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Torchlight II |OT| Good things come to those who wait
- Thread starter jim-jam bongs
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opticalmace
Member
Where is this from?
I love the skill system in PoE. If I want to for example roll a melee class that specialises in wands and magic damage, I can do that. Its the most flexible system I've seen in any of these games. Other stuff like art direction, crafting, the way potions are used - and the fact that its free - really strike a chord with me. It's also got a very old school feel to it. There's a jankiness about PoE that I actually find really appealing. Its not polished to an incredibly high finish the way a game like Diablo 3 is, but I feel that has allowed the game to develop a real sense of character. Though I can definitely understand how most people will just be put off by that.
I've probably said it before, but PoE, D3, TL2, BL2, Grim Dawn soon - all the same subgenre of games more or less, but all offering quite distinct experiences. I love the fact that there's so much choice now.
Path of Exile has a very interesting leveling system, a lot of great loot (though it's far more scarce than in Torchlight 2), and the best online infrastructure in place for this type of game (IMO).
As a Witch Doctor...the combat in D3 really isn't that fun. Melee combat seems like it's a lot better. Ranged combat is broken at a fundamental level because enemies can hit you with melee attacks even if you run half a screen length away from them before the attack connects.
Booter
Member
scytheavatar
Member
Most people will agree that the Embermage starts off the weakest class in the game and it takes a while for the class to get going, so you need a lot of patience for that class. IMHO as far as ranged units goes the Embermage is clearly outclassed by the Outlander, which is in turn outclassed by the very broken Engineer. But that is probably the main attraction for the Embermage since you really need to put in some effort and there's no brain dead tactics for you.
thetrin
Hail, peons, for I have come as ambassador from the great and bountiful Blueberry Butt Explosion
A completely fair criticism. I played every class but WD to 60, and enjoyed all of them, but I will agree that melee is fundamentally better balanced (though the Wizard is fucking awesome).
I don't know why, but finding a multiplayer game in PoE was like pulling teeth. I could never find someone who was actually LFG that wasn't afk all the time.
I enjoy TL2's multiplayer quite a bit more (because I can actually play it), but my issue there is the same with Borderlands 2. People seem to rush from objective to objective, taking no time to check loot, allocate stats, and generally chill out a bit. I didn't have that problem in D3, but that's probably because the loot was crap, so there was no point in stopping anyway.
If only we had a game with both. Oh, right, we do.
It's because of self-sabotaging decisions like these that Diablo 2 is likely to remain in the highest regard for years to come. While I really like Diablo 2, it would be nice to see someone give the complete package a run for its money.
Anoregon
The flight plan I just filed with the agency list me, my men, Dr. Pavel here. But only one of you!
UncleSporky
Member
One thing I do miss from Diablo 2 are the skill trees, requiring 1 point investments along the way to unlock later skills. I would've loved this as I wouldn't have felt bad trying out all the skills along the way toward a later goal (in my case the outlander's Shadowling Brute).
I understand why people wouldn't want this, but I don't feel like it'd be a problem. Most skills scale very well with even 1 point invested, so they'd mostly be useful, unlike in Diablo 2 (Necromancer's Teeth, yeesh). And with 133 skill points, it's not like those 1 point prereqs would kill your build. Heck they could've planned for it and given us 10 extra fame ranks or something.
I just find it hard to experiment, even with the 3 point respec available. I would honestly rather be forced to experiment, and be able to assume that others have a wide variety of abilities at their disposal as well.
I understand why people wouldn't want this, but I don't feel like it'd be a problem. Most skills scale very well with even 1 point invested, so they'd mostly be useful, unlike in Diablo 2 (Necromancer's Teeth, yeesh). And with 133 skill points, it's not like those 1 point prereqs would kill your build. Heck they could've planned for it and given us 10 extra fame ranks or something.
I just find it hard to experiment, even with the 3 point respec available. I would honestly rather be forced to experiment, and be able to assume that others have a wide variety of abilities at their disposal as well.
Done Act 1 and Act 2 for most classes on Elite. Frost Embermage, Prismatic Bolt Embermage, 2H Engineer, Poison Outlander, and Tundra Berserker.
As for most viable class, I dunno. PB Embermage with sub Frost spec is pretty ridiculous damage output and with good CC options so I'd honestly say that may be one of the better options; pure Frost could work but the low levels isn't the most pleasant thing ever, though it probably has the better late game. Glaive Throw Outlander has great range and clearing ability as well so that's worth a thought.
Not sure how they'll scale into NG+ territory, however, as they're both almost exclusively Level and Focus scaling builds so not sure how no WeaponDPS scaling will really function for them late game.
UncleSporky
Member
Joseph Flemming
Member
Wtf?!
Hahaha!!!
MasterShotgun
brazen editing lynx
Wtf?!
That's about -305 HP per second. If you survive that, you deserve a medal.
Dead Prince
Banned
that includes using HP pots?
cutmeamango
Banned
I'm stocking potions to survive the Sweet-Aide.
Don't know if I'll use it though
My berserker (elite) is the least close to a berserker possible.
More of a "sit and watch pet and minion, attack when it looks safe" kind of guy.
Don't know if I'll use it though
against Cacklespit since I'm underleveled yet.
My berserker (elite) is the least close to a berserker possible.
More of a "sit and watch pet and minion, attack when it looks safe" kind of guy.
There's a good chance my Tundra Berserker ends up DWing Wands.
MasterShotgun
brazen editing lynx
*smacks forehead*
I forgot about about that. That would require up to 100 potions though. It would be a huge waste of money.
