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Transgaf: 'cause boys will be girls (and vice versa)
- Thread starter lexi
- Start date
Fox the Sly
Member
Instigator said:
From what I've gathered the producers of the show contact trans-women online (usually) and offer them ~$300, two-way flight, and hotel lodgings to do the show. The boyfriends are hired too.
Kinda sad, but some girls feel they have few options to fund their expensive transition and have to hustle. :'(
Jamie xxoo
Member
tehAinsley said:
SQUEE! CUUUUUUTE!
Jin34 said:Stealth boasting detected
lexi said:
Oh I didn't mean it like that at all :lol
I meant I'm not a finished product. Facial feminization surgery in 2 months, 5 days! Woot! I'll grow my hair out more, I also intend to lose a little bit of weight and muscle mass, and I'm pretty sure my breasts will get bigger than this with time and hormones. Lots to look forward to. In 6 months I hope to look back on these pics and cringe. =) My transition's underway but there's a lot ahead of me, as there is for all of us.
Jamie xxoo
Member
You're pretty NOW, silly girl!
tehAinsley said:
See, I'm the kind of person that would then get like a bunch of glitterly unicorn stickers or something, slap them all over the bed, and then be sure to ask my mother when she came over how she liked my personalizing of the bedroom set. *laughs*
Jamie xxoo said:
Obviously I completely support the decision of everybody who transitions to do it their own way, and would never argue otherwise, but I don't know that the "treat someone's transition like a spectacle or magic trick" part is totally fair.
My love for seeing before and after shots is pretty obvious: it helps me better understand what may be in store for me. For non-trans folk, though, I think it helps them better come to terms with the whole process, and, in fact, my help avoid a feeling of it being a "magic trick". If a person not familiar with the whole process can see visual proof of the changes a person goes through via hormones, transitioning becomes more scientific and "real" instead of "I used to be X, now I'm Y" and having to imagine how all of that happens.
Again, don't misunderstand, I'm not saying that your opinion is wrong in any way: just saying how I feel, at least as of this moment. I completely and totally understand the desire to leave that part of your life behind, because who you were isn't who you are, and looking back at yourself (or letting other see you like that) can be really hard, especially if it clouds someone's view on who you are now. For me, though, maybe I'm still young and naive about all of this: I think the more information on all of this we give people, the better, because it helps get more understand out there.
Of course, should I get to the point that you're at, I wouldn't be surprised for my mind to change: my goal isn't to be "that woman who used to be a guy," but "that woman," so the less connection to my old self that I give people, the better perhaps.
And quickly on what Android was saying about photos, I can't imagine not keeping mine. Will they remind me of who I used to be, and that might be hard? Sure. But even with all of the burden I've had to carry, I've also had some truly wonderful times in my life, and getting rid of those memories is something I could never do.
Edit: Facial feminization surgery? WAT.
Fox the Sly
Member
shidoshi said:
DISCLAIMER: This isn't aimed at Jamie or her getting FFS (especially since it's pretty standard for trans-women), it just reminded of something I wanted to touch on.
I completely respect the fact that you all have certain visions of how you ultimately see yourselves physically, but please be careful with the amount of surgeries you get in the future. I've seen girls ruin their look because they went too far and I wouldn't want that to happen to any of you. <3
The facial surgery sounds like a 5'4 girl with C cups getting breast implants, totally unnecessary. Judging from her pic I just don't see what the problem is, she looks really cute. Maybe Jaime is very photogenic and we aren't seeing what she sees, why don't you post more pics Jaime, show us what you don't like so we can wrap our head around why you want surgery.
I bet she still looks great and it's just a silly insecurity
shidoshi said:
LOL! I hadn't thought of that. Excellent idea. I guess the reason it bugs me so bad is that she's known I'm trans for over 10 years now. All I get from her are mixed messages anymore. One moment she tells me she'll love me and support me whatever I do in that regard, the next she pulls lines like that.
Gah.
Fox the Sly said:
It's a really delicate topic. I'm in no position to tell Jamie what she does or doesn't need, and I can't begin to think I can make a judgement call about that question based on a few facts. Still, though... when I look at her, I never once think I'm looking at somebody who needs FFS to get to where they need to be (in my opinion of where that is).
