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Tomb Raider |OT| Lara's Misfortune

Grisby

Member
And by that, you mean that you're going to miss TR's cover system.
Maybe. Gears is probably going to be a lot more chaotic than TR. Has a heavier feel to the combat, sliding/sticking into cover and everything. I love it but I will be thinking of TR when I'm playing it.

TR has some damn good shooting. I almost wish there was some sort of horde mode deal just so I could get some hectic firefights going on. I think it's so satisfying because the enemies really react to being shot.

Game's easy as pie but damn if I'm not having a good time. I'll finally beat it tomorrow.
 

Dahbomb

Member
I gave it a 4 which is slightly below average. I couldn't justify any more with how much of the game is automatically handled and how pointless the XP and skill system is, and how easy it was on Hard. I felt like it was a fair score for what the game offered, and the only reason it didn't get a lower score is because the controls and handling weren't horrible.
Well what do you consider an "average" game? Like what game would you give a 5 on that is similar to TR. I think that would make it easier to understand where you are coming from and what is your bar for this type of game.
 
I gave it a 4 which is slightly below average. I couldn't justify any more with how much of the game is automatically handled and how pointless the XP and skill system is, and how easy it was on Hard. I felt like it was a fair score for what the game offered, and the only reason it didn't get a lower score is because the controls and handling weren't horrible.

People saying the game was easy on hard are smoking crack, trolling, or playing with keyboard/mouse. I beat all 3 Uncharteds on Crushing so im pretty sure im not terrible, and this game was not easy on Hard. The AI could have been a little smarter, but there were definitely encounters i had to try 10+ times and wasnt sure if i was going to be able to beat at all without turning down the difficulty
 

Bladenic

Member
Okay so that is a game ending glitch that Crystal Dynamics need to fix asap, but luckily people found an easy solution that involves, ironically, another glitch.
 
Good god this game is frustrating. Not the difficulty, but the nature of the content. Every single jaw-dropping setpiece is ruined with hand holding; everything legitmately impressive that I have nothing but admiration for the technical, artistic, detailed effort that went into crafting it is juxtaposed with gameplay that insults it by constrast.

I am becoming more and more in love with this environment and it makes every moment of wiggling the stick back and forth, walk-forward-itis, or dull wave combat a damnable shame. I sit there holding forward or mashing X or O,imagining the 3 or 4 different ways they could have approached it that would have made this game incredible.
 

TripOpt55

Member
Um wtf is this a glitch or am i missing something obvious?
Right after you get the rope ascender, what's supposed to happen? I use the ascender on the crate thing, mash sqaure, but the crane rips off and the crate stays in the same place.

I got this glitch as well and there is
a way to fall through the floor where the crate is supposed to have made a hole. Searching Youtube about the Rope Ascender Glitch Fix or something like that should get you a video for it. It sucks, but I was not prepared to replay like 60% of the game, so this solution worked for me.

Edit: Seems you figured this out already.
 

Derrick01

Banned
Well what do you consider an "average" game? Like what game would you give a 5 on that is similar to TR. I think that would make it easier to understand where you are coming from and what is your bar for this type of game.

Uncharted 1 and Gears 3 are two similar games I'd give a score in the 5-6 range, I guess that's close enough. I give U1 a higher score because of the cinematic strengths from ND which are some of the best in the industry and Gears has better and tighter gameplay than TR. Not to mention both are more challenging.

People saying the game was easy on hard are smoking crack, trolling, or playing with keyboard/mouse. I beat all 3 Uncharteds on Crushing so im pretty sure im not terrible, and this game was not easy on Hard. The AI could have been a little smarter, but there were definitely encounters i had to try 10+ times and wasnt sure if i was going to be able to beat at all without turning down the difficulty

It was incredibly easy for me and I never broke a sweat the entire game. Conversely I kind of suck at the Uncharteds because of the slightly wonky controls and bad shooting mechanics. I always seem to slightly struggle with them in places on Normal.

And no I was playing with a 360 pad on PC. The AI makes it incredibly easy to headshot people like crazy and they never try to flank so I didn't have to worry about that (like I am right now in Spec Ops on hard, a really frustrating game).

