:/
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Tomb Raider |OT| Lara's Misfortune
- Thread starter Fracas
- Start date
Ok, so played another solid chunk today. Really enjoying it. Some of the scale and art in these monetary areas is gorgeous, as is the use of wind. It's weird, because as much as I find the tombs far far too few and far between, there is a crap load to collect throughout the game. Maybe too much, though I do enjoy collecting and upgrading all my stuff. The upgrades do feel largely unnecessary though, as the game thus far has been far too easy on Medium.
Obviously there are many similarities to Uncharted, however there are differences too. To me Tomb Raider is a bit more open in certain areas, and perhaps a bit more comprehensive when it comes to things to do in any given area. Having said that, the actual linear bits are far behind Uncharted. They just don't seem as polished or well thought out. There's a slight janky rushed'ness to some of the on the rails linear bits, that by contrast often seem more fluid and expertly visualised in the Uncharted franchise.
Overall Uncharted does characters, polish, linear segments, set piece scripted segments, narrative deployment, visuals, elements of combat and animations better, sometimes much better. But Tomb Raider does gameplay variety, less linear segments, scale and overall length slightly better. At both of the games peaks, Tomb Raider can't touch Uncharted, but as an entire package, in many ways Tomb Raider is very much as enjoyable, just not as profound or quite as well polished. Uncharted's best moments really do leave a lasting impression, whereas Tomb Raider's sort of temporarily linger. I'd say Tomb Raider was the jack of all trades, master of none, whereas Uncharted is more focused in what it tries to achieve, and does specific things better than any other franchise.
Obviously there are many similarities to Uncharted, however there are differences too. To me Tomb Raider is a bit more open in certain areas, and perhaps a bit more comprehensive when it comes to things to do in any given area. Having said that, the actual linear bits are far behind Uncharted. They just don't seem as polished or well thought out. There's a slight janky rushed'ness to some of the on the rails linear bits, that by contrast often seem more fluid and expertly visualised in the Uncharted franchise.
Overall Uncharted does characters, polish, linear segments, set piece scripted segments, narrative deployment, visuals, elements of combat and animations better, sometimes much better. But Tomb Raider does gameplay variety, less linear segments, scale and overall length slightly better. At both of the games peaks, Tomb Raider can't touch Uncharted, but as an entire package, in many ways Tomb Raider is very much as enjoyable, just not as profound or quite as well polished. Uncharted's best moments really do leave a lasting impression, whereas Tomb Raider's sort of temporarily linger. I'd say Tomb Raider was the jack of all trades, master of none, whereas Uncharted is more focused in what it tries to achieve, and does specific things better than any other franchise.
Yeah, I still like to think of 28 as young.
Already did, son.
That's pretty sad. What was their reason, or was it always meant to be a one-off kind of game?
I think the real problem is in an ideal world we wouldn't even be comparing this to Uncharted because they'd be rather uncomparable. Tomb Raider continuing to be a platformer/adventure focused series and Uncharted about action and setpieces. Sure there was always someone comparing the two series, but their gameplay focuses were so different that you'd just ignore those people.
I think the issue was that most people ignored Tomb Raider in general. The reboot looks to have fixed that pretty well, and really modernized a lot of stuff - namely the combat, as well as the art and tone of the series.
I think it's clearly a labor of love, and you can tell because of all the attention to detail they put into this game. They were clearly excited about it and wanted to try something different. I'd rather the developers do what they want, instead of being chained to making the same kind of game for decades.
I'm sure they'll try hard to top themselves in the inevitable sequel, and I look forward to that. I'd rather they just work on something new. All the old Tomb Raider games still exist for people who want to play them. They even did an HD re-release of some of them didn't they?
Finished it last night on normal with 100% completion. Loved every minute of it, especially having gone in with pretty moderate expectations.
Will definitely be in my top ten for the year unless there is an unexpected onslaught in the back half of the year or something.
I also didn't feel like there was too much combat. Maybe that was because I did a lot of exploring in each level. Definitely not as shooting heavy as Uncharted and definitely nowhere near a CoD.
The traversal/platforming was great and felt like it required more skill than Uncharted or Assassin's Creed (neither of which require much).