But indeed; surgery of any kind can be very dangerous, and just look at all of the natural-born women who have really messed themselves up in the quest for "perfection". For us, it isn't just a desire for "beauty" - it is a quest to be accepted as who we want to be, and for that reason, I can't fault somebody for wanting surgery. At the same time, I think we, more than a lot of others, need to be extra careful because of that, and because of the self-doubt that is inside of us all.
Robobandit
Member
Jamie is very pretty as she is.
I've seen plenty of genetic women that look manly compared to Jamie
I know that none of us could ever see Jamie the way she sees herself, though.. and if she's not happy with where she is, that's her decision.
I've seen plenty of genetic women that look manly compared to Jamie
I know that none of us could ever see Jamie the way she sees herself, though.. and if she's not happy with where she is, that's her decision.
Jin34 said:
I see what you did there. :lol :lol
I think Jamie is hot with a capital OMG. I believe the term is "Fiiiiiiiine."
I also agree with Fox on the surgeries for TGs: keep them to a minimum. As I've said before, there are certain things that can make your appearance what one would consider traditionally male or female, but there's a lot that crosses over. There are plenty of genuine girls with strong chins, long noses, smaller eyes, broad shoulders, etc, and that doesn't change how many people like them. Sometimes you simply don't need a surgery, because you're comparing yourself with something you see on TV. Sometimes things just are what they are.
As an aside, did anyone get a chance to watch that bit that was on CNN the other night? I don't have cable, and I was at work, so I didn't get to check it out. Any opinions?
Jamie xxoo
Member
Just popped in to see where the thread was at.
I just can't post old photos of myself Shidoshi. I'm glad you respect my feelings about that, even if you disagree with the reasons for them. It would hurt me more than it would help anyone else.
With regards to cosmetic surgery, it's a very persistent feeling in me that I've been disfigured by testosterone, and I want to remove the scars that it's left on me. Scars that other people skim over, but which hit me like a brick every time I see myself, and make me afraid of being stuck behind a mask for the rest of my life. I'm just going to let the results speak for themselves after I've had the operation. And it's ONE, cosmetic operation. There are no more planned after that. I'm not a surgery junkie. =) I hope my transition will involve exactly 2 surgeries, and this is the first. The other one is to fix plumbing. I'm not out to look like a celebrity or a different person or a younger version of myself, I just want a few things adjusted by a matter of a millimeter here and there so I feel feminine even at my worst. It sounds pointless but it will make all the difference in the world to how I see myself. It's not for other people. I've been over it with a therapist after this huge wall of negativity about having FFS came crashing down on me online when I once mentioned it on YouTube, and my reasons and desires have been pronounced reasonable and sound. My parents support me in doing this too. I don't seem to be able to make a convincing case to everyone though, and I've just learned over time that some people just don't get it and think I'm crazy, and that that's allowed to happen.
@Jin34 Breast enlargement when you already have large breasts is all about vanity. This surgery is about me getting rid of the visual reminder of what I've had to live with all my life, which hits me like a mallet every time I see my own image. Totally different motivations. And I'm not going to post photos that highlight the features I hate! :lol That's like showing you a picture of a wart to see if you approve whether or not it should be removed! Ew. That was too visual. now I'm thinking about warts.
@tehAinsley Instead of griping about what your mom did to you, go set her straight! "Mom, you said that bedroom set didn't look girly like that was appropriate for me. I LIKE girly things. I'm trans, remember? That means I think and feel like a woman. You know that, right? Or did you forget?" Just be upfront and tell it like it is, don't be a victim and brew in silence or she'll *never* "get" it!
I couldn't watch that show you're all talking about (it didn't air over here), but it sounds like it was just a big bunch of negativity that I don't need, so I'm kinda glad I missed out!
I just can't post old photos of myself Shidoshi. I'm glad you respect my feelings about that, even if you disagree with the reasons for them. It would hurt me more than it would help anyone else.