Fine Ham Abounds said:
Good god this game is frustrating. Not the difficulty, but the nature of the content. Every single jaw-dropping setpiece is ruined with hand holding; everything legitmately impressive that I have nothing but admiration for the technical, artistic, detailed effort that went into crafting it is juxtaposed with gameplay that insults it by constrast.

I am becoming more and more in love with this environment and it makes every moment of wiggling the stick back and forth, walk-forward-itis, or dull wave combat a damnable shame. I sit there holding forward or mashing X or O,imagining the 3 or 4 different ways they could have approached it that would have made this game incredible.

I do have to say some of the larger areas in the game are really impressive to look at and admire the scale, but yeah the gameplay and shallow collectibles kind of ruin the point of them.
 
The shooting in this game seems way harder for me than the Uncharteds. That might have to do more with how annoying the enemies are though, they show up out of nowhere at all so I can't really be as precise with the shooting as I am with a game like Uncharted 2.
 
Good god this game is frustrating. Not the difficulty, but the nature of the content. Every single jaw-dropping setpiece is ruined with hand holding; everything legitmately impressive that I have nothing but admiration for the technical, artistic, detailed effort that went into crafting it is juxtaposed with gameplay that insults it by constrast.

I am becoming more and more in love with this environment and it makes every moment of wiggling the stick back and forth, walk-forward-itis, or dull wave combat a damnable shame. I sit there holding forward or mashing X or O,imagining the 3 or 4 different ways they could have approached it that would have made this game incredible.

I keep saying this about how the game has design philosophy problems that conflicts with the gameplay.
It just takes you out of it sometimes.
 
People saying the game was easy on hard are smoking crack, trolling, or playing with keyboard/mouse. I beat all 3 Uncharteds on Crushing so im pretty sure im not terrible, and this game was not easy on Hard. The AI could have been a little smarter, but there were definitely encounters i had to try 10+ times and wasnt sure if i was going to be able to beat at all without turning down the difficulty

I played through the whole game on hard and died only 4 times in combat encounters (plenty more from intentionally dying during cinematic sequences). I used an Xbox controller with the default sensitivity. Maybe you just didn't pay attention to the tips like shooting an enemies leg to get them to stagger or throwing dirt in their faces?
 
People saying the game was easy on hard are smoking crack, trolling, or playing with keyboard/mouse. I beat all 3 Uncharteds on Crushing so im pretty sure im not terrible, and this game was not easy on Hard. The AI could have been a little smarter, but there were definitely encounters i had to try 10+ times and wasnt sure if i was going to be able to beat at all without turning down the difficulty

You are accusing us of being on crack?
 

LegendX48

Member
Once you get over the initially abrupt transformation (from killing 1 dude to killing a bunch more), it's great. And they even acknowledge that she's murdering people when she say's "you'd be surprised how easy it was". Great character design, great voice acting, less arrogant, more fierce/badass. I don't know what's not to like.

because its so jarring. She goes through such a short moment with her first kill and proceeds to go on a rampage with shotguns, assault rifles, explosive arrows and even shouts at enemies trying to intimidate them like some seasoned veteran or something.
 

Totobeni

An blind dancing ho
The game is certainly not pointless when you judge it by how well it is being received. Is it some complex, thought provoking endeavor that redefines the genre? No, nor does every game have to be. I love all sorts of games, provided they entertain me. And loving such a game does not make one a drooling moron with low standards, either.

If a game is well made, plays great and has a stellar presentation and production value, then I will kick back and enjoy the ride. I am not too 'hardcore' to have fun. Of course the game not being your cup of tea is one thing, and I absolutely respect that. But talking down to the majority who love the game as if you are on some higher intellectual plane of existence is nothing short of repugnant snobbery.


I love games that respect me as a player, that offer some sort of challenge and don't think I'm here just to push the analog stick forward and watch a Z-rated movie.

this is not a well made game,it's full of issues it's repetitive, piss easy,stupid AI,with samey location, bad pacing that kill any use of the player head and it's do not play "great" either every elemnts it take from the other games are better in the other games not here, the cover system is lame and the controls is nothing to write home about, and stellar presentation and production value mean absolutely nothing (see Quantic dream or Ninja theory).
 
