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Tomb Raider |OT| Lara's Misfortune

Skilletor

Member
Geez you guys are acting like the entire game is nothing but a QTE sequence.

Do QTEs suck in this? Yeah they do, but goddamn they are so far in my play 1% of the game.(With the exception of the beginning)

Do you all enjoy anything anymore?

I enjoy lots of stuff, sure. Plenty of recent releases I've liked.

I guess I'm on Team Neutral or something? The whole binary red/blue thing sparks of some Twilight fangirl shit. There's room in the world for Unchrated 2 and Garou Mark of the Wolves.

Where is Garou2, ViewtifulJC?

:(

Where is it?
 

Andrew.

Banned
No, I'm not asking you to do a essay on it - I'm encouraging you to be substantiate your claims with proper reasoning and elaborate explanations. Instead you have only put forth platitudes so far.

Simply saying "I felt the transformation and cared about the character, therefore it is successful" is superficial at best. It's like saying "I liked the taste of this ice cream, because I could taste the ice cream." You unfortunately fail to specify and point out which elements supported this claim in addition to not explaining why it is the fact that it worked.

Therefore DeadRockstar you get a D+ on todays assignment and you will not be attending the school dance on Friday.
 

sublimit

Banned
I would never buy that DMC game no matter the money hats. DmC is still a DMC game with stylish action and combat. If DMC was made into an Uncharted clone I don't know what I would do.

The people who want every franchise to become that type of game are part of the industry's problem IMO.

By the way my deaths from combat so far in Hard mode: 0

Deaths from random ass QTEs = At least 50

Lara after killing a few people "I was surprised how easy it was".

Seems like she always had homicidal tendencies.

Next Uncharted game to pit Drake against Lara.

I really don't understand the motivation of people who want to change long established franchises (that never cared about) into something that fits their personal tastes.
I would never do that personally.I would feel terrible for the fans of that series even if the changes were catering more to my personal tastes.
 

I'm an expert

Formerly worldrevolution. The only reason I am nice to anyone else is to avoid being banned.
Actually, now I want to know Derrick's opinion on Dark Souls. I don't think I've ever seen him talk about it.

I specifically asked him how he called Dark boring but said he wanted TR to be more difficult and less hand holdy - exactly what Dark is. He ignored me. =/
 

Andrew.

Banned
Then it's safe to say he should not be taken seriously.

Well yeah, I mean this is coming from the guy who bashes every modernized present day gaming trope, but has admitted to being a full fledged trophy whore, which is arguably one of the the worst additions to modernized gaming. It's also probably the only reason why he tortures himself with the gaming nowadays.

It makes no sense. Chew on that for a bit.

He also ignores any request for his favorite all time games, since most of them are years old and far from fucking perfect, *cough* Alpha Protocol *cough*
 

Derrick01

Banned
I would like to answer this for myself instead of everyone assuming they know what the answer is.

Actually, now I want to know Derrick's opinion on Dark Souls. I don't think I've ever seen him talk about it.

It was ok but I do not like the minimalist nature of these games. Not the fact that it doesn't tell you where to go, I obviously enjoy that part, but there's nothing to really do in the game but progress to the next (likely huge) boss and figure out how to kill it. What's there is well done and it has intriguing melee combat that requires skill and timing, but contrary to what fans of the game want to tell you there is no real story or character development in the game. You can piece very vague hints together with items but that's as deep as it goes, which kind of bothers me for a RPG. Mechanically it's hard to criticize it as a RPG, it does it better than most do anymore.

I also think the difficulty with these games is overblown. Dark Souls at least was not that hard, precisely because it relies on your skill as a fighter.

Andrew. said:
He also ignores any request for his favorite all time games, since most of them are years old and far from fucking perfect, *cough* Alpha Protocol *cough*

AP is not one of my favorite games ever unless I'm going to make a top 100 list or something. Again I would like people to stop assuming they know these things especially since I don't believe I have ever listed my favorite games, and don't intend to.
 

