the game.

Decent write-up. I think this little passage perfectly encapsulate the entirety of this thread:

I don’t think there could be a more emblematic game of the divide gaming has taken in the last few years. In the blue corner are the traditionalists, the old-school, they who see gaming as something they control. In the red corner, the new-school, the neophites, they who see gaming as an experience to be guided through. Tomb Raider, a series traditionally set in the old, in this reboot of the franchise firmly enters the new. It’s got something it wants to show you, so could you please follow this way.

 

[ViewtifulJC]

Dunno if this was posted yet (search came up nil) but Rock Paper Shotgun put up their review and as usual for them it's fantastic. Really nails the good and bad of the game.

This narrative, which offers not a single twist, surprise, or even interesting notion, is shoved down your throat at every opportunity, the controls constantly wrestled from your hands as it crucially needs to take over to stop you from doing something it might not like. This is so deeply at the core of every element of the game that you can’t even shimmy along a ledge without the game doing the bits where you go past a pillar for you. Run toward a building and scoooop, control is stolen, the camera jerked upward, because you might not have looked up at the pretty thing they drew. It feels like a combination of arrogance and deep paranoia. “You might play the game wrong! Let me do it!”

lol video games

 

[NullPointer]

Great write-up. I think this little passage perfectly encapsulate the entirety of this thread:

Damn straight I'm in the blue corner.

 

[I'm an expert]

This narrative, which offers not a single twist, surprise, or even interesting notion, is shoved down your throat at every opportunity, the controls constantly wrestled from your hands as it crucially needs to take over to stop you from doing something it might not like. This is so deeply at the core of every element of the game that you can’t even shimmy along a ledge without the game doing the bits where you go past a pillar for you. Run toward a building and scoooop, control is stolen, the camera jerked upward, because you might not have looked up at the pretty thing they drew. It feels like a combination of arrogance and deep paranoia. “You might play the game wrong! Let me do it!”

lol video games

lol interactive movies!

 

[Andrew.]

Also, please stop using the word 'fun' as a valid descriptor of the game. The word holds no meaning whatsoever in a discussion between two parties about the elements of a game.

Nah I dont think I will stop. The game is a fucking blast and so far it is fun to play.

I believe 85% of the posters in here would agree with me, which is way more than the amount of shared misery the handful of you carry with you like some incurable disease =P

 

[Derrick01]

Yes, you absolutely can revisit previous areas of the island (using a fast travel option, should you wish), to scoop up any of the seventy trillion secret items scattered about, locate any “Optional Tombs” (puzzle-based vaults where you must manipulate the scenery to reach a treasure), and climb to the top of things to say that you did. But the game really doesn’t want you to. It wants you to keep going, to rescue the next person, to keep saving the day. The urgency with which you’re pressed to carry on means that to go off and explore is to shatter the thin veneer of a narrative it so desperately wants to have

This narrative, which offers not a single twist, surprise, or even interesting notion, is shoved down your throat at every opportunity, the controls constantly wrestled from your hands as it crucially needs to take over to stop you from doing something it might not like. This is so deeply at the core of every element of the game that you can’t even shimmy along a ledge without the game doing the bits where you go past a pillar for you. Run toward a building and scoooop, control is stolen, the camera jerked upward, because you might not have looked up at the pretty thing they drew. It feels like a combination of arrogance and deep paranoia. “You might play the game wrong! Let me do it!”

This scripting also means that Lara is repeatedly put in situations where she must run/slide/fall away from everything exploding and collapsing. (Never has one person fallen so far, so often. The brutality with which Croft is ceaselessly met is astonishing.) And during these sections your job is to move left or right to avoid obstacles, and sometimes jump. It’s enormously impressive, the scenery blowing up and tearing away, the fantastic physics very well shown off. But are you playing? Barely.

RPS nailed it yet again.

 

[umberhulk2]

It's still about a mix of acrobatics and about being trigger happy, and surviving in an exotic environment. It was exceptionally transparent the second they announced this game that there would major revisions to the formula. And like, there were.

 

[Skilletor]

I honestly thought the game was gonna be this way for some reason. I was expecting to rely on the bow and the other weapons be horded for difficult sequences.

I was wrong. Kind of wish there was a difficulty that lowered ammo availability. Would be really fun to worry about EVERY shot.

There's a skill that lets you retrieve arrows you used from foes you've killed. Why, though, when the things can be found EVERYWHERE?

There's so much ammo in this game.

It's still about a mix of acrobatics and about being trigger happy, and surviving in an exotic environment. It was exceptionally transparent the second they announced this game that there would major revisions to the formula. And like, there were.

There's no sense of survival. Lara is damn near invincible.

 

[ced]

Closing in on the radio tower, really enjoyed it so far.

I would agree that ammo, especially arrows should be rare.

 

[NullPointer]

A random aside, but didn't Army of Two have this automatic non-attached cover system?

 

[SlasherJPC]

RPS nailed it yet again.

And once again all these things happen in the Uncharted series as well. Still sold a ton, still held in high regards by many. Regardless if certain people hate these sort of "games" The majority seem to enjoy them.

 

[Necrovex]

Nah I dont think I will stop. The game is a fucking blast and so far it is fun to play.

I believe 85% of the posters in here would agree with me, which is way more than the amount of shared misery the handful of you carry with you like some incurable disease =P

I am about three and a half hours in the game, and I am really loving it. So much goodness!

I also love Asura's Wrath, so the cinematicness of the game is what I love about it. Plus, I really find the gameplay fun.

 

[I'm an expert]

I can see the new threads now.. Which is more of a game... Journey or Tomb Raider? The Walking Dead or Tomb Raider?

A random aside, but didn't Army of Two have this automatic non-attached cover system?

Raccoon City did too. It's nothing new or innovative.

 

[derFeef]

RPS dudes sound more grumpy and jaded with every review, no one can please them.