I am becoming more and more in love with this environment and it makes every moment of wiggling the stick back and forth, walk-forward-itis, or dull wave combat a damnable shame. I sit there holding forward or mashing X or O,imagining the 3 or 4 different ways they could have approached it that would have made this game incredible.

I think what made me less annoyed at the walk forward parts is the fact that somebody mentioned somewhere that about 75% of the Lara-does-nothing-but-walk-forward parts are loading screens. And considering it keeps me in-game instead of breaking atmosphere, I became okay with it. Of course, 25% of the time it's during "action" sequences and that definitely sucks.

Also on the note of breaking atmosphere, I find it mind-boggling how they managed to do very well with not having a HUD to keep you engrossed in the scenery, only to break the immersion by having 10 XP! or "press LB to use instinct!" ding up every twenty feet.
 
I guess it could have to do with my upgrade choices, or lack of upgrades in general since I didn't explore much until post-game (and thus didn't have a ton of upgrades), but there were definitely some really difficult moments. Usually when there's 5-6 guys bombarding you with fire arrows and dynamite from 500 yards away and a single one breaks your cover. Off the top of my head, the 3 hardest fights for me were
(1) shanty town right after the helicopter, (2) right before grim dies, and (3) when you're in the japanese palace after you find the general's skeleton, in that small room with the staircase in the middle and the moat going around the staircase
. Of those, (3) was probably the hardest. (1) might have been the hardest except I found a spot where I could stand to cheese it
 

ironcreed

Banned
Good god this game is frustrating. Not the difficulty, but the nature of the content. Every single jaw-dropping setpiece is ruined with hand holding; everything legitmately impressive that I have nothing but admiration for the technical, artistic, detailed effort that went into crafting it is juxtaposed with gameplay that insults it by constrast.

I am becoming more and more in love with this environment and it makes every moment of wiggling the stick back and forth, walk-forward-itis, or dull wave combat a damnable shame. I sit there holding forward or mashing X or O,imagining the 3 or 4 different ways they could have approached it that would have made this game incredible.


The quick time events are about my only complaint with the game. Would have appreciated having some of them dialed back or eliminated, but the game on the whole still makes up for it for me. As it is, you can tell a lot of effort and love went into making this reboot. Anxious to see where it goes from here.
 

Replicant

Member
Regarding the difficulty, I'm starting to wonder if there's a difference between US and Euro copy. Isn't Square normally tuning up the difficulty on their European copies? That'd explain why some people have difficulty while others think it's too easy.
 
Regarding the difficulty, I'm starting to wonder if there's a difference between US and Euro copy. Isn't Square normally tuning up the difficulty on their European copies? That'd explain why some people have difficulty while others think it's too easy.

way to make a guy feel like shit. I played the US version :p
 

GenoZStriker

Neo Member
Regarding the difficulty, I'm starting to wonder if there's a difference between US and Euro copy. Isn't Square normally tuning up the difficulty on their European copies? That'd explain why some people have difficulty while others think it's too easy.
I doubt it. Some people are just better at games than other. And honestly, having played it on the PC I do think I would have had trouble playing it with a controller. It just felt very good with Mouse and Keyboard and being used to FPS games on the PC, made it very easy for me. Since I have better control over my camera and aim, compared to what I would have with a controller.
 

antitrop

Member
Just finished this right now, 84%, 16 hours played on Steam.

That ending.

m1C1E.gif


They can announce a sequel, now.
 

Sissel

Member
How is this Lara is better than the old Lara?

New Lara is just of what hollywood typical b-movies shitty heros are, and she is still not "realistic" she just is robotic as the old Lara, and actually have nothing unique or new in her, how the hell she is more awesome? because she kill too many people? or just get in too many unlucky situation and screams a lot? there is absolutely nothing that makes the new Lara "awesome" or badass or anything, at least old Lara design was iconic which can't be said here.
Because she isn't an arrogant smarty pants and portrays emotions in a believable way. She's just much more likeable and somebody to root for now. And you're crazy if you think she's as "robotic" as old Lara. Go play Tomb Raider Legend, listening to Lara talk is painful.
 

