-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Twin Peaks Season 3 OT |25 Years Later...It Is Happening Again
- Thread starter Sumio Mondo
- Start date
- Status
The perfect Dark
Banned
Violence Jack
Member
I can't believe this day is finally here. One of the most heartbreaking season finales ever is finally getting resolved after 25 years. Welcome back Coop.
I think you are right.
BenjaminBirdie
Banned
Maybe Michael Cera plays Mr. Harriet Hayward
31GhostsIV
Banned
There are several parts that I think are on par with the Winkies scene and the old people at the end of the movie, though the way the terror works is usually more comparable to the painting sequence from Fire Walk With Me.
Inland Empire made me feel the weight of fear crushing down on me. The first time I saw it (in a cinema) one part made me scream out loud.
So: much, much scarier.
The perfect Dark
Banned
Haha...yep.
Only time a movie has ever made me scream.
JoJoShabadoo
Member
First time I saw that movie, it was around 4 am by the time I reached the end. I was high, with headphones, watching it with my laptop right in front of me. That part scared the shit out of me.
Same. I wasn't expecting it at all! It probably helped that the rest of the film was so damn unnerving.
Jump scares always work best when there's actual built-up tension to release.
I found it interesting that the movie is basically the same, and as scary, high or not. It can make you feel like you're high when you're sober.
David Lynch has the potential to drop some IE level nightmares on us with this series. I'm not sure I'm ready.
EDIT: Great minds...
Yup. I'm almost certain we'll see some of Inland Empire Lynch in the new series, so I'm looking forward to being scared outta my mind again.
Buttonbasher
Member
This also made me yell. It's on screen way longer than most jump scares in horror movies, and doesn't become less horrifying the more you look at it, which can't be said for the Mulholland Drive equivalent.
Not to talk mess on MD. It's obviously among his best work, and that scene in particular is stunning.
Just saying: Inland Empire goes hard.
Edit: Just finished reading The Secret History of Twin Peaks. I generally liked it, but hope that certain aspects aren't taken literally in the new season.
Here's hoping Special Agent T.P. has a large role in the show. I really liked her character, and think a story through her eyes, of her healthy skepticism being proven wrong by visiting Twin Peaks would be a joy to watch.
DoctorFling
Member
Holy shit I'm so excited, decided I'm gonna stay up for it. My plan is to go and buy some cherry pie in advance!
31GhostsIV
Banned
I was researching this very subject earlier.
With Now TV (only), you can stream it live on Atlantic at 2am, however I wanted to get up tomorrow morning and watch - apparently the first two episodes won't be on catch up until after the repeat on Monday night. Apparently. I might be wrong.
Yeah I have the blu ray.
I guess the concept of the ring confused me? It's like a safe guard from Bob? Did Leland know he raped her or not?
Sheryl Lee killed it
Finale Fireworker
Member
I'm dying here. I can't wait until tonight. To pass the time, I'm just reading interviews and Reddit posts and this thread and super-old usenet comments.
Something that I've noticed a lot in the last two days, which is a genuine surprise to me, is that people laud the pilot as one of the best episodes. I've watched Twin Peaks five times through in the last six years. It's a show I really love. I never think the show gets bad, even in season two, and am forgiving towards Fire Walk With Me even though I don't enjoy watching it.
But I really don't like the pilot. I've initiated... (counting in my head)... thirteen people to Twin Peaks. I used to host private viewings for my staff when I managed a movie theater. It has been an immense personal joy of mine to turn so many skeptics into unabashed Peak Freaks. But every time I've shown a new person, from my old staff to new girlfriends to friends of friends, I always caution the long, boring, and esoteric first episode. Maybe it's because I have contextualized it as bad beforehand, or maybe people just wanted to agree with me since I was the "expert", but everyone has agreed with me.
Complaints have been unanimous. It's an extremely slow burn with no reward. It's basically an hour and a half of set up that doesn't payoff in any way until the (excellent) second episode. It introduces a ton of characters who serve little purpose in the episode other than being introduced for later. There's so many different plots unfolding that are hard to follow when you're brand new.
