RJMacready73
Simps for Amouranth
Can guys just simply not be dicks to women for like 5mins ffs
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Top Director at Bungie Was Fired After Misconduct Investigation - Bloomberg
- Thread starter adamsapple
- Start date
Sethbacca
Member
What does this have to do with the topic ? Is this the new vegan meme where if you haven't told someone something's woke or DEI every 5 minutes your balls will implode or something?
Shifty1897
Member
Maybe if he worried more about getting his games out on time and less about nutting in the company ink, Bungie would be in a better place.
Tiago Rodrigues
Member
I feel like i lost most of my brain cells reading this.Jason on why he didn't just publish the texts.
That guy has to be playing dumb. Schreier is totally right here. Sharing the texts would mean the guy would know who he sent those to. Those women would NOT feel safe. What's so hard to understand?
Hudo
Member
They're doing the actual work.
AJUMP23
Parody of actual AJUMP23
Barrett called lower-level female employees attractive, Probably not a friable thing, but definitely not smart to do. Not in the current environment. I just tell all the men that work for me their mother thinks they are wonderful
asked them to play truth-or-dare - You can get Fired for this. This will end your career quickly
and made references to his wealth and power within the studio, - If you imply Tat for tit then it will not go well.
asked them to play truth-or-dare - You can get Fired for this. This will end your career quickly
and made references to his wealth and power within the studio, - If you imply Tat for tit then it will not go well.
Sethbacca
Member
Probably about as many more examples as will be made of dudes who can't keep their dick in their pants. Eventually you guys may get the message about how to act in a professional environment?
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
Yeah, that guy just comes off as someone just trying to pick an argument for no reason.
near
Gold Member
Jason Shmuck.Jason on why he didn't just publish the texts.
Hudo
Member
I mean, Jason is always there when there's drama to use for clicks and promotions (for his badly written books). Dude has no interest in actually trying to better the industry. He was salty as fuck when the whole shit about Blizzard came to light without him. Schreier is as bad as the motherfuckers harassing women.
near
Gold Member
I wouldn't go that far. But yeah, he's moral compass is all over the place and somehow always plays the moral high ground.
soulbait
Member
A director on a movie is very much a different role than a director within a corporation. Also, movies are usually a single contract: you are co-workers during the duration of the production of the movie, which has a set time, and then just people afterwards (until the next project). Working in a corporation your relationship will always be director -> lower role, until someone leaves the company and it is no longer an issue. The power dynamics between a director and actor is different than the power dynamics within a corporation.
Yes dating takes place in the corporate world, but it should always be with someone on the same level as you and even better if they are in a different department to minimize conflicts of interest and power dynamics.
Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
And worse? Seriously?
Don't you think sensitivity training and making a public apology to each person affected would not be more appropriate?
Sorry, but when people advocate for punishments disproportionate to the offences in question I really have to wonder about their moral compass.
Proportionality is the keystone of justice.
TheThreadsThatBindUs
Member
African immigrants in the diaspora are far less likely to commit acts like this in the workplace for obvious reasons.
African men in positions of power in African companies based in Africa, however... yeah, they be harassing and raping women with impunity out there like it's the wild west.
I don't think it's racist to point out that radical leftist activists like Justin Schrier willfully overlook stories about minorities that perform acts of criminality in favour of reporting those that involve straight white males.
In fact, the entirety of left-leaning media in the US and Europe is guilty of this. It's just a fact.
A game studio is very different from a corporation, being a creative enterprise, and a game director in a game studio is absolutely more akin to a movie director, then a senior director of finance in a bank for example.
Slimy is absolutely right.
simpatico
Gold Member
He’s not releasing the texts because they’re weak as shit and likely exonerating. No way a higher up at Bungie was not all-in on the woke culture, so I hope he gets the full force of the cancellation. See what you’ve done? Get a Bible, a gym pass and a freezer full of steaks. Come back when you grow some balls and make better games Bungie man.Jason on why he didn't just publish the texts.
simpatico
Gold Member
Do what? I see no allegations of physicality. No touching, groping or anything. Did your mother teach you the phrase: “sticks and stones can break my bones but words can never hurt me”?
