The_Mike
I cry about SonyGaf from my chair in Redmond, WA
With good reason. I tried that on all devices I had with oled, never again.
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TV's Vs Monitors, and Why TV's Make Much More Sense for Next Gen Consoles
With good reason. I tried that on all devices I had with oled, never again.
BluRayHiDef
Banned
This couldn't be any further from the truth. Yes, there are some TV manufacturers that are focusing on alternative technology, such as QD-OLED and QNED, which are being developed by Samsung Display. However, have you heard about Mini LED and Micro LED? Samsung Electronics (not to be confused with Samsung Display), LG, and TCL are heavily investing in this technology.
LG just released their first Micro LED TV.
________________________________
Samsung Electronics is so hell-bent on LED LCD technology, that they have rejected Samsung Display's aforementioned QD-OLED and QNED technology.
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BluRayHiDef
Banned
I'm assuming that you're talking about me. What don't I have a clue about?
Bo_Hazem
Banned
It hit the ceiling of improvement, theoretically. Doesn't mean they'll be discontinued soon, but for example there are 4,000 nit tv's like that expensive one from Sony, and it's still LCD. MicroLED (Crystal LED from Sony) should hit around 4,000-10,000 nits in the future, that's pretty far from OLED's reach.
But hey, scientists are there to find new solutions, we might get a surprise by an OLED tech that's reliable and can hit high peak brightness as well.
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BluRayHiDef
Banned
OLED will be succeeded by QD-OLED.
S0ULZB0URNE
Member
I can't f-with such a dim technology and burn in seals any chance of me ever using oled for more than a dark room non gaming tv.
Bo_Hazem
Banned
Let's all agree that each tech had its positives and negatives. You just pick the TV that meets your demands and deal with the negatives. Until CLED and MicroLED, there is no perfect tv. To me, OLED is an extreme gamble as I abuse my tv for endless hours non stop up to 2+ days in rare occasions! But still an impressive one.
Bolivar687
Banned
I'm glad to see a new TV enthusiast thread like this one, but I think the real point that has been demonstrated here is that the price delta between console and PC gaming is gone.
Ulysses 31
Member
?
Being a PC enthusiast will still cost a lot more.
An RTX 3080TI will cost more than XSX and PS5 combined. And good HDMI 2.1/DisplayPort 2.0 monitors will also cost a fair bit.
Bo_Hazem
Banned
You mean adding the price of the tv to pc? You know we don't plug our PC's to the wall and use our imagination to view
. Many are still in 1080p and this should serve like a great guide for them, you can comfortably stay with a 4K@60Hz HDR tv and be 90% satisfied I'm using my PC on the tv as well, but using netflix natively from the tv itself.
Bo_Hazem
Banned
?
Being a PC enthusiast will still cost a lot more.
An RTX 3080TI will cost more than XSX and PS5 combined. And good HDMI 2.1/DisplayPort 2.0 monitors will also cost a fair bit.
You can get X900H for $999 55" and PS5/XSX for a price of just 2080Ti card alone.
splattered
Member
So with 120fps coming to gaming consoles i'm assuming existing TVs with HDMI 2.0 that have 120Hz aren't going to be compatible with the 120fps mode?
I have the older TCL 55R615 TVs in my house, i looked up the specs and it says 3840x2160p 120Hz Clear Motion Index CMI.
I have the older TCL 55R615 TVs in my house, i looked up the specs and it says 3840x2160p 120Hz Clear Motion Index CMI.
Bo_Hazem
Banned
That's motion clarity refresh rate, I think Sony had something like 240Hz in older tv's and it should be much faster now, but that regards motion tech:
Motion interpolation - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
Some HDMI 2.0 TV's can run 1080p@120Hz. You don't need to upgrade if you already own a decent 4K@60Hz HDR though.
splattered
Member
That's motion clarity refresh rate, I think Sony had something like 240Hz in older tv's and it should be much faster now, but that regards motion tech:
.Motion interpolation - Wikipedia
Some HDMI 2.0 TV's can run 1080p@120Hz. You don't need to upgrade if you already own a decent 4K@60Hz HDR though.
Hmm how do i find out if it can do 1080p@120 then?
I would be totally fine with 1080p/120 and 4k/60 for now.
Bo_Hazem
Banned
Not sure, you either check rtings.com or reviews. Check that on rtings.com and couldn't find that exact model. I only know Hisense H9G having 1080p@120Hz mode and now Sony XH90 before the HDMI 2.1 firmware. Probably there are other tv's supporting that, but not sure if the consoles will do support that?