Prior to the modern age of television (the Breaking Bad/Game of Thrones/Mad Men era, to be specific), there is a common and playful metric that TV enthusiasts always refer to: every show has a bad pilot. They usually look different, feel different, and don't match up with the heights of the show. Scrubs had a pilot that could be from a completely different show. It's completely different totally, visually, and characters are completely rebooted between episodes one and two. The Office pilot is a complete remake of the UK pilot and none of it works.
The Twin speaks pilot doesn't have these same problems. Just Audrey's awful haircut. But the pilot suffers from trying to do way too much heavy-lifting with characters you don't care about yet. If I didn't urge people to continue, many would have given up after episode one. I've always said Twin Peaks relies on the Three Episode Test to really reach a new viewer.
And yet, everywhere I look online, the pilot is beloved. It's praised as one of the best episodes, if not THE best episode. David Lynch says it's the part of the show he is most proud of. Fans online are saying they're just rewatching the pilot to prepare for season three and nothing else.
My opinion hasn't changed, but I guess my reality has. I don't like the pilot at all, but I am accepting the fact I am a clear minority on this. I have to wonder, of all the people I showed the show who agreed, how many were merely echoing my own sentiment.
What does PeaksGAF think of the pilot episode? Even if you don't agree with me, can you see where I'm coming from with my criticisms?
Something that I've noticed a lot in the last two days, which is a genuine surprise to me, is that people laud the pilot as one of the best episodes. I've watched Twin Peaks five times through in the last six years. It's a show I really love. I never think the show gets bad, even in season two, and am forgiving towards Fire Walk With Me even though I don't enjoy watching it.
But I really don't like the pilot. I've initiated... (counting in my head)... thirteen people to Twin Peaks. I used to host private viewings for my staff when I managed a movie theater. It has been an immense personal joy of mine to turn so many skeptics into unabashed Peak Freaks. But every time I've shown a new person, from my old staff to new girlfriends to friends of friends, I always caution the long, boring, and esoteric first episode. Maybe it's because I have contextualized it as bad beforehand, or maybe people just wanted to agree with me since I was the "expert", but everyone has agreed with me.
Complaints have been unanimous. It's an extremely slow burn with no reward. It's basically an hour and a half of set up that doesn't payoff in any way until the (excellent) second episode. It introduces a ton of characters who serve little purpose in the episode other than being introduced for later. There's so many different plots unfolding that are hard to follow when you're brand new.
Prior to the modern age of television (the Breaking Bad/Game of Thrones/Mad Men era, to be specific), there is a common and playful metric that TV enthusiasts always refer to: every show has a bad pilot. They usually look different, feel different, and don't match up with the heights of the show. Scrubs had a pilot that could be from a completely different show. It's completely different totally, visually, and characters are completely rebooted between episodes one and two. The Office pilot is a complete remake of the UK pilot and none of it works.
The Twin speaks pilot doesn't have these same problems. Just Audrey's awful haircut. But the pilot suffers from trying to do way too much heavy-lifting with characters you don't care about yet. If I didn't urge people to continue, many would have given up after episode one. I've always said Twin Peaks relies on the Three Episode Test to really reach a new viewer.
And yet, everywhere I look online, the pilot is beloved. It's praised as one of the best episodes, if not THE best episode. David Lynch says it's the part of the show he is most proud of. Fans online are saying they're just rewatching the pilot to prepare for season three and nothing else.
My opinion hasn't changed, but I guess my reality has. I don't like the pilot at all, but I am accepting the fact I am a clear minority on this. I have to wonder, of all the people I showed the show who agreed, how many were merely echoing my own sentiment.
What does PeaksGAF think of the pilot episode? Even if you don't agree with me, can you see where I'm coming from with my criticisms?
Dusk Golem
A 21st Century Rockefeller
you said that scene in Inland Empire well. I honestly think it's up there as one of the best jump scares ever done. It's horrifying just to look at, it's on screen for a lot longer than many jump scares (it's like a 20-30 second scene), it has great build-up, and it's fucking unnerving as hell.
It's even fucking unnerving in gif format without the audio or the context of the film. That's when you know you have an effective as hell jumpscare.
For the Secret History of Twin Peaks, the narrators in the book aren't reliable. The book has new information, but you have to remembered it's filtered through their understanding of it. Basically what they think and their evidence vs what actually happened.
