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Tomb Raider |OT| Lara's Misfortune
- Thread starter Fracas
- Start date
ViewtifulJC
Banned
It's simultaneously MORE scripted than Uncharted(I've never seen so many damn button prompts for pseudo QTEs), and less with the combat design and the explorable areas.
The game is good when you can, ya know, play the fuckin' game.
I'm an expert
Formerly worldrevolution. The only reason I am nice to anyone else is to avoid being banned.
Are you saying his criticisms aren't legitimate or if the review had been completely positive you would no longer think of him as grumpy and jaded?
You must have missed the part where they said they actually enjoyed many parts of the game. You don't seem to be enjoying it at all.
They're just calling out modern gaming bullshit, since no one else will.
If you read the review he says he likes it when the game actually lets him play (which goes further than I would, because I find the game fuckin boring) but it's the hand holdy cinematic elements for the simple minded crowd that they hate.
I don't think you understood my point.
Majority and number of opinions do not equal validity and soundness.
I know you're partly joking, but misery? Why does every criticism of something have to be understood as something deliberately negative and miserable? I'm not sitting by my computer with a grumpy face when I shit on a game or a film or a book. I mean, not everyone who is negative about something is like this:
I'm an expert
Formerly worldrevolution. The only reason I am nice to anyone else is to avoid being banned.
Dat day one (two) dlc!
umberhulk2
Banned
RPS - High-Maintenance.com
I know, only have played 4 hours or so (want to save it for the weekend), but I would never say that CD is not leting me play the game. I actually think their "automatic" walk and duck thing is great, feels good too. I think it's a bit much critisizing that you don't have to press a button to use cover - because if it fit's the game and works good I welcome such things.
And please stop with the "simple minded" stuff, it's kinda offensive.
Ravensmash
Member
Eh, I've been having a lot of fun with it so far so I disagree.
I think the game has good pacing (so far at least) and gives a good balance of combat and the parts focused more on travelling through an area/platforming.
Feels like a more 'open' Uncharted, and it's pulling it off very well.
Edit: I think the cover system is fantastic too - refreshing almost.
Agreed. The cover system is one of the best I've seen in a while.
umberhulk2
Banned
She was in the older games.
It's meant to be offensive because that's who's being targeted by so many of these non interactive shitty elements in games.
As far as the cover stuff I would prefer to handle it myself. The more the game takes away from you and handles itself the more you realize all you're doing is holding the stick forward or pressing the triggers. The game already has enough auto mechanics, I think even the crowd they're aiming at can handle pressing a button to get into cover.
I guess Im in the minority when I say I dont have the time, nor do I want to spend an hour or more on a fucking puzzle within an action/adventure game nowadays.
When I was younger? No problem.
Ravensmash
Member
For what reason though? If you want to get into cover then you still navigate to a suitable place on your own accord - Lara just gets into position at the same time.
I don't think the lack of pressing a button to stick to a wall would be of any huge benefit in this particular game, it's not really going down the sticky cover route.
umberhulk2
Banned
I like the game. It's good, a bit frusterating in that I think it SO EASILY could have been great. But the cover is actually the first thing I would criticize (other than the qtes.) When she does it automatically, it becomes incongruous to what your doing with the controller and creates a disconnect.
The older games didn't focus on combat as the main gameplay mechanic. I know it was possible to mistime or miscalculate jumps, get burned or impaled on traps, have something cave in on you if you weren't paying attention.
But I'm not even comparing this Lara to the old one. I'm just playing this as the game it is, and this Lara, in this game, has to try to die.
NullPointer
Member
There are hundreds of other games to play. You have plenty of choices out there if you don't want platforming and environmental puzzles. That's not a great reason to gut a unique series.
umberhulk2
Banned
Yeah, this fucking sucks to type, but I agree.
You have time to gun people down for 10 hours, you have time for something that actually takes a little bit of effort.
It's not gears of war where you need to be glued to the cover to make it actually work as cover. Anyway, continue to look down on us (or at least me, as simple minded, or "that crowd")
So maybe this is what I should ask before I get the disk and put it in: What is this game trying to be mechanically?
I don't even really know what kind of game this is supposed to be at all.
People in this thread are saying good things about the character, and that's great, but, well, what is the game?
I don't even really know what kind of game this is supposed to be at all.
People in this thread are saying good things about the character, and that's great, but, well, what is the game?
Ravensmash
Member
The cover system feels really good though, it's a nice change from the 'hit x to stick to wall and slide around everywhere' mechanic, if anything Lara feels more controllable in combat because you don't have this stickiness etc. Maybe it's needed in some games, but I don't think it's as necessary here, at all.
I think it's nicely animated too.
I think it's nicely animated too.
DeadRockstar
Member
It seems like you're expecting me to write an essay about the subject here. It's good because I found it successful and affecting, which I assume was the developers goal. The fact that I felt the transformation from A to B to C and cared about the character going through it, does in fact make it successful, yes. The methods they used are clear to see from playing the game. We're working from the same source material.
I do believe the dialogue, pacing, performance, casual exclamations during gameplay etc. support the developers intent because I experienced the desired result. Isn't that much obvious?
You don't need to have a sticking mechanic. All they could use is a crouch button since that's what she does behind cover, and crouch could be used for stealth instead of the game handling that automatically too. There are times when I play this when I'm wondering what I'm actually doing since the game seems to handle everything but the kill button for me.
umberhulk2
Banned
I think the best way to do is the have a kneel button as opposed to cover--like the way Saint's Row 3 does it.