With regards to cosmetic surgery, it's a very persistent feeling in me that I've been disfigured by testosterone, and I want to remove the scars that it's left on me. Scars that other people skim over, but which hit me like a brick every time I see myself, and make me afraid of being stuck behind a mask for the rest of my life. I'm just going to let the results speak for themselves after I've had the operation. And it's ONE, cosmetic operation. There are no more planned after that. I'm not a surgery junkie. =) I hope my transition will involve exactly 2 surgeries, and this is the first. The other one is to fix plumbing. I'm not out to look like a celebrity or a different person or a younger version of myself, I just want a few things adjusted by a matter of a millimeter here and there so I feel feminine even at my worst. It sounds pointless but it will make all the difference in the world to how I see myself. It's not for other people. I've been over it with a therapist after this huge wall of negativity about having FFS came crashing down on me online when I once mentioned it on YouTube, and my reasons and desires have been pronounced reasonable and sound. My parents support me in doing this too. I don't seem to be able to make a convincing case to everyone though, and I've just learned over time that some people just don't get it and think I'm crazy, and that that's allowed to happen.
@Jin34 Breast enlargement when you already have large breasts is all about vanity. This surgery is about me getting rid of the visual reminder of what I've had to live with all my life, which hits me like a mallet every time I see my own image. Totally different motivations. And I'm not going to post photos that highlight the features I hate! :lol That's like showing you a picture of a wart to see if you approve whether or not it should be removed! Ew. That was too visual. now I'm thinking about warts.
@tehAinsley Instead of griping about what your mom did to you, go set her straight! "Mom, you said that bedroom set didn't look girly like that was appropriate for me. I LIKE girly things. I'm trans, remember? That means I think and feel like a woman. You know that, right? Or did you forget?" Just be upfront and tell it like it is, don't be a victim and brew in silence or she'll *never* "get" it!
I couldn't watch that show you're all talking about (it didn't air over here), but it sounds like it was just a big bunch of negativity that I don't need, so I'm kinda glad I missed out!
Jamie xxoo said:
Actually, I think you mis-understood what I was disagreeing with you on. My comment was that I think non-trans people wanting to see before and after pics is more innocent that it seems like you were saying. Sure, I think some of them do want to see the progress of somebody's transition less out of honest curiosity and more for the possible "sideshow" aspect of it all, but I truly don't think that's the norm.
My concern - and this isn't directed at you, but the trans community at large from what I've experienced of it so far - is that I've ran into a number of trans folk that, now that they've transitioned (or gone a decent way through the process) seem to get annoyed or insulted when people who aren't trans want to know more about what they went through. I completely get the fact that a lot of people don't want to think about their past anymore, and don't want to keep living under the shadow of being labelled as part of a group, but I think care needs to be taken in dealing with those who don't understand. Personally, I'd rather dredge up something in my past that is unpleasant than have somebody who genuinely wants to understand what I've gone through continue to not understand me (and via that, others like me).
So, my comment had absolutely nothing to do with me disagreeing with your reasoning or desire to show old photos of yourself; I don't question that decision at all. My feeling was more that your comment, "and the natural inclination to treat someone's transition like a spectacle or a magic trick", isn't totally fair to the non-trans folk in my opinion, because I think most people want to see such things (such as old photos) so that they can have a better understanding of what transitioning really means, what it can (or can't) do, and other such things. Things they want to know for educational reasons, not entertainment ones.
Jamie xxoo said:
Totally understand your position here. I have exactly the same feelings about being "disfigured" by testosterone. Even though there are some aspects of my face I love. Like pretty much everything from the nose up. But T did a real number on the chin and lips. And I fully intend to get that fixed at some point.
Jamie xxoo said:
I really wish I was that quick on my feet when speaking to people, my Mother especially. I think I just have some extreme fear of depressing her though. She was in and out of mental wards when I was growing up for depression. Sometimes for only a couple days, sometimes as long as 6 or more months. She always been extremely emotionally fragile.
And I know that's no excuse for her insensitivity to my issues, or my bottling up my feelings every time she manages to hurt them, but I thought it may just give some insight as to why she and I do those things. Though you're very right, I really need to learn to become more self-assured and assertive. I'm far too passive. I just worry if I'll be able to in a situation where she's around as often as she is.