I get where you're coming from, but yeah, I disagree. It's all about the tone. It's strange and sad and funny and (briefly) scary, sometimes all at once. It doesn't pay off like you might hope an episode would, but it certainly gets me excited to see more.
Octavianus
Banned
BenjaminBirdie
Banned
I just finished the pilot and actually think it's totally brilliant. The slow, laborious journey for like 30 minutes through the discovery of the body to the Palmers finding out to that spinning out to the rest of the town is a narrative masterpiece.
It expertly shows the way the show managed to give the soap opera tropes of its plots this deeply authentic, Sirkian emotional tether.
I suspect that might be the thing that is least present in the new series. Goodbye Big Ed and Donna at the gas station or Donna telling her sister to brush her teeth. Hello jump scare after jump scare after jump scare, Inland Empire style.
Season 3 will have the fury of its own momentum.
It expertly shows the way the show managed to give the soap opera tropes of its plots this deeply authentic, Sirkian emotional tether.
I suspect that might be the thing that is least present in the new series. Goodbye Big Ed and Donna at the gas station or Donna telling her sister to brush her teeth. Hello jump scare after jump scare after jump scare, Inland Empire style.
Season 3 will have the fury of its own momentum.
Chip N Chance
Member
Can i watch this on my xbox one? I have showtime on my cable package and was wondering if i can stream it live on the Showtime app. Sorry if this isnt in the spirit of the thread. I really have been waiting along time for this, and it means allot to me.
ToyMachine228
Member
Fyi Showtime is free this weekend on Slingtv.
Thanks for this info. I'll activate a free trial tonight yo catch the premiere.
CharminUltra
Member
Do you know who I am?
I am the arm.
And I sound like this:
Whoopwhoopwhoopwhoopwhoopwhoopwhoop
I am the arm.
And I sound like this:
Whoopwhoopwhoopwhoopwhoopwhoopwhoop
Excellent use of that quote.
I dunno, I'm one of the probably few people who's hoping for an Inland Empire type work here, but I expect that with the 18 hour length, Lynch will slow down at times for some beautiful melodrama. Just, it will probably be tangled in a lot more abstraction than last time.
This is 100% my interpretation as well. The ring "weds" the wearer to Mike, preventing Bob from possessing the wearer.
Laura takes the ring = Dead, but not possessed
Laura doesn't take the ring = Alive, but possessed
Dusk Golem
A 21st Century Rockefeller
The Ring has some interpretation that can be read into it, but it was recently expanded on in that book by Mark Frost so there's some things clear about it. Basically that Ring has had important bits in history, IE Richard Nixon apparently had the ring at one point. Know the Ring is connected to The Man From Another Place It appears in the main series too, but briefly. While the exact effects are unknown, in Fire Walk With Me Teresa Banks had the ring (the woman who was murdered in Deer Meadows and is mentioned in the first episode of the main series by Cooper, who mentions Laura's Death is similar to Teresa Banks but Teresa's death was undereported until Laura's death since the cases were similar). The FBI agents know the ring is mentioned on her profile, but her corpse no longer has it on her person. The FBI Agent Chester Desmond then finds the ring in the trailer park, but he mysteriously vanishes and is never seen again when he picks it up, his fate is unknown.
Laura Palmer wore the ring so BOB can't possess her, BOB mentions either to let him in or he'll kill her. While BOB is doing his ritual, The Man From Another Place throws the ring to Laura, she puts it, and then BOB kills her, implying the ring makes it so BOB can't possess her. Of note in the series, Mike aka the One-Armed Man had the Ring as well and it was because of the Ring he cut his arm off (or some ring, it's not said but he mentions a Golden Circle).
Leland knew he raped her, but it's debatable if he was in control or if Bob did it. My personal theory is that Bob's possession doesn't completely eliminate the person's personality, more like he preys on a person's darker inner self, he becomes their dark side. I doubt Leland would of done anything without Bob's influence to his daughter, but I take it as maybe he had feelings of lust for his daughter and Bob acted on those feelings.