I'm an expert

Formerly worldrevolution. The only reason I am nice to anyone else is to avoid being banned.
I would like to answer this for myself instead of everyone assuming they know what the answer is.



It was ok but I do not like the minimalist nature of these games. Not the fact that it doesn't tell you where to go, I obviously enjoy that part, but there's nothing to really do in the game but progress to the next (likely huge) boss and figure out how to kill it. What's there is well done and it has intriguing melee combat that requires skill and timing, but contrary to what fans of the game want to tell you there is no real story or character development in the game. You can piece very vague hints together with items but that's as deep as it goes, which kind of bothers me for a RPG. Mechanically it's hard to criticize it as a RPG, it does it better than most do anymore.

The only thing I can comment on is the lore of Dark. It's huge and far from vague. If anything I'd figure you're the type of player who'd enjoy that kind of story since it isn't beating you over the head with cutscenes.
 
I played for about 3 hours now and these are my impressions.

I like the Game, but there are so many little things that annoy me. One are the QTEs. Most of the time it feels more like a trial and error, but I am playing on hard, so maybe thats why.

But even then, the gunfights are too easy. The whole game feels like a Game for the current Generation Gamers. Too much handholding, the levels are kinda linear and the open-world is more like levels who are connected, in which you can backtrack.

As I said. I like the Game, but it seems the Game is more focused on presentation than on gameplay in comparison to the old TR titles.
 

antitrop

Member
The only thing I can comment on is the lore of Dark. It's huge and far from vague. If anything I'd figure you're the type of player who'd enjoy that kind of story since it isn't beating you over the head with cutscenes.

Dark Souls is one of the best games ever made, and easily the best RPG of the generation, but I'll admit that I would have liked to have known who Gwyn was when I got to him without having to read a Wiki.
 
I'd be spared so much shitty story and voice-acting, if more games stopped assuming they needed to have a story.

That said, while I don't like the story much in this games, I loved this part.

"What? Still Alive?"

(old school lara voice) "YES, still alive"
 
Despite all of the jokes regarding protecting her, her characterization is so good so far that I feel I probably will be pretty damn attached to her by the endgame.

... I like Lara too but damn man. I'm beginning to fear what will happen to you once Infinite drops and you experience Liz in all her glory. Better start saving for that rock I guess
 

I'm an expert

Formerly worldrevolution. The only reason I am nice to anyone else is to avoid being banned.
Dark Souls is one of the best games ever made, and easily the best RPG of the generation, but I'll admit that I would have liked to have known who Gwyn was when I got to him without having to read a Wiki.

(where do you think the info for the wiki came from)

Man just thinking back on it.. Gwyn..his first sun (see what I did there), the image of Gwynevere by Gwyndolin, the betrayal by Seath.. Artotrias..so good..
 

RedSwirl

Junior Member
Third person action/adventure. Think Uncharted but with way more exploration and more platforming, more responsive controls and with an experience system for character progression.

See, I think they could've nailed something amazing if they'd kept the old puzzle-platforming focus but added Uncharted's combat on top. I always thought each franchise had the opposite problem: Uncharted has sub-par puzzles, and Tomb Raider has always had sub-par combat. I've been waiting for a game to combine the strengths of the two.
 
the combat in this game isn't very good compared to some other third person shooters IMO. Melee is just completely non exsistent so far and the stealth is done poorly
 

Andrew.

Banned
(where do you think the info for the wiki came from)

Man just thinking back on it.. Gwyn..his first sun (see what I did there), the image of Gwynevere by Gwyndolin, the betrayal by Seath.. so good..

I finished Demons Souls. Loved it. Called out of work for it, etc.

Never played Dark, and I hear its easier.
 