Replicant

Member
I doubt it. Some people are just better at games than other. And honestly, having played it on the PC I do think I would have had trouble playing it with a controller. It just felt very good with Mouse and Keyboard and being used to FPS games on the PC, made it very easy for me. Since I have better control over my camera and aim, compared to what I would have with a controller.

The thing is some of us actually aced Uncharted 3 crushing and that was fucking annoying too. Yet those who said UC3 too gang-bangy was also the one who said this one was easy.

I also remember someone saying they only fought 15 people at the start of Shanty town but I felt 10-13 was roughly the first wave of enemies that I had to fight before they add about 7-8 for the 2nd wave and another 3-4 for the 3rd wave.
 

ironcreed

Banned
I love games that respect me as a player, that offer some sort of challenge and don't think I'm here just to push the analog stick forward and watch a Z-rated movie.

this is not a well made game,it's full of issues it's repetitive, piss easy,stupid AI,with samey location, bad pacing that kill any use of the player head and it's do not play "great" either every elemnts it take from the other games are better in the other games not here, the cover system is lame and the controls is nothing to write home about, and stellar presentation and production value mean absolutely nothing (see Quantic dream or Ninja theory).

I'm glad you feel that way and you are entitled to your opinion. But please don't try to ram it in my face as if I am wrong for enjoying the game. Is it some intellectually stimulating exercise? No, nor do I need it to be, but there is certainly more to it than just pushing the analog stick forward, lol.

If it was indeed such a horribly designed and awful game, then I doubt that it would be received so well by critics and gamers alike. No, it is just horrible for you and that is OK. There are plenty of high scoring, popular games that I can't stand, but I don't run around telling everyone how horrible the game is and how wrong they are for thinking otherwise.
 

Papercuts

fired zero bullets in the orphanage.
The thing is some of us actually aced Uncharted 3 crushing and that was fucking annoying too. Yet those who said UC3 too gang-bangy was also the one who said this one was easy.

I also remember someone saying they only fought 15 people at the start of Shanty town but I felt 10-13 was roughly the first wave of enemies that I had to fight before they add about 7-8 for the 2nd wave and another 3-4 for the 3rd wave.

I feel like TR has been a decent challenge on Hard, but I also realized I focused so much on the melee based tree I actually missed a health boost until just now...so that might be kinda important.

There is also the RNG based weapon drops. People keep saying how powerful the AR is, so I'm wondering around what place in the game people have been getting the most powerful one. I still don't have it and I'm heading towards
the shipwreck
.
 

Skilletor

Member
People saying the game was easy on hard are smoking crack, trolling, or playing with keyboard/mouse. I beat all 3 Uncharteds on Crushing so im pretty sure im not terrible, and this game was not easy on Hard. The AI could have been a little smarter, but there were definitely encounters i had to try 10+ times and wasnt sure if i was going to be able to beat at all without turning down the difficulty

Or maybe just better than you at games.

The AI is fucking retarded. There were times that I was out in the open taking headshots with bows and they would literally just sit there doing nothing.
 

Sissel

Member
I'm glad you feel that way and you are entitled to your opinion. But please don't try to ram it in my face as if I am wrong for enjoying the game. Is it some intellectually stimulating exercise? No, nor do I need it to be, but there is certainly more to it than just pushing the analog stick forward, lol.

If it was indeed such a horribly designed and awful game, then I doubt that it would be received so well by critics and gamers alike. No, it is just horrible for you and that is OK. There are plenty of high scoring, popular games that I can't stand, but I don't run around telling everyone how horrible the game is and how wrong they are for thinking otherwise.
indeed. And some of his complaints aren't even valid. The cover system is lame? No, it's pretty great and works really well. The controls aren't good? What? lol. It's repetitive? Hell no, it paces its enemy encounters really well.
 
The thing is some of us actually aced Uncharted 3 crushing and that was fucking annoying too. Yet those who said UC3 too gang-bangy was also the one who said this one was easy.

I also remember someone saying they only fought 15 people at the start of Shanty town but I felt 10-13 was roughly the first wave of enemies that I had to fight before they add about 7-8 for the 2nd wave and another 3-4 for the 3rd wave.