V2Tommy
Member
ceiling.
No display technology is maxed out yet, it’s just some are closer to perfect than others. Always room for improvement.
Bo_Hazem
Banned
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Ulysses 31
Member
I'm willing to bet 2020 OLEDs have 99% of the performance of 2021 OLEDs just like 2019 --> 2020. Mayor improvement will likely be cheaper price when inkjet printing production ramps up but that does nothing for the quality of the emitters.
Bolivar687
Banned
?
Being a PC enthusiast will still cost a lot more.
An RTX 3080TI will cost more than XSX and PS5 combined. And good HDMI 2.1/DisplayPort 2.0 monitors will also cost a fair bit.
Most PC gamers will not own a 3080Ti.
You mean adding the price of the tv to pc? You know we don't plug our PC's to the wall and use our imagination to view
Just looking at the proposition of having a 4K, HDR, 120Hz, low latency TV is easily going to put you in $1,500 territory. I watched the video you linked about budget gaming TVs and combined with a console you are still looking at a $1,200 proposition. That is the threshold where I tell someone who cares about gaming visuals to take full control over it and build their own PC. Yes, you are going to watch a lot more on that display than your console games but the same goes for your PC, especially with working from home in the current global situation and the productivity and comfort that cheap low latency monitors provide on that front.
This is subjective, but I have always sacrificed color and imaging for refresh rate and latency. My first high refresh monitor six years ago was somewhere from $200-250 and the 165Hz, 1440p, GSync Display I upgraded to was on sale for $364.83. Yes, I recognize that a quality build can be expensive before you add your monitor on top of that. Even then, it still seems to me that an affordable console with a quality TV will cost you about the same as a quality PC paired with an affordable 144/165Hz monitor. I know which side of that equation I would rather fall on. Also, the first PC you build is the starting point of your upgrade path, whereas a game console is only a final destination. As I wrote above, the price delta is gone.
I suppose what initially threw me off here is when you wrote that monitors having lower latency than TVs is totally false. You then posted a bunch of charts that clearly show a range of monitors at or under 5ms next to a lot of TVs where you hope to get to 10ms in gaming mode depending on your resolution. I just don't see any reason not to keep switching my HDMI cable to a monitor the moment I take my console games online.
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Rbk_3
Member
Your TV has a 60hz native refresh rate. The 120hz Clear Motion is marketing BS.
Bo_Hazem
Banned
Well, if you read again the title, it'll make more sense, as it's more of pairing consoles with tv's instead of monitors. TV's provide superior picture quality, and Sony just threw 7.2ms for 4K@120Hz, so 4K vs 4K it's near impossible now to find a monitor better than that. Samsung Q80T is doing a ridiculous 5.3ms for 1440p@120Hz if you go back to the chart, it's a bit confusing due to variable modes.
If you're a PC gamer you prefers shooters, then it's still better to have a monitor at 240-360Hz at lesser IQ for competitiveness. For consoles it doesn't make sense.
But the market is diverse, so everyone tailors his setup according to his taste and needs
Bo_Hazem
Banned
Yup, 6.6ms at 1440p@120Hz according to:
LG C9 OLED Review (OLED55C9PUA, OLED65C9PUA, OLED77C9PUA)
The LG C9 OLED is an excellent TV. Like all OLED TVs, it delivers outstanding dark room performance, thanks to the perfect inky blacks and perfect black uniformi...
www.rtings.com
But couldn't find the 4K@120Hz input lag, but here is CX
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Rossco EZ
Member
yeah really glad i went for the tv when i did so i’m ready for the next consoles, surprised that the CX shows 1440p @ 120hz at 7.3ms but the C9 shows 1440p @ 120hz at 6.6ms. also hoping they add support for freesync as i think it only supports g sync currently?Yup, 6.6ms at 1440p@120Hz according to:
LG C9 OLED Review (OLED55C9PUA, OLED65C9PUA, OLED77C9PUA)
The LG C9 OLED is an excellent TV. Like all OLED TVs, it delivers outstanding dark room performance, thanks to the perfect inky blacks and perfect black uniformi...
But couldn't find the 4K@120Hz input lag, but here is CX
Bo_Hazem
Banned
It has Freesync, but not sure if it'll support Freesync Premium like CX.
Rossco EZ
Member
oh i didn’t even know it did i thought that only got added to the CX. what’s the difference between premium and standard?
Bo_Hazem
Banned
I have no idea, personally, maybe PC-related benefits?