I really liked the atmosphere, level design, RPG elements and the combat.
I also didn't find the difference between what you are doing and the way the character acts in cutscenes to be as jarring as Far Cry 3 or Uncharted.
Can't wait for a sequel.
Will definitely be in my top ten for the year unless there is an unexpected onslaught in the back half of the year or something.
I also didn't feel like there was too much combat. Maybe that was because I did a lot of exploring in each level. Definitely not as shooting heavy as Uncharted and definitely nowhere near a CoD.
The traversal/platforming was great and felt like it required more skill than Uncharted or Assassin's Creed (neither of which require much).
I really liked the atmosphere, level design, RPG elements and the combat.
I also didn't find the difference between what you are doing and the way the character acts in cutscenes to be as jarring as Far Cry 3 or Uncharted.
Can't wait for a sequel.
I still feel they could have achieved most of what they did in this reboot (new start for Lara, better presentation, one location, better combat, gear-gating) to get people excited again without losing what made the series so unique and special (challenging platforming and puzzles). Modernizing elements of the series doesn't mean it has to completely change its focus I don't think. Nor does it mean they have to simplify the platforming and puzzles so much.
revolverjgw
Member
It often feels like they're temporarily lingering even while they're happening. Every setpiece just seems to go on a BIT too long and too far. It almost makes Uncharted feel conservative and controlled by comparison. Never thought I'd say something like that.
Might have something to do with the tone coloring my perception of the action. It's awfully grimdark and it gets a bit exhausting watching Lara destroy and get destroyed... the color, joking around and feeling of pulpy derring-do just isn't there to offset the carnage. And I really have no interest in revisiting Lara or anybody else in this game. Looking forward to playing the sequel for the action, but not for the characters or fiction.
Very good game though. I wish it was harder, but I love how agile you are in combat, and this game does fun things using verticality. I love not being glued to the ground in UC and this, leaping around, sticking and moving, mixing up melee and shootbang. Although I missed not being able to hang and shoot.
God I've been so busy I haven't had a chance to play much.
This game is so good. I love looking at every nook and cranny in these levels. I'm about 25% through right now.
Also someone at Crystal Dynamics must read my GAF posts:
What I just played is almost exactly like that. It's freaky.
This game is so good. I love looking at every nook and cranny in these levels. I'm about 25% through right now.
Also someone at Crystal Dynamics must read my GAF posts:
What I just played is almost exactly like that. It's freaky.
Yeah got the DS DLC myself. Wondering does anyone know if there will be any new story DLC for Tomb Raider? Would love to jump back in the world. I'd even take a zombie island DLC ala Red Dead
The problem is that they were so in love with their work that they couldn't trust the player to experience it without heavily guiding them, taking away all skill requirements for traversal, and neutering and optionalizing puzzles. They didn't really make something new, they just added a bunch of extraneous elements from other popular games, reduced the quality of traversal and puzzles, and shifted the gameplay focus in favor of combat (improved for the franchise, but still not great) to the point of exhaustion. It's not like they had to use the IP if they wanted to make something not like the IP.
Have I not been catching up on the latest comparisons? Opinions (and comparisons to Uncharted) vary but instead of hate, I'd say some feel basically meth about it.
I loved it. I just hope the sequel finds a way to weave more raiding of kick-ass tombs. In regards to capturing the mystique of underground caverns, Uncharted wins this round.
I loved it. I just hope the sequel finds a way to weave more raiding of kick-ass tombs. In regards to capturing the mystique of underground caverns, Uncharted wins this round.
crisdecuba
Member
Sure, I'll clarify. I was responding mainly to this statement, which is vague in itself and did not include justification for the criticisms:
To that non-fleshed-out statement I responded with my own simple statement. The point of it was that, on balance, the game does enough things well that it does not deserve the level of negativity (i.e. hate) that some are leveling at it (for example, the poster I quoted above). For a decent summary of what the game does well, please see this post: http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=49761819&postcount=8556 or this post: http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=49724658&postcount=8471
Is that a decent enough elaboration? In all seriousness, though, what I should have done was quote the comment that primarily fueled the response.