Only thing I can think of is that maybe it had to do with the upgrades we had. Or maybe there's just some subtle difference in the cover mechanic such that some people found Uncharted easier and some people found this one easier. At least in Uncharted you could stay in cover for a while without having to move. The worst part about this one is that you'd have guys throwing dynamite at you if you stayed in cover for more than 2-3 second, or if you popped your head up they'd instantly head shot you with an arrow, knocking you out of cover. So you've got 4 guys on the other side of the map throwing dynamite at you, and if you do peek over to try to get a shot at one of them, they just pop you with a bow instantly and it takes you like 2 seconds to recover before you can control your character again.

So yea, either more upgrades or something about the cover mechanic is the only reason I can think of why some people found it easy
 
Or maybe just better than you at games.

The AI is fucking retarded. There were times that I was out in the open taking headshots with bows and they would literally just sit there doing nothing.

I'm sure there are people that are better than me, but I did beat all 3 Uncharteds on Crushing, so I mean it's not like a total doofus or anything.

I didn't think TR Hard was as hard as UC3 Crushing, but it definitely wasn't "a cake walk" that I could do "without breaking a sweat". I actually thought it was just right
 

Skilletor

Member
indeed. And some of his complaints aren't even valid. The cover system is lame? No, it's pretty great and works really well. The controls aren't good? What? lol. It's repetitive? Hell no, it paces its enemy encounters really well.

I dunno, I'm almost at the end of the game and can't bring myself to finish it. It's stupidly repetitive. I don't think the latter half of the game has well paced encounters. Definitely feels like wave after wave, and then set piece, and then wave after wave, and then set piece.

Middle half of the game was good.
 

ironcreed

Banned
indeed. And some of his complaints aren't even valid. The cover system is lame? No, it's pretty great and works really well. The controls aren't good? What? lol. It's repetitive? Hell no, it paces its enemy encounters really well.

Yeah, the cover system makes old fashioned sticky cover feel like outdated jank to me. It is just so seamless, immersive and natural feeling. No more getting stuck or clinging to objects as you go in and out of cover. It's like liquid and works beautifully.
 

XAL

Member
(PC Version)
I was able to 100% this game with no glitches and very little frustration, I found the whole experience very enjoyable. I guess I'm in the minority of people that had no issues with it.

I thought everything about the game was solid from the movement, platforming, shooting, and game feel. Overall I liked it a lot better than any of the uncharted games.

Though I was sort of puzzled by how Lara hadn't put everything together at the end of the game when the whole purpose of everything was laid out in front of her, not even including the information from the collectibles.

I wasn't expecting much from this game, but I'm surprised how well put together it is and really glad they made Lara a more respectable character.

I can't wait for what they're going to do with the sequel.

8.5/10
 

antitrop

Member
Yeah, the cover system makes old fashioned sticky cover feel like outdated jank to me. It is just so seamless, immersive and natural feeling. No more getting stuck or clinging to objects as you go in and out of cover. It's like liquid and works beautifully.
It's extremely slick. Sure Army of Two did it 5 years ago, but that game sucked, who gives a shit.
 

MG310

Member
I'm anxiously awaiting the youtube video that is just 2 straight hours of Lara falling down hills/off bridges/down rivers set to yakkity sax.
 

Replicant

Member
The AI is fucking retarded. There were times that I was out in the open taking headshots with bows and they would literally just sit there doing nothing.

This is never happened to me. The AI always scrambling for newer position, flanking from all sides, if you hit it once, it'll hide in cover or move to another cover if you hit it with fire arrows. The guys who throw explosives will stay away from you and those with submachine gun will hunt you sneakily from behind while the ones with armor will try to flank you from another side so while you're avoiding their attack, you get hit by submachine gun from behind. I once even saw an AI trying to get to a hiding cover by crouching/dragging their body on their side so it can avoid my line of fire. The AI is many thing but fucking retarded is not it.

The only time the AI will slump down doing nothing is when they're badly hurt (so obviously they can't move) and you're one step away from finishing them off (indicated by the green triangle on PS3). But if you're not fast, he'll recover and go into hiding before flanking you again once they get backup.
 

Trey

Member
The only reason auto cover works is because of the pace of TR. You never need to enter or leave cover with any urgency. I do like how it's rather seamless, though. I never felt stuck to a waist high crate, like in Mass Effect or Gears.