Well that's done
What a fight !The boss dropped a Bow and an outlander pair of gloves .... but the quest reward had a niiiiice chest piece that is from an engineer tank set !
Took a peak at the maps, some silly things in there !
Awesome game !
Now ... new game +, or new char ..... xD
You can pick whichever difficulty you want, no unlocking. Although AFAIK, you need to host your game online/LAN to have access to difficulty changes.
Off-hand, there's up to New Game ++++. Elite's relatively rough though nothing too bad for a first run but that's probably just me. Veteran is probably the more "balanced" Normal mode difficulty; hard enough to not be an AFKfest but not enough to be frustrating.
Just to clarify, it's four difficulty modes (Casual, Normal, Veteran, and Elite) and then the four New Game Plus runs. So think more of a combination of Diablo's Normal/Nightmare/Hell/Inferno and traditional difficulty modes.
Edit: Worth noting that NG++++ is Level 120 enemies, 20 above the player level cap. I'm kind of curious at what Elite NG++++ would be like.
MasterShotgun
brazen editing lynx
All difficulties are unlocked from the start. The game is not set up in a way that's meant for you to start low and work your way up the difficulties. First off, you're locked to the difficulty you choose at the beginning. (But you can play a LAN game and change the difficulty to get around that.) So the challenge all depends on the difficulty you go for. Seeing as you want a challenge, I'd say start with Veteran or Elite. Elite was fucking brutal for me, but others have found it great.
You can do a NG+ every time you play the game. Each time, the levels of enemies go up. I'm only on my first NG+, and I'm almost always at or near the suggested levels of the area I'm in. From what I've read, it goes all the way up to NG++++, where enemies are Level 120. The player level cap is 100, so that could be an additional challenge to look forward to. If you beat that, you can play it again, but the enemies won't get any tougher.
There's also an area called the Mapworks that unlocks when you beat the final boss for the first time. You can always access it from a town in any future NG+. The Mapworks has a merchant who sells you maps to randomized dungeons. They'll have a specified level range and varying conditions. So if you just want to dive into a dungeon at any time, it's the place to go.
Oh thanks, I think I understand. So if I beat it on Veteran, I can start Veteran+? Wouldn't that be the same as Elite?
MasterShotgun
brazen editing lynx
It's still Veteran. You and the enemies are just at a higher level. Elite is a whole different beast.
They're separate things entirely. There's four difficulty options and then four New Game Plus modes, each New Game Plus being harder than the one before it. NG+ Veteran is not the same thing as Elite mode, it's merely NG+ on the Veteran difficulty.
The difficulty options are your normal difficulty option sort of things (enemies have more HP, hit harder, have higher armor, etc.) and then NG+ (up to NG++++) all have higher level enemies. Think of the New Game Plus options as Diablo's Normal/Nightmare/Hell/Inferno climb.
Edit: And while you do choose a difficulty (Casual/Normal/Veteran/Elite) at the start of the game, this can be changed for online or LAN play. Single player, however, will stick to whatever difficulty you first selected, though you can always play a solo LAN game if you want to tone the difficulty down.
NG and NG+ are comparable to Diablo 2's normal and nightmare; they adjust the balance by increasing the level of the monster, along with the appropriate stats. Monsters will have several times the health and damage that they do on previous levels; as a result, these difficulties are unlocked and played one at a time.
The difficulty selection you make at the beginning of the game is like the /players function in Diablo 2: it increases the health of the monster but not the level. Unlike /players, however, it also increases their damage and does not increase the reward for killing them. The difficulty selection exists ONLY to make the game more or less challenging. As a result, unlike the huge differences made by NG+, changing the setting from normal to elite will likely only double the health total.
The difficulty selection you make at the beginning of the game is like the /players function in Diablo 2: it increases the health of the monster but not the level. Unlike /players, however, it also increases their damage and does not increase the reward for killing them. The difficulty selection exists ONLY to make the game more or less challenging. As a result, unlike the huge differences made by NG+, changing the setting from normal to elite will likely only double the health total.
MasterShotgun
brazen editing lynx
Based on what I've read on Runic's forums, here's roughly how the levels go.
NG: 1-50
NG+: 51-80
NG++: 81-100
NG+++: 101-120
NG++++: 120
Damage Reduction% will just grow in value as damage skyrockets vs Armor gains. I wonder how useful end game Force Field will be vs Elite NG++++ damage output...
MasterShotgun
brazen editing lynx
It's up to this so far, with another 41 levels to keep scaling (and not yet maxed out).
Huh, wth. Which level is your engineer? Mine is 58 and my Forcefield Lvl 12 is absorbing 3500 damage.
robotzombie
Member
at 5 charge levels?
Lvl 59. I get 3712 with no charges and rank 11.
It must be scaling with something other than level as well.
MasterShotgun
brazen editing lynx
It's up to this so far, with another 41 levels to keep scaling (and not yet maxed out).
Hmm... I guess the only way to find out is to test it.
I'm glad the Embermage has a couple of % damage prevention spells. Immolation Aura at max will prevent 15% of all damage and lasts for 58 seconds with a shorter cooldown. Elemental Boon at max will prevent 36% of all elemental damage, but it lasts for 15 seconds with a shorter cooldown. I'd imagine both of those are required for high level play.
Ah, didnt realize he meant that this was at full charge level.
Yeah, if a max level forcefield could not withstand the hits, I have no clue how the other squishy classes could survive at all.
That is the only way to use it
I run in and build charge and pop it once my health gets really low. The healbot will top me off and I can get back to 5 charge before it goes down.