Since Jamie mentioned "employment discrimination", I'd be curious to hear how everyone else feels about it. Should transsexuals at any stage of transition be eligible for any and all jobs? There's a lot of customer service-related positions out there, and it seems like most TSes go through the "guy in a dress" phase which frankly tends to give normal people a creepy, uncomfortable sensation of the uncanny. Even if their look is off-putting to a majority of regular people, should everyone be receiving a fair shot at a job? Or is it fair to say that those in a customer-relations position need to be passable or better in terms of both looks and voice?
In some ways it seems kind of callous to ask, but it's not as if plenty of other people aren't similarly discriminated against due to clothing, hairstyle, tattooes, or other appearance issues. Of course hair and tattooes aren't as intrinsically linked to one's essence as gender, but there's a prevailing notion that if you want to deal with customers (or subordinates if you are in a management position) then you have to be somewhat within the norms.
In some ways it seems kind of callous to ask, but it's not as if plenty of other people aren't similarly discriminated against due to clothing, hairstyle, tattooes, or other appearance issues. Of course hair and tattooes aren't as intrinsically linked to one's essence as gender, but there's a prevailing notion that if you want to deal with customers (or subordinates if you are in a management position) then you have to be somewhat within the norms.
I can sorta understand where those who choose not to post or even keep pictures of their old selves come from.
I avoid pictures whenever possible. I don't let teachers, friends, or family take pictures of me unless it'd really mean something to them. I used to trash order forms for school pictures and yearbooks when I got them. I want as few images of me to exist as possible. I knew that my mom wanted the yearbook/school pictures for memories in the future, but I just didn't want them around. At all.
Once I came out to her I told her the truth as to why I "never got" the order forms for yearbooks or school pictures for the past few years. I told her I'd start giving them to her and it'd be fine for her to buy them as long as she keeps the pictures and yearbooks for personal memories, never showing them to me or anyone except my dad in the future.
I'm still my "old self" though
I avoid pictures whenever possible. I don't let teachers, friends, or family take pictures of me unless it'd really mean something to them. I used to trash order forms for school pictures and yearbooks when I got them. I want as few images of me to exist as possible. I knew that my mom wanted the yearbook/school pictures for memories in the future, but I just didn't want them around. At all.
Once I came out to her I told her the truth as to why I "never got" the order forms for yearbooks or school pictures for the past few years. I told her I'd start giving them to her and it'd be fine for her to buy them as long as she keeps the pictures and yearbooks for personal memories, never showing them to me or anyone except my dad in the future.
Shidoshi basically laid out one of the reasons I wanted to see "before" and "after" photos, as well as videos, and why I would follow the progress of people who started vlogging at the very beginning, when they were even still telling family. The progression, through photographic evidence, made the process far more understandable than someone just explaining it to me via text.
As someone who is non-trans, and someone who started learning about all of this only about a year ago or so, there were sooooooo many misconceptions I had, that visual aids really did have to help me. You see, in my stupidity, I figured all TG male to female looked very masculine. The "man in a dress" that people think is all the rage. But when I heard about female feminization surgery, I had to look up pictures to see the results. It wasn't until I saw pictures from the TGs before (as a male) to the after (both before the surgery, when they were just on hormones, and weeks afterwards) that I started putting everything together. You could see how much hormones could do, and how much surgery had to do.
HRT was also a big misconception. I thought it only gave you breasts. Call me stupid, but I did. I didn't think it could change bone mass, muscle mass, etc. No one really considers that unless you see the beginning and the end.
But, Jamie, that doesn't mean you're wrong in your opinion. I don't see you as someone who is TG, but a woman. End of story. That's just the way it is. However, I didn't know the process, and I still wouldn't, if I didn't have visual aids. Those do help, and I think people more than anything want to use them to understand, and not point fingers and laugh. If anything, the average person knows so little about what can be done medically with the human body, that normal procedures are considered "magic." Something like transitioning... try explaining how hormones affect male and female bodies, or how and why the therapist comes into play, or even what FFS, and most people will just look at you cluelessly. In fact, I'm almost certain the first question you will be asked isn't about how to make yourself appear more feminine, but, instead, when you are getting SRS.