The AI is wholly stupid, no two ways about it.
 

Replicant

Member
The only reason auto cover works is because of the pace of TR. You never need to enter or leave cover with any urgency. I do like how it's rather seamless, though. I never felt stuck to a waist high crate, like in Mass Effect or Gears.

Are we even playing the same game? If you stay in the same cover longer than 2-3 sec, they WILL throw molotov cocktails at you that automatically pops you out of cover.
 

Trey

Member
Are we even playing the same game? If you stay in the same cover longer than 2-3 sec, they WILL throw molotov cocktails at you that automatically pops you out of cover.

Those things take a good three seconds to explode. They conveniently come with their own blinking red indicator so you can't possibly miss it, and half the time the AI throws them somewhere other than your location. Also, they take so long to throw the thing that you should be pinging them on their wind up.

Most of the combat in TR plays out with you behind cover, waiting for an enemy to provide their dome for bow practice. As such, entering and exiting cover is merely a formality, compared to other games like Vanquish or Gears of War.
 

Dahbomb

Member
People saying the game was easy on hard are smoking crack, trolling, or playing with keyboard/mouse. I beat all 3 Uncharteds on Crushing so im pretty sure im not terrible, and this game was not easy on Hard. The AI could have been a little smarter, but there were definitely encounters i had to try 10+ times and wasnt sure if i was going to be able to beat at all without turning down the difficulty
The part about the K and M is probably true, game feels tuned for console analog aiming so being able to aim fast and precise makes combat easier than it should be.

I am definitely with you, I did noy find the game THAT easy where you coukd beat it in under 3 deaths first time on hard. AI is easy but you can easily get 3-4 shotted.. It also varies in difficulty if you got the upgrades. A fully upgraded bow and AR is broke in the game but the pistols and shotgun are more tuned to the combat. So yea.. mileage varies on the difficulty a bit.
 

Papercuts

fired zero bullets in the orphanage.
Those things take a good three seconds to explode. They conveniently come with their own blinking red indicator so you can't possibly miss it, and half the time the AI throws them somewhere other than your location. Also, they take so long to throw the thing that you should be pinging them on their wind up.

Most of the combat in TR plays out with you behind cover, waiting for an enemy to provide their dome for bow practice. As such, entering and exiting cover is merely a formality, compared to other games like Vanquish or Gears of War.

That is dynamite, molotovs are instant and linger around the cover. You can shoot it out of the air/make them drop it, though, but they have been very aggressive with pelting stuff at me making TR a very fast paced combat game.
 

antitrop

Member
It's a very specific type of enemy that throws the molotov, right? The big orangey guy or whatever?

Standard grunts throw dynamite?
 

Replicant

Member
Those things take a good three seconds to explode. They conveniently come with their own blinking red indicator so you can't possibly miss it, and half the time the AI throws them somewhere other than your location.

The bombs are blinking and you have 3 seconds to decide if it's better to stay in the cover and take the bomb OR get out of the cover and get flanked by the guy with submachine gun. BUT the molotov cocktails are instaneous and it creates ring of fire around you.

Most of the combat in TR plays out with you behind cover, waiting for an enemy to provide their dome for bow practice. As such, entering and exiting cover is merely a formality, compared to other games like Vanquish or Gears of War.

Again, not true. There's only one instance when that happens (the gondola tower because the way they get into your area expose them to your attack). This is not the case in Shanty town, where they have exact throwing precision and you are at disadvantage since you're on the lower level than the guys who throw them. This is not the case inside the temple where the enemies basically pouring from all directions and you CAN NOT stay in one cover AT ALL. You'd be dead in seconds if you do.

I'd say that I prefer Vanquish cover system because I know what I get into but it's not true that you can just stay in cover longer than 2 seconds in TR.
 

Dahbomb

Member
Yea anyone saying they beat the game by staying in cover all day were either playing on Easy/Normal or got the fully upgraded AR very early in the game. I call BS on that big time.
 

antitrop

Member
Yea anyone saying they beat the game by staying in cover all day were either playing on Easy/Normal or got the fully upgraded AR very early in the game. I call BS on that big time.
This game is all about moving. Lara's agility is her greatest asset. Other than an upgraded assault rifle, I suppose.
 
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