HeisenbergFX4
Member
Bo_Hazem
Banned
HeisenbergFX4
Member
Not sure honestly and wouldnt trade it with my Sony X900H though.
Bo_Hazem
Banned
As a sucker punch to my plans, a sweet one, a7s III is being released! That will make me scrap Xperia 1 ii, XH90, I think. I wanna buy as much lenses ASAP! So might get the X900H (XH90) in early-mid 2021 or the newer 2021 models from Sony.
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S0ULZB0URNE
Member
Bo_Hazem
Banned
vizio though
I was shocked that TCL with much, much more dimming zones yet it destroys details in favor of contrast. Color/image accuracy is something I won't trade for some fancy, extra blacks.
S0ULZB0URNE
Member
Futurematic
Member
Speaking of TCL they’ve offered more details on their team up with THX on a Game Mode for the upcoming 6 series, and said they’d be out summer sometime.
BluRayHiDef
Banned
HeisenbergFX4
Member
ASUS ROG announces world's first HDMI 2.1-certified 4K 120Hz gaming monitor - VideoCardz.com
ASUS Republic of Gamers (ROG) announced that its upcoming 43-inch gaming monitor is the first monitor to receive HDMI 2.1 certification, passing all compatibility and validation tests conducted by leading Allion Labs, Inc — an international company specializing in product testing. Unnamed ASUS...
videocardz.com
The new ROG monitor is compatible with next-generation consoles, with HDMI 2.1 giving it a full bandwidth of up to 48 Gbps to support 4K UHD (3840 x 2160) visuals at variable refresh rates of up to 120 Hz. Auto Low Latency also enables the game console to control the processing mode of the display, prioritizing low latency or processing quality depending on the content. Allion Labs subjected the monitor to stringent Fixed Rate Link (FRL) tests, including FRL Electrical, FRL Pixel Decoding and FRL Protocol tests, to ensure full compatibility with upcoming HDMI 2.1 devices.
With the impending arrival of next-generation gaming consoles later this year, ROG has an entire series of HDMI 2.1 gaming monitors for the holiday season. These monitors are available in 27-, 32- and 43-inch models.
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saintjules
Gold Member
3 top reasons to upgrade your TV (not 4k 120)
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Robot Carnival
Member
should I wait for something with HDMI 2.1 or 2.0 is fine? been looking around on monitors and TV and some friend was telling me to wait for 2.1
LokusAbriss
Member
Just pulled the trigger on a X900H (55 inch). Sony just lowered the general price, mediamarkt has a 150€ direct price reduction for sony tvs and the taxes are currently reduced.
I was set on a XG95 for better HDR and so on. The better smart tv experience, gaming features and the price sold me on the XH90 now.
I was set on a XG95 for better HDR and so on. The better smart tv experience, gaming features and the price sold me on the XH90 now.
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Rikkori
Member
If not on PC, there's less reason to wait. If you value picture quality more, there's also less reason to wait. Thing is, we need to know about 100 more things before we can give advice. Too bad we don't have a questionnaire template made.
Robot Carnival
Member
If not on PC, there's less reason to wait. If you value picture quality more, there's also less reason to wait. Thing is, we need to know about 100 more things before we can give advice. Too bad we don't have a questionnaire template made.
haha, thanks. like I said before in this thread, I'm mostly looking for a monitor since TV is a little hard to do. mostly it'll be for when I put a new desktop together, hopefully when GPU price had gone down and I can get something like a 2080 for a decent price. but since talking to you guys, I've been looking into some TV also. still not too sure if I can do it since my living room situation is a little... problematic. I'm still looking into it thou.
Mortimer Brewster
Member
Finally took the dive and decided to replace my 10 year old Sharp LED with a Sony Z8H.
BluRayHiDef
Banned
Wow, how rich are you?
Tygeezy
Member
SDR is meant to be 0-100 nits which is easily achievable on oled. Despite oled not getting as bright in HDR its typically more impressive due to better contrast with infinite ratio and not having blooming that lcd hdr is notorious for.
Tygeezy
Member
Every display device will have input lag. Finally tvs are starting to get so close to monitors that it doesn't matter. 6.5 ms at 120 hz on lg oleds.
TKOFromTokyo
Member
I’m looking to finally upgrade to 4K with this next console generation. I’m perfectly content with waiting until 2021 though. I would only use the tv for console gaming, broadcast tv, and UHD movies. Does it make sense to wait until next year given that the past two years of LCDs on the premium brands have been kind of downgrades or stagnant at best (Samsung and Sony)?