Those are my thoughts on that.
No, sir, you are very hetero. Jamie is very attractive to me, and I don't find men attractive. That is because Jamie is female, very feminine, and we like those aspects about her.
Unless we are talking about stores that already discriminate against people with, say, a missing limb, no. I'm sorry, but I've had plenty of these so called normal people approach me who were disgusting as is. Or natal women who were ugly but could help me buy something when I needed it.
As someone who is non-trans, and someone who started learning about all of this only about a year ago or so, there were sooooooo many misconceptions I had, that visual aids really did have to help me. You see, in my stupidity, I figured all TG male to female looked very masculine. The "man in a dress" that people think is all the rage. But when I heard about female feminization surgery, I had to look up pictures to see the results. It wasn't until I saw pictures from the TGs before (as a male) to the after (both before the surgery, when they were just on hormones, and weeks afterwards) that I started putting everything together. You could see how much hormones could do, and how much surgery had to do.
HRT was also a big misconception. I thought it only gave you breasts. Call me stupid, but I did. I didn't think it could change bone mass, muscle mass, etc. No one really considers that unless you see the beginning and the end.
But, Jamie, that doesn't mean you're wrong in your opinion. I don't see you as someone who is TG, but a woman. End of story. That's just the way it is. However, I didn't know the process, and I still wouldn't, if I didn't have visual aids. Those do help, and I think people more than anything want to use them to understand, and not point fingers and laugh. If anything, the average person knows so little about what can be done medically with the human body, that normal procedures are considered "magic." Something like transitioning... try explaining how hormones affect male and female bodies, or how and why the therapist comes into play, or even what FFS, and most people will just look at you cluelessly. In fact, I'm almost certain the first question you will be asked isn't about how to make yourself appear more feminine, but, instead, when you are getting SRS.
Those are my thoughts on that.
Cenobite said:
No, sir, you are very hetero. Jamie is very attractive to me, and I don't find men attractive. That is because Jamie is female, very feminine, and we like those aspects about her.
border said:
Unless we are talking about stores that already discriminate against people with, say, a missing limb, no. I'm sorry, but I've had plenty of these so called normal people approach me who were disgusting as is. Or natal women who were ugly but could help me buy something when I needed it.
NewGamePlus
Member
So much has happened since I last posted.
I'm not sure if you've addressed this, and you don't have to if you don't want to, but may I ask what's kept you from transitioning if you've been out for so long? I only ask because telling people was probably my number one roadblock.tehAinsley said:
I can completely understand the need for surgery. Until it's done, you're always going to see that shadow of your former self in the mirror. Of course that won't bother everyone, but I can't fault you for wanting the surgery.Jamie xxoo said:
That situation kind of sounds more like a societal problem to me. I do think that people in transition should be eligible for any job. I can understand the desire for companies to project certain images, but I usually disagree with their methods (as Alfarif pointed out, firing a girl for only having one arm, like really? really?). Though fortunately for them, our rights are only protected in thirteen states here in America. I don't know what the situation is like internationally.border said:
Tornado Condor
Member
I'm heterosexual and everything but i just came to this thread to say that i
would
Jamie xxoo said:
.
would
NewGamePlus
Member
Omg, why is this starting up again. Of course you are. Do you really think a gay guy would want Jamie?salva said:
NewGamePlus said:
It's a variety of reasons. In telling people I got a lot of mixed reactions. Which scared me back into the shadows, so to speak. Also, soon after I told my Mom had a breakdown. So once again I had to step up and keep a roof over out head. Which wasn't the first time. I'd dropped out of high school at 16 and gotten a job to pay the bills for that very reason before. And so my brother had a stable home to finish high school in. That was pretty much much the entire reason. That and until recently I just didn't have the money or courage to really go through with anything.
So yeah, in a nutshell, I've played parent for 10 years now while Mom got herself fixed. Which she isn't even really. Doesn't have her own home, or car. She drives a truck making 14k a year and refuses to look for another job.