Laura Palmer wore the ring so BOB can't possess her, BOB mentions either to let him in or he'll kill her. While BOB is doing his ritual, The Man From Another Place throws the ring to Laura, she puts it, and then BOB kills her, implying the ring makes it so BOB can't possess her. Of note in the series, Mike aka the One-Armed Man had the Ring as well and it was because of the Ring he cut his arm off (or some ring, it's not said but he mentions a Golden Circle).
Leland knew he raped her, but it's debatable if he was in control or if Bob did it. My personal theory is that Bob's possession doesn't completely eliminate the person's personality, more like he preys on a person's darker inner self, he becomes their dark side. I doubt Leland would of done anything without Bob's influence to his daughter, but I take it as maybe he had feelings of lust for his daughter and Bob acted on those feelings.
You missed a really good Gordon Cole scene, I'm telling ya!
But it was your decision, so that's fair enough. At least you'll be along for what'll hopefully be a damn good ride.
Dusk Golem
A 21st Century Rockefeller
The pilot's not my favorite episode either, I think it's a good introductory episode to get you to know a lot of the cast, which is a huge cast to be fair. I actually warned when I first watched the first three episodes with a friend who never saw it recently that the first episode is slow, but he actually loved the first episode and was impressed they introduced so many characters who seemed interesting in the first episode. He can be very critical of things and get angry at things he finds slow and dull, so I was honestly surprised he liked the first episode so much.
I wouldn't say I dislike the episode, but it's not even in my top 10 Twin Peaks episodes if I was going to be honest. But I do think it does a good job as the set-up and has some memorable moments, certainly.
shadowfoxx21
Member
When I originally watched the series I didn't have a problem with the pilot. I recently tried to get my girlfriend into it and she couldn't make it halfway through. She was beyond bored and is hesitant to revisit it. I also found it boring especially knowing how good the series gets later on. I'm thinking about just finding a synopsis for her to read as I really want her to finish the series.
VistraNorrez
Member
I actually watched the pilot after I watched the first season. In the US the DVD set did not come with it. So it was years later that I actually watched it, but I loved it.
I love it more everytime I see it. I was a David Lynch fan before a Twin Peaks fan, so I knew his proclivities. The pacing was perfect to me. And because I now know where these characters are going, it's so heartbreaking.
I love it more everytime I see it. I was a David Lynch fan before a Twin Peaks fan, so I knew his proclivities. The pacing was perfect to me. And because I now know where these characters are going, it's so heartbreaking.
DoctorFling
Member
I'm in Ireland and I'm watching it at 2am on Sky Atlantic.
JoJoShabadoo
Member
The pilot is a perfect hour of television. Each scene is significant.
The way Laura's death is discovered by each parent. The way the school discovers it (the dead silence in the room as the desk is unoccupied and Donna and James realize what happened), Bobby and Shelley driving leisurely down the road with a jazzy song, and upon seeing a then unknown truck, he u-turns, clearly frightened, with the sound of sawing wood. Cooper saying "I will remind you that these crimes occurred at night" and it cuts to the sound of howling wind and a lone streetlight. Sarah Palmer's vision at the end.
I could go on and on. It perfectly encapsulates what makes Twin Peaks Twin Peaks.
The way Laura's death is discovered by each parent. The way the school discovers it (the dead silence in the room as the desk is unoccupied and Donna and James realize what happened), Bobby and Shelley driving leisurely down the road with a jazzy song, and upon seeing a then unknown truck, he u-turns, clearly frightened, with the sound of sawing wood. Cooper saying "I will remind you that these crimes occurred at night" and it cuts to the sound of howling wind and a lone streetlight. Sarah Palmer's vision at the end.
I could go on and on. It perfectly encapsulates what makes Twin Peaks Twin Peaks.
People considering the pilot boring is news to me. I really do feel like you clouded those people's vision with your warning, Fireworker, because I can't imagine it be such a majority opinion among them without it.
You mention setup with no reward, well here's the thing, I don't understand that sentiment at all. I love set up. I always do, set up tends to be one of the most enjoyable parts to me in any quality work. Payoffs tends to disappoint me far too often after a good introduction because my imagination goes wild. And Twin Peaks does the most wonderful job at introducing all these characters in the pilot if you ask me, it made me fall in love with all of them in an instant. Add the immense sense of sadness to that, the way the pilot shows the effect Laura's murder has on that community (that school scene and the call are the stuff of legend), and yeah, I think you've got something special there. One of my favourite episodes for sure.
