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Truck plows into market in Berlin killing 12, injuring 48. Suspect shot dead in Italy
- Thread starter Ensirius
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They apprehended him because a witness reported him. Should they suddenly not do that?
And we don't know why the witness accused him, so lets just take a step back for a moment.
The Friendly Monster
Member
Yuck. Well I hope you do your part in the elections next year and vote for a party that will do more for people like your family.
Patrick S.
Banned
Thank you for the info. Still, that's a lot of money.
I completely understand your frustrations.
That's because refugees pretty much aren't allowed to even apply to for a jobs the first 15 months.
http://m.dw.com/en/when-refugees-want-to-work-in-germany/a-18737104
I'm sure they're glad a war in their home country sped up their bureaucracy.
But taking your, admittedly awful, train of thought for a moment, if letting in refugees is "protecting them from a thunderstorm" as it were, why should Germany let in your in-laws? No thunderstorm there, no?
Not even people, apparently. You're painting quite the picture of yourself.
Patrick S.
Banned
I vote CDU. I don't agree with refugee and migration policy, but overall CDU still have my trust.
Just no.
I see some people here are really enjoying indulging themselves in a far-right extremist fantasies. Thing is, the vast vast majority of attacks in Europe have been perpetuated by natives. Your closed borders wet dream won't put a dent in terrorism. If anything, it would just make it worse.
No, she didn't. And a lock on your house is completely useless, most of the attacks are coming from the people that were born inside the house.
I hope people understand how Merkel has destroyed her country.
You do have a lock on your house for a reason. You do want to control who is getting into your house.
Sad for all who died today.
No, she didn't. And a lock on your house is completely useless, most of the attacks are coming from the people that were born inside the house.
Sounds like "stay alive" money. German citizens get quite more than that in welfare.
You are creating this controversy from absolutely nothing but your own biases.
It's very easy to imagine that police would arrest the wrong person. This is a chaotic event and they have to follow any lead they can. I doubt they went around arresting brown people, as you are implying with your previous post.
uh.. but you are just one german. To the rest of germany they would obviously go into the same "who are those people to me"-pile you just put all of the syrian refugees in.
The main difference is that those refugees literally have no home to go back to. Now, personally i don't mind either staying but i find it baffling that you think that someone who doesn't want refugees from syria would think differently about your wifes parents.
The reality is they get less than social wellfare, incl no health insurance(except when they study).
And the money is the most basic minimum to live.
Patrick S.
Banned
Because they are my (wife's) family. The should be enough reason for them to come here. Plus, they have a pension plus health instance. The economical burden they put on the German society that says the are of no worth is zero. Family reunification is a thing, you know.
Ros8105
Member
But this isn't what happened, so I don't get your point.
Now you're plainly making stuff up. None of the recent big terror attacks were committed by natives. I think you might have a wrong definition of native and are including people with northafrican/middleeastern migration background
Again generalizations as if everyone who comes is a syrian war refugee. Look up the statistics.
ClosingADoor
Member
Good thing we have no indication that is what has happened here at the moment then.
He is right that most of those people have been born in Europe. Lack of integration and the radicalization people are then more vulnerable to are a real problem. That is the biggest worry with the refugees also, that in 10, 20, 30 years we will still be dealing with a lot of people who just don't function in European society, but instead live in a parallel society, as we see in France a lot also.
Disagreed. They are not dependent on you or your wife, and you are not dependent on them. Thus you relationship is not of much concern to the immigration process.
Patrick S.
Banned
You are basically saying that we either have to welcome everybody or nobody at all. It has never been that way.
d00d3n
Member
How does closed borders make terrorism worse? And do you honestly believe that EU voters can be convinced of that?
Asylum and immigration are two completely independent systems, who knew? Just because we're going through a large uptick in the former, doesn't mean the latter is relaxed.
It's unfortunate your wife can't be near her family, but I imagine it's simply because your in-laws can't afford to support themselves in Germany (unless they happen to be extremely wealthy Peruvians?). A Sol pension won't go far in Germany, and immigration can't take your word that you'll pay for them for life.
Example: Paris
so you're saying just because someone was born in France or Belgium that he isnt native to this country for some reason? How many generations do their ancestors have to lived there already? 3? 5? You should set this number low or many US Americans will run into some issues.
I know but he is purposefully using the word "natives" without differentiating between migration background to paint an incorrect picture.
Are you under the impression that people wasting away in refugee camps in Turkey, Lebanon and elsewhere are not recruitment targets for the extremists? Or are you simply of the delusion that you could put up a literal wall around Europe that terrorists could never ever cross?
You're obviously a native of the country you're born in. Claiming anything else is absurd.
No, i just don't get why you think that the people of germany would place more value on your wifes parents than they do anyone with refugee status. The refugees gets to stay because sending them home means death. That's literally the only reason they are let in.