Sorry all, I really hate bitching about my Mother, but... gawd. It's funny, when you're a kid you see your parents as the ultimate. Infallible. But you grow up and realize they're just a kid, same as you. And it's frustrating the hell out of me. :lol
Since I've been pimping This American Life a great deal so far, I might as well bring up this episode which is free to stream:
http://thislife.org/radio-archives/episode/220/Testosterone
The episode has several stories, but the most obviously pertinent one is about a guy who due to some disorder, his body stops producing testosterone. He begins to see the world in a very different light. He sees everything as beautiful, and his desire for things drops off completely. So it pretty obviously brings up the issue of whether you are who you are because of your perspective and experiences, or whether you're just the result of what chemicals your body does or does not produce. If you're on hormones is it bringing you closer to who you really feel you are, or is it just the result of a new chemical balance in your body?
The second story actually chronicles an FtM transsexual who undergoes a pretty massive series of testosterone injections. Despite best efforts he goes from being a total feminist to being a horndog who ogles women on the street. He also gains an interest in generally male-oriented fields like science and math.
It's kind of a little different since having only one arm has a very real measurable effect on your ability to do a job, whereas being a non-passable transsexual has a less measurable effect on customer perception.
http://thislife.org/radio-archives/episode/220/Testosterone
The episode has several stories, but the most obviously pertinent one is about a guy who due to some disorder, his body stops producing testosterone. He begins to see the world in a very different light. He sees everything as beautiful, and his desire for things drops off completely. So it pretty obviously brings up the issue of whether you are who you are because of your perspective and experiences, or whether you're just the result of what chemicals your body does or does not produce. If you're on hormones is it bringing you closer to who you really feel you are, or is it just the result of a new chemical balance in your body?
The second story actually chronicles an FtM transsexual who undergoes a pretty massive series of testosterone injections. Despite best efforts he goes from being a total feminist to being a horndog who ogles women on the street. He also gains an interest in generally male-oriented fields like science and math.
NewGamePlus said:
It's kind of a little different since having only one arm has a very real measurable effect on your ability to do a job, whereas being a non-passable transsexual has a less measurable effect on customer perception.
NewGamePlus
Member
That sounds really rough. I'm glad you have managed to seemingly come out of it so well. I'd be an utter wreck. I mean I'm no stranger at the psych ward as it is, and I've had, for all intents and purposes, a great life.tehAinsley said:
IIRC, in the incident being referred to it wasn't affecting her ability and was completely an appearance issue. Regardless, I find discriminating against people with disabilities to also be quite unjust. Unless a person has a severe mental handicap, I would think most companies could find something for them to do.border said:
Tornado Condor
Member
NewGamePlus said:
Probably not. she looks stunning
So this whole prefacing that you're not gay but you _______ is starting to reallllly PISS me off. Do you start every fucking sentence indicating you're straight? Is that how you introduce yourself? Do you think you're being nice and making us feel good when you say that?
You could just say 'you look great' whatever, but no, you have to say that you're not gay, first of all indicating that even after transition you still see us as men and secondly, we should feel privileged for the honor of your attraction.
You could just say 'you look great' whatever, but no, you have to say that you're not gay, first of all indicating that even after transition you still see us as men and secondly, we should feel privileged for the honor of your attraction.
NewGamePlus said:
It wasn't as rough as it sounds to live through simply because I was a young naive kid. I had no idea the consequences of my actions down the road. It's only now that I do, and while I don't regret it because I did what needed to be done. I can't help but be angry at my Mother for putting me into that position in the first place.
Tornado Condor
Member
crap, im sorry! I didnt mean to offend you guys.
EatChildren
Currently polling second in Australia's federal election (first in the Gold Coast), this feral may one day be your Bogan King.
Jamie's jawline is bullshit. Its like, the jawline I put on all my fem characters in videogames. Stop it. Its mine.
Jamie xxoo
Member
OK, this post looks huge, but it's just a string of little replies that I would have made today had I been on NEOGAF to respond to all the things I missed.
Wow, that's really encouraging for my future dating life. It's great to hear guys say that they wouldn't automatically run away when they're told.