Yeah, but what if I actually enjoy the "shitty, boring gunplay" and the "mundane exploratory elements" and the "elementary platforming"? Isnt that enough?
I spent an hour last night just seeking out those wooden trinkets hanging in the trees for that Ghost Hunter challenge. I never really take that kind of time to do side stuff.
Im really glad I couldnt stand the older series, but I do understand where the anger and frustration is coming from. Thankfully, I love my hobby enough that I can embrace change. I embrace it so hard. =P
I'm an expert
Formerly worldrevolution. The only reason I am nice to anyone else is to avoid being banned.
This was the perfect opportunity for aintnobodygottimeforthat.gif and you blew it!
Third person action/adventure. Think Uncharted but with way more exploration and more platforming, more responsive controls and with an experience system for character progression.
Fine Ham Abounds
Member
I partly believe that most of us are so used to games being easy and forgiving that the difference between automatic gameplay and real is sorta blurred. We're handed experiences out of our control because without punishing obstacles, what's the difference? Directed, automatic sequences are the natural evolution of game design in an environment where people want flashier, less challenging experiences and reward those providing them these products with their money.
These hand-holdy offerings are almost masturbatory; there's no respect for the emergent qualities of systems, instead you're going through the motions of shallow, canned content for a superficially pleasurable but fundamentally artificial experience. Sure, everything in a game is an illusion, but what I'm getting at is trying to manufacture satisfaction without player agency.
The pacing and presentation of so many games nowadays is a reflection of devs who seem to remember only clearing games and not the important licks they took learning how to get through them. They remember how much better they would have made some story or sequence, and become more enamored with a specific vision of it than with the potential to inspire players' imaginations as they were once inspired. These cinematic visions for game narratives indicate a certain disrespect for both the tired tropes but also the strengths of the medium, a disrespect that is generally tolerated in an environment where gameplay and challenge are perceived as no longer of prime relevance.
These hand-holdy offerings are almost masturbatory; there's no respect for the emergent qualities of systems, instead you're going through the motions of shallow, canned content for a superficially pleasurable but fundamentally artificial experience. Sure, everything in a game is an illusion, but what I'm getting at is trying to manufacture satisfaction without player agency.
The pacing and presentation of so many games nowadays is a reflection of devs who seem to remember only clearing games and not the important licks they took learning how to get through them. They remember how much better they would have made some story or sequence, and become more enamored with a specific vision of it than with the potential to inspire players' imaginations as they were once inspired. These cinematic visions for game narratives indicate a certain disrespect for both the tired tropes but also the strengths of the medium, a disrespect that is generally tolerated in an environment where gameplay and challenge are perceived as no longer of prime relevance.
Ravensmash
Member
Lack of a crouch button is odd, but I don't think it's a major issue - or at least not for me so far. I still feel involved and engaged with the action, and the controls overall are fantastic and very responsive.
Too much truth in this post.
Yeah, but what if I actually enjoy the "shitty, boring gunplay" and the "mundane exploratory elements" and the "elementary platforming"? Isnt that enough?
In another post you said you don't have time for a well crafted puzzle but then you wasted an hour looking for random ass trinkets in the game.
Double standards much?
I'm an expert
Formerly worldrevolution. The only reason I am nice to anyone else is to avoid being banned.
There is definitely a lacking of player imagination in games nowadays.. everything must be scripted, sculpted, and the player guided along it otherwise the assets that cost millions will be wasted. Great post, Fine Ham.
brofist.jpg
Obviously not. It's as if we're 'bad' people for liking this game, the scourge that is killing gaming.
DeadRockstar
Member
It's an action adventure that borrows what you might call the successes from other games of this console generation. It has shades of Uncharted with more successful stealth and a more open world.
It has the audio log style of adding to the back story as well as an XP based progression mechanic.
I'd say it mixes it's own identity with those elements to form an amalgam.
umberhulk2
Banned
All this talk about cover made me think of Killswitch(ps2)--since I saw it in a store recently and laughed.
But at least we have Dark Souls to play the Ying to Tomb Raider's Yang.
I'm fine with both of them existing and each offering me different, but immensely valuable and enjoyable, gaming experiences.
spandexmonkey
Banned
A fun experience, like a Christopher Nolan action movie or along the lines of the current James Bond films. Wraps itself in serious face, but ultimately the plot/characters are 80's action schlock. Good production value, fun to play, little depth, no real challenge.
If you want that depth and challenge, there's plenty of other games to hold your attention.
He said it was boring a couple pages ago and doesnt like it.
I, for one, was shocked.
If I recall correctly, he didn't like it.
No, I'm not asking you to do a essay on it - I'm encouraging you to be substantiate your claims with proper reasoning and elaborate explanations. Instead you have only put forth platitudes so far.
Simply saying "I felt the transformation and cared about the character, therefore it is successful" is superficial at best. It's like saying "I liked the taste of this ice cream, because I could taste the ice cream." You unfortunately fail to specify and point out which elements supported this claim in addition to not explaining why it is the fact that it worked. Why is it good? Why was it well-executed? Why did it make you feel the way it made you feel? etc.
ViewtifulJC
Banned
I guess I'm on Team Neutral or something? The whole binary red/blue thing sparks of some Twilight fangirl shit. There's room in the world for Unchrated 2 and Garou Mark of the Wolves.