You mention setup with no reward, well here's the thing, I don't understand that sentiment at all. I love set up. I always do, set up tends to be one of the most enjoyable parts to me in any quality work. Payoffs tends to disappoint me far too often after a good introduction because my imagination goes wild. And Twin Peaks does the most wonderful job at introducing all these characters in the pilot if you ask me, it made me fall in love with all of them in an instant. Add the immense sense of sadness to that, the way the pilot shows the effect Laura's murder has on that community (that school scene and the call are the stuff of legend), and yeah, I think you've got something special there. One of my favourite episodes for sure.
Lord Frieza
Member
Did the actual pilot actually air back then? I thought they just started with the second episode because of some weird rights issue
Fried Food
Banned
the brie sandwich scene was one of my favorites lol
I think it's the home release that ran into rights issues.
That was only an issue with the initial DVD release in some territories I believe. He pilot aired normally.
(I'll spoiler some bits just in case there's still someone doing a frantic catch-up)
Despite having watched the full TV series twice before, this weekend's capping-off of a run-through was the first time I've seen Fire Walk With Me and subsequently, The Missing Pieces.
I feel that I wouldn't have missed the opening half-hour if it hadn't been there. The mystery of Teresa's murder and subsequent investigation as an enigmatic background to the Laura Palmer case worked better for me as an off-screen incident, leaving whatever terrifying details occurred to the imagination.
Cooper almost seems like a completely different person to who he was when he first arrived in Twin Peaks, especially in the deleted "Diane" scene where he comes off as being a bit of an asshole.
Once the story reaches Twin Peaks itself, things fall into place a lot better and I wasn't as put-off by the "new" Donna as I was worried about. As I'm completely spoiler-free about Season 3 to the point of not even knowing the cast details outside of Kyle, I wouldn't be adverse to Moira Kelly being the returning actress.
The added context to the details of Laura's last days serves to underpin how horrendous the situation was, making
far less 'innocent' than his final moments indicated, and gives answers to scenarios such as
My heart also raced at the end of The Missing Pieces, as I didn't realise the final snippets were
.
Currently making my way through The Secret History of Twin Peaks and rolling my eyes a little at the tie-ins to
given that there was no inference to any such thing for
in the original series, but we'll see how it plays out, if at all, in the upcoming episodes.
Now eagerly awaiting tomorrow night (as I'm in the UK and can't be up at 2am to watch it) and keeping my fingers crossed that we end up with a suitable finale to the past 25 years' wait.
Despite having watched the full TV series twice before, this weekend's capping-off of a run-through was the first time I've seen Fire Walk With Me and subsequently, The Missing Pieces.
I feel that I wouldn't have missed the opening half-hour if it hadn't been there. The mystery of Teresa's murder and subsequent investigation as an enigmatic background to the Laura Palmer case worked better for me as an off-screen incident, leaving whatever terrifying details occurred to the imagination.
Cooper almost seems like a completely different person to who he was when he first arrived in Twin Peaks, especially in the deleted "Diane" scene where he comes off as being a bit of an asshole.
Once the story reaches Twin Peaks itself, things fall into place a lot better and I wasn't as put-off by the "new" Donna as I was worried about. As I'm completely spoiler-free about Season 3 to the point of not even knowing the cast details outside of Kyle, I wouldn't be adverse to Moira Kelly being the returning actress.
The added context to the details of Laura's last days serves to underpin how horrendous the situation was, making
Leland
Laura's spirit's horrific scream in the final episode being a mimicry of that final night that's stayed with her.
My heart also raced at the end of The Missing Pieces, as I didn't realise the final snippets were
from just after the ending of Season 2
Currently making my way through The Secret History of Twin Peaks and rolling my eyes a little at the tie-ins to
Roswell and the flying-saucer craze
the Milford brothers
Now eagerly awaiting tomorrow night (as I'm in the UK and can't be up at 2am to watch it) and keeping my fingers crossed that we end up with a suitable finale to the past 25 years' wait.
- Status