Phonomezer
Banned
Actually had a blast with the MP this afternoon, a lot of fun when you're playing with people who know what they're doing (meanwhile, I certainly didn't).
Started this yesterday. It's been a long time since this happened, but I couldn't put the game down. It flows really well from the start, and before I knew it, it was 2 AM. Played one long session until
I want to double back and explore previous areas for goodies, but I can't bring myself to it because I'm swept up in the campaign. It feels like Uncharted with more room for exploring and going off the main path. Can't wait to dive into this again.
I escaped from the room with the giant bell, after avoiding the giant guardian thing.
crisdecuba
Member
I disagree with what you say re the professional game reviews. most reviews do notice the problems that are being mentioned here, but those problems do not impact their enjoyment of the game to the extent it seems to have impacted you and some others here. Personally I really enjoyed the game from start to finish, even though I did notice some of the issues being pointed out, it's simply that those issues did not detract enough to make the game, on balance, a bad game.
if anything, this game has me looking forward to the inevitable sequel. And it is clear that the game creators put a lot of effort into this game. This was not a situation in which they were simply trying to get a product out the door.
toastyToast
Member
Amirox brought something interesting with the no fail cinematic moments. The problem with then is a lack of agency. In and of themselves, they're pretty fantastical but the sheen disappears when you realize it might as well be a cutscene. How about making those everything-crumbles ledge navigating segments an actual challenge. Some ledges collapsing as soon as any weight is applied or something like a fatigue system where Lara could scale cliff faces with just her axe (maybe some climbing boots too) but overexerting herself could lead to her falling. So there's an incentive for finding an optimal existing path (that isn't immediately known, maybe randomize it) at the same time you could go commando and pray to God you find a spot to rest. I'd appreciate that and it'd be Lara's self motivation would be warranted.
Doing the shit that Lara should be fucking terrifying and it's a shame that it isn't communicate that in a substantial way.
Doing the shit that Lara should be fucking terrifying and it's a shame that it isn't communicate that in a substantial way.
ubersticky
Member
So sick of playing multiplayer trying to get to level 60. God of War here I come.
TGO
Hype Train conductor. Works harder than it steams.
Damn that reminds me I still want my Jackie Chans Armour Of God game
lol, I agree
Lots of nice comments in here.
I'll add mine :
whether good or not, I'm stuck into the game like a penis into a new pussy.
Can't tell if it's a one-off thing and I'll say bad things afterwards, but damn...I can't stop playing...Woke-up with swollen eyes and I dared not check the time when I went to bed.
Game will be finished tonight after two sittings.
Usually it's one sitting for a game I fell in love with, so I'll give credit to the devs for putting out a relatively lengthy SP.
I'll add mine :
whether good or not, I'm stuck into the game like a penis into a new pussy.
Can't tell if it's a one-off thing and I'll say bad things afterwards, but damn...I can't stop playing...Woke-up with swollen eyes and I dared not check the time when I went to bed.
Game will be finished tonight after two sittings.
Usually it's one sitting for a game I fell in love with, so I'll give credit to the devs for putting out a relatively lengthy SP.
just play through the game and explore the island afterwards.
D
Deleted member 30609
Unconfirmed Member
These bricks I have lying over here make terrible wheels. Therefore, I don't see their point.
bucknuticus
Member
Rented this game from redbox on sunday and have been really really enjoying it. I really havent gotten into a game in the past year, couldnt even tell you the last game i played to completion.
I can see the uncharted comparisons, but the way I described the game to my buddy is its more like the Batman Arkham Asylum, where you have these little mini open worlds you can run around and explore. I think im nearly through the game, just reached a beach not too long ago.
I can see the uncharted comparisons, but the way I described the game to my buddy is its more like the Batman Arkham Asylum, where you have these little mini open worlds you can run around and explore. I think im nearly through the game, just reached a beach not too long ago.
Haven't even touched multiplayer yet. Would you say it's fun enough to just dabble into or is it too restricted for people not interested in the level grind?
Dance Inferno
Unconfirmed Member
It's fun to dabble in. I've played a game or two every night for the past few days and it's just mindless fun. It's pretty simplistic insofar as the lack of extensive loadouts and attachments, the aiming is a little fidgety, and matches are only 4v4, but it has a janky charm.