Oh I didn't think it wasn't innocent. I think you probably took connotations from "spectacle" and "magic trick" that I didn't mean to communicate. I think the curiosity is human and reasonable, and I respect your views that showing such pictures can be educational.
Edit: I totally skimmed over "people who aren't trans" in your original message and wrote out the following in regards to trans people asking personal questions of other trans people:
Having read what you wrote PROPERLY (lol sorry, I only had 3 hours sleep last night), I've got nothing to say, really. You said it all.
Oh hon, I'm so sorry. That's difficult. No wonder you didn't say anything about the bed set. *hugs*
Well, I've worked in customer support with all sorts of people who can cause a certain section of the public to be uncomfortable. People with thick accents, disabled people, obese people, people with missing teeth, little people, effeminate men - should they all be weeded out from having customer service roles as well? Do we only let blond, blue-eyed, attractive, hetero, straight-acting white people between the heights of 5'8" and 6' have these jobs? As long as the transitioner is dressing appropriately for the workplace then there's no excuse for discrimination.
Is what I want to say. But recently my little brother bought a cafe in a small country town, and he wants me to go help him out for a few months. I don't want to, because all it takes is for one person in that town to notice or discover that I am trans, and then everyone will know, and it might stop people coming in to his business. Just the fact of me being trans could send him broke. So, it's complex, and I don't have the answers. If people would just stop being jerks, we'd all be fine.
LOL nice edit. Smooooooth :lol
Lexi, I totally get where you're coming from, but, c'mon, lets ease up on Salva. "I'm heterosexual and everything but" is his cute, clumsy guy-way of telling me I *must* be a woman because *he's* attracted to me, and since he's *only* attracted to women, I must be one too. That's just how some guys think. They ARE meaning to be nice. It's easy to get sensitive about these things, but... they're guys. "I would" is like the best compliment some know how to give. It's like, "Well done! You passed my standards!" It's innocent male egotism and it's one of the adorable and sometimes terminally frustrating things I love about men in general and wouldn't change for the world. A healthy male ego is hot. <3
Are you kidding me? I hate my jaw! God, a few people talked about my "wonderful" jaw line in the Post Pics thread and I totally thought they were tactfully saying "hey there Ms. man-jaw". Were those compliments? LOL I really am clueless about what other people see when they look at me.
Alfarif said:
Wow, that's really encouraging for my future dating life. It's great to hear guys say that they wouldn't automatically run away when they're told.
shidoshi said:
Oh I didn't think it wasn't innocent. I think you probably took connotations from "spectacle" and "magic trick" that I didn't mean to communicate. I think the curiosity is human and reasonable, and I respect your views that showing such pictures can be educational.
shidoshi said:
Edit: I totally skimmed over "people who aren't trans" in your original message and wrote out the following in regards to trans people asking personal questions of other trans people:
Jamie xxoo said:
Having read what you wrote PROPERLY (lol sorry, I only had 3 hours sleep last night), I've got nothing to say, really. You said it all.
tehAinsley said:
Oh hon, I'm so sorry. That's difficult. No wonder you didn't say anything about the bed set. *hugs*
border said:
Well, I've worked in customer support with all sorts of people who can cause a certain section of the public to be uncomfortable. People with thick accents, disabled people, obese people, people with missing teeth, little people, effeminate men - should they all be weeded out from having customer service roles as well? Do we only let blond, blue-eyed, attractive, hetero, straight-acting white people between the heights of 5'8" and 6' have these jobs? As long as the transitioner is dressing appropriately for the workplace then there's no excuse for discrimination.
Is what I want to say. But recently my little brother bought a cafe in a small country town, and he wants me to go help him out for a few months. I don't want to, because all it takes is for one person in that town to notice or discover that I am trans, and then everyone will know, and it might stop people coming in to his business. Just the fact of me being trans could send him broke. So, it's complex, and I don't have the answers. If people would just stop being jerks, we'd all be fine.