Dahbomb

Member
I thought there was plenty to do in Dark Souls, go out finding crazy monsters and leveling up your characters and finding hidden items. The boss fights were amazing. Game made you feel like a pathetic human trying to fight mythical beasts. I too feel the difficulty of the games are overblown mostly because gamers have forgotten what real challenge is all about. You can either skillfully beat the game or you can grind through it. When I first started Dark Souls... I beat that first boss with that broken sword and didn't know that you had to run past him to get your real sword...

Game is godlike though. There aren't enough games like it. Also the game didn't beat you over the head with it's narrative, the lore was there if you looked for it.
 

I'm an expert

Formerly worldrevolution. The only reason I am nice to anyone else is to avoid being banned.
I finished Demons Souls. Loved it. Called out of work for it, etc.

Never played Dark, and I hear its easier.

Demon's lore is actually much more cryptic but I think the universe is better. Difficulty, meh, if you've played Demon's you know exactly what you're walking into. Both games are pretty easy. I remember speed running Demon's like nothing after I first beat it.
 

Andrew.

Banned
Demon's lore is actually much more cryptic but I think the universe is better. Difficulty, meh, if you've played Demon's you know exactly what you're walking into. Both games are pretty easy. I remember speed running Demon's like nothing after I first beat it.

I only got my ass kicked really hard in 1-1. (The Learning Level as my friends and I would come to call it)
 

antitrop

Member
(where do you think the info for the wiki came from)

Man just thinking back on it.. Gwyn..his first sun (see what I did there), the image of Gwynevere by Gwyndolin, the betrayal by Seath.. Artotrias..so good..
I beat Dark Souls and I have absolutely no idea what you're talking about.

Although I do know enough about Dark Souls to understand that it's simply because I chose not to look for the lore. It's a design decision and I respect that.
I suppose I just wish it would have been a little easier to find the lore if I really wanted to.

Sometimes the game is overly obtuse about certain things. It could be a bit more coherent.
 

I'm an expert

Formerly worldrevolution. The only reason I am nice to anyone else is to avoid being banned.
I beat Dark Souls and I have absolutely no idea what you're talking about.

Although I do know enough about Dark Souls to understand that it's simply because I chose not to look for the lore. It's a design decision and I respect that.

I suppose I just wish it would have been a little easier to find the lore if I really wanted to.

It's a game that requires your strictest attention, in pretty much all aspects. Without that or at least a guide I guarantee you wouldn't find a lot of the stuff that fleshes out the world. I wonder how many people even know of Darkstalker Kaathe.
 

Lime

Member
(where do you think the info for the wiki came from)

Man just thinking back on it.. Gwyn..his first sun (see what I did there), the image of Gwynevere by Gwyndolin, the betrayal by Seath.. Artotrias..so good..

Seriously. It's so great. The way that Dark Souls told its story made me appreciate its story even more. I can understand that direct exposition is preferable to other people, but damn if I didn't like the way the pieces and lore bit by bit fell together as a seemingly incomprehensible jig-saw puzzles.

The way the player has to infer how the world has come to be like it is, the way the player has to interpret the fate of Artorias or even the main story in itself. Just wow. And this subtle or almost obtuse way of telling its story is perfectly complimented by the challenging gameplay.
 

Andrew.

Banned
Derailment, but I think you guys are starting to convince me to play it. No way I could finish it before Infinite though.

Plenty of time to kill in April and May however =D
 

antitrop

Member
Seriously. It's so great. The way that Dark Souls told its story made me appreciate its story even more. I can understand that direct exposition is preferable to other people, but damn if I didn't like the way the pieces and lore bit by bit fell together as a seemingly incomprehensible jig-saw puzzles.

The way the player has to infer how the world has come to be like it is, the way the player has to interpret the fate of Artorias or even the main story in itself. Just wow. And this subtle or almost obtuse way of telling its story is perfectly complimented by the challenging gameplay.
I absolutely LOVE all of that, I just wish there was maybe a tiny bit more context from the beginning.

Although I completely understand that removes all of the mystery and tension and the awe of discovery that surrounds the first... uhm... well all of the game, actually.