12345666
Banned
Creating a hostile work environment makes employees unhappy. Unhappy employees tend to perform worse at their job and depending how widespread the issues are, it could be a small deal of a very big deal that costs the company money in lost productivity.
So its probably more feasible to axe the person causing all the issues than it would be to build a time machine and send a team back, and have them visit all the employees parents to ensure they are "raised right" so later in life they are willing to put up with all the hostility.
RJMacready73
Simps for Amouranth
I for one spent many a year with a large breasted colleague who would always lean over my desk separator pushing her boobs out chatting to me, blouse straining and I never once felt the need to complain to HR
Shifty1897
Member
You'd complain if your boss was an overweight 50 year old man leaning over your desk just enough that his dick was resting on your mousepad and texting you after hours to get drinks and come over.
simpatico
Gold Member
Sounds like they axed the talent though. They’re paying this guy a hell of salary. Really worth losing him over some interns and admin people?
12345666
Banned
There isn't enough info to speak concrete about this so everything I say is just assumptions.
In my experience people who treat some people badly will generally treat a lot of people badly. It's unlikely the hostile work environment he created began and ended with interns and admin folks. And given the state of the company right now you could draw a loose conclusion that maybe they were just looking for an excuse to get rid of him and this is what they found.
But anyway, fuck that guy. He is a grown ass man and if he can't act like one, then being sent to a farm upstate is probably best for all parties involved.
simpatico
Gold Member
Until we see texts or concrete evidence I wouldn’t call him any names. We’ve seen countless instances like this where it’s all BS. What informs your “fuck this guy” statement”?
Games of Today
Member
Probably the retard that told Naughty Dog that Factions 2 sucked.
simpatico
Gold Member
Just weird to people make sure bold statement with literally zero evidence. I guess it speaks to why we’re even in this situation. Bloodthirsty mobs doing bloodthirsty mob things.I believe I already covered this. And I'm sure he will be OK if12345666 on NeoGAF thinks he sucks.
12345666
Banned
He was fired in March after Bungie investigated the numerous allegations against him. You are right, we don't have the texts or any concrete evidence, and you can call me crazy here but Bungie letting him go and Jason Schreier's reporting is good enough for me and probably a lot of other people. I don't think discussing the issue and having a different opinion than you is "bloodthirsty mobs doing bloodthirsty mob things".
StreetsofBeige
Gold Member
Unless someone is really confident and knows any flirting wont lead to stupidity, it's always risky to try dating or marrying coworkers. Dont get me wrong it happens. I know people who met and married and their work and home life are fine. So it all worked out with no drama. But then I've also seen crazy shit like one person dropping their coworker spouse for another coworker right in their face! And all 3 people worked together for a year on other sides of the floor! Crazy shit.
CuckooBananaNuts
Banned
Yeah. But people are perpetually stupid, so here we are.
20% of relationships in the US still begin at work, last I saw the stats. It’s human nature. But it’s also more risky for men than it’s ever been, especially men in leadership positions. Everyone is looking for an opportunity to cancel someone to further their own career. And it is happening constantly.
Smart professionals in the post-#metoo era don’t hold closed-door one-on-one meetings, don’t flirt, don’t pursue relationships at work, and maintain absolute boundaries.
TheThreadsThatBindUs
Member
There's lot of shit that happens in the workplace that is far more egregious and far worse in terms of creating a hostile work environment that absolutely would if reported result in all of fuck all happening. e.g. senior staff refusing to acknowledge a mistake and instead shifting the blame to a subordinate, managers conspiring to get someone fired for no other reason than they don't like them, small close-knit cliques acting as gatekeepers to certain promotions creating a glass ceiling for everyone else, incompetent project managers blaming their resources for failing to meet project deadlines after having done all of fuck all planning etc etc etc..
You and I encounter this shit every day and there is no recourse to report someone and get them fired for it. This shit is way way more toxic than a single senior developer asking a woman to play truth or dare.