CENOBITE said:
LOL nice edit. Smooooooth :lol
Salva said:
lexi said:
Lexi, I totally get where you're coming from, but, c'mon, lets ease up on Salva. "I'm heterosexual and everything but" is his cute, clumsy guy-way of telling me I *must* be a woman because *he's* attracted to me, and since he's *only* attracted to women, I must be one too. That's just how some guys think. They ARE meaning to be nice. It's easy to get sensitive about these things, but... they're guys. "I would" is like the best compliment some know how to give. It's like, "Well done! You passed my standards!" It's innocent male egotism and it's one of the adorable and sometimes terminally frustrating things I love about men in general and wouldn't change for the world. A healthy male ego is hot. <3
EatChildren said:
Are you kidding me? I hate my jaw! God, a few people talked about my "wonderful" jaw line in the Post Pics thread and I totally thought they were tactfully saying "hey there Ms. man-jaw". Were those compliments? LOL I really am clueless about what other people see when they look at me.
Android18a
Member
Jamie xxoo said:
Agree with everything you said until this. Your jawline is so perfect.
Fox the Sly
Member
Jamie xxoo said:
*guilty*
Although there was no ego involved on my part, just reassuring you that a randomguy#18909 digs you despite whatever flaws, real or perceived.
Jamie xxoo said:
Nah, most people on GAF wouldn't directly insult another member's pics (especially a female). They'd sooner say nothing at all. :lol
Jamie xxoo
Member
Has the furniture been delivered? If not, do you think you could straight-up tell your mom you really appreciate the gift, but that you don't like the style she chose, and ask if you can pick another one because after all, she's spending a lot of money on you? In some families I know that's like a slap in the face and you'd be expected to take the furniture and silently hate it for years - my parents would want me to say something if I didn't like it though. (But then, they wouldn't pick something out for me in the first place.)
Yeah unfortunately she's already paid for it and it was from a private party so she can't give it back. She did say if I didn't like it she could give it to my brother and his wife, or use it herself. But, she'd be really hurt either way.
I'm debating trying to talk to her about it, but... Gawd. I dunno. It may not even be worth the hassle.
I'm debating trying to talk to her about it, but... Gawd. I dunno. It may not even be worth the hassle.
Jamie xxoo
Member
Oh that's too bad. Well if it's any consolation there's nothing particularly girly about my furniture either. I actually quite like modern, clean and neutral furnishings, with some warm dark wood pieces. The only girly things in my place are some white tulips, some cherry blossom twigs, a zillion pillows on the bed and a teddy bear. Dave. Oh, and a woollen throw on the couch. Just because you're a girl doesn't mean you have to live in a sea of pastel florals and whimsical paintings of children wandering down country paths.
:lol :lol :lol :lolJamie xxoo said:
Oh beleive me, thats not what I'm after either! The furniture she got isn't ugly by any means. It's just very... Country Man. If that makes any sense. I'm very much into simple, clean, furniture. god I sound like I'm bitching about something I have no business bitching about. :lol
I mean, I do appreciate the fact that she bought me the furniture, because I will need it. It's just, I guess the "It's not girly at all! lawl!" bit got way too far under my skin. And also, my move is still a couple months off. I have no where to put things she's bought. So I don't have the slightest idea where we're going to put it when we pick it up tomorrow.
Also, it kinda burned me that she didn't even run it by me, or take a picture to show me before she plunked down that money. I mean, I just find it really... inconsiderate, I guess, and that annoys the hell out of me too. I mean, I know she's excited about me getting my own place, so am I... bah.. I dunno! So... annoying is the key word I guess.
EDIT: I mean,I love the phrase "I mean" apparently. I mean, I was gonna edit some of those out, but, I mean, its making giggly so I'll leave em! :lol
Skittleguy
Ring a Bell for me
Here's an interesting little piece about a person who decided to become completely, legally, androgynous:
Sex not specified: Australia leads the way with legal document
And a link to their blog:
http://www.may-welby.blogspot.com/
Fascinating read.
Sex not specified: Australia leads the way with legal document
And a link to their blog:
http://www.may-welby.blogspot.com/
Fascinating read.
EatChildren
Currently polling second in Australia's federal election (first in the Gold Coast), this feral may one day be your Bogan King.
Jamie xxoo said:
You have no idea how many guys love a jaw like that on a girl. There's nothing manly about it at all. Its sexy as hell.