I'm grasping at straws to critique a near perfect game, here.
 

Dahbomb

Member
Alright guys I am stuck in the game.

I am trying to find Roth's back pack and I found it in the wolf's den. Then when I get back this wolf attacks me and it sets off a QTE. Well I can't beat the QTE, it gives me the mash left/right event and I am mashing it hard but then he chomps me anyway. I have died 20 times to it. No other QTE prompt comes up.
 

Dance Inferno

Unconfirmed Member
Dark Souls is one of the best games ever made, and easily the best RPG of the generation

Eh. I don't mind challenging games, but I think the Souls series takes it way too far. If I only have an hour to game after work and I get killed at the 59th minute, I have officially made zero progress in that game session. Not my idea of fun. That's also the reason I disliked DMC3, even though I think it has some pretty tight combat mechanics.

Then you have Tomb Raider, which apparently is so easy that it's a cakewalk even on Hard. I never really played the Tomb Raider games for their combat, but if this game is going to revolve around its combat then at least make it a challenge.

I actually think that COD and Uncharted have a pretty decent balance here, where it has checkpoints every so often to prevent you from retreading lots of ground when you die, but the combat can be challenging and rewarding when you beat it.
 

SmithnCo

Member
Alright guys I am stuck in the game.

I am trying to find Roth's back pack and I found it in the wolf's den. Then when I get back this wolf attacks me and it sets off a QTE. Well I can't beat the QTE, it gives me the mash left/right event and I am mashing it hard but then he chomps me anyway. I have died 20 times to it. No other QTE prompt comes up.

Mash left/right then triangle (on PS3, dunno about others). It didn't give me any trouble so maybe you should reset. Could be a glitch?
 
So it shouldn't exist and is a very bare bones feature but..I keep coming back to the MP.

Headshots from a long distance with a bow never gets old.
 

Dahbomb

Member
Mash left/right then triangle (on PS3, dunno about others). It didn't give me any trouble so maybe you should reset. Could be a glitch?
I am on the PC version and no other prompt comes up. Usually it's either E or F but I tried both and none of them are working.
 

I'm an expert

Formerly worldrevolution. The only reason I am nice to anyone else is to avoid being banned.
Eh. I don't mind challenging games, but I think the Souls series takes it way too far. If I only have an hour to game after work and I get killed at the 59th minute, I have officially made zero progress in that game session. Not my idea of fun. That's also the reason I disliked DMC3, even though I think it has some pretty tight combat mechanics.

This will always depend on the person though. For me, Souls is very, very normal when it comes to difficulty. The zero progress comment though is an exaggeration. The point of your hour is to learn why you died and become a better player because of it, not throw yourself against the same thing for another hour. If you do not, it's not the game that is hard, but the player that lacks skill.

The other games you mentioned literally do not require that amount of thought or skill, just a steady finger to line up a headshot from behind cover. (I enjoy these games too, otherwise I wouldn't be in this thread)
 
Too much truth in this post.

Yeah, but what if I actually enjoy the "shitty, boring gunplay" and the "mundane exploratory elements" and the "elementary platforming"? Isnt that enough?

But at least we have Dark Souls to play the Ying to Tomb Raider's Yang.

I'm fine with both of them existing and each offering me different, but immensely valuable and enjoyable, gaming experiences.

Well, part of me feels the same way, at least to an extent. What really is the the problem with popcorn games, junk food games, comfort games? I think though that this shares a similar difference as between mindlessly entertaining films and engaging, challenging films. It's just that, at least in the opinion of many producers and publishers, these more "broadly accessible" titles are the ones making the most money. Should one kind of game become the most rewarded, that becomes the accepted baseline, and through the elimination of potentially less profitable projects, we must be faced with some level of homogenization. It's not unreasonable to have a low tolerance for this, I don't think.

I'm glad there are lots of experiments out there, I certainly don't want certain types of games to simply go away, I would just like to see certain established types of games to remain, especially as I have a concern that the most abundant current titles are actively abandoning what I consider the unique qualities and strengths of the medium.