If your threshold for bearing with toxic work culture is so low, then honestly maybe you shouldn't be working in corporate environments in the private sector. Maybe you should have considered being a kindergarten teacher or a dinner lady?
Private sector work in for profit organisations are environments that select for somewhat narcissistic, highly disagreeable, even somewhat Machiavellian type personalities in leadership. If you can't learn how to navigate these personalities in the workplace you will not succeed in your career.
No good intentions, laws or corporate policy can ultimately control individual worker's behaviours. They can only help to limit the impact at the extremes where those actions have already taken place. Unlike with laws and their impact on the broader society, in the corporate world, laws and policies are not the deterrent you think they are; and this guy in the OP is clear evidence of that.
Maybe you should have?
You engage in company mandated knitting classes (when you should be working on the game) and then tell me you can resist harassing your work colleagues? That shit be like fishing bait.
The corporate work environment is one that rewards and promotes highly disagreeable, risk-takers. These are not the kind of people to maintain the kinds of self-moderation on their own behaviour as you laid out in this post.
It's not a justification. Rather a simple reality of why we see and will continue to see sleazy people in power doing shit like this.
Last edited:
Chuck Berry
Gold Member
Probably all of the above.
I'm sure he never said "Y'all" either
Nothing more cringey than hearing that coming out of a white persons mouth on purpose who isnt from the south.
12345666
Banned
I was in the Army for 8 years, combat veteran, multiple trips overseas. This sort of thing doesn't work on me but I'll pat you on the back for your effort.
It's not really a contest of what matters the most, in that just because there are worse things out there it doesn't mean the bad things under that threshold are somehow not important. If the allegations are true then axing him was the right call, full stop.
The system never works as designed but that's far from a reason to not do anything about it.
Companies have rules and in many cases these employees has singed employment contracts, so if they break rules and enough people take issues with it, its run up the proper channels and they are fired... well, thems the fucking breaks I guess.
finalflame
Member
I agree with everything you're saying but you're wasting your breath on the chuds. There are unfortunately retards on both sides. The reason I prefer to be amongst the ones here, honestly, is that we can call them retarded and just move on, lol.
Last edited:
12345666
Banned
Honestly, I'm just disappointed in myself for even posting ITT and then giving some of these dorks the time of day. You can't fix stupid and tbh its not really my job.
I agree with everything you're saying but you're wasting your breath on the chuds. There are unfortunately retards on both sides. The reason I prefer to be amongst the ones here, honestly, is that we can call them retarded and just move on, lol.
Sethbacca
Member
I dunno dude, wanting to work in a room full of sweaty dudes sounds a bit gay to me. You sure you’re not trying to push DEI here?Bring back (mostly) all dude dev teams.
If there are one or two women on the team they're married or otherwise off the market.
TheThreadsThatBindUs
Member
You're entirely missing my point. I'm not saying don't have rules. That's a silly strawman. I'm arguing that no rules you ever create will provide you the ability to universally control human behaviour in the workplace. This incident is a prime example of that, i.e. a rich successful guy with a smoking hot wife who seemingly wasn't content enough that he still willfully skirted the rules in a post-MeeToo world.
My argument is that given the above fact, you have to consider how to set the rules. Instead of setting them in such broad terms as to give the opportunity to create far too many false-positive cases, some level of resilience should be required on the part of women in the workplace and the rules set to exclusively punish the most obviously egregious behavior. Anything else is coddling women and not setting then up for success in a workplace choc full of toxic behaviour that is far more hostile and far less punished by corporate codes of conduct and polices.
You act as if sexual harassment is the only example of bad corporate behavior that results in a hostile working environment. It's not and it's not even close to being the worst. And the worst toxic corporate behaviour is completely unregulated and unpoliced by HR policy. Everybody just has to learn how to navigate it.
Last edited:
simpatico
Gold Member
If you're a Sony shareholder and they just paid what they did for Bungie, you should be upset today. You lost a game director today. On a long enough timeline, the only people who are going to be employed by corporate America are going to be the HR broads. If anyone can find out what job titles these girls had, I'm really curious. Fully expecting entry level disposable things.