If a people is born in a country, they are native to that country. That's how it works.
No it isn't, inform yourself before making these ignorant statements.
Except it isn't. In almost every survey and statistic whatsoever it is differentiated, from education to labour to PISA tests. You are purposefully trying to paint a picture of this being just regular everyday french people when the reality of paris (as it was mentioned above) was this:
A border does nothing if most of the terrorism is coming from inside from your own citizens. It also does next to nothing to stop organised terrorism.
Seems irrelevant. They are born in the country. They cannot be deported to anywhere.
QuicheFontaine
Member
Haha wtf? Some of the attacks came from inside so don't bother locking your door? That is some exceptional logic!
Refugee status is a thing too. And if they built a live during their time here, why should they be sent back.
It sucks for you and your in-law family that they can't stay, but it has nothing to do with the current refugee situation. They're not taking away your in-laws' spots.
ClosingADoor
Member
Depends, dual citizenship is a thing.
but refugees = brown ppl = terrorists, qed
Yeah, that's the big challenge coming up and I feel like it's not properly tackled yet.
d00d3n
Member
I am 100% convinced that effective measures will be implemented to keep immigrants out of Europe. A physical wall is not out of the question for some parts of the border, but the most effective measure will be the end of the right to seek asylum in the EU by physically showing up in a EU country. As I stated in my original reply, it sickens me that it has come to this. That being said, with effective border control in the EU, terrorist activity would probably decrease. It seems extremely far fetched to me to assume that stricter border control, the end of asylum rights and probably fascist monitoring of what immigrants do in EU countries, would result in more terrorism here. It may lead to more terrorism in other countries, though.
It is absolutely relevant when you are claiming it doesn't matter because many attacks are committed by people born in the country with migration background, because those are in many cases first or second generation children of migrants from exactly those regions. You're trying to throw smoke by painting a picture of "french people commit terror acts anyways" when that is only true in regards to those with migration background from exactly those regions.
And aside form that, there have now been multiple terror attacks by people who came as refugees through the balkan route. The notion of "well there are terrorists with migration background born here already, might as well just allow mass migration from those regions" takes some serious mental gymnastics to be logical.
GlamFM
Banned
I hope you understand that my country is fine.
It's only logical to lock your door in that situation if you start also profiling, registering and do surveillance on all your born citizens too.
Closing the borders isn't going to stop terrorism or make a dent on it.
God Dayumm
Banned
It is like those regressives in the U.S.A. that feign concern for Mexican immigrants but are against H1B visas. I don't completely agree with your opinion, but I understand it.
i think theres an "if" missing there
Many of them have double citizenship.
So how many generations of ancestors do you need to become a native person to the country that you were born in? If you hate those names because they sound muslim then thats your thing. Doesn't change the fact that they were (mostly?) natives. How many generations? During Nazi germany it were 3 generations - how many do you propose?
I don't know and frankly don't care, ask the government and statistics officials but don't try using this as smokescreen to deflect from the matter at hand.
You are really not contributing anything to this thread other than poisoning the discussion with continued strawmen to a point where you must be borderline trolling.
Liar! This is live footage
That terrorist attacks in the west were almost exclusively executed by people born/raised in the west?
QuicheFontaine
Member
I'm in the UK, and yeah that's essentially what we're doing now. Hey, at least it's equal opportunity ;-)
As regards the bolded, why are you always with the black and white statements like this? It could well keep some potential terrorists out altogether, even if it doesn't stop all of them or prevent "homegrown" terrorism.
Edit:
I agree, but these threads are always chock-a-block with such shitposts sadly.
it's not the first time this happened, won't be the last, everyone has a breaking point.
edit: also "deport all the refugees" is an hyperbolic strawman
ClosingADoor
Member
Please point to posts in this thread saying this.
People are saying we should have better checks and not let in as many people. Not deporting all refugees.
This is one of the reasons it is so hard to have a discussion about this topic. Anytime you voice concern for the immigration policies in a country, some people act like you are against all immigration and want everyone deported, when that is simply not the case.
There is neither a smokescreen nor is it an attemp to deflect anything. Your idea of "born in this country, grew up in this country, still not a native" is a racist borderline far right-extrem view. You can't post this kind of ideology and expect no counter questions. I guess you're already familiar with the nazi germany race laws - if not: they said 3 generations. I'm just asking for your number.
I love how Middle Eastern Germans are considered natives indistinguishable from Westerners when they commit atrocities and when hiding disproportionately high crime rates , but when it comes to asserting policies that address inclusion, diversity and income equality, they're specifically Middle Eastern Germans with specific target-issues in a greater Western society. Yes borders and immigration policy have *something* to do with what's going on there.
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