I mean, I'm someone who loves the Souls games, classic Mega Man, old Tomb Raider, but also No More Heroes and Saint's Row 3. My top 4 games that left an impression on me last year were Tokyo Jungle, Dragon's Dogma, Sleeping Dogs, and fucking Frog Fractions for god's sake.

Maybe I'm just easy to please sometimes, but I think ever since Uncharted 3, I've been done with the direction AAA games have gone. I think I can respect weird, over-the-top, wacky, janky, even plain mediocre if it's coming from somewhere more creative than a committee with a hungry wallet and a checklist.
 

Derrick01

Banned
The only thing I can comment on is the lore of Dark. It's huge and far from vague. If anything I'd figure you're the type of player who'd enjoy that kind of story since it isn't beating you over the head with cutscenes.

I don't mind some cutscenes if they're well written and directed, just like I don't mind stories being in games or even the focus of some games if they're well written (I am one of the biggest Obsidian fans after all). It's just most of the AAA games doing that (including this one) have such terrible storytelling and writing.

But with Dark Souls and it being a RPG and everything, I don't like the minimalist approach they take with many elements. It's a game with great combat but not something I think is a great game overall.
 

I'm an expert

Formerly worldrevolution. The only reason I am nice to anyone else is to avoid being banned.
It's honestly not that bad... it's just so, I don't even know the word for it. Pointless?

What's the point of any competitive multiplayer? To test your skill of the gameplay mechanics when facing live opponents and not scripted ai.
 

kunonabi

Member
Finished it. I liked it even less than I thought it would.

I do have one question how many people did the cult/pirates actually kill?

I count Roth. I can only think of two others they might have killed: the pilot and someone in the camp when the gun went off and everyone scattered. I'm unclear as to whether or not they actually killed someone there.
 

I'm an expert

Formerly worldrevolution. The only reason I am nice to anyone else is to avoid being banned.
I don't mind some cutscenes if they're well written and directed, just like I don't mind stories being in games or even the focus of some games if they're well written (I am one of the biggest Obsidian fans after all). It's just most of the AAA games doing that (including this one) have such terrible storytelling and writing.

But with Dark Souls and it being a RPG and everything, I don't like the minimalist approach they take with many elements. It's a game with great combat but not something I think is a great game overall.

If by rpg you mean it in the strictest sense of the word, a role playing game, it most definitely is not one of those. If you just mean it by gameplay mechanics, you bet it is. The thing is, nowadays what rpgs really give a player any sense of freedom or ability to shape their character or events? Anyway, you don't have to reply to this, I don't want to keep an off topic convo goin this long heh.
 

Trey

Member
The game is very hand-holdy but what really feels like a misstep to me is how easy the combat is. Just shoot everyone in the face. There's no further depth than that. And the enemy variety is paltry.

I like the game's animation, though.
 

Zafir

Member
What are you PC guys pressing on the wolf QTE? Seriously it's driving me insane... I am upto 40 deaths now.

Which one you stuck on?

Assuming
rape QTE
, it's F, F, left to right spam, E mashing and then click when it's facing him from what I remember.
 

I'm an expert

Formerly worldrevolution. The only reason I am nice to anyone else is to avoid being banned.
Mass Effect, duh

=P

This was actually what I was gonna joke about in that post but I did't want to make someone angry lol.. LEFT TRIGGER GOOD BLUE GUY or RIGHT TRIGGER RED BAD GUY. Role playing!
 

Jarekx

Member
So I've played a couple hours and I like it. It's not spectacular so far but pretty solid. I mostly enjoy just exploring the environments as much as I can looking for hidden treasures and such. If they used those with combat I think I'd have fun trying to maneuver around enemies and pick them off with the bow as silently as possible...but from what i've played it hasn't opened up like that.

I dislike all the QTE sequences though. They are just boring.
 
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