TheThreadsThatBindUs
Member
Sony lost a game director who was borderline sexually harassing his colleagues. I'm pretty sure Sony is not upset at them letting him go... and not least because the game, Destiny 2, has been going down the shitter for past 2yrs. So clearly this dude wasn't the best at his job.
simpatico
Gold Member
Jason not releasing those texts tells me there is nothing in them. We just saw this with Avellone. If there are texts with him being an overt, literal sex pest I won't defend him. I'm guessing this was the most innocent shit and they interpret it as "assault".
Last edited:
12345666
Banned
I'm not missing your point -- I just don't agree with you, there is a differnece.
Rules are not always about controlling people. It's about setting a standard that people must adhere to in order to fit in. Those who cannot fit in will be removed. Which is what happened here.
I disagree. The rule is you don't sexually harass your co-workers. If you do sexually harass them (or harass in general) and they complain, or if enough people complain, you're out.
You may not have noticed but this thread is about a guy who allegedly sexually harassed his co-workers, so if you're wondering why that is what this thread is about, well there you go... lmao.
I don't know. Sounds to me like you just want to make excuses and move goal posts. The world is changing and no matter how hard you kick and scream and dig your heals in, it won't make a difference.
Thank you for your time here but I don't think we have anything further to discuss.
Last edited:
near
Gold Member
He was replaced as Marathon's director in June 2023 by another competent director that worked on Valorant. Nothing to be upset about here.
Last edited:
simpatico
Gold Member
It's more the point. We've seen this movie before where "we're not going to the police" combined with "we have evidence, but we're not going to show it to anybody". It ends the same way almost every time when it involves a high profile person.
Peroroncino
Member
I guess they need some brownie points with the games media considering their recent headlines
petey probably wants to take some heat of his ass
petey probably wants to take some heat of his ass
Last edited:
near
Gold Member
Here is where I stand with this. Telling a coworker to fuck off or calling a female coworker cute can be considered misconduct. The extent of Chris Barrett's misconduct is up for debate, but it remains a fact that he was dismissed for misconduct, and that is a fair decision for any company to make. He wasn't cancelled, he was fired by he's employer without public discourse encouraging it. The only problem I have with this is Jason Schmucks article, we didn't need to know about he's firing. He wasn't fired for sexual harassment, which is an entirely different thing.
TLDR:
Fuck Jason Schmuck
Sethbacca
Member
I have to assume at this point that you're not in the U.S. or have never worked in a professional environment because you keep making this about reportable crime somehow? You don't have to do something illegal to be fired for creating a hostile work environment. There doesn't need to be a reportable crime for any of this because that's literally not how any of this works. In almost any job in the country you're going to get training on what constitutes sexual harassment on day one, and then annually after that. The shit that you should or should not be doing is crystal clear for anyone whose brain has more control of their body than their dick does.
Last edited:
TheThreadsThatBindUs
Member
Fine but you're also missing the nuance which is why your opinions on the issue are largely grossly oversimplified.
What rule was broken here? The behaviour described by Schrier's article is not and should not be enough to qualify as harassment, sexual or otherwise. There is an allegation of more egregious text messages, which none of us have seen because Schrier refuses to release them.
As such, there is nowhere near enough information for us to conclude that actual sexual harassment was committed here.
What you're missing is, how does said company define sexual harassment? To pretend this is some trivial issue that is resolved because there is some infallible universal definition of sexual harassment, is absurd and incredibly naive.
I've worked in companies that would define it in very strict terms that address only the most obviously egregious behaviour. But I've also worked in companies who define it such broad terms that smiling at your female colleague for too long would get you disciplined; because it's defined by how it makes the victim in question feel and not by some objective standard. If you don't see the issue with definitions like the latter then I can't help you.
Again you strawman my arguments and misrepresent them because you don't have a good counterargument. The best you can come up with is, "there are rules. rules must be followed". Your inability to comprehend the nuance of the topic and situation in the OP is why you're struggling in this thread.
Yeah, I'm happy to leave you to your ignorance.