Tricky I Shadow
Banned
Eh, it's pretty much just the same small group of people being extra vocal about not liking it with Amir0x leading the charge. Most love the game.
And in a lot of ways Tomb Raider >>> Uncharted.
ubersticky
Member
Yeah, it's definitely fun just to dabble in. If you've ever played a third person shooter game you'd get into it fast. It's very simple.
But it can get very frustrating with some players who are great with the bow. Lots of 1 kill hits with bow and shotguns. Can't see myself playing it in the long run though, it needs alot of work... balancing, tweaks, smoother animations... trying to shoot at someone who rolls is impossible. They really should've had a beta.
Dance Inferno
Unconfirmed Member
Yeah if you're getting shot at just jump and roll around a lot. It's impossible to get hit that way lol.
I love the game, but don't make me slap you now.
I love the game, but don't make me slap you now.
batman2million
Member
Just finished it and I am impressed. This was a fun game and I would love to see it more. I didn't think the story was up to snuff and Lara was interesting enough for me to care.
Yeah from what I read here it's about 75% that dont mind the hands looking like a 80 years old and 15% that hate the game with 1% that hates the hands... 
Seriously,it's too bad that besides Sam and Roth that are kinda cool,all the rest of the supporting cast are pretty weak...if they add a cast like Uncharted for example or a chemistry like Skies of Arcadia let's say,the game would be a masterpiece ...seriously,I love it.
Seriously,it's too bad that besides Sam and Roth that are kinda cool,all the rest of the supporting cast are pretty weak...if they add a cast like Uncharted for example or a chemistry like Skies of Arcadia let's say,the game would be a masterpiece
...seriously,I love it.Lots of people think Tomb Raider bests Uncharted in lots of areas. Better exploration/traversal, weapon upgrading, even the moment-to-moment gunplay.
I personally say Uncharted 2 > Tomb Raider = Uncharted 3 > Uncharted 1.
BruceLeeRoy
Banned
Exploration definitely and ummmmm yeah thats it.
Which is okay TR is its own thing as is Uncharted I just hope the gap widens between them with the next game.
Tricky I Shadow
Banned
Tomb Raider has better combat, much better atmosphere, better controls (dat automatic cover system!), better platforming (allowing Lara to move direction when jumping is fantastic as is her sense of weight), better level design, better sound design, pacing right up there with Uncharted 2 and is much better at letting you explore with more open areas. It feels more 'gamey' if that makes any sense. And to be perfectly honest....the graphics at certain points impress me just as much as Uncharted 3 did. The art style goes a long way in Tomb Raider and is GOD TIER! And all of that is coming from a massive Uncharted fan.
ubersticky
Member
Lord, I was playing in some game with randoms who were around 30-40 in rank... all they did was jump, shoot, jump, shoot... the only kills I got in that game were from traps and grenades I think, maybe one or two kills with the rifle. I'm kinda crap at aiming but I've won alot of FFA games but that match just showed how easy it was not to get killed by just jumping around... so I've started doing it whenever I'm close to dying and I survive most of the time.
BruceLeeRoy
Banned
I 100% agree on the platforming aspects and overall level design. There are two areas in TR that are remarkable in that regard but the pacing for me is really bad when looking at the game as a whole. I love the beginning areas and especially Mountain Village but Shantytown and Fortress are so bad that it almost soured me so I took a long break from the game. Thankfully the game picks back up with the best area in the game - The Beach. Overall its too up and down for me to say the pacing is better. Combat is really fun but not as satisfying as UC is for me but thats because I love the challenge that UC gives. Graphics are to inconsistent for every windy temple you have other areas that just don't hold up as well. I will say though that the graphical highs are very high. Obviously just my op.
I will say this. When ND show the next Uncharted game and CD show the next TR I will be excited about both for completely different reasons.
I love it when Lara changes her pose when enemies are around and the use of cover, as if she's actually trying to be careful.
Was wondering since I'm at 80% mark with the game... If I fast travel back to the earlier areas, will they respawn some mooks for some real combat?
BruceLeeRoy
Banned
Yeah it does and its the best part of the game.
toastyToast
Member
No more than